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[JoeM86]

Of course not but you're basing your argument off graphics lead to lower sales for MK8 when in reality it's the actual install base that is limiting its potential buyer reach. How can you possibly compare the two when the actual hardware scenario is completely different. Like someone else already pointed out MK8 has a higher attach ratio than Wii, so that in itself proves it did better. Revenue and profit cannot be compared because it's on a different platform, not to mention the various other factors thst we would never be able to understand such as loss in revenue from pack in, DLC, and peripheral sales.

Not to mention they're comparing almost 7 years on sale to just a few months.

Just to compare properly: Mario Kart 8 has sold 3.49m as of September 2014, which is 5 months on sale. To compare, Mario Kart Wii at September 2008, also 5 months on sale, it had sold 9.53m (http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2008/081031e.pdf)

Still a drop, but come on...if we're going to use figures to compare and spout gloom, can we at least use contextually valid figures?

 

[DarkLordMalik]

It is pretty crazy but 3DS won't ever reach GBA sales and Wii U won't even get close to GC sales.

 

[DXB-KNIGHT]

I think Nintendo should try out the animated movie industry for more ways to get revenue

Seeing how Nintendo is exploring various businesses, I won't put it past them.

 

[Led_Zeppelin]

Interesting data. Also with the 3ds numbers and their current perfomance it seems safe enough to say that the 3da will sell less than the gba hardware wise and match the software sales. I wonder how will Nintendo tackle the fact that both of their handheld and console are trending to be lowest selling system they have since the virtual boy.

I guess amiibo was the first step towards a new revenue stream by taking more money out of their existent fanbase.

 

[Team Top Hat]

You are putting words in his mouth by making this exaggerated claim.

You said MK8 had "horrible" profit margins. Something that can't be proven with the data that Celine has shared with us. And more importantly withouth providing any data of yours.

I never said such thing. I said compared to 35m vs 3m, Mario kart 8 is horrible in revenue and profit.

Obviously the game is ace.

 

[Griss]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

 

[VICI0US]

glad to see kid icarus uprising over the 1 million copies sold mark

still might be my favorite 3DS title, absolutely amazing game.

 

[omonimo]

Erm. The Wii and DS were MASSIVE sellers...... How is it a miracle they survived? Am I missing something here or are some people so full of hate for Nintendo that they just make shit up?

The latter.

I just said WiiU sold terribly even compared the GC which I don't expected. Probably if the budget invested was the 'normal'for this business, Nintendo could been in real trouble, yes. But Jeez the Nintendo fans defensiveness in some post. Ugh. I will be the first to buy a new console from them, if they put on it some decent specs. The hate, lol.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I don't know what else Nintendo can really do besides make something that abandons a lot of what Metroid's identity has been up until now. It's not like Super Metroid, Prime 1, and Other M didn't have fairly substantial marketing pushes, which points to the IP just not being all that appealing to the larger audience. I mean, they even tried to sell Prime 3 as a part of their "Wii Would Like to Play" campaign from the first year of the Wii, and the best they got was almost matching Super's sales, despite being a considerably more expensive game to make. It pains me to say this, but Metroid is caught between a rock and a hard place, and it left the grappling beam at home.

Metroid could easily be as big as Bioshock, but Nintendo would have to embrace dual analog as a control mechanism for that to happen. Letting the series branch out into more extravagant sci-fi without being tethered to the (now) mangled story of the main series would probably help as well. A spiritual reboot is probably in order.

Snip.

Metroid Prime is the best game in the Prime series. Prime 2 is a noticeable step down in level design and balance. Prime 3 is a motion controlled FPS, which limited the audience from the outset. Other M was a mistake.

 

[ToastyFrog]

My main takeaway from this is that fully 1/3 of people who owned an NES didn't own Super Mario Bros. Who were these criminals?

 

[Dr. Feel Good]

I never said such thing. I said compared to 35m vs 3m, Mario kart 8 is horrible in revenue and profit.

Obviously the game is ace.

Thanks captain obvious. Literally every game on the Wii U will see horrible revenue (don't assume on profit, you have no idea on what their margins are unless you want to provide actual data instead of assumptions) compared to their Wii counterparts because the hardware sales are so drastically different that the actual consumer pool they are selling to is a fraction of what it was last generation.

 

[Refreshment.01]

I never said such thing. I said compared to 35m vs 3m, Mario kart 8 is horrible in revenue and profit.

Obviously the game is ace.

i understand now, sorry for the confusion.

i don't understand to what was "Obviously the game is ace" adressed. Maybe other posters? Have never made any assessment of quality about this or that entry XD

 

[Flappy]

I just said WiiU sold terribly. Probably if the budget invested was the 'normal', Nintendo could been in real trouble, yes. But Jeez the Nintendo fans defensiveness in some post. Ugh.

Quoting your own post for you, since you can't remember what you said:

That's a miracle if this company it's survived to the Wiiu disaster.

 

[Celine]

Were the Rogue Squadron games not published by Nintendo on GC?

No.

 

[Ninjimbo]

It's the same reason GT6 sold so much less than GT5. They released too late in the console's life. People had moved on by that time.

It seems that way. I'm just shocked at the raw numbers. I didn't know Goldeneye had sold that much and not even half of the people that bought Goldeneye decided to come back and buy Perfect Dark. Crazy.

Perfect Dark was a much better game too.

 

[Dr. Feel Good]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

I would bet most original Prime buyers were duped into thinking it was a Halo type game for GameCube. It was a time where FPS started to gain a lot of traction in the console scene. Most people probably never actually enjoyed the game... It's not really casual friendly like say a Halo or CoD is.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

No.

Looking at N64, many Star Wars games are on that list, so it's not unreasonable to expect some were published by Nintendo on GC but didn't hit a million.
Edit: Oops, just realized you are the OP
I stand corrected

 

[omonimo]

Quoting your own post for you, since you can't remember what you said:

And? What's wrong with that? Just imagine if it happened to sony or MS to sold the same amount. It would been a total disaster for them.

 

[Eiolon]

Not seeing Tropical Freeze make even 1 million is heartbreaking.

 

[Ridley327]

Metroid could easily be as big as Bioshock, but Nintendo would have to embrace dual analog as a control mechanism for that to happen. Letting the series branch out into more extravagant sci-fi without being tethered to the (now) mangled story of the main series would probably help as well. A spiritual reboot is probably in order.

Arguably, Metroid is right about where Bioshock is these days, so you have a point there!

Ultimately, though, you seem to be saying what I alluded, in that a Metroid game needs to sorta not be a Metroid game in order to sell better.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

You need to look at the numbers again. Metroid sales are pretty much consistent or they paint a clear pattern through out all generations.

Metroid 1: 2.73
Super Metroid: 1.42
Prime 1: 2.75
Prime 2: 1.10
Prime 3: 1.41

Handhelds:
Return of Samus: 1.72
Fusion: 1.60
Zero Mission: <1.00

By your hyphotesis, looking at the declinie in sales from Metroid to Super Metroid (the most acclaimed game in the series no less) one would conclude that the public rejected the "Metroid formula"

The reason for the Corruption numbers can be atributed that there wasn't a "WOW!" factor that high end visuals bring to a franchise of this type. After all the Wii was GC hardware and the competition was a generation ahead. These type of users were looking at first person games in other consoles. The ones that bought Corruption were the die hard Metroid fans that would stick to any platform the game is in.

 

[_machine]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

Yup, as much as I loved the whole trilogy it doesn't really look like we'll be getting a sequel anytime soon. Even though the attach rate for the game might be quite good with the Wii U's limited userbase we're talking about sales that probably won't be enough to break even on a quite costly game and Nintendo can leverage Retro's talent for titles that are much more likely to be better bang for the buck.

 

[JimboJones]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

I think a game like Metroid Prime really benifits from graphical increases, it was at the time a looker for that generation of hardware and by 3 it was competing with the 360/PS3 games which looked much better and also probably where a large % of the type of audience for that type of game went.

The batman games are metroidvania esqe so there is probably still an audience for some metroid gameplay, maybe not exactly in the way it was presented in the prime games though.

 

[ReyVGM]

its very true for GB and GBC (I still don't get why Nintendo take them as one generation), but on the DS and DSi its not the case since all the DSi Games were just enhancements from the DS and the latter can play them all, the DSi is just a minor change from the DS, while the 3DS is a true generationla leap, for example..

the same goes when the New 3DS sales start, they should be counted as one since they are in the same hardware level

That's not true. The DS / DSi is the same exact thing as what the GB / GBC were.
The GBC had more powerful hardware and played games the original GB couldn't.
Same with the DSi, it had more powerful hardware, and it played tons of games that the DS couldn't. They were digital this time around, but they were DSi exclusive and do not run on a normal DS, not even if you manage to put them on a cart or if you use a DS emulator.
And the same deal now will happen with the 3DS and NEW 3DS.

 

[Seiniyta]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

There's a few things to consider. How much was Metroid Prime 2 marketed compared to 1. The same for metroid Prime 1. I remember having that Metroid Prime 3 promo channel on the Wii itself but I wonder how many people used that. The video quality then wasn't so great if I remember right. Was there a substantial marketing budget for the title or did they rely solely on the wii channel for the most part for marketing?

Metroid Prime 2 was also quite divisive. Still a really good game but more polarizing (hehe).

Do not count on people buying a sequel just on the merits of the first game. A good marketing team is needed as well to sell a game properly.

 

[Griss]

Metroid Prime is the best game in the Prime series. Prime 2 is a noticeable step down in level design and balance. Prime 3 is a motion controlled FPS, which limited the audience from the outset. Other M was a mistake.

Right, but Prime 2 reviewed almost as well as Prime and you would have expected the momentum to carry, but it didn't. The more in-depth opinion regarding MP1 vs 2 didn't really crystallise until later. That big of a drop tells me that tons of people didn't enjoy MP1.

I broadly agree with your entire point about each of the 4 games, though.

I would bet most original Prime buyers were duped into thinking it was a Halo type game for GameCube. It was a time where FPS started to gain a lot of traction in the console scene. Most people probably never actually enjoyed the game... It's not really casual friendly like say a Halo or CoD is.

That's pretty much my reading of it. That's a lot of gamers whose opinions upset me, but it's definitely not casual friendly.

Not seeing Tropical Freeze make even 1 million is heartbreaking.

Yeah it is. The difference between us is that I'm so jaded at this point by your Flappy Birdses and Kardashians etc that I no longer even expect the GOTY and the pinnacle of the much-loved platforming genre to actually sell.

 

[andrerobot]

KI Gold didn't make a million. Well, that was a really shitty game.

 

[jimi_dini]

had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals?

Can we stop calling the best controls ever a "gimmick"?

MP3 and MP1+2 from the MP trilogy on Wii play WAY better than the stone age analog stick controls on gamecube. That's simply a fact. RE4 on Wii also plays way better. The player is able to aim way more accurately.

Does anyone call analog thumbsticks a "gimmick"? Why not? You could still use the digipad. And analog thumbsticks were also created by Nintendo.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say.

No. Metroid Prime 2 Echoes was simply not anywhere near Metroid Prime 1.

The same happened to Other M. People figure this out pretty fast and then stop buying it. It's that easy.

So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system

You conventiently forgot that it still sold way better than Echoes. And plenty of people, who bought Echoes, were disappointed by it. I also never finished Echoes on Gamecube. I managed to do that in Trilogy on Wii.

A bad game after a superb game always sells better than it should simply because people buy it based on the previous game. Also see: SOCOM Confrontation. That one was utter shite and sold really well especially for what it was. Why? Because of the SOCOM games on PS2. SOCOM 4 was not as bad, but still bad. And it got the sales based on how bad Confrontation was.

btw. why didn't you mention that the original Metroid sold around 2.7 million copies and Super Metroid "flopped" and sold only 1.4 million?

 

[Pociask]

Wow - awesome compilation of sales data. Thanks!

The drop from Goldeneye to Perfect Dark...damn. With all the hype PD had, it didn't even come close to what Goldeneye did.

My initial reaction to these numbers was more along the lines of, damn, Nintendo went from crushing it on console FPS's, with Goldeneye being the third best seller for the console, to completely missing the boat during the Gamecube generation. It was Nintendo's game to lose - and they lost!

The other thing I found surprising was that, despite the 64 selling less than the SNES, look at all those million sellers. Was then when Nintendo perfected squeezing sales from its core fans? Or is that just a reflection of less third party choices?

 

[SuperEpicGuy]

Holy shit, I didn't know wii was doing so well. Wii U is almost 1/50th of that. One hell of a drop. They should have beefed up the system more and had more 3rd party support. Oh well.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Arguably, Metroid is right about where Bioshock is these days, so you have a point there!

Ultimately, though, you seem to be saying what I alluded, in that a Metroid game needs to sorta not be a Metroid game in order to sell better.

Bioshock is a poor man's Metroidvania. Castlevania: Lords of Shadow as well.

Batman is a great Metroidvania, and has a 4th iteration coming out soon. It's really the game anyone who's looking to reboot the franchise should be looking at. Arkham Asylum/City are probably the closest things to Super Metroid/Prime on modern consoles.

The formula can certainly be done with modern production values.

It can also be done 2D or 2.5D on a more modest budget, like Dust: ET, Outland, Strider, and Shadow Complex.

 

[OnPoint]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

....

... it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

A new 2D or 2.5D Metroid is, for my money, the way the series needs to go. But it needs to be pushed somehow. Whether it's an ad campaign, or an awesome companion anime series, or something else entirely, they need to make Metroid compelling to those who haven't stuck with the series or might not even know it exists. Let's be honest, the game is well-known by enthusiasts, but if you showed someone a bit more casual Samus they'd ask when Master Chief got a new paint job.

A new 3D Metroid, on the other hand, needs to be a pack-in to a new system I think. Get the franchise into the hands of EVERYONE who buys the system and you'll expand the reach of the franchise. And you can't do it on the Wii U because they don't seem interested in pushing that system much harder than they have.

 

[KillerMan91]

Nintendo might not have a hit every time, who does?, but one thing is sure, they know how to run a company. If they can make a profit off the GC then I am sure they will make one off the Wii U.

Gamecube sold actually more and games were cheaper to develop back then too. Not to mention it's kinda hard to say how much they profited from GC as GBA brought tons of profit to the company. As an overall project WiiU will not probably make any money.

 

[flattie]

Those are really, really upsetting numbers for the Metroid franchise.

Why? Because MP1 sold 2.78 million, probably on the back of reviews claiming it was one of the greatest games of all time. That critical reception would be echoed by the fans - almost everyone agrees it's a masterpiece. You'd expect the next game to do gangbusters having established a bar of quality like that. But instead they lost 1.68 million of the MP1 buyers.

But that's because the Cube was dead / dying, you say. So how do you explain MP3 only selling 1.41 on a system that was moving faster than free money, and had a good motion gimmick to recommend it to casuals? The only answer I can see there is that despite making incredible games and an initial splash, the market simply rejected the Metroid Prime formula. People don't want it. As these are 3 of my favourite games of all time, that is seriously upsetting to me.

It also explains why Nintendo took a hard left turn with Other M. The only consolation is that that shit-fest was properly rejected and didn't reach a million. (I would've cried if I'd seen it on that list.) But if Metroid Prime doesn't work in the market, and Nintendo's best idea fell flat on it's face critically and in terms of sales, then it's very hard to know what the future of the franchise could be.

I see them trying a 'New Super Metroid' type 2D deal. If that doesn't crack 1 million on the 3DS then you couldn't begrudge them shutting it down indefinitely. It doesn't help that Metroid games are probably right behind Zelda as the most expensive games Nintendo makes.

The only good argument for making a new 3D Metroid is if you do it at launch in order to get the hardcore on board and evangelising your system. Because it's the type of game that would make far more noise on the internet than actual sales. That's the best value it would have to Nintendo - giving 'gamer cred' (sorry, I really am) to a newly launched system. Sounds stupid but you want the hardcore gamers both in the media and on message boards on your side early, you want to make a splash at E3 and elsewhere and Metroid is the type of title that will do it. Outside of that, it just doesn't seem to make sense.

Maybe they [Nintendo] should have been a little more paced with the Prime games. We had three games following the same (brilliant) template within 5 years. I wonder if restricting the IP to one main entry per home console would have allowed people to build a little pent-up demand for the game. By the time Corruption launched, Metroid felt like a safe IP; 'you could miss this one, the next might be better' type thing.

7 years on (Other M doesn't count), I do wonder if Nintendo might be trying to manage the Metroid fanbase a little more intelligently by building up some demand for the franchise by letting it cool off for a while. It is clearly still in their thoughts having been touched upon in numerous interviews and by how prominent Samus tends to be in Nintendo's cross IP products, not to mention the various Virtual Console releases.

I still think an entry on the Wii U is possible, (2016 maybe), but I wouldn't be surprised to see it appear on the next system either.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

From the charts you can tell that Wii and DS Gen was the exception in the Nintendo hardware shipments decreasing over time

I think every rational person accepts this although i do still dome gaffers saying otherwise. However software wise the picture is alot different, according to the somewhat incomplete data avalible to us on the net atleast (Im talking Nintendo&3rd party sales.)

Completely disingenuous to say this in reference to GBA. I mean it's literally 12 year lifespan (GB), four year lifespan (GBA), eight year lifespan (DS). Given it's trajectory GBA could have outsold the DS if they weren't in such a rush because of PSP.

On the console side I see it more like "Hit! Miss! Miss! Miss! Hit! Miss!" It's not fate, it's not destiny. It's a bad product.

 

[ReyVGM]

The other thing I found surprising was that, despite the 64 selling less than the SNES, look at all those million sellers. Was then when Nintendo perfected squeezing sales from its core fans? Or is that just a reflection of less third party choices?

The SNES had a ton of amazing 3rd party games. You could have the console and not even play Nintendo games.
However, on the N64, you either played Nintendo games or you died. Baring a few exceptions.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

Bioshock is a poor man's Metroidvania. Castlevania: Lords of Shadow as well.

Batman is a great Metroidvania, and has a 4th iteration coming out soon. It's really the game anyone who's looking to reboot the franchise should be looking at. Arkham Asylum/City are probably the closest things to Super Metroid/Prime on modern consoles.

The formula can certainly be done with modern production values.

It can also be done 2D or 2.5D on a more modest budget, like Dust: ET, Outland, Strider, and Shadow Complex.

Would the Arkham games be nearly as big if they didn't star Batman? Not only is he recognized by everyone, he's benefited from fantastic presence in other media as well.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

Thank you for compiling this stuff!

The above chart is very interesting. There seems to be a very strong correlation between installed base and sales numbers of their flagship software releases.

Seeing the data like this, it would be very hard to justify them not going third-party if their hardware flops next generation as well.

 

[ScepticMatt]

Hmm... I didn't realize that WiiU software sales were this bad...

 

[omonimo]

Just a little ot. I admire Nintendo to release their sales data even for the worst scenario. Company should take example, especially sony.

 

[Ricky 7]

Fire Emblem: Awakening over a million, nice. Hopefully the new Smash Bros will have a similar effect for Monolith Soft's titles.

 

[Dead_Pixel]

Wow at the Wii install base! Link's crossbow training outsold NSMBU...

 

[Celine]

The other thing I found surprising was that, despite the 64 selling less than the SNES, look at all those million sellers. Was then when Nintendo perfected squeezing sales from its core fans? Or is that just a reflection of less third party choices?

 

[TheMoon]

Those Wii software sales.

THOSE WII SOFTWARE SALES.

You know, everbody just bought Wii Sports and nothing else. *cough* idiotic gaming myths *cough*

OP could've used more up-to-date data for Wii U and 3DS from September, though.

 

[sörine]

Just a little ot. I admire Nintendo to release their sales data even for the worst scenario. Company should take example, especially sony.

This is true. It'd be so great if we could get similar figures out of Sony & MS, not to mention older hardware makers like Sega, SNK, Atari, NEC, etc.

 

[jimi_dini]

Those Wii software sales.

THOSE WII SOFTWARE SALES.

And that's just 1st party.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/01/29/these-are-nintendos-lifetime-hardware-and-software-numbers

software sold in total: 892.34 million
Attach rate: 8.84

(source is IGN, so who knows...)

"But most people only played Wii Sports" ... bullshit

 

[Celine]

You know, everbody just bought Wii Sports and nothing else. *cough* idiotic gaming myths *cough*

OP could've used more up-to-date data for Wii U and 3DS from September, though.

Doesn't make sense to me update my datasheet at each quarter when most updated figures are given after FY closes.

Also no one should take as definitive data for 3DS and WiiU obviously.

EDIT:

Thank you for compiling this stuff!



The above chart is very interesting. There seems to be a very strong correlation between installed base and sales numbers of their flagship software releases.

Seeing the data like this, it would be very hard to justify them not going third-party if their hardware flops next generation as well.

Well, you didn't need that chart to know that software sales are tied to hardware sales/userbase (and viceversa).
What that chart shows is that it's in Nintendo best interest to never go third-party and try to create an healthy ecosystem for themselves.

 

[arnoldocastillo2003]

DAMN!!!!! those numbers are huge, now all we need is to SONY release their Software and Hardware sales from 1996 to 2014 to have an accurate comparison between both companies. If Sony ever does release this, it would be awesome to actually see the results of the comparison.

 

[Celine]

DAMN!!!!! those numbers are huge, now all we need is to SONY release their Software and Hardware sales from 1996 to 2014 to have an accurate comparison between both companies. If Sony ever does release this, it would be awesome to actually see the results of the comparison.

Hardware shipment are already available (more or less) for both Sony and Microsoft (and Sega too except MS, GG and maybe MD).
But this is not a thread meant for that.

 

[Jachaos]

This is really interesting. I read somewhere that Goldeneye was the best selling N64 game, and always assumed that was true.

Also, the 3DS was only at 44 million hardware sales as of last March?! I thought it was much higher than that. So it's probably ~50 million sales by now?

I imagine Goldeneye being the best selling was a "*in the US" thing.