-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Not a fan of BG3, but I DO hope this sends a message to AAA JRPG game devs.
- Thread starter -Zelda-
- Start date
nowhat
Member
TBH, the traditional turn-based JRPG stuff kinda sucks. It's just element vs. another. And RNG of course. Whereas with BG3, much of it has to do with positioning and using the environment to your advantage (or at times, to your demise). BG3 is much more engaging in that regard.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I agree with you!
Guilty_AI
Member
That is the premise of tactical turn based games. Stuff like Final Fantasy Tactics had similar mechanics.
btw, sales estimation is probably around 10M
Last edited:
Dynasty8
Member
I enjoy turn based games more, but that's not the only message I hope it sends.
Make sure the games have a good story, non cringy good writing and interesting characters. Oh and content. Oh and please challenge players instead of making the difficulty brain dead easy like FFXVI.
JRPGs can improve big time, but I feel like they're so afraid to take certain risks nowadays.
Make sure the games have a good story, non cringy good writing and interesting characters. Oh and content. Oh and please challenge players instead of making the difficulty brain dead easy like FFXVI.
JRPGs can improve big time, but I feel like they're so afraid to take certain risks nowadays.
Mossybrew
Member
Uh no thanks on that lesson, the fact that it is turn based is the worst part about it. The lessons to be learned are - invest in your game characters, and allow players meaningful choices, even if they are bad choices, even if they miss out on significant content due to choices.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Gold Member
Paging
SlimeGooGoo
SlimeGooGoo
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Persona 3 Remake
Trails Through Daybreak
Final Fantasy VII Rebirth
Metaphor
Yakuza 8
Eiyuden Chronicle
Dragons Dogma 2
SaGa Emerald Beyond
.
I count 6 turn based jrpgs and 2 action jrpgs releasing next year. I like turn based too, OP, but I think we’re good.
Trails Through Daybreak
Final Fantasy VII Rebirth
Metaphor
Yakuza 8
Eiyuden Chronicle
Dragons Dogma 2
SaGa Emerald Beyond
.
I count 6 turn based jrpgs and 2 action jrpgs releasing next year. I like turn based too, OP, but I think we’re good.
Flash Junkins
Member
Nope. You are wrong.
RoboFu
One of the green rats
It definitely got a hype boost from either being a delegated PlayStation GOTY contender where there was none or from people who like all the weird romance options. 
. maybe a mixture of both?
I really liked it but it wasn’t Zelda level of goodness that’s for sure.
. maybe a mixture of both?I really liked it but it wasn’t Zelda level of goodness that’s for sure.
Last edited:
VideoGameEnjoyer
Member
You like turn based RPG's but don't like BG3? That has got to be a very small section on the Venn diagram.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
I’m fan of turn based JRPGs but I have ZERO desire to play BG3…just not in to CRPG.
Last edited:
Hudo
Member
While I do love Baldur's Gate 3, I think that each developer should implement a combat system that they deem fun and interesting. For example, Atlus' "press turn/one more action" turn-based system is quite fun. I also enjoyed the action-rpg combat of FF7 remake.
The only developer I want to take note of Baldur's Gate 3 is BioWare.
The only developer I want to take note of Baldur's Gate 3 is BioWare.
VideoGameEnjoyer
Member
What is the functional difference? Is it making choices?
I ask because I didn't even know what CRPG meant when BG came out, and google says 'Computer Role-Playing Game' which is a very unhelpful descriptor and not even true for Baldur's Gate. I thought it might mean something to do with choices. Would appreciate an explanation of the differences.
lughnasadh123
Member
Take away the better writing if nothing else.
Dacvak
No one shall be brought before our LORD David Bowie without the true and secret knowledge of the Photoshop. For in that time, so shall He appear.
As much as I love the combat in BG3, that’s not what made it so good for me. I think the standout elements of the game are how rich almost every quest/side quest is, how every character has incredible mocapped acting/dialog, how detailed and explorable (yet not overwhelming) the whole world is, and, most importantly, how the game respects the player’s time. Yes, it’s an insanely long game (by my standards, anyway), but there were few if any moments where I felt like I was just completing filler or grinding.
Almost every single battle, action, and conversation I had in that game felt like it was meaningful enough for Larian to include. Everything always felt like it was somehow important and worth exploring. In a similar way to how BotW and TotK are master classes in environmental exploration being fulfilling and addictive, BG3 is the greatest example of narrative exploration (dialog and action-based) I’ve ever experienced in a game.
I famously dislike not only RPGs, but video game stories in general. The only other gaming stories I remember really caring about are like Mass Effect and TLoU. I also don’t care for high fantasy. Yet somehow BG3 just excelled so much that it immediately shot up to my favorite RPG of all time. It’s stupidly good and absolutely deserved the GOTY (even if my personal choice was TotK).
I’m so happy for Larian. They must be in cloud 9 today.
Almost every single battle, action, and conversation I had in that game felt like it was meaningful enough for Larian to include. Everything always felt like it was somehow important and worth exploring. In a similar way to how BotW and TotK are master classes in environmental exploration being fulfilling and addictive, BG3 is the greatest example of narrative exploration (dialog and action-based) I’ve ever experienced in a game.
I famously dislike not only RPGs, but video game stories in general. The only other gaming stories I remember really caring about are like Mass Effect and TLoU. I also don’t care for high fantasy. Yet somehow BG3 just excelled so much that it immediately shot up to my favorite RPG of all time. It’s stupidly good and absolutely deserved the GOTY (even if my personal choice was TotK).
I’m so happy for Larian. They must be in cloud 9 today.
Guilty_AI
Member
Not surprising considering the average RPG mechanics were designed with turn based combat in mind.
Last edited:
Guilty_AI
Member
Don't you want a new Final Fantasy Tactics?
Last edited:
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
I’m so sick of this type of BS, same shit happened with Witcher 3, everyone saying every game needs to be like Witcher 3 and now it BG3……FUCK THAT!
If you guys don’t like how JRPG plays and tells its story then go fucking play western RPG or CRPG. I got in to JRPGs because they are nothing like them.
If you guys don’t like how JRPG plays and tells its story then go fucking play western RPG or CRPG. I got in to JRPGs because they are nothing like them.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
You can keep fucking comparing every fucking game to BG3 but I’m not never gonna be in to BG3….you enjoy that game then more power to you.
Last edited:
Guilty_AI
Member
But would you be into a new FF tactics tho? I know i would.
Last edited:
Lucie Goosey
Member
Yup.
I haven't heard of a single person, IRL or online, that was excited about the turn based combat, knew it existed, or praised it above all other things in the game.
The main appeal appears to be that it's an actual RPG and properly done.
But, also very little to no complaints about the combat.
Guilty_AI
Member
I think OP is just saying the logic of turning historically turn-based/tactical games into action-based because of "appeal", like FFXVI did, doesn't fly anymore.
Last edited:
March Climber
Member
Exactly. OP is taking away the wrong lesson from Larian's win. Their win has nothing to do with turn-based gameplay.
It has everything to do with the narrative/storytelling and the delivery of the product instead.
Guilty_AI
Member
OP is not telling JRPG devs to make their games like CRPGs. She's saying the excuse of turning turn-based/tactical AAA JRPGs into action-based because of "wide-appeal" is not an excuse that flies anymore, not when the GOTY winner was a turn-based game with classic "non-appealing" mechanics.
She's telling the OPPOSITE of what you and other users are implying she's saying. She's telling devs that you can stick with classic roots and still make a popular mainstream game, and that BG3 showed that. That you do not need to dumb things down or turn everything into an action game to sell.
Last edited:
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
We are still getting plenty of turn based JRPG, this year alone we got Octopath 2 which was FANTASTIC game and 2024 we are getting Metaphor. I want and need both turn based and action JRPGs......like Granblue Fantasy Relink and FFVII Rebirth as my action JRPG and Metaphor and Persona 3 Reload as my Turn based RPG.
Guilty_AI
Member
Yeah but those are nicher, mid-low budget titles. She's refering specifically to AAA JRPG devs, that they don't have to stick with the idea AAA JRPGs must all restrain their mechanics and dumb everything down.
For you, imagine something like Octopath 2 with the budget, production and scope of FFXVI. Thats what BG3 feels like to many traditional rpg fans.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
I dont care if its AA or AAAAA as long as the game is good and Octopath series brought great 2D-HD visuals style to gaming which happened because of its AA game.
Last edited:
Guilty_AI
Member
Still, wouldn't you like to see a game with the same mechanical depth, creativity and great writing as many of these AA games you play, combined with great visual fidelity, full skillful voice acting and motion capture?
The formers were often waved away in the name of 'being safe', but BG3 just proved you can have it all, that a game like that can still sell as much as it needs to. You can have a Final Fantasy Tactics that looks like Final Fantasy XVI.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
Like I said many time I care faaaaaaar more about aesthetics over high tech graphics, this is why to me Metaphor looks phenomenal because of its interesting visual style.
also
You mean scan faces?......no thank you, I dont want that in my JRPG.
Last edited:
nowhat
Member
Dude, chill.
...and also, might I suggest fucking a bear to relieve all that tension.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
Guilty_AI
Member
Its not just about visual style, motion capture can convey emotions that is hard to do with just VA or text boxes. Same with things like lightining, proper visual direction, etc.
Just compare a full-fledge cutscene in FFXVI with the character talking to a random person in a side-quest. Wouldn't rather if all of the interactions in the game had the same degree of touch and attention as those cutscenes?
What if a game like Persona or Metaphor had a much higher amount of anime-style cutscenes, rather than characters just standing around moving their arms awkwardly? Or at least they used and improved the game visuals to make them as good as one of those anime cutscenes? Its the kind of thing the power of money and graphical tech can bring.
Last edited:
nowhat
Member
Yeah, all you're doing is running away from them. Try to embrace it.I had enough of bears.......
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
Have you not watched Persona 3 Reload and Metaphor trailers? Not we are getting anime cutscenes, we are also high quality 3D cutscenes. Also games like Elden Ring and Armored Core VI had ANY "motion capture" but that didn't stopped me from enjoying those games.
Unlike most people in GAF, for me high budget and tech is not all that important to me, as long as I liked overall aesthetics, I'm happy.