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[DryvBy]

It's not the "HDR setting" videogames have had for ages. It's a new tech for displays.

I looked up some basic images and I don't get why this is a talking point. Am I missing something here?

 

[therealbigrich]

I see a lot about don't 4k TVs already upscale and I'm pretty sure my 4k tv goes to 1080 when when I play Xbox or Ps4 games. When I'm on my PC it stays in 4k. Maybe it's just Vizio that does that

 

[Caayn]

I looked up some basic images and I don't get why this is a talking point. Am I missing something here?

HDR display tech isn't something you can express in images on a monitor that doesn't support it. Similar to how you can't explain the difference between red and blue properly on a black/white TV.

Read this article as an 101 to HDR: http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinions/hdr-tv-high-dynamic-television-explained

I see a lot about don't 4k TVs already upscale and I'm pretty sure my 4k tv goes to 1080 when when I play Xbox or Ps4 games. When I'm on my PC it stays in 4k. Maybe it's just Vizio that does that

If your TV doesn't upscale you'd see a 1080p as a picture with fat black bars on all sides

 

[TalonJH]

I'm seeing xbox ones for cheap at GameStop, is it OK to buy them right now if you're not interested in 4k?

Depends on how low. I would personally say wait for the S but that's up to you in the end.

 

[mboojigga]

I see a lot about don't 4k TVs already upscale and I'm pretty sure my 4k tv goes to 1080 when when I play Xbox or Ps4 games. When I'm on my PC it stays in 4k. Maybe it's just Vizio that does that

All tvs upscale to their native resolution.

 

[justsomeguy]

I looked up some basic images and I don't get why this is a talking point. Am I missing something here?

Unless you're using an HDR display to compare, you probably can't see the difference I'd guess.

 

[backbreaker65]

delete

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

That part about VR and console gaming sounds good to me. Since he's saying they are very focused on console gaming, i do hope they start investing in new studios or at least least significantly more exclusives.

 

[Figments]

I see a lot about don't 4k TVs already upscale and I'm pretty sure my 4k tv goes to 1080 when when I play Xbox or Ps4 games. When I'm on my PC it stays in 4k. Maybe it's just Vizio that does that

Most, if not all, HD TVs upscale to their native resolution, except in the case where the source signal is already set to the TV's native resolution.

 

[Outrun]

I sure as hell hope this interview will not be dissected to look for anything negative...

I think that the 4k BR player angle is a good one.

I am excited for Scorpio.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

I mean it's such a transparent move that it's hilarious they try to justify it in any other way. Saying they wanted to reach out to devs is stupid considering they have zero documentation or plans for devs to even try to develop for Scorpio. It's still a ways away from being tangible.

I get the distinct impression that nobody at Microsoft even knows what Scorpio is going to be yet. They have prototypes and a overall vision but not even near a development platform, never mind a consumer product.

Also, people should be incredibly weary of the lack of talk of Scorpio realising first party ambitions. Sounds like Microsoft wants to make a powerful box that third parties take advantage of, not a powerful box to push the envelope first party wise (although of course, all devs will take advantage of extra power). The video with heads of EA and Bethesda, but not Turn10, 343i or the Coalition on compounds this.

Edit: turns out the last bit was a bit of bollocks. Whoops.

 

[ScaryShark]

I was extremely excited about the S (I still have it pre-ordered) but the fact that it won't bitstream HD audio codecs like Atmos or DTS: X gimps this thing right out of the gate and alienates a large portion of the enthusiast market. It's such a dumb oversight/lack of prioritization that is really disappointing for a product that is cool in a lot of other ways.

 

[fastest finger]

I sure as hell hope this interview will not be dissected to look for anything negative...

I think that the 4k BR player angle is a good one.

I am excited for Scorpio.

Dissecting MS's messaging is practically a sport. There's always at least one howler in there. Hours of fun for the whole family.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

WTF. They specifically talked about Scorpio doing VR in their conference.

I've never been convinced that it was the future of console gaming. First and foremost, the technology has yet to showcase itself as worth a damn for gaming at the level that I expect. It's very gimmicky so far. It's going to be a whole lot bigger for apps and social media platforms/websites, and especially for things like movies or TV shows when the tech matures.

 

[leeh]

So does your 4K TV. Question is, how much better is it?

The upscalers in TV's usually add quite a bit of delay onto the image. I'm presuming it'd be a high-quality one, just as we've seen in the X1/PS4.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

I get the distinct impression that nobody at Microsoft even knows what Scorpio is going to be yet. They have prototypes and a overall vision but not even near a development platform, never mind a consumer product.

Also, people should be incredibly weary of the lack of talk of Scorpio releasing first party ambitions. Sounds like Microsoft wants to make a powerful box that third parties take advantage of, not a powerful box to push the envelope first party wise (although of course, all devs will take advantage of extra power).

Right? They always mention that Developers are already coding for PC and that it'll somewhat translate to the Scorpio. It makes me wonder a lot, and in a good way.

I can't wait for more info to be revealed. Some good ol' concrete info.

I was extremely excited about the S (I still have it pre-ordered) but the fact that it won't bitstream HD audio codecs like Atmos or DTS: X gimps this thing right out of the gate and alienates a large portion of the enthusiast market. It's such a dumb oversight/lack of prioritization that is really disappointing for a product that is cool in a lot of other ways.

Speaking of info.. do you have a confirmed source about the S being unable to support the HD-Codecs? Or is it assumption because the current xbox one does not support it atm?

 

[AndyMoogle]

So does your 4K TV. Question is, how much better is it?

Picture quality will most likely be very similar, but I can see it meaning lower latencies than when some TVs do it.

 

[Shin-Ra]

But with a huge majority of consumers still playing games on standard HD televisions, is 4K compatibility really a selling point? Spencer thinks so – and he claims the developers themselves helped set the specifications required. “When we look at what’s happening from a hardware and games capacity in the PC space, 4K gaming has become a real benchmark,” he says. “So when we were talking to gamers about what they expected, 4K was a natural next inflection point for hardware. We talked to the creators about the capability they needed in order to deliver games at 4K and at great frame rates. Six teraflops was what they told us.”

“We had the ability to look at doing an interim console this year if we wanted to. We thought about that. But we didn’t think we could deliver, with the silicon that’s out there, a true 4K gaming six teraflop machine this year. So we decided to wait until we hit the real spec that people were asking for.”

Those developers Phil's been speaking to were pulling his leg! The hardware AMD's offering won't deliver "true" 2160p60 games unless developers are willing to restrict themselves to that target. 1080p30 is comfortably attainable now but many developers still struggle.

Microsoft is promising that there will be no Project Scorpio-exclusive titles. Games will ship with components that will take advantage of whatever hardware you’re loading them on – just like PC games have done for years. “Our commitment is to make sure every single game and every single accessory works across all of those platforms,” says Ybarra. “When we picked the silicon to go into all those devices, that’s the first question the engineering team that I’m responsible for asked themselves. Will this enable the compatibility and great games we’re promising? Can we deliver those? Everything is built from the ground up with this in mind. One game will run on the entire family of devices.

Every. Single. Game!

“Sony is doing incredibly well with the PS4 but they’re doing something fundamentally different from us. We’re not building a strategy in response to what they’re doing, we’re building a response to what I see customers and gamers asking us for.”

As a primarily console player, I'd never ask for first party game development to be split between countless potential hardware combinations. I want the best made of the console hardware I've already bought, or buying next.

So was VR support a key part of the Scorpio vision? “I think the capability in the consoles that are on the market today to play high-fidelity true console-like experiences in VR ... they’re just not powerful enough,” he says. “To deliver the experience that console gamers expect, that’s really a six-teraflop problem at least. You kind of need to get there.”

That magic AMD 6TF number again.

 

[KodiakGT]

Yea but back then the market was hugely dependent on physical media, unlike now with streaming.

But it still is with 4k, at least if it is to become mainstream. The most recent number I could find for average us internet speed said 11.8 Mbps as of late 2014 (median would be more useful, but a recent number from that didn't seen to be available?)

The bandwidth recommendation for netflix 4k streaming is 25Mbps, more than twice the national average.

 

[Bits N Pieces]

Will read the article later when I get a bit of downtime, going to be an interesting 12-18 months ahead for the XBox division.

Exciting!

 

[HokieJoe]

I was extremely excited about the S (I still have it pre-ordered) but the fact that it won't bitstream HD audio codecs like Atmos or DTS: X gimps this thing right out of the gate and alienates a large portion of the enthusiast market. It's such a dumb oversight/lack of prioritization that is really disappointing for a product that is cool in a lot of other ways.

It wouldn't be surprising if they add that capability down the road. I mean, people talk about 4k being niche, well, ATMOS/DTSX are way nichier at this point. BTW, I hope they do add support for those formats.

 

[DryvBy]

HDR display tech isn't something you can express in images on a monitor that doesn't support it. Similar to how you can't explain the difference between red and blue properly on a black/white TV.

Read this article as an 101 to HDR: http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinions/hdr-tv-high-dynamic-television-explained
If your TV doesn't upscale you'd see a 1080p as a picture with fat black bars on all sides

Thanks for the article. I'll correct my ignorance on the subject.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

So if the Xbox One S does the upscale to 4K, your TV wont because the signal is already 4k. I just hope the One S upscaler is high quality.

If your TV scaler is better, set the Xbox output resolution to 1080p and use it.

 

[Xbudz]

If your TV scaler is better, set the Xbox output resolution to 1080p and use it.

good point, and I'd suggest this to anyone to test their 4K tv's upscaler.

 

[Shin-Ra]

I could've sworn gaming was never the focus and they said it's just not ready to be that kind of product.

Hololens isn't a gaming / consumer targetted device... Right now it's aimed at enterprise scenarios, it's not really for gaming although obviously games exist for it and will be created for it. Hololens is a standalone device, isn't tethered to any other hardware so "creating a console for it" doesn't make sense. It's also still very much on the way - as an enterprise device, as always planned, dev kits are out with developers now and we're building stuff for people on it today.

Why did they show HoloLens at E3...

Cool your jets big guy. The also showed illumiroom ages ago and nothing came of it. They show concepts all the time, and at no point did they say this was consumer ready. Heck, whenever discussion of actually selling this came up they actually said the opposite. That the tech is super expensive right now since it's entirely wireless. Don't know why you are getting bent out of shape here.

It's clear now Microsoft showed HoloLens as a high-tech counter punch to the interest VR and Morpheus were receiving, not as a viable product. Did they show any concepts that won't become products this year?

 

[ScaryShark]

Speaking of info.. do you have a confirmed source about the S being unable to support the HD-Codecs? Or is it assumption because the current xbox one does not support it atm?

This guy met with the Xbox One S team and asked them point blank at E3: http://www.entertainmentbuddha.com/...k-blu-ray-uhd-player-but-not-for-audiophiles/

 

[justsomeguy]

but not even near a development platform, never mind a consumer product.

Let's not forget - they're not reinventing the wheel here... it'll be a revision of the existing XDK, UWP and Windows 10 - it's not going to be a whole new underlying OS. Of course it still needs work for specific Scorpion capabilities but it shouldn't be as large as a new "generation" as-was... that's kind of the point of the new model.

Also, people should be incredibly weary of the lack of talk of Scorpio realising first party ambitions. Sounds like Microsoft wants to make a powerful box that third parties take advantage of, not a powerful box to push the envelope first party wise (although of course, all devs will take advantage of extra power). The video with heads of EA and Bethesda, but not Turn10, 343i or the Coalition on compounds this.

The lack of talking heads in a video is a really tenuous way to jump to that conclusion. The whole point of First Party is to push the platform.

 

[justsomeguy]

This guy met with the Xbox One S team and asked them point blank at E3: http://www.entertainmentbuddha.com/...k-blu-ray-uhd-player-but-not-for-audiophiles/

I didn't see a quote in there... The team are well aware of the ask - it's way up on UserVoice for example. (Not least from me nagging... I just installed my Atmos system at the weekend) ;-)

e: usually I like to see who has said something's not coming and exactly how they phrased it. Maybe it was a PR saying "We haven't announced anything at this time?" , or just repeating what it supports today? (he says, hopefully)

 

[Harp]

Unfortunately the Xbox one s does not support bitstream audio for movies. Making it the cheapest UHD player but also the worst. What this means is that you cant get Dolby atmos or dts x audio. Anyone that has been to a atmos movie will tell you that atmos stands out even more then 4k high quality movies. I think they go hand and hand. I want a complete player.

 

[Sydle]

I get the distinct impression that nobody at Microsoft even knows what Scorpio is going to be yet. They have prototypes and a overall vision but not even near a development platform, never mind a consumer product.

Also, people should be incredibly weary of the lack of talk of Scorpio realising first party ambitions. Sounds like Microsoft wants to make a powerful box that third parties take advantage of, not a powerful box to push the envelope first party wise (although of course, all devs will take advantage of extra power). The video with heads of EA and Bethesda, but not Turn10, 343i or the Coalition on compounds this.

Bonnie Ross and Rod Fergusson were in the talking head video.

 

[mboojigga]

Unfortunately the Xbox one s does not support bitstream audio for movies. Making it the cheapest UHD player but also the worst. What this means is that you cant get Dolby atmos or dts x audio. Anyone that has been to a atmos movie will tell you that atmos stands out even more then 4k high quality movies. I think they go hand and hand. I want a complete player.

The majority of consumers going to the movies and experiencing Atmos surround(whether they know it or not) are still the same majority of consumers buying sound bars. Consumers were not even taking advantage of 5.1 digital surround. Look at websites and tv makers promoting sound bars. Most consumers don't know or care about Atmos. Dolby digital went hand and hand with DVD and Blu-Ray as well and in most homes and majority just care about picture.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

This guy met with the Xbox One S team and asked them point blank at E3: http://www.entertainmentbuddha.com/...k-blu-ray-uhd-player-but-not-for-audiophiles/

I feel a bit blue inside now... i think almost-all uhd content is mastered in atmos, right? Especially those with dolbyvision....

le-sigh

 

[mboojigga]

I feel a bit blue inside now... i think almost-all uhd content is mastered in atmos, right? Especially those with dolbyvision....

le-sigh

Most movies are still not mastered in 4K.

http://www.highdefdigest.com/blog/ultra-hd-not-always-4k/

 

[pedrothelion]

This guy met with the Xbox One S team and asked them point blank at E3: http://www.entertainmentbuddha.com/...k-blu-ray-uhd-player-but-not-for-audiophiles/

What's the big deal about not being about to bitstream though? The Xbox One still sends out a lossless audio signal. Is it that important for your "Dobly TRUEHD" to be lit up on your receiver?

 

[flkraven]

Why did they show HoloLens at E3...


It's clear now Microsoft showed HoloLens as a high-tech counter punch to the interest VR and Morpheus were receiving, not as a viable product. Did they show any concepts that won't become products this year?

Scorpio lol

 

[Samurai G0SU]

Most movies are still not mastered in 4K.

http://www.highdefdigest.com/blog/ultra-hd-not-always-4k/

So those movies, out right now, that claim UHD, are not native 4k? How does it work? This is a little confusing now....

What's the big deal about not being about to bitstream though? The Xbox One still sends out a lossless audio signal. Is it that important for your "Dobly TRUEHD" to be lit up on your receiver?

Well, i put in the Minions Blu-ray that has an Atmos track. I have audio out as uncompressed 7.1 hdmi. My receiver receives it as Multi-track. Checking to see which speakers are being used, my atmos speakers are not.

So, what could be the problem? Any help?

 

[theWB27]

Why did they show HoloLens at E3...


It's clear now Microsoft showed HoloLens as a high-tech counter punch to the interest VR and Morpheus were receiving, not as a viable product. Did they show any concepts that won't become products this year?

Why'd they reveal a game machine and talk about tv?

I'm not sure what one wants to hear. At this point it isn't ready for gaming.

 

[Colonel Nasty]

Well, those are retailing at $399. With Xbox One S, at $299, you’re getting 4K Blu-ray, a 4K upscaler for games and video

Are they realy using this wildcard?

Why wouldn't they? There's no way Neo is coming in under this price point. It'll be the cheapest 4K player on the market and 90% of all tvs sold over like 500$ will be 4K so it a good add on. I know some people will be like no one buys discs any more but 4K video require hella bandwidth, I think Vudu is the only place that offers limited 4K streaming of movies and they're I think currently exclusive to one tv manufacturer.

 

[InsaneTiger]

Don't all 4K tvs 'upscale' and push the content out at 4K?

Yes, it rather redundant.

 

[pooptest]

Speaking of info.. do you have a confirmed source about the S being unable to support the HD-Codecs? Or is it assumption because the current xbox one does not support it atm?

I found this:
https://xbox.uservoice.com/forums/2...tings/suggestions/8513638-support-dolby-atmos

Yes, it rather redundant.

This kinda reminds me of the Aaron Greenberg 1080p statement, but in reverse.

 

[Peltz]

Don't all 4K tvs 'upscale' and push the content out at 4K?

Yes, but many have input lag when they do so. Also not all scalers are created equal. The Xbox One S's scaler is likely to be competitive with many of the ones in 4K sets, if not better.

Xbox 360's scaler was really underrated tech and one of the reasons why 360 games often looked cleaner than PS3 games that otherwise had graphics parity. PS3 literally looked different on different 1080p sets depending on the scaling, but Xbox 360 was far more consistent because of the strength of its internal scaler.

It was also lag free.

 

[justsomeguy]

What's the big deal about not being about to bitstream though? The Xbox One still sends out a lossless audio signal. Is it that important for your "Dobly TRUEHD" to be lit up on your receiver?

Yeah - it needs to be unprocessed, a 'raw' bitstream if you like... At the mo' the XBox mixes the system soudns in and outputs at 5.1 or 7.1, which isn't good enough for those of us with ceiling speakers ;-)

There's a UserVoice with a few thousand votes on but I deleted the link. Doh.

 

[mboojigga]

Why wouldn't they? There's no way Neo is coming in under this price point. It'll be the cheapest 4K player on the market and 90% of all tvs sold over like 500$ will be 4K so it a good add on. I know some people will be like no one buys discs any more but 4K video require hella bandwidth, I think Vudu is the only place that offers limited 4K streaming of movies and they're I think currently exclusive to one tv manufacturer.

I have no idea what your talking about related to Vudu. What do you mean they are the only place that offers limited 4K streaming of movies?

Also, what difference does it make for example if a movie on Netflix streamed in 4K is 7GB an hour and 1080P is 3GB and hour? Plenty of consumers have highspeed and it is clear streaming is more popular than Blu-Ray disc since BR still hasn't surpassed DVD in the last 10 years. I stream 4K through my tv and YouTube. I have Comcast 150mb. Most consumers with Comcast have 75Mb which is more than enough for 4k streaming. 25Mb is enough to stream 4K.

 

[CircleOfFire]

I mean it's such a transparent move that it's hilarious they try to justify it in any other way. Saying they wanted to reach out to devs is stupid considering they have zero documentation or plans for devs to even try to develop for Scorpio. It's still a ways away from being tangible.

My theory was that they rolled the dice on if Sony would go big with the Neo announcement. I know Sony said a couple of days before that they wouldn't, but the US-centric nature of MS and E3 no doubt leans more heavily towards going for it.

 

[orichalcos]

Just one thing. What about 21:9 support?

 

[mboojigga]

So those movies, out right now, that claim UHD, are not native 4k? How does it work? This is a little confusing now....
QUOTE]

No different than movies that were not mastered in 1080p but are available on Blu-Ray. Same for DVDs.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

No different than movies that were not mastered in 1080p but are available on Blu-Ray. Same for DVDs.

Ah, i seen the article you added. That is crazy! Will they update that list with new UHD movies coming out?

For example, can they tell me if the Marco Polo Season 2 is real 4k? Or is deadpool? BvS? Wonder why some of them are shot in 5k but then 2k? interesting.....

 

[Shin-Ra]

Yes, but many have input lag when they do so. Also not all scalers are created equal. The Xbox One S's scaler is likely to be competitive with many of the ones in 4K sets, if not better.

Xbox 360's scaler was really underrated tech and one of the reasons why 360 games often looked cleaner than PS3 games that otherwise had graphics parity. PS3 literally looked different on different 1080p sets depending on the scaling, but Xbox 360 was far more consistent because of the strength of its internal scaler.

It was also lag free.

360's scaler was and still is awful with the artificial sharpening it applies. Made worse by the dodgy gamma curve that not all developers compensated for.

 

[rokkerkory]

Fundamentally different business model and strategy moving forward vs Sony or Nintendo. Highly scalable and social core components for Xbox moving forward. I like it.

 

[Bits N Pieces]

Bonnie Ross and Rod Fergusson were in the talking head video.

Hah!