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Ok GAF lets battle it out. Which franchise is better F-Zero or Wipeout
- Thread starter nin1000
- Start date
I really did not like the Vita version of Wipeout.. 30fps just seems pointless and they went for a more rugged look.I think you mean Wipeout Fusion and not 2097.And isn't Wipeout on Vita all-new content though? And Omega includes all of its tracks, so that's sweet.
Makes me so mad that was their last game. Sony fucked so many studios with the Vita.
This thread is like a competition between Quake Champions and Doom 1.
It's ridiculous.
The PSP games are also 30 fps and were also excellent games. Same as Wipeout XL/2097 etc.
But I'm glad it's 60fps in the omega collection.
It's ridiculous.
The PSP games are also 30 fps and were also excellent games. Same as Wipeout XL/2097 etc.
But I'm glad it's 60fps in the omega collection.
Can I vote for this post? I choose it over either of the poll answers.I watched this thread for a few days and thought about it but in the end i'm not gonna vote. I can't decide and im just happy they both exist(ed
To the people who like one, but actually dislike the other... I'm sorry but that just shouldn't be possible. You're wrong, and it makes me wonder if you even realise what's so great about the one you do like. Frankly, you'd have to be a fool not to like either, assuming you like racing games in the slightest.
Burning Justice
the superior princess
Played both F-Zero X and F-Zero GX for the first time a few years ago and loved both. Played Wipeout HD + Fury for the first time a couple years ago and couldn't really get into it.
So... F-Zero.
So... F-Zero.
This post shows I can never take an opinion you offer on gaming seriously, ever. You have such a narrow definition of what a 'game' should be.
This thread is like a competition between Quake Champions and Doom 1.
It's ridiculous.
The PSP games are also 30 fps and were also excellent games. Same as Wipeout XL/2097 etc.
But I'm glad it's 60fps in the omega collection.
LOL Those GIFs are some fine cherry picking. Lets compare skillful driving in Wipeout to driving in F Zero by someone who has no idea what they are doing and also lets pick a GIF of a stage that is only in one mission.
Also i think you got it mixed up which game is the Doom 1 and Quake Champions equivalent. But since you only played a bit of GX its not hard to understand why.
How in the fuck is that cherry picking? The 3 second snippets at 320x240 are not meant to be exemplary of anything except cool, futuristic looking games.
If you take offence at that, maybe take a deep breath and relax.
I did not take any offence just found the comparison ludicrous. He specifically called it the equivalent of doom 1 which makes no sense and borders on trolling. He also compared it to Dick Tracey?. Like its fine if he likes the game better but to act like he knows F Zero at all because he played it for maybe 2 hours is nonsense and he knows it.
tenderbrew
Member
Watching AGDQ time trial FZGX speed-runs. So good.
Can't believe people don't like the aesthetics in this game. So varied. So many cool planets with so many things going on.
Can't believe people don't like the aesthetics in this game. So varied. So many cool planets with so many things going on.
Greatest Ever
Member
How's RedOut?
Ok not great. Like in a world without new F-Zero or Wipeout it's decent.. but still does not hold a candle to them.
That said I am still glad they made it and hope they continue improving on it.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
The GBA games (which are three!) are not ports. Climax in particular is a great game.
They are so different, I don't know why this is so hard to understand. Just look at the gifs that were just posted, it's night and day. In fact, I would say that Sonic Unleashed (daylight stages) is closer to F-Zero than Wipeout is.
Even though the F-Zero GX screenshot is not showing a highlight scene for the course design, it is so obvious how much better the controls are from just those gifs, you are right, this is a strange competition.This thread is like a competition between Quake Champions and Doom 1.
It's ridiculous.
There is[/] a multiplayer in X and GX...
I can't wait until I'm so good at the internet, I can tell how well a game controls just from animated gifs.
Chiramii
Member
This. F-Zero got a great sense of speed and does not have terrible floaty controls. F-Zero for me. Didn't enjoy Wipeout at all.
Are you saying you've noy played Wipeout HD?
the androgyne
Member
I didn't say anything about how different they are, other than implying they're both outstanding. If you can't see that, you're free to go back to playing Sonic.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
You cannot judge everything, but you can see right away the difference in reaction to moving left / right in both games.
I don't get how you come to that conclusion. I have played Wipeout HD, though I have more experience with the Vita game (naturally, since I own the Vita game, but don't own a PS3).
Well, yes, I don't see it in the sense that I could feel joy from playing Wipeout and I will certainly play two Sonic games this year.
As someone that loves all four games (Q3A, UT, F-Zero and WipEout), I'd argue that one a gameplay level, you've got these comparisons the wrong way around. Quake 3 Arena is the momentum based game with smooth flowing movements, whilst UT is the twitchy direct game where the characters move in a far more digital manner.
Stylistically, I would agree with F-Zero being more like Quake (character focused, colourful outlandish personalities), whilst WipEout is more UT (sleek industrial designs, more focused on team representation).
I also think that whilst it's close in both situations... Quake > UT and WipEout > F-Zero.
Yup. The fact that anybody would try to use momentum as an argument against a fucking racer, is imo just stupid. Perhaps he just generally doesn't like racers, with F-Zero being an exception as it takes the focus off something that's inherent to the genre naturally (because physics), but then just say that... don't act like your car/ship/whatever is supposed to handle like Bayonetta in order to be a good racing game.
What I can see are tight, winding turns in the Wipeout HD gif versus driving in a wide-ass track barely doing much of anything. Somehow that shows how obviously F-Zero GX is so much better? You've been talking complete nonsense throughout this thread.
It's not cherry picking at all. 99% of F-Zero footage is exactly like that, same for wipeout.
"No idea what they're doing" - driving f-zero normally, not glitching about.
Just because they're not doing exploits in f-zero like in all the other gifs people post to make it look more interesting, which is actual cherry picking. That's probably the most authentic representation of f-zero on gaf.
I've put in enough hours into F-Zero tbh. If I want arcade, Trackmania 2 Lagoon just released.
It's excellent.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
But it is not true, I like for instance:
- Burnout 1 & 2 (3 is also OK, but I like the stronger focus on racing in the first two)
- Need for Speed Underground 1 & 2
- Mario Kart series
- Excite Truck
- Sonic & All-Stars Racing
- Out Run
- Ridge Racer series
Now regarding the controls argument, the F-Zero X controls are so incredible also because of their flexibility. Look at these two world record runs, this level of control is just amazing:
- An example for tight cornering on a more straight forward track: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2GZZgYqXpw
- An example for amazing turns on a track that would be probably completely unsurvivable in Wipeout: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QX2ORAdKJy8
Let's not be silly. That was totally cherry-picked. It's from a story mode chapter that takes place on a highway with no real turns at all. If you're going to use a gif to represent F-Zero is should come from the tracks/races from the GP cups.
With that said though, I do agree that the cast majority will still show courses that are far wider, with far more driving straight forwards than any given moment in a WipEout game. The game be design just doesn't opt to have a constant series of challenging corners, because the core mechanic banks on players depleting their energy to the point where a single scrape against the wall kills... so it's made easy in general to avoid even that single scrape occurring.
Most of the time racing in F-Zero is very slight bends with super wide tracks. I'm not saying it doesn't have corners, but let's be real, it's not close to wipeout.
He insults the racer because they aren't snake glitching to go faster and make it look cool, like in pretty much every other gif of f-zero here, and that's how it looks with normal gameplay.
Here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsUC1x7Xvt4
And he's still glitching
the androgyne
Member
Two good representations:
Wipeout 2097/XL - Phenitia Park - Phantom Speed
F-Zero GX Sand Ocean Lateral Shift - No Snaking
Wipeout 2097/XL - Phenitia Park - Phantom Speed
F-Zero GX Sand Ocean Lateral Shift - No Snaking
Wipeout as a franchise over many different platforms is better as a whole, in my opinion. Buuuut F-Zero has the best game in it, F-Zero GX. Picked Wipeout due to me enjoying many entries over many platforms, but if I had to pick the single best game out of all games of both, it would go to F-Zero.
Unaha-Closp
Member
I have very fond memories of Rave Culture and the emergence of WipEout in the UK. Many a chill out at someone's house afterwards would have WipEout on and it was great. Haven't played F-Zero so can't comment. The Capital E is as daft as it is applicable - least in my experience in that time.
How's he reaching 4000km/h without snaking or glitching? Other videos show 1000:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AjVYj1RCSg
Here's some high speed wipeout footage, with actual corners - and without glitching the game:
Alias03
Member
LOL are you really serious?? It's almost like people can't own more than one system....
Bullshit. Just because you have to plan a corner earlier in Wipeout does not make the controls any more critical. You turn any later on most corners at higher speeds it will fuck up your run.
I'd hate to know what you think about games like SSX or Wave Race where the avatar you're controlling doesn't react immediately because of the surface they're moving across.
the androgyne
Member
He's shift boosting (briefly leaving the track surface to gain speed)
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Max Speed setting, different machine, not crashing into walls...
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Haven't played SSX, hate Wave Race (EDIT: And that is even though I completely beat the GameCube game, it's not because I suck at the game, it's because I don't find it enjoyable.).
So you don't like games that don't occur on anything but a road or road-like surface. That must mean games like Wipeout, Wave Race, Rapid Racer, Hydro Thunder, Cool Boarders, SSX and Amped all handle like shit because you don't turn right away when you push the left or right d-pad arrow.
Or maybe it's a taste thing and none of those games are objectively worse than GX.
Do you have any experience with any racing games that don't involve roads? Serious question.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Of those I enjoyed Amped 3. But please look into my posts in this topic and find where I use objectively, maybe then you can get an idea what I think in that regard.
You are being so delusional and ridiculous to the point that is ironic.
How can you even doubt that i was talking about the style? Do you really think that has person that is mentally sane would argue that a game that was released in 2003 is technically better than games that were released in 2008/2012/2017 on much more modern hardware? No seriously, answer that... did you really really think that i was talking about technically over stylistically?
The Dolphin comment was merely an addendum to state that with a bit of polish through heavy increase of internal resolution output and some heavy anti aliasing filtering the game is still a gem to look at despite its age even for those that usually can't stomach stuff that came out earlier than the seventh gen of consoles which is something that can't be said for all games.
They're also both pretty different despite being aesthetically similar, which is what makes this thread really funny.
Much of what you listed has far less "direct" and/or immediate maneuverability then WipEout does... some laughably so (Need for Speed Underground). Regardless of individual game picks though, using momentum as a negative for racers is ridiculous. WipEout feels "floaty" because it's antigravity racing... you're floating. If anything it's F-Zero that has the disconnect between the premise and the handling model, with the ship effectively being more of a bobsled than a AG craft in practice. Having a preference for this is fine and all, but you're not framing it as one.. you're acting like it's objectively better for heavy shit to act weightless, because accounting for that weight is something you don't like to deal with.
The videos you show don't show me much in the way of flexibility tbh. The flexibility in F-Zero is primarily in the insane pull you have on the ship in the air, but in your examples it's just akin to doing a barrel roll off some undulation in WipEout, and in other examples, it's just outright breaking the game's mechanics entirely, invalidating course designs.
Also, I don't get how you have the idea that a WipEout ship would be unable to navigate a course like the second video... it's super wide, with round corners leading to long straights. WipEout courses are routinely filled with tighter corners, on narrower tracks with undulation everywhere (something F-Zero uses very little of in general). Look at something like the right-angled platforms in Spilskinanke or the narrow hairpins of Sebenco Climb... you can make incredibly sharp corners on Wipeout even when boosting directly into them... it's just a case of actually handling the ship's momentum in order to do so.
Honestly, the more you talk about WipEout, the more it just seems like you simply don't understand how to play it, and just chalk it up to the game's mechanics being limiting, rather than you just having limited grasp of them.
I'm not saying I disagree with the general point. F-Zero's courses are far less windy, with far longer straights, and far wider despite the handling system being more direct. I just don't think it's useful to display overly exaggerated examples of this. That was a stage with zero corners, because it's a battle. When you have a point worth making, there's no reason to devalue it by picking something non-representative.
^Tonnes of stages have lots of sections like that, I just picked a random section. Doesn't really make a difference if that track had NO corners at all, that's actually kinda worse.
I wanted to show what it looked like when you're not glitching to get higher speeds like most other footage here.
Glitching f-zero looks like crazy fast, dodging left/right, but that's a different comparison to just comparing standard gameplay.
I wanted to show what it looked like when you're not glitching to get higher speeds like most other footage here.
Glitching f-zero looks like crazy fast, dodging left/right, but that's a different comparison to just comparing standard gameplay.
staticneuron
Member
This thread is crazy. Wipeout is better. Maybe not at first, but the last entries were amazing.
Team Wipeout, it's the better and more fun to play game.
lol
Upcoming Wipeout game vs the latest F-Zero:
I think the winner is clear. Game over indeed.
lol
Jack The Nipper
Banned
Ps3 definitely isn't best Wipeout. Tracks are very narrow and just feels different
I would not call a port of old games "Wipeout still gets games".
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