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[ResurrectedContrarian]

All after the sheer success of Critical Role in introducing people to D&D as a whole.

Critical Role captures exactly what I hate about newer D&D.

If you watch them play, it's basically "drama club nerds who need their character and acting to be the center of attention."

Classic D&D wasn't a hang-out for drama-class rejects. It was a game borne of guys who loved tactical wargames, and who would recreate battles or historical maps on a table, who knew obscure things about French polearm weapons or loved to debate the stats of mounted attacks on different terrain--mixed with a love of hefty lore from things like Lord of the Rings. That's a totally different demographic than the one playing 5e.

 

[semiconscious]

I love BG3, but I'm also really enjoying Starfield. I don't think the two naturally cancel each other out. To write an article about it just seems like doing it for the clicks.

Again, everyone is different so experiences may vary. I'd say both BG3 and Starfield are a win for gaming in general.

y'think? with articles like this, who needs chatgpt?...

 

[RespawnX]

People running around and searching for the generated content instead of playing the dozens of hand made quests and locations.
Equivalent would be running in Skyrim up and down the roads waiting for the usual "help me" NPC, attacking bandits or complain about the spawning random dragons which look all the same.

Pure clickbait bullshit. 45h down into the game and nearly any quest and activity open without any need to touch any generated content. Just started my first faction quest line. I barely used the ship designer, didn't build a base, I'm still at the beginning of the skill system (lvl 32). Only thing a really completed was the main quest and a few minor side quests. There is a lot to do.

Only thing really ruined this guy are the drugs which fucked up his brain to write such clickbait bs. There is a lot to complain about the game but not the amount and variety of content.

 

[Punished Miku]

The question isn't whether or not PC Gamer is full of clickbait garbage, it is. The question is whether or not his criticisms are fair. I haven't seen anyone say that he was totally wrong or missed something major in Starfield that could change his opinion.

Honestly even engaging with this stuff at all means you've already lost.

"It's disappointing compared to a revelatory experience like Baldur's Gate 3, but it's not even really living up to Bethesda's own standards either. 15 years ago, Fallout 3 had more interesting environments than this, full of computers to hack, turrets and robots to take control of, unique notes and audiologs to find, traps to subvert, and factions to side with. I've made fun of Bethesda's approach to environmental storytelling before (we should aspire to greater subtlety than two posed skeletons with a note next to them) but at least it was storytelling. Starfield is a world of repeating rooms full of angry bandits and randomised loot."

I've literally already hacked computers, taken control of turrets and robots, found many audiologs in Starfield. To even suggest that there's not "factions to side with" is one of the most odd things to even type. The factions are numerous, each with a quest line that's large enough to almost feel like it's own game. I don't think the environments in Fallout are more interesting than the insanely huge and detailed cities they've created here, or the large space stations and battleships.

No one wants to bother to correct this guy because it's clickbait trash. Now we're debating back and forth, which is by design. That's the whole point. I don't care if anyone hates Starfield. Makes no difference to me at all. The only thing to actually comment on is how obvious the motivations are behind the headline and article, because that's all that actually matters.

He also complains about the factions not locking you out of content when you pick one. That's fine if you like to replay games over and over, and I can see the appeal. But I would honestly hate that personally. Each faction has a huge quest line and I think it would be terrible if you can't do any UC content if you do a Freestar quest first. This lets you just do everything. It's just a different approach (one I prefer for a long game I will almost likely never fully replay).

 

[Games of Today]

Play Stalefield first, then play Baldur's gate 3.
Problem will then be somewhat mitigated.
Or just skip Stalefield.

Or just be realistic?

Baldur's Gate 3 is an obvious fluke among games. The devs poured a ton of effort into what it is.

And so did Bethesda but it's a very different game. Baldaurs gate doesn't have the capability of stacking a thousand potatoes in a room and fucking around with them.

So far I've only played side missions and jobs but they are what I expecting and then some from Bethesda.

The random planet generation seems to be the make or break for people.

 

[SirTerry-T]

Isn't Total War: Warhammer III THE game when it comes to Warhammer Fantasy?

WH Fantasy Battle, yep not WHFRP

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

I just can't play games that are set up like this anymore. It's not worth the time.

To be fair though, that comment is speaking about filling in the world with things to do in the procedural planets. Starfield also has more handcrafted content than any previous BGS game by far, and most of that is what this person is looking for. And no doubt has found, as the game clearly lays out that stuff.

 

[Chronicle]

So silly. They both do very different things. And both can co-exist in their own niches.

Not sure why the hyperbole or negativity is necessary. Starfield is not a top down CRPG, BG3 is not an open-world simulation RPG spanning a galaxy of 1,000 planets.

But console wars!!!!

 

[DeepEnigma]

But console wars!!!!

PC Gamer site talking about two games that are on the PC. Nothing to do with console wars.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

But console wars!!!!

Right?!

It’s like, why can’t it be that both games are excellent in what each sets out to do, which are both very different from each other. And shouldn’t we all just be happy that both of these insanely large games both exist and were made for us to play them?

I don’t understand why one has to fail for the other to be considered the good one, or the winner.

We all win because two different companies spent 5 years and hundreds of million of dollars making these 2 amazing games. Wow, what a time to be a gamer!

Heaven forbid we enjoy them.

 

[Little Chicken]

Just more clickbait trash, hard times at PCgamer.

 

[SirTerry-T]

Do PC Gamer still let the producers of games write the reviews of their games for them?

That may or may not have happened "back in the day".

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Kind of an unfair comparison since BG3 is one of a kind game with a quality that rarely happens in the industry.

But yeah, just as with Horizon facing BotW in 2017, the experience side to side might be a little stale.

Same thing happened to H:FW too, was overshadowed by GotG contender Elden Ring as well all know.

 

[kuncol02]

Just more clickbait trash, hard times at PCgamer.

Add to that their review and you may start to think that someone from Bethesda killed their editor-in-chief pet.

 

[Chukhopops]

Just more clickbait trash, hard times at PCgamer.

Makes space seem like a boring, barren expanse

It’s wild how a sentence can at the same time be completely obvious and yet entirely wrong in the context of Starfield.

 

[StueyDuck]

 

[Dacvak]

Can someone put me in a 4 week coma so I don’t have to read about Starfield anymore on GAF

 

[Crayon]

Errr I know what I'm getting once I get to start the game. It's not going to be an in depth or even well balanced rpg. I'm going to play it expecting an immersive sandboxy game.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

People hyped up Starfield to the moon and back. Of course the pendulum is going to swing back the other way when the game gets released, and it doesn't meet the urber hype behind it.

This article is about as tasteless as all the hype articles and threads that came before it.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Same thing happened to H:FW too, was overshadowed by GotG contender Elden Ring as well all know.

And the first Horizon was overshadowed by BotW lmao. Series is cursed

 

[KungFucius]

Yeah…dipping my toes into Starfield yesterday and it feels like more of the same, and spread out too thin. It’s not bad, it’s just feels like the same game we’ve been playing for the last 15 years with a bit more polish. BG3 feels like a legit next gen leap forward, and Starfield feels like a step back. I’ll keep playing, but one is definitely living up to the hype and the other isn’t.

It seems more like one is exceeding the hype by a long shot and the other

Another starfield thread. Definitely the most talked about game of the generation.

alongside ToTK which is... checks math, the most talked about game of the PS360 era.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

One of Sony's best exclusives of 2023.

 

[Thaedolus]

One of Sony's best exclusives of 2023.

Except I was playing it a month earlier than my PS5-only buddy on PC

 

[avin]

BG3 is an awesome game, no question, maybe my GOTY. But I'm starting to think that Starfield is the kind of phenomenon that everything and everybody defines themselves by. At least right now, everyone feels the need to have an opinion, and to tell everyone else about it.

It's still too early to tell if this thing has legs, but I imagine it'll have big tits at least, hopefully any day now.

avin

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Except I was playing it a month earlier than my PS5-only buddy on PC

I'm better, I'm not playing it nor gonna touch it even if given for free.

 

[H From Steps]

So silly. They both do very different things. And both can co-exist in their own niches.

Not sure why the hyperbole or negativity is necessary. Starfield is not a top down CRPG, BG3 is not an open-world simulation RPG spanning a galaxy of 1,000 planets.

People tend to compare things all the time doesn’t matter if it’s games, films or music just the world we live in I agree with you they do two completely different things I personally couldn’t keep playing BG3 as I’m not a big fan of CRPG but I’ll definitely give it it’s props for bringing something else to games in general and from what I’ve seen gets my vote for game of the year but besides that I’m loving Starfield so far and it’s a lot of fun

 

[Clintizzle]

Having sex with a woman ruined starfield for me.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

People tend to compare things all the time doesn’t matter if it’s games, films or music just the world we live in I agree with you they do two completely different things I personally couldn’t keep playing BG3 as I’m not a big fan of CRPG but I’ll definitely give it it’s props for bringing something else to games in general and from what I’ve seen gets my vote for game of the year but besides that I’m loving Starfield so far and it’s a lot of fun

I yearn for a better world lmao. Join me!

Also I feel like we might actually be the same person. “Did we just become best friends?!”

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Having sex with a woman ruined starfield for me.

But isn’t that like, not even a new thing for BGS games, tho. I feel like you can do that in at least two other recent Bethesda games.

 

[The artful mincer]

Stop comparing games to BG3! You will hurt devs feelings!

 

[H From Steps]

I yearn for a better world lmao. Join me!

Also I feel like we might actually be the same person. “Did we just become best friends?!”

Maybe we did but I’m just a humble lurker back to the shadows I go

 

[EDMIX]

I agree that BG3 is a superior game.

However, it was very expressly built from the ground up with impactful choices in mind. That isn't the only hallmark of an RPG. If anything, that's quite rare anymore and nearly non-existent outside of CRPGs.

They're trying to do completely different things.

I don't disagree, they are different things in terms of what they are trying to do, but it begs to question why would Starfield omit meaningful or impactful choices?

Its not as if Starfield MUST be the void of choice in order to be successful at the core concept of what they are doing mind you and its not as if that is some odd thing when talking about a Bethesda game, need I remind you of the choices in Skyrim regarding factions or even in Fallout 4 regarding Megaton or Fallout New Vegas etc

So I understand BG3 having a game built around impactful choice, I actually don't get that being absent in Starfield by a team that has done this a fuck ton in the past.

Steal a ship and want to throw everyone out in the airlock, have a crew member disagree. Have a person on the ship plead their case on why they shouldn't be killed even though they are a pirate and that they can be useful.

A planet poses a threat of war and now you steal a ship that happens to have nukes. Nuke the planet and prevent an all out war in the star system, but nuking the planet now kills millions on that settlement and many people will now be hunting you down for revenge.

That is simply off the top of my head btw. If any of those things existed in this game, none of us would be questioning any of that shit sir, that is what was in past titles in terms of those types of choices.

 

[anthraticus]

If you're not a pre teen that needs soo bad to play the 'cool new thing', you don't play either and wait on mods to help try and fix all the fuck ups, degeneracy, etc..

 

[I Love Rock 'n' Roll]

It's easy, one is the game of the year (and is still not on Xbox), one is not...

 

[EDMIX]

Understand I still judge every game based on their own merit of what they offer individually that being said Baldur's gate 3 does a great job of reminding us what amazing RPG's actually are in regards to engaging storytelling and interesting core role playing mechanics.

I don't care that much that the space exploration is lacking if it was fully focused on being the classic RPG's that this team is known for I could just Settle on knowing it's going to be something like that, But hearing that it's not even in the same ballpark as Elder scrolls or fallout Is very disheartening. So I don't know what to say , if BG3 did not come out this year maybe more time would have been focused just playing Starfield but when you have such a polished RPG that released prior it starts to highlight all of starfield's problems even more....

At the same time I don't believe if BG3 just magically skipped this year that we would just ignore all of these issues with Starfield. I'm literally only going in this expecting the same type of RPG the team is used to making and to even here it's actually not that to the same degree makes this shit even sadder because that's at the very baseline of what I was expecting not some looter shooter type thing

 

[kazuyamishima]

Flash News:

Even if BG3 has been a smash hit and deserves to win GOTY, it won’t, and not because it doesn’t deserve it. But, reasons!

 

[anthraticus]

Critical Role captures exactly what I hate about newer D&D.

If you watch them play, it's basically "drama club nerds who need their character and acting to be the center of attention."

Classic D&D wasn't a hang-out for drama-class rejects. It was a game borne of guys who loved tactical wargames, and who would recreate battles or historical maps on a table, who knew obscure things about French polearm weapons or loved to debate the stats of mounted attacks on different terrain--mixed with a love of hefty lore from things like Lord of the Rings. That's a totally different demographic than the one playing 5e.

No doubt. I find it hard to recognize Critical Role as 'D&D', it doesn't remind me of D&D at all. It's basically a sanitized and happily delivered stereotype of what most people imagine D&D to be like. The known voice actors on the show are there to lend credibility to the 'nerd culture phenomenon' and given their success/taste for theatrics makes a casual viewer get wrapped into their campaign and truly believe D&D is how they portray it.

If you hate the type of writing which is purple prose from Hell and verbose, Critical Role is the tabletop version of that. It'll breed a bunch of dipshits that just want to tell an "awesome story" and get bogged on the details of description while occasionally remembering there's supposed to be combat.

The best tabletop campaigns will be by DMs that tell you the important details and create great encounters, not Matthew Mercer self-indulging on being a failed actor.

 

[Clintizzle]

But isn’t that like, not even a new thing for BGS games, tho. I feel like you can do that in at least two other recent Bethesda games.

I meant like a real woman. In real life

 

[AngelMuffin]

I’m actually playing AC6 more than either of them.

 

[simpatico]

From what I've seen BG3 and Starfield have all the same faults.

 

[adamsapple]

Just more clickbait trash, hard times at PCgamer.

bitch eating crackers meme.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

I meant like a real woman. In real life

Lmao

 

[noise36]

What if I told you two different games can both be good?

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

They are both RPG’s, but isn’t this like comparing Persona 5 to FF16 or Tekken to Smash Bros? Apples and lemons.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

One of Sony's best exclusives of 2023.

Nice try! Xbox version of this *port of a third-party PC game* also launches this year.

 

[DryvBy]

Yeah…dipping my toes into Starfield yesterday and it feels like more of the same, and spread out too thin. It’s not bad, it’s just feels like the same game we’ve been playing for the last 15 years with a bit more polish. BG3 feels like a legit next gen leap forward, and Starfield feels like a step back. I’ll keep playing, but one is definitely living up to the hype and the other isn’t.

That's my issue. I mean if you're dying for games and don't like anything complicated, this is a good choice. But this was just the worst year for it imo. Everything has been amazing so it's not even in my to play list until next year. If this came out last year, this would have been my big game of the year.

 

[Thaedolus]

From what I've seen BG3 and Starfield have all the same faults.

Lawl try playing both then

 

[Thaedolus]

I'm better, I'm not playing it nor gonna touch it even if given for free.

That’s fine too. It’s definitely not a game for everyone, but also definitely not a game I’d be like “Sony exclusive!!” considering I’ve got a PS5 and never thought I’d buy it on that over PC

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

At this point, where I'm at is, Starfield doesn't respect my time.

Explore for no real reward and get trapped in a complex of lookalike corridors in a dull research facility and I'm stuck roaming forever trying to fight off CO2 build up.

Plus, I've run out of digipicks, and come across a locked door.

First inclination was to find the key or bash through it, but neither of those things is an actual choice in Starfield.

And in wake of BG3 that's where a lot of games are going to lose me.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Man, I wish some one would do for Warhammer Fantasy what the Baldur's Gate games have done for D & D.
And also....fuck Games Workshop.

Carry on!

Well, we're getting Rogue Trader but that's Warhammer 40,000 but it's based off the Rogue Trader RPG.

That's going to combine science fiction with fantasy so it's almost going to be a little bit like Baldur's Gate meets Starfield as you should be able to explore different planets.

That's the one I'm waiting for.