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Middle-earth: Shadow of War is Play Anywhere (XB1/Win10)

amdb00mer

Member
But publishers offer crossbuy within ecosystems all the time. Steam (Windows/Mac/Linux), iOS (iPhone/iPad), PlayStation (PS1 games. PSP to Vita, etc), Android. He'll, it's even been the case on Windows up to now with Windows Phone and Windows 8/10. The Xbox console was the outlier.

Don't waste your breathe Syth. People want to hate and accuse of MS paying off devs/publishers. If there is an incentive for the PA it probably is nothing more than MS taking a reduced cut since the devs/publishers get more out of it.
 

singhr1

Member
Good deal, if I didn't already have a PS4 Pro I would be all over this. I assume MS has the marketing deal then?

1. Who cares about marketing deals
2. RE7 came to W10 store and was Sony dealio so don't make those assumptions about "marketing deals"
 

EvB

Member
While I'd consider Square-Enix and Namco to be just as AAA as Capcom, Activision also hasn't; COD wasn't PA.

COD wasn't but I suspect that was down the the marketing Deals that Sony have done.
I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes XPA at a later date.
 

amdb00mer

Member
Marketing, prime placement in XBL, more cut on purchases, are all financial investments.

Well yeah, nobody is doing this for free.



This is not how it works. The game is also getting a Steam release that runs on Windows 7 just fine, which means the "no extra cost for the port" is complete bullshit.

Wow, angry much? X1 OS is built off of Win10 OS, not Win7. Win7 does not offer the same Xbox App features that Win10 does. Are there 3rd party apps that allow screenshots and recording yes, but again, that is NOT Win10 OS and Xbox App features built in to Win7. Developing for the X1 and/or Win10 is using the same tools basically. Only real differnce is Win10 versions will be able to adjust resolutions and individual graphics settings.
 

MUnited83

For you.
Not quite, I mean the game acknowledging it's running on a beefier console and adapting, because the game was already made with that in mind.

Unlike non uwp games running on Scorpio for instance, where they will just run at maximum target frame rate and resolution, but no further improvements.
This won't do that, since unless anything changed, the XB1 and PC versions are still technically speaking different builds of the game.
But publishers offer crossbuy within ecosystems all the time. Steam (Windows/Mac/Linux), iOS (iPhone/iPad), PlayStation (PS1 games. PSP to Vita, etc), Android. Hell, it's even been the case on Windows up to now with Windows Phone and Windows 8/10. The Xbox console was the outlier.
Backwards compability and cross-buy are different things.

Wow, angry much? X1 OS is built off of Win10 OS, not Win7. Win7 does not offer the same Xbox App features that Win10 does. Are there 3rd party apps that allow screenshots and recording yes, but again, that is NOT Win10 OS and Xbox App features built in to Win7. Developing for the X1 and/or Win10 is using the same tools basically. Only real differnce is Win10 versions will be able to adjust resolutions and individual graphics settings.
Again, the game runs on Windows 7. Are you saying that they went to the full extent of porting the game twice? One for W10, one for Steam/Win 7 that according to you takes a lot more work? Because that sounds quite frankly quite ridiculous.

Don't waste your breathe Syth. People want to hate and accuse of MS paying off devs/publishers. If there is an incentive for the PA it probably is nothing more than MS taking a reduced cut since the devs/publishers get more out of it.
...

what do you think their cut is paid in? Monopoly bucks? Mentos? Happy thoughts?
 

dLMN8R

Member
But publishers offer crossbuy within ecosystems all the time. Steam (Windows/Mac/Linux), iOS (iPhone/iPad), PlayStation (PS1 games. PSP to Vita, etc), Android. Hell, it's even been the case on Windows up to now with Windows Phone and Windows 8/10. The Xbox console was the outlier.
Exactly.

Any incentive a developer has to push Xbox One owners to buying digitally instead of at retail is worth it, since the developer/publisher will get more money out of that purchase than from the costs which go into disc manufacturing and distribution.

The detractors assume "Why would they dissuade customers from buying two versions??"

But no one does that anyway. The real answer is:

"What else can we do to get people to buy a digital purchase on Xbox One instead of buying an Xbox One disc"?
 

iavi

Member
I still don't quite get the appeal of Play Anywhere. If someone invested the money into building a gaming PC rig to do these games justice, I don't see why they would ever bother with an inferior console version.

For those that do see the appeal, this is great news

There's different use cases.

I have my Gaming PC at my desk and all I love to play on it, but sometimes my fiancé wants to join in so we'll play whatever game through in the living room together on the Xbox instead--we're doing this for RE7 right now due to play anywhere. And I'll still have the PC version for a Vive run when VR exclusivity ends for Sony. The whole "people are playing play anywhere games more due to more access" really holds true for me personally

If it wasn't for play anywhere I'd just buy whatever copy I feel I'll use more and be done with it despite technical advantages-- like I really wish Titanfall 2 was play anywhere. I bought the XB versions for the user base, but wouldn't mind getting a few rounds in on my PC--or even better: my laptop while on break at work. But I don't double dip.

It's not even a stretch to see the appeal, not even including the co-op loophole
 

LordRaptor

Member
People want to hate and accuse of MS paying off devs/publishers. If there is an incentive for the PA it probably is nothing more than MS taking a reduced cut since the devs/publishers get more out of it.

Uhhhh... you get that waiving fees other people have to pay is still effectively a pay off right?

Like... if a news story broke about your local politician pushing through a very pro-business bill and it was revealed he'd been given free products by the business the bill supported and been on free holidays all paid for by that same business, you wouldn't be going "but that's not a pay off, its just a reduced cut of expenses", right?
 

Synth

Member
Don't waste your breathe Syth. People want to hate and accuse of MS paying off devs/publishers. If there is an incentive for the PA it probably is nothing more than MS taking a reduced cut since the devs/publishers get more out of it.

Well in all honesty I wouldn't rule out them offering incentives for the current releases. I'm just pointing out that the idea that no publisher would allow anything beyond a Nintendo level of device freedom isn't close to reality.

Even if MS are currently paying for XPA titles, it should be pretty obvious that they're not looking to do this perpetually for every 3rd party title that ever releases on the MS Store, so it's logical that they believe that publishers would choose to make a game XPA off their own accord in the future. And other similar ecosystems make a good case for that.
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
Woah this thread is negative.

Awesome news! Might grab it digitally if I can get it for a reasonable price. If it's Play Anywhere via retail like Halo Wars it leads to some pretty cheap third party digital prices too which is great.

Interested to see Scorpio support for the game too.
 

pr0cs

Member
And why would I want to play this on xbox one when I have PC ?
When I'm travelling and visiting family and friends that do have an xbox but not a gaming pc

When my pc is busy doing something else or the TV is doing something else and I want to still play thr game

When I'm playing multiplayer with friends who are only on xbox but I still want to go thru single player with the best possible quality (pc)

I mean this isn't rocket science, there are tons of reasons why
 
This won't do that, since unless anything changed, the XB1 and PC versions are still technically speaking different builds of the game.

Backwards compability and cross-buy are different things.


Again, the game runs on Windows 7. Are you saying that they went to the full extent of porting the game twice? One for W10, one for Steam/Win 7 that according to you takes a lot more work? Because that sounds quite frankly quite ridiculous.


...

what do you think their cut is paid in? Monopoly bucks? Mentos? Happy thoughts?
Anytime a game is made for Xbox One and then put on Steam, it had to be made twice. Any game on Xbox One and Windows 10 are 98% the same code as both run on the same OS and UWP.
 

MUnited83

For you.
Anytime a game is made for Xbox One and then put on Steam, it had to be made twice. Any game on Xbox One and Windows 10 are 98% the same code as both run on the same OS and UWP.
So you're saying that they are porting the game twice then?

They aren't. Extremely likely that the W10 version is little else than the Win7/Steam port inside a UWA wrapper
 

icespide

Banned
Anytime a game is made for Xbox One and then put on Steam, it had to be made twice. Any game on Xbox One and Windows 10 are 98% the same code as both run on the same OS and UWP.

I don't think this is as true as you think it is, the Win 10 version is streamlined but there is still work involved
 

LordRaptor

Member
Any game on Xbox One and Windows 10 are 98% the same code as both run on the same OS and UWP.

This isn't true but I really can't be arsed having this argument again.

Making a regular PC SKU, an X1 SKU and a W10 SKU is for all intents and purposes for modern developers using modern pipelines, making three games.
 

singhr1

Member
Uhhhh... you get that waiving fees other people have to pay is still effectively a pay off right?

Like... if a news story broke about your local politician pushing through a very pro-business bill and it was revealed he'd been given free products by the business the bill supported and been on free holidays all paid for by that same business, you wouldn't be going "but that's not a pay off, its just a reduced cut of expenses", right?

One is a conflict of interest and one isn't. One is bringing more people access to a thing while the other is choosing sides. Is XPA an "incentive" for people to buy that one, sure.

Terrible analogy
 

icespide

Banned
This isn't true but I really can't be arsed having this argument again.

Making a regular PC SKU, an X1 SKU and a W10 SKU is for all intents and purposes for modern developers using modern pipelines, making three games.

are you saying it's not just checking a checkbox to export to Win 10?
 

Matt

Member
Don't waste your breathe Syth. People want to hate and accuse of MS paying off devs/publishers. If there is an incentive for the PA it probably is nothing more than MS taking a reduced cut since the devs/publishers get more out of it.
I don't think there has to be "hate" involved. The W10 Store is a young and not widely used platform, there is nothing wrong with MS using financial incentives to help get publishers to support it.
 
That sounds great. Looks like I am buying digital then. I actually played FH3 the other day on my PC and the save synced just fine. Was really nice actually. I hope more 3rd party games are PA. And should be.
 

Synth

Member
So you're saying that they are porting the game twice then?

[M They aren't. Extremely likely that the W10 version is little else than the Win7/Steam port inside a UWA wrapper

If you're getting a UWA without any significant additional work regardless... then what does it matter if that version was derived from the Steam version, or the Xbox version?
 

xabbott

Member
While I'm not so into this game I'm happy this is getting growing support. I really like the idea of a game library following me across devices. I was more into PC gaming last gen more into consoles this gen. That could always change and I already play some games on my work and old pc using PA like Halo Wars, Forza, and Fallout Shelter. It's seamless.

It's what I wished at one time Valve could have done with Steam boxes but I don't think they pushed it properly.
 
A Play Anywhere title ensures that each sale is a permanent one off with no possibility of any future double dipping (unless the W10 appstore gets nuked).

It seems reasonably likely that there is some current financial incentive to giving up future long tail sales.
With that mindset no one would ever put their games on pc because eventually they can't make people pay twice for the same game.

The program itself offers more financial incentive than disc/retail, and it's extremely easier for ms to give further incentives like reduce their cut and so on.
 

MUnited83

For you.
If you're getting a UWA without any significant additional work regardless... then what does it matter if that version was derived from the Steam version, or the Xbox version?
...

The port wasn't any easier because of the supposed tools, is what I'm saying. They still had the exact same work they would have to port it than they would if they didn't release it as a UWA...
This isn't true but I really can't be arsed having this argument again.

Making a regular PC SKU, an X1 SKU and a W10 SKU is for all intents and purposes for modern developers using modern pipelines, making three games.
It's crazy how people still believe the "Universal" myth and think XB1 and PC are running the same build, and think that their titles will automatically upgrade to ultra settings on Scorpio 2 or something.
 

WadeitOut

Member
On a less agenda based note, PA is a feature me and my fellow PC/Console gaming friends have been praying for years for.

The fact that third parties are getting on board is nothing but a great thing for gamers.
 
All these posts going "I don't see the point of this", gamers must be amongst the least imaginative people on Earth.

Can we get MS to slide a few dollars EA's way to make Madden a Play Anywhere title please?
 

LordRaptor

Member
Terrible analogy

Except you tacitly admit the analogy I was making - that financial incentives don't have to be giving someone cash - is correct, so okay?

are you saying it's not just checking a checkbox to export to Win 10?

Even if it was that simple to build, you would get screamed down by end users from getting any sales by having a game that has a min spec of an 8-core CPU and a 6Gb VRAM GPU combo (not widely popular) that has no performance scaling options and doesn't support the native inputs of a PC.

A W10 build is going to need its own seperate build pipeline and fork, thats pretty much inescapable.

With that mindset no one would ever put their games on pc because eventually they can't make people pay twice for the same game.

Except PC sales tails are effectively infinite.
People buying 360 games today are statistical noise.
 

WadeitOut

Member
All these posts going "I don't see the point of this", gamers must be amongst the least imaginative people on Earth.

Can we get MS to slide a few dollars EA's way to make Madden a Play Anywhere title please?

Well we are talking about gamers. The same people who think choices are bad and brand loyalty is life.
 
This won't do that, since unless anything changed, the XB1 and PC versions are still technically speaking different builds of the game.
Nothing changed, except that now there are true uwp games coming to Xbox and soon that will be the norm.

Last year you'd still had to have a different build for Xbox, but that's no longer the case.
 
...

The port wasn't any easier because of the supposed tools, is what I'm saying. They still had the exact same work they would have to port it than they would if they didn't release it as a UWA...

It's crazy how people still believe the "Universal" myth and think XB1 and PC are running the same build, and think that their titles will automatically upgrade to ultra settings on Scorpio 2 or something.

Out of interest, are you a developer making games for both W10 and Xbox with the latest SDK's?
 

dLMN8R

Member
This isn't true but I really can't be arsed having this argument again.

Making a regular PC SKU, an X1 SKU and a W10 SKU is for all intents and purposes for modern developers using modern pipelines, making three games.

Are you a game developer and have you worked directly with the Universal Windows Platform?
 

LordRaptor

Member
Are you a game developer and have you worked directly with the Universal Windows Platform?

Yes and no, but are you going to tell me that fairly essential components of PC games such as options screens that console titles eschew are autogenerated by UWA?

Because I'm not going to believe that.
 

Synth

Member
...

The port wasn't any easier because of the supposed tools, is what I'm saying. They still had the exact same work they would have to port it than they would if they didn't release it as a UWA...

Sorry, I wasn't clear with the angle I was coming in at with the comment.

Basically, if the goal is to convince an XB1 player to purchase the game digitally... or hell, even a PC player to purchase the game off the store for the console price because they feel they may benefit from it being playable on a console at some point... then either scenario seems basically equivalent.

-If the Xbox version is trivial to turn into XPA, then you've done the work for two platforms (Xbox console and Steam), and then you leverage the XB1 version to create the XPA. More Xbox players buy it digitally instead of from Gamestop, can't sell it after a week, and so you're happy.

-If the Steam version is trivial to turn into XPA, then you've done the work for two platforms (Steam and Xbox console), and then you leverage the Steam version to create the XPA. More Xbox players buy it digitally instead of from Gamestop, can't sell it after a week, and so you're happy.

From the point of view of incentivising an XPA release, the two are basically equivalent cases unless the game was not already going to have a Steam release in the first place... which going by current release trends is seemingly less likely than the XB1 was not going to have a release in the first place.

Except PC sales tails are effectively infinite.
People buying 360 games today are statistical noise.

Let's be real here. Old console games sell... it's just that they've typically sold used via retail outlets. This has a lot to do with the fact that the games were historically not consistently available for digital purchase, and that the buyer couldn't expect the game to work on future hardware. Old PC games stopped being "statistical noise", because old PC games were made to be readily available for constant purchase, and patched up to work on modern PCs.
 

ekim

Member
I don't get the negativity here. I have always seen the Play Anywhere program as an addition to the Xbox copy. For example I bought RE7 to mainly play it on console but also now having a PC copy is quite cool. You can still buy it on Steam if you just have a PC. I don't see any problems here.
 

ekim

Member
Yes and no, but are you going to tell me that fairly essential components of PC games such as options screens that console titles eschew are autogenerated by UWA?

Because I'm not going to believe that.

The other way. The option screens are rather removed on the console versions. They will still play around with settings during development to find the sweet spot between performance and beauty.
 

LordRaptor

Member
The other way. The option screens are rather removed on the console versions. They will still play around with settings during development to find the sweet spot between performance and beauty.

In my experience, those have always been developer art sliders that get prettied up into an actual UI very late as part of the PC port cycle, because almost nobody builds tools until they really have to

e:
I don't get the negativity here. I have always seen the Play Anywhere program as an addition to the Xbox copy.

Yes, its a value-add for Xbox digital purchasers.
 

amdb00mer

Member
I wonder if WB will also have Injustice 2 has a XPA title? I know RE7 was not listed as such until real close to launch.
 
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