Lets start a topic to discuss about the Nintendo 3DS hardware. The idea of this thread is remove from games threads the discussion of how powerful or not the 3DS is and create a reference topic to everybody consult in future where we try to understand what this handled really can do or not.
I understand that measure the power of a machine is something very hard to do if you dont have all the specs in hand, but I believe we can approach from the truth here. The image I put above is because everybody here understand that 3DS is more powerful than a Dreamcast and less powerful than a Vita. But what kind of game a company can do with its hardware?
Is 3DS powerful enough to run a Monster Hunter game with all their detailed creatures?
Can the 3DS produce a lot of enemies like Rebel Strike?
Or even produce a game with lots of shaders like Riddick?
Or run any of these games?
http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/a...of-the-cursed-king-20051116001115384_640w.jpg
http://www.linickx.com/files/2008/05/ssx3.jpg
http://image.gamespotcdn.net/gamespot/images/2001/vgnews/102201/roguel_790screen009.jpg
http://images.fragland.net/screenshots/3632/2.jpg
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2002/vgnews/053102/ninjagaiden_screen002.jpg
http://media.teamxbox.com/games/ss/1297/1138623093.jpg
http://media.moddb.com/images/games/1/1/68/Far_Cry_qjpreviewth.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_cdADKZp-q...AI8/3Z0sVR_nKn0/s1600/granturismo4(ps2)_2.jpg
http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/RSC2_ARG_WRX2_640w.jpg
Most of the discuss about 3DS power came from the polycount that hardware can or not do.
Everybody that understand about hardwares say that polygons is not the best way to measure a hardware power. If its for polygons alone, the Ps2 was to be a more powerful machine than gamecube, but most of the games that was made for ps2 and ported to NGC had a better graphic in gamecube. In the inverse, none of the games that came from NGC to Ps2 looks better on Ps2. That is because there are a lot of things the machine need to do to display a game, like:
- Polygons / geometry
- Textures
- Light and shadows
- AI
- Physics
- Filters (like AA)
- after-effects (like transparency, reflection and other shaders)
It is the capacity of the machine to make this conjuncture of elements run together that make a fair understand of how powerful the hardware can be. This and the competency of the team that is working in this machine. Below has a good example. Look how this year's Driver look starving in polygons on wii version, but look a a driver made in 2007 after that.
Driver: San Francisco Wii (2011): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=px7pzla1PdM&feature=youtu.be
Driver Parallel lines Wii (2007): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKE4FkHpUyg
Its prove that not only the capacity of the machine is necessary, but the competence of the team that is working in this machine.
Other thing that is possible to discuss is the effects 3DS can do. I bring back this from other topics to use as a example of what we can expect when developers really try to utilize the hardware of a proper manner:
More than that, we know that 3DS has 128 MB of ram, thats twice the amount of ram found in XBOX. What other specs we know about 3DS hardware?
The rest of technical specs of these machines and what they can or not do, I will let to who really understand about this subject. But for me, this hardware is localized between D and E on the first screen in this thread.
I understand that measure the power of a machine is something very hard to do if you dont have all the specs in hand, but I believe we can approach from the truth here. The image I put above is because everybody here understand that 3DS is more powerful than a Dreamcast and less powerful than a Vita. But what kind of game a company can do with its hardware?
Is 3DS powerful enough to run a Monster Hunter game with all their detailed creatures?
Can the 3DS produce a lot of enemies like Rebel Strike?
Or even produce a game with lots of shaders like Riddick?
Or run any of these games?
http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/a...of-the-cursed-king-20051116001115384_640w.jpg
http://www.linickx.com/files/2008/05/ssx3.jpg
http://image.gamespotcdn.net/gamespot/images/2001/vgnews/102201/roguel_790screen009.jpg
http://images.fragland.net/screenshots/3632/2.jpg
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2002/vgnews/053102/ninjagaiden_screen002.jpg
http://media.teamxbox.com/games/ss/1297/1138623093.jpg
http://media.moddb.com/images/games/1/1/68/Far_Cry_qjpreviewth.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_cdADKZp-q...AI8/3Z0sVR_nKn0/s1600/granturismo4(ps2)_2.jpg
http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/RSC2_ARG_WRX2_640w.jpg
Most of the discuss about 3DS power came from the polycount that hardware can or not do.
Everybody that understand about hardwares say that polygons is not the best way to measure a hardware power. If its for polygons alone, the Ps2 was to be a more powerful machine than gamecube, but most of the games that was made for ps2 and ported to NGC had a better graphic in gamecube. In the inverse, none of the games that came from NGC to Ps2 looks better on Ps2. That is because there are a lot of things the machine need to do to display a game, like:
- Polygons / geometry
- Textures
- Light and shadows
- AI
- Physics
- Filters (like AA)
- after-effects (like transparency, reflection and other shaders)
It is the capacity of the machine to make this conjuncture of elements run together that make a fair understand of how powerful the hardware can be. This and the competency of the team that is working in this machine. Below has a good example. Look how this year's Driver look starving in polygons on wii version, but look a a driver made in 2007 after that.
Driver: San Francisco Wii (2011): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=px7pzla1PdM&feature=youtu.be
Driver Parallel lines Wii (2007): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKE4FkHpUyg
Its prove that not only the capacity of the machine is necessary, but the competence of the team that is working in this machine.
Other thing that is possible to discuss is the effects 3DS can do. I bring back this from other topics to use as a example of what we can expect when developers really try to utilize the hardware of a proper manner:
27 - What effects / shaders can the 3DS / Pica200 do?
The 3DS comes with a series of shaders ready in the box. DMP's MAESTRO technology is used for these; it is a customized version of OpenGL/ES1.1 with added features. In addition to the basic shaders, MAESTRO-2 g technology lets you see:
- Blending [a]
Allows for reflection, as mirrors, without having to bend processing (like was done in Ps2 and PSP). Same result, better performance.
- Cube environment map
A smart way to trace the light for different materials. The first picture is used the old method and the other the Cube environment map.
- Normal Map
More advanced that the Bump Mapping, creates a 3-d look in 2D textures.
- Procedural Texture
Allows use textures with good resolution (less blur) and saving space. Facilitates implementation of normal mapping and saves processing.
- tessellation
Subdivision of polygons antialiasing to image. Can split 1 polygon up to 16 times depending on the distance of the object. Helps save polygons and processing.
- Soft shadow
Allows the creation of real-time soft shadows on the environment and self-shadowing
- subsurface scattering
For showing light impact on different materials, including transparency and brightness
- Bidirectional Reflectance Distribution
Refraction of light that causes brightness on the edges of clothes and models.
- object rendering gas
Volumetric fog, perfect to do things like clouds.
See MINKAGE demo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-NQBKVlUBc
See more information and photos here:
http://translate.google.com.br/tran...20100715_380961.html&sl=ja&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8
and
http://translate.google.com.br/tran...20100716_381357.html&sl=ja&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8
MT Framework Mobile on 3DS
- Resident Evil Revelations
Revelations started for 3DS,it's not a project that was on another hardware and then moved to 3DS.
Takuechi says that at first people couldn't believe the results they were getting.
The game utilizes all the common rendering techniques on 360/PS3 like HDR rendering, surface shaders and normal maps, there are a lot more details in there and picture comparisons. Depth of field, gamma correction etc all are used.
In 3D mode it's 30fps (for each eye)
I don't know if these pics are new or not!!
Left without HDR, right with HDR
Left without color correction, right with it.
Motion Blur, apparently it's not compatible with 3D and is only used in 2D mode.
Left without motion blur, right with it.
Depth of Field
Normal maps
Surface shaders, self shadowing
More than that, we know that 3DS has 128 MB of ram, thats twice the amount of ram found in XBOX. What other specs we know about 3DS hardware?
The rest of technical specs of these machines and what they can or not do, I will let to who really understand about this subject. But for me, this hardware is localized between D and E on the first screen in this thread.