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[Lights and Waves]

'Ghost in the Shell': 4 Japanese Actresses Dissect the Movie and Its Whitewashing Twist from The Hollywood Reporter.

When THR interviewed Japanese fans about the whitewashing claims, they weren’t bothered by it, and neither was Mamoru Oshii, who directed the 1995 anime version. How do you feel about their response?

Yoshihara: People in Japan worship white people.

Kato-Kiriyama: Even in the story, there are Japanese people involved in creating these beings and they also may very well see the ideal human being as a white woman. So you’re sort of messed up all the way around.

Agena: Yes! I felt more messed up watching this movie. It reinforced my own personal messed-up standards of physical beauty.

Okatsuka: This is an important conversation to have.

Yoshihara: Even my ex-boyfriend, who is Asian-American, said, “What Asian lady has a body like Scarlett Johansson?”

Agena: There are certain priorities there.

Okatsuka: It’s this weird thing where Asian Americans or Asian nationals living here like me, working in film, are fighting both our motherland and white producers here. We’re walking this in-between where I scream at Hollywood but I’m also like, “Why’d you do that, Japan?!” Et tu, brute, on both sides.

Yoshihara: Japanese people are self-loathing.

Full article.

THR invited the women to join a no-holds-barred conversation about cultural authenticity and why Japanese nationals fail to understand the race controversy: "People in Japan worship white people."

Some really great perspective here. I particularly enjoyed the commentary on how Japanese mothers behave.

 

[Mr. Giggles]

And other people of color?

 

[bud]

i think that applies to asia in general.

 

[Maxinas]

Too bad her perfect white body couldn't save the trainwreck of an anime adaption. Hollywood needs to stop making these.

 

[eggandI]

Isn't it the same in China and south Korea as well?

 

[Jacce]

i think that applies to asia in general.

Very true. Trying to appeal to Asian markets, in particular China by including more Asian characters rarely has any positive impact on box office numbers.

 

[ghostofsparta]

News at 11

 

[OG Shaka Zulu]

This is too pervasive.

Look how certain people of color are reluctant to realize that all POC have white supremacy as a common enemy here.

 

[Count Dookkake]

Charlie Rose: Senator, do we need a Charisma Man?

Senator Finch: There is one.

 

[n00bsauce87]

If Japanese people worship white people

Are commercials involving a parody of an American white person

Racist?

or

A form of flattery (Imitation)?

 

[Slayven]

This is too pervasive.

Look how certain people of color are reluctant to realize that all POC have white supremacy as a common enemy here.

Yep people argue the best person for the job got it, why is 9.9/10 the best person is white? White is the the universal default and anything else is seen as straying from the norm or "pandering".

 

[HStallion]

Miyazaki: White people in anime were a mistake.

 

[Ken K in the Fresh!!!]

Asians in Asia want to look white but not be white

That's my contribution to this thread

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

Ai Yoshihara: Major’s backstory is white people trying to justify the casting.

 

[ISOM]

If Japanese people worship white people

Are commercials involving a parody of an American white person

Racist?

or

A form of flattery (Imitation)?

Probably both.

 

[Jenenser]

sounds like propaganda, lol.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

actually reading the article, there are alot of good points brought up.... about how careless/thoughtless this was to the japanese aspect of this movie

also... the irony in this...

Yoshihara: The actress who played the mom played a madam in Memoirs of a Geisha, and when I saw that movie I knew she was directed by white directors because she was totally playing an American bitch. In Japan, we don’t act like that. The demeanor and body language was mimicking an American person. Any time a white director directs a Japanese movie, they’re always trying to get us to act American.

Kato-Kiriyama: Meanwhile, Asian Americans are asked to be super Oriental. (Laughter)

 

[Piggus]

i think that applies to asia in general.

My fiancee and most of her friends are always trying to avoid the sun. Some of them have even used whitening injections. They're Indonesian, where I guess some people associate darker skin with outdoor labor.

 

[The Main Event]

i think that applies to asia in general.

Yup.

 

[NOLA_Gaffer]

Yoshihara: Even my ex-boyfriend, who is Asian-American, said, “What Asian lady has a body like Scarlett Johansson?”

Guess we know why he's an ex-boyfriend now.

 

[teruterubozu]

And yet when white people idolize the Japanese, they're labeled as a weaboo.

 

[The Kree]

And other people of color?

I just wanna point out how fucked up the phrase "people of color" is because it's usage in seemingly any context automatically highlights the problem. There's white people, and then there's everybody else.

 

[SRG01]

My fiancee and most of her friends are always trying to avoid the sun. Some of them have even used whitening injections. They're Indonesian, where I guess some people associate darker skin with outdoor labor.

It's more than just labor. Darker skinned Asians are often looked down upon as the lower class and is a pervasive attitude across almost all Asian countries.

 

[R0ckman]

i think that applies to asia in general.

Had a Chinese girl in my high school class who hated white people so much you'd think she was actually black, would mumble to us about them getting on her nerves when they did something she didn't like.

 

[Evilkazzzz]

I'm disappointed at how little the people in the interview seem to know about Ghost in the Shell in general.

They even went on about the Geisha thing even though it's a direct reference to the original, as well as how Scarjo acted in such a detached/robotic way.

Not that referencing the original so much excuses problems people might have with it, but it kind of seems like they're missing certain aspects the director was going for in order to be respectful to the 90's film.

 

[DrFunk]

And other people of color?

hahahaha

 

[teruterubozu]

I'm disappointed at how little the people in the interview seem to know about Ghost in the Shell in general.

They even went on about the Geisha thing even though it's a direct reference to the original, as well as how Scarjo acted in such a detached/robotic way.

Not that referencing the original so much excuses problems people might have with it, but it kind of seems like they're missing certain aspects the director was going for in order to be respectful to the 90's film.

? One the people interviewed is the director of the original 1995 movie.

 

[L Thammy]

i think that applies to asia in general.

Indians definitely have some aspect of this. My mother makes fun of me for being "black". I'm not even very dark; a lot of people think I'm Mexican or South American, especially Mexicans and South Americans.

 

[Trojita]

Yoshihara: The actress who played the mom played a madam in Memoirs of a Geisha, and when I saw that movie I knew she was directed by white directors because she was totally playing an American bitch. In Japan, we don’t act like that. The demeanor and body language was mimicking an American person. Any time a white director directs a Japanese movie, they’re always trying to get us to act American.

lol wut

 

[dbztrk]

All those blond characters in Street Fighter V is a testament to this. The obsession is real.

 

[Killer Queen]

Thanks for posting this.
Through all the discussion on race for this film and engaging with other members here I've changed my views on all of this and it's definitely nice to get more perspective.

 

[PixelatedBookake]

Could this be due to European/American standards of beauty being recognized through imported pop-culture as being "the gold standard" of beauty in Asia due to its prevalence creating this idea of "default appearance" as being white like it is in predominantly white countries?

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I'm disappointed at how little the people in the interview seem to know about Ghost in the Shell in general.

They even went on about the Geisha thing even though it's a direct reference to the original, as well as how Scarjo acted in such a detached/robotic way.

Not that referencing the original so much excuses problems people might have with it, but it kind of seems like they're missing certain aspects the director was going for in order to be respectful to the 90's film.

I'd recommend you watch the original again. The major doesn't actually sound robotic. She looks that way, but she very much has a personality and intonation to her voice. Scarlett is playing a version thought up by someone who hasn't watched the original in a long time, or only watched the boat scene

 

[Platy]

Which is why I never understood when those neo nazis use japan in arguments.
Like the infamous jon tron debate ... dude you just DON'T put japan in such a high regard for racial relationship.

I guess it is some kind of otaku thing where japan is suddenly not a very homophobic, sexist and racist country... or maybe it is EXACTLY because of that =P

 

[HStallion]

Indians definitely have some aspect of this. My mother makes fun of me for being "black". I'm not even very dark; a lot of people think I'm Mexican or South American, especially Mexicans and South Americans.

Its something that happens across the world from Asia to Africa to South America and beyond. Whiteness for a long time has not only been considered the defacto look of humanity because of the dominance of the white western world for so long and especially over a lot of forms of pop culture which really compounded the issue even more so. When all the biggest movie stars, pop singers, etc. are mostly white for decades and decades and decades, it just becomes the beauty norm sad to say and everyone who isn't still tries to achieve just because that's the status quo.

 

[MikeHattsu]

? One the people interviewed is the director of the original 1995 movie.

Nah, read it again.

 

[The Kree]

lol wut

You know how American Bitches™ be acting.

 

[Slayven]

I just wanna point out how fucked up the phrase "people of color" is because it's usage in seemingly any context automatically highlights the problem. There's white people, and then there's everybody else.

Pink Lives Matter

 

[Mr. Giggles]

I just wanna point out how fucked up the phrase "people of color" is because it's usage in seemingly any context automatically highlights the problem. There's white people, and then there's everybody else.

I agree with you but its gonna be a while before the term dies - unfortunately

 

[cartographer]

Had a Chinese girl in my high school class who hated white people so much you'd think she was actually black, would mumble to us about them getting on her nerves when they did something she didn't like.

Ummmmmm

 

[teruterubozu]

Nah, read it again.

Ah ok, she was mentioned. Got confused

 

[Lovely Salsa]

All those blond characters in Street Fighter V is a testament to this. The obsession is real.

Link blonde and blue eyed. Zelda blonde

It all makes sense now

 

[ReAxion]

You know how American Bitches™ be acting.

they be shoppin?

 

[Evilkazzzz]

? One the people interviewed is the director of the original 1995 movie.

I meant the roundtable discussion thing.

 

[PSqueak]

If Japanese people worship white people

Are commercials involving a parody of an American white person

Racist?

or

A form of flattery (Imitation)?

Sometimes people don't worship the real thing, just their warped idea of what it should be.

 

[L Thammy]

Which is why I never understood when those neo nazis use japan in arguments.
Like the infamous jon tron debate ... dude you just DON'T put japan in such a high regard for racial relationship.

I guess it is some kind of otaku thing where japan is suddenly not a very homophobic, sexist and racist country... or maybe it is EXACTLY because of that =P

This might amaze you, but racist white people generally don't know that much about other countries. They certainly don't know anything about the Ainu or the Japanese untouchables.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Neocolonialism, breh

 

[Trojita]

It's fucking crazy how complexions have changed in Japan the last twenty years. You go back and watch live action shows from Japan 20-30 years ago and you'd think they weren't the same people today. Back then they looked closer to how Okinawans look today.

Japan and Korea have whitening creams and treatments that would put that Beyonce bleach fake commercial to shame.

 

[Lovely Salsa]

Had a Chinese girl in my high school class who hated white people so much you'd think she was actually black, would mumble to us about them getting on her nerves when they did something she didn't like.

You make it sound like black people hate white people lol

 

[Zoe]

I was kind of iffy on that part of the interview, but there's a lot of great content in there in addition to that.

This part is just sad:

Yoshihara: The actress who played

Spoiler

the mom played a madam

in Memoirs of a Geisha, and when I saw that movie I knew she was directed by white directors because she was totally playing an American bitch. In Japan, we don’t act like that. The demeanor and body language was mimicking an American person. Any time a white director directs a Japanese movie, they’re always trying to get us to act American.

Kato-Kiriyama: Meanwhile, Asian Americans are asked to be super Oriental. (Laughter)

It's hard to discuss this article without spoiler tags though because the ending twist is a main subject.