DontBeThatGuy
Member
Blame Chump
My mind should be blown that this was the end of this fucker, but nah, it's not.
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Is the "R-slur" becoming more accepted in Trump's America?
- Thread starter Poor GRIMES
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My mind should be blown that this was the end of this fucker, but nah, it's not.
King Tubby
Member
This is what's known as the "euphemism treadmill." I don't think people will ever stop using such terms to call each other stupid.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
How do you not understand that you're literally using it as a slur?
Going to bat for a word that causes offence is the most bizarre thing to me. All it says in my books is that group matters less than them. And when that group is some of the most vulnerable in society there is a severe empathy deficit.
Also it's one bloody word! The English language is a beautiful thing because of its versatility. Use it! And maybe because I'm British and we love swearing and invent new words all the time but twat is far better than retard.
So in conclusion: TWATS.
Also it's one bloody word! The English language is a beautiful thing because of its versatility. Use it! And maybe because I'm British and we love swearing and invent new words all the time but twat is far better than retard.
So in conclusion: TWATS.
I remember gradually becoming ashamed that it was us (everybody that was at school during the 80s/90s) that forced the name change onto Scope. We were amazed and amused that people (adults) could be so upset by our harmless playground banter but eventually we grew up.
Solid SOAP
Member
During my student teaching life, the 1st grade teacher called one of his students retarded to his face. Lol
King Tubby
Member
I don't think someone who uses the word "retard" or "retarded" necessarily lacks empathy for the mentally retarded.
Ignorance is bliss, but as time goes on and especially in the Internet age it looks more and more unlikely.
sugarhigh4242
Banned
eh, i'd definitely say they lack *some* empathy. Even if the social magnitude of "retarded" is not as extreme as other slurs we could discuss, the logic of dropping it casually is the same.
Idiot, imbecile, and moron were once medical terms. I love etymology. You can use idiotic but not retarded and not be a hypocrite or boorish.
sugarhigh4242
Banned
dumb
Dumb ass
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
People on here can tell me I have no empathy and no respect for the mentally challenged all day long for using the word retard. Doesn't make it true. As much as you guys seem to want it to be.
Bye
Is this really the hill to die on? Or did I fall for the bait?
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
I really don't know how else to talk about a person who uses a word they know sucks in one conversation but then will avoid it in another where they would actually have to be accountable for their use of the word. Cowardly? Shitty? Willfully ignorant? How should we be approaching such a contradiction?
How can you read something like this and maintain that view:
What are you gaining?
Edginess?
What is with this response lately. I've seen this a lot on GAF.
Someone makes a statement or has a thought. Reply is: Are you sure this is the hill you want to die on???
Solaire of Astora
Death by black JPN
I have one person on my gaf ignore list. During a discussion, they kept throwing the R word around. When I asked them to maybe consider using a more appropriate word, they came out with the "don't censor me" spiel. Fine. I'll ducking block you instead.
Funny that you mention that. I grew up with a few people who ended up developing hateful opinions (sexism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia/etc) and all but one of those went to university. I don't really think there's any link between going to university and not being a total shit.
Funny that you mention that. I grew up with a few people who ended up developing hateful opinions (sexism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia/etc) and all but one of those went to university. I don't really think there's any link between going to university and not being a total shit.
Snkfanatic
Banned
"I made an account 3 years ago and barely post on it just to burn it using the world these guys are upset about. That will show them"
Use your main account or go back to the hole of the internet you crawled out of.
Merchandise
Member
Regardless of the topic of conversation right now, I honestly agree. People hold random opinions; no not every single opinion they have is so defining of them that they will go to war to defend it. It's insignificant.
We don't seem to have an answer.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
Approach it however you want. Maybe I'm all of those things in your opinion, that's okay.
To me anyway, it's the same thing as avoiding a topic I know is gonna hurt someone in a conversation. As an example, after a friend of a friends suicide, I try not to say things involving suicide because it's just gonna hurt my friend to bring it up.
Loose example obviously. I'm not saying I'm a good person because I'll only say retard around people who aren't mentally challenged. I'm just saying that I'm not that shitty that I'd say it to someone in that group.
I guess retard doesn't hold the weight to me personally as it does others. Maybe I should Re think how I speak and what words I use. Clearly this word does hurt people as evidenced above.
I just kinda know that after I close this thread and put my phone down, chances are pretty high I'll keep saying retard now and then because it's such a normal thing to me.
A friend tried telling me about using gay and faggot in everyday use a few years back. To most ends I have removed that from my vocabulary I think. But last year he went off about how I call cigarettes fags. I'll often say I'm going for a fag or I'm outta fags or whatever. I don't see myself ever being able to stop saying. Due to both being ingrained and due to me not seeing that use as troublesome.
I really don't know what else to say on this tbh
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
We disagree a lot here, but I appreciate this post a lot, because you're listening and elaborating on your view (which I think is the main frustration some here have had with your previous posts).
While I understand your point about avoiding a sensitive topic, I think your behavior is less analogous to that sort of scenario and more analogous to how bigots talk one way in private and another in public, which often comes off to me as a way to dodge personal responsibility by only opening up to those you trust to not make you have to reconsider your own (and their own) behavior.
PixelatedBookake
Junior Member
I've been trying to avoid saying the word ever since I learned how hurtful it could be a few years ago. In the past year its slipped out here and there, but I can't not feel like a shithead after saying it.
King Tubby
Member
The thing that makes them bigots though isn't speaking one way in public vs in private, it's the actual opinions they hold. I say all sorts of insensitive and vulgar things when I'm with close friends that I wouldn't in public or with strangers because I know it can offend or be taken the wrong way.
I hope you enjoyed your brief time here on this forum.
Whether or not you were/are aware of a "movement" to stop it's usage, there was one. The trickle down effect would have been people not using it as frequently, and given that most people tend to follow trends it died out. For me, my parents would usually be the first to correct my ignorance - i.e - whenever I parroted harmful language or opinions because I was young and none the wiser, they would correct me. Eventually you learn to be mindful and challenge your own behaviour, or challenge the behaviour of others when appropriate.
For me its more the fact that a lot of people say offensive stuff in private, I'm guilty of this too but many still don't want to admit its offensive or insulting. I've said stupid shitty offensive things in private but if anyone called me out for it that wasn't in my own group of friends then I wouldn't get all but hurt or defensive. I'd take the L and apologize for it like an adult. A lot folks are defiant over it, as if its not their bad but everyone else for taking offense in the first place.
parrotbeak
Member
For me it has been years of catching myself and correcting my behavior. I grew up using it and so did many people I talk to, so I slip here and there, but so does self correction and peer correction. The reason I started to make an effort to change was because I had a colleague with a mentally handicapped child. Then I had friends who had special needs babies. Then over the years I found out I knew a lot of people with mentally handicapped family.
Traditionally handicaps have been a source of shame. People won't talk about it unless they're comfortable. I have family too that no one talked about when growing up and we never saw them except at funerals.
If you don't know anyone who has a handicapped child or close relative that they've helped care for, it might be because they aren't comfortable enough around you to tell you. When I was younger I know I came off ignorant a lot, and I think a lot of people just wouldn't tell me things. I would rather people not feel like they have to keep their guard up around me because of the language I use.
Traditionally handicaps have been a source of shame. People won't talk about it unless they're comfortable. I have family too that no one talked about when growing up and we never saw them except at funerals.
If you don't know anyone who has a handicapped child or close relative that they've helped care for, it might be because they aren't comfortable enough around you to tell you. When I was younger I know I came off ignorant a lot, and I think a lot of people just wouldn't tell me things. I would rather people not feel like they have to keep their guard up around me because of the language I use.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
It is pretty crazy that the term retard came to be used to replace words used like idiot, moron, or imbecile, which were seen as negative. The word retard then becomes the one that shouldn't be said, while the words it replaced are free flowing insults.
In the US we never got a campaign to stop using the word spaz. I had only ever heard of the word being used to describe someone hyperactive, usually an uncontrollable kid. "Spaz out" might have been used one to describe someone having a mental breakdown or alluding that they feel like they are having one.
In the US we never got a campaign to stop using the word spaz. I had only ever heard of the word being used to describe someone hyperactive, usually an uncontrollable kid. "Spaz out" might have been used one to describe someone having a mental breakdown or alluding that they feel like they are having one.
parrotbeak
Member
I never knew it was offensive in the UK until this thread. I also never really hear or use it much.
The wiki article actually talks about the difference between UK and US usage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spastic
In the UK it developed into a very derogatory catch-all for people with any form of mental condition, learning disability, or physical disability instead of the initial use of the term in use regarding people with cerebral palsy and The Spastics Society;
"It's over 20 years since we changed our name from The Spastics Society to Scope.
In 1952, three parents of children with cerebral palsy set up The Spastics Society because no one would educate their children.
The organisation grew and changed to become a household name. But attitudes to disabled people changed as well. The word 'spastic' became a term of abuse. Suddenly, The Spastics Society's name was holding it back.
We wanted to say something positive about disability. In 1994, The Spastics Society became Scope.
Read more at https://www.scope.org.uk/history#JbRul0j3LMJlqd7V.99"
I think it's good you're thinking about it. I used to use it. I grew up using it, like I grew up calling people "queer", and "faggot", and probably worse things, because I grew up in the seventies when the world was less willing to treat with respect anyone outside of what it defined as "normal" (which meant white, male, an neurotypical).
Even as an adult, I'd still use it, because it's a handy way to suggest something is stupid beyond stupid. I'd feel a little bad, but I'd use it.
And then I saw someone call something retarded in front of my nephew, who is on the autism spectrum, and who had been called retarded many times, to his face, by other children. And I saw that it hurt him to hear that slur thrown around so easily by people, as if it had no effect. And we talked about it, and he introduced me to the concept of neurodiversity (which is hilarious given I have a mood disorder and my older brother is also on the spectrum, so neither of us are neurotypical) and explained how it made him feel when people used the word retard.
So I stopped, because I love my nephew, and it causes him pain. And later, when a different nephew was born with Down's Syndrome, I watched his mother (who had grown up in the same period as me, and used the word "retard" easily and without thought) go through the same thought process, and figure out it wasn't that hard to find an alternate word.
It is a word that has caused a bunch of people a lot of very deep pain. It is used to shame and humiliate people still. I don't use it for the same reason I don't use "nigger" or "faggot", and don't have any desire to use either, because they are words that by their very nature cause large swathes of humanity emotional pain, and that's no what I'm trying to do. Before I knew they caused pain, I could claim ignorance, but I cant anymore, so I stopped.
Which doesn't mean it doesn't slip out once in a blue moon. I'm human and I screw up, and I try to do better next time. That's all anyone can really ask. Anyway, thanks for at least thinking about it.
Ampersands
Member
I hate when people say "retard" especially when they stress the "re" but I admit that I call some things retarded sometimes. It's usually undirected but it feels like a bad habit to me.
For some people it might be the language barrier. I'm german for example, here "Retardierung" (retardation) or "retardiert" (retarded) are only medical terms, they don't exist in colloquial language or as a slur, in fact someone using "retardiert" in german would sound well spoken and like a professional so it never occurred to be that it could be offensive in english, it was just another word that I used as a synonym for stupid or lame until it was pointed out to me.
Mechanized
Member
I try not to use it but I grew up saying it to refer to something as stupid or incomprehensible, so it's a tough habit to break - especially since it's not a word used often anyways. I have a slip now and then but I try my best to avoid saying it because even if my intent isn't to hurt others I realize it can.
That said, I don't feel like it's said any more today than it was back in the day. People want to say hurtful things to hurt others. I don't think there's any avoiding it.
That said, I don't feel like it's said any more today than it was back in the day. People want to say hurtful things to hurt others. I don't think there's any avoiding it.
NZ is similar to the UK, so when I hear Americans casually toss around "spaz" I do the Drew Scanlon blink.
thepenguin55
Member
Yeah, I started listening to Retronauts from a decade ago and it's nuts as I have not heard such casual use of the R-word or the C-word in a very long time. I forget the guy's name (Sharkey? Or something like that?) just tosses those words out like they're nothing. Maybe this makes me a jerk but I kind of miss being able to throw out words like that without any guilt. Restricting words like those from my lexicon was something I struggled with for a long time as I never used them literally and it was more about how they sounded which is how I would justify my use of them.
muntersaur
Member
I agree that there was a movement to phase the word out, but how successful was it? Sure spastic is no longer used anymore, but derogatory slurs for the disabled are still commonplace. As soon as spastic was phased out, another word with the same meaning replaced it. Retarded is interesting I suppose due to its longevity, but as soon as using retarded becomes taboo, another word will replace it.
Targeting words does not work unless there is a change in culture to go along with it.
There are always going to be shitty people so I find making that point is kind of like saying water is wet. Doesn't mean we shouldn't curtail their shitty behavior if possible especially the language they use.
Would you feel the same about homophobic slurs that used to get tossed around the playground and all through highschool, such as calling things "gay" or others a "fag"? I'm all for hurtful language being phased out of the acceptable lexicon.
I already talked about all that with you, you can't be defeatist. And it's an excuse.
It's not like people are being threatened with being shot if they use it, they are being educated on WHY not to use it.
And in stopping that use you make them reluctant to use another. Nothing replaced spastic and what happened with it, and we can do the same again.
Far easier in fact.
The Albatross
Member
Not around me. Hardly ever hear it thankfully.
The only times I hear it are from people older than me. I'm 33, and hadn't really heard it used often in years, but I remember hanging out with some friends from work who were in their later 30s, around 40, and it was way more common for them to use it. I think it's a bit of a generational thing, where millennials (I'm an older millennial) started to be coached by society not to use it, but people older than me never had that coaching.
I used to use it plenty in high school and college in the 90s and early 2000s, it just wasn't really considered a bad word then by most people, but I stopped at some point and cut it out of my vocabulary just about entirely.
Aside from the actual debate at hand, I agree with you. "Is this the hill you want to die on," is a way of molding a social group or a way of making your point of view be perceived as the dominant or "right" view ,without actually giving any reasons or basis. It's basically saying, "You're wrong and this opinion isn't welcome here." In the case of this thread, I think that person is probably right, but I think it's a stupid way of making that point.
The only times I hear it are from people older than me. I'm 33, and hadn't really heard it used often in years, but I remember hanging out with some friends from work who were in their later 30s, around 40, and it was way more common for them to use it. I think it's a bit of a generational thing, where millennials (I'm an older millennial) started to be coached by society not to use it, but people older than me never had that coaching.
I used to use it plenty in high school and college in the 90s and early 2000s, it just wasn't really considered a bad word then by most people, but I stopped at some point and cut it out of my vocabulary just about entirely.
Aside from the actual debate at hand, I agree with you. "Is this the hill you want to die on," is a way of molding a social group or a way of making your point of view be perceived as the dominant or "right" view ,without actually giving any reasons or basis. It's basically saying, "You're wrong and this opinion isn't welcome here." In the case of this thread, I think that person is probably right, but I think it's a stupid way of making that point.
CrimsonSquall
Member
My mind was blown when I saw the r/the_donald explanation for this. Oh lordy, the cope of that subreddit
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