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[Ninja Moomin]

Folks do realise that even if it did have always on and drm for every game... That all that could change with a simple firmware update?

all the arguing the toss about EDGE vs polygon and their comments... Its not beyond reason that they planned DRM / anti used games and always connected... But simply changed?

 

[Meus Renaissance]

Sources tell Polygon that the next Xbox will indeed have some form of an always-on requirement. That will be both to support the suite of non-gaming entertainment applications that will be launched alongside the console, like streaming video services, but also as a possible anti-piracy tool. Currently, the console will support digital rights management and anti-piracy checks using an internet connection. Under Microsoft's current guidelines, which may still be changed, the decision of whether a game will require an internet connection to work and if that is a one-time authentication or a constant connection, will be left up to individual publishers.

Pretty comfortable in saying that Sony will allow the same.

This would then suggest second hand games wont be allowed on the PS4 if they give publishers the choice.

 

[twobear]

If you do think that Polygon is a MS mouthpiece, the idea that they would fabricate positive rumours just doesn't make any sense. Why publish positive, false rumours that could only possibly lead to disappointment once the announcements are out?

 

[Hoo-doo]

What surprises me is the downright flaccid reaction the Xbox announcement reveal date is receiving.

I guess the negative rumors do impact people's outlook in some capacity.

 

[twobear]

What surprises me is the downright flaccid reaction the Xbox announcement reveal date is receiving.

I guess the negative rumors do impact people's outlook in some capacity.

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

 

[Kill Your Masters]

What surprises me is the downright flaccid reaction the Xbox announcement reveal date is receiving.

I guess the negative rumors do impact people's outlook in some capacity.

It's gonna be either worse, or people will simply forget about all the negative rumors if it turns out to be any good. I keep my expectations pretty low, as I did with Sony's (and I liked that one)

Expect the same people that post 'I'm buying a PS4' to continue doing that in all MS threads though, good event or bad.

 

[something fishy]

are people getting bloody paid to shill any interest out of this reveal or are they that desperate to see their brand "win"?

 

[watership]

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

Same. I remember that only after the box was out and people were messing with the features did people start to hype over it.

 

[statham]

What surprises me is the downright flaccid reaction the Xbox announcement reveal date is receiving.

I guess the negative rumors do impact people's outlook in some capacity.

 

[twobear]

are people getting bloody paid to shill any interest out of this reveal or are they that desperate to see their brand "win"?

Honestly, I think gaming is an industry where there's no reason to pay for astroturfers because the fans do all the PR you could ask for, for free.

 

[something fishy]

yeah that's a fair point.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

What surprises me is the downright flaccid reaction the Xbox announcement reveal date is receiving.

I guess the negative rumors do impact people's outlook in some capacity.

Yes, I can see it being a little bit less exciting because of the uncertainty.

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

It had hype but it was also the successor to the Xbox so it wasn't exactly coming off record success. It's not easy to be worse than that but for the new Xbox to have this huge excitement has to be attributed to the swirling rumors. Considering the success of 360, this even should have more excitement but it doesn't. Not right now at least.

 

[Rösti]

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

I don't know about negative rumors or the reactions to when that event was announced, but the MTV Presents: The Next Generation of Xbox Revealed thread back in 2005 didn't see much commotion: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46948

 

[Goldmund]

Dogmatic thinking is certainly a thing over at Polygon. Fortunately for us, it's been carefully crystallized into a single continuum (absolutely impenetrable by logic!) of purely self-opinionated thought processes, hermetically sealed within a single impenetrably thick skull and made infinitely identifiable by the lack of hair covering said skull and the lack of decency governing its bearer's utterances.

 

[ciridesu]

In the end, I find it likely that the battle will come down to two things: Price and potential revolutionary feautures.

Kinect is an already-introduced accessory with dying hype, and personally I am doubtful it will have a huge impact on sales (especially with early adopters), unless it has some dramatically exciting features. Really interesting to see, where they have decided to go with it though

Games will likely be extremely similar between the nextbox and ps4, akin to this gen (third-party dominance). I find it extremely unlikely MS is able to secure any major exclusives, as the investment would be extreme (see for GTA, ES, Fifa, COD, BF and such - they would have to pay in hundreds of millions), thus I find the battle to be fought within the first-party games (they will likely secure some marketing campaign advantage with certain publishers though, but again, I guesstimate the same for Sony).

Thus...

The most worrying part especially with the AC- and used games -rumours is the price. I find it likely that PS4 will try to begin from the $399 price-point, which was what I estimated for Xbox too. But $499? The price-point was perhaps the most important reason for MS capturing the throne this gen from PS in the US, and shouldn't be underestimated. When there are two extremely similar consoles, consumers are gonna go for the cheaper one.

But again, if MS has some ace in a hole besides a revamped Kinect (I could be underestimating its pull), then they stand a major chance. PS4 took an extremely safe route, but the safe route is often the one to take (unless you're the Wii) as noted by ps2, xbox 360 etc (i.e. games, good entry-price, good usability). Windows 8 won't be it. It's a relatively toxic brand and has failed to gain any significant market share in either PC or mobile markets, and thus I am doubtful about its impact with xbox too. I doubt PS4's OS will be so horrendous that xbox will gain a significant edge here.

Will see though. Extremely interested in seeing, what special features they have in store. With all the negative rumours going on, it's no wonder that the word of mouth is slightly on the negative side, but all that can be countered by an impressive presentation in May. They have to bring in some revolutionary though, or else I doubt they will succeed in introducing such anti-consumer measures at a higher price point, and hope to get away with it. Will see.

 

[twobear]

It had hype but it was also the successor to the Xbox so it wasn't exactly coming off record success. It's not easy to be worse than that but for the new Xbox to have this huge excitement has to be attributed to the swirling rumors. Considering the success of 360, this even should have more excitement but it doesn't. Not right now at least.

People have short memories. The general consensus, not completely unwarranted, seems to be that the past three years have been crappy for 360 even though for the first three it was good enough to make the PS3 virtually irrelevant. By the same token everyone forgets about the PS3's first two years when they cite Sony's handling of the PS3 as good reason to be hyped for PS4. It's not completely unreasonable, of course, because it gives some kind of idea of the current state of Sony and Microsoft.

If Microsoft come out of the announcement and E3 all guns blazing, I'm pretty sure there'll be more hype; and frankly I don't see why they wouldn't do that. This E3 is not the end of a very long generation for them, where they've sold all the XBoxes they will to 'core' (I hate that word) gamers and are pushing broader experiences to move more 360s. It's the start of a new generation and I honestly doubt they're stupid enough to think they can push a $400-500 game console as mass-market while ignoring the traditional trappings of gaming in the process.

 

[fastford58]

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

Except that the console preceding the xbox 360 did not have nearly the sell through/install base or mind share that the 360 holds.

 

[fastford58]

People have short memories. The general consensus, not completely unwarranted, seems to be that the past three years have been crappy for 360 even though for the first three it was good enough to make the PS3 virtually irrelevant. By the same token everyone forgets about those first two years of the PS3 when they cite it as good reason to be hyped for PS4. If Microsoft come out of the announcement and E3 all guns blazing, I'm pretty sure there'll be more hype; and frankly I don't see why they wouldn't do that.

Wat. The 360's last 3 years have been crappy? Pass the bowl, I want some of that lol.

 

[gofreak]

My memory is that the 360 received broadly the same treatment.

It's hard to generalise. I do detect a more muted atmosphere here on GAF, but is this true in general?

As for GAF, I think it boils down to a few simple things. 1) This won't be the first next-gen reveal, so they don't have the advantage of novelty. 2) I think to a certain extent Sony has sucked a lot of air out of the room. They went first and their platform is ticking a lot of boxes. People may feel satiated. 3) Rumours don't give a lot to be excited about.

Sentiment can change quickly though, depending on what is shown from E3 on out. But PS4 was 'a first', it had a neutral-to-positive run-up of rumours, and the short timeframe between rumours and reveal didn't leave a lot of time for negative rumours to hang around like a bad smell. There was also a steady drip-drip of leaks after the PS Meeting was announced that kept discussion flowing up until the reveal. The reveal came surprisingly early, there was an unexpectedly short wait.

With Durango, I get the sense that to a degree, people are tired of talking about rumours. The wait for the reveal has been long, and the tone mostly negative. Someone leak a picture of the controller or something, or talk of some big exciting betrayalton!

 

[LiquidMetal14]

People have short memories. The general consensus, not completely unwarranted, seems to be that the past three years have been crappy for 360 even though for the first three it was good enough to make the PS3 virtually irrelevant. By the same token everyone forgets about those first two years of the PS3 when they cite it as good reason to be hyped for PS4. If Microsoft come out of the announcement and E3 all guns blazing, I'm pretty sure there'll be more hype; and frankly I don't see why they wouldn't do that.

Wishful thinking is one thing but I would hold all reservation and be as fair as can be.

You're right on a few things, MSFT has been lackluster the last few years and Sony has also slowed down.

The way I see it now is that having a success with Xbox doesn't really entail anything for the next generation. Not with all the stuff we read (good or bad).

The thing is that they can have guns a blazing but have to consider the positive head start Sony has had and must know that they also have some potentially killer announcements.

In short, I think anyone who knows how strong Sony's 1st party studios are would be more excited compared to Microsoft's but that's a matter of taste I suppose.

I think both will have strong showings for different reasons though.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Wat. The 360's last 3 years have been crappy? Pass the bowl, I want some of that lol.

Well, a lot of people (on NeoGAF) feel that the release of Kinect lead to a substantial dip in quality of MS first party games and an overall shift in vision that left "hardcore" gamers in the cold.

 

[MasLegio]

In the end, I find it likely that the battle will come down to two things: Price and potential revolutionary feautures.

////
They have to bring in some revolutionary though, or else I doubt they will succeed in introducing such anti-consumer measures at a higher price point, and hope to get away with it. Will see.

Neither of them appear to will fill those two things. They both will be quite expensive the first year and I have not seen anything revolutionary from any of them. They are just a hardware and technology update to current consoles.

Sure MS might have their TV thing but that is totally irrelevant and will bring nothing to the table competition wise outside of the US.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Wat. The 360's last 3 years have been crappy? Pass the bowl, I want some of that lol.

Well, it's common knowledge that there's been no good games on the 360 since 2009. No, existing IPs don't count. XBLA doesn't count. Indies don't count. Kinect games lol don't count. Third parties never count. See? Crappy.

 

[Karma]

are people getting bloody paid to shill any interest out of this reveal or are they that desperate to see their brand "win"?

Are you saying that the people interested or excited about the new Xbox reveal are being paid to do so?

Well, a lot of people (on NeoGAF) feel that the release of Kinect lead to a substantial dip in quality of MS first party games and an overall shift in vision that left "hardcore" gamers in the cold.

Really? Didn't the 360 have more "hardcore" releases last year than the PS3? Didn't we just get a new Gears?

 

[jond76]

Its hard to stay excited ( or at least continue to show excitement on the boards) when every Xbox thread is invaded by the Westboro Gaming Church waving around all the same stupid signs.

 

[Uno Venova]

Wat. The 360's last 3 years have been crappy? Pass the bowl, I want some of that lol.

It's been pretty lackluster yes. I smoke from the same bowl apparently.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Well, it's common knowledge that there's been no good games on the 360 since 2009. No, existing IPs don't count. XBLA doesn't count. Indies don't count. Kinect games lol don't count. Third parties never count. See? Crappy.

Oh great, one of these posts. Nobody is saying this.

 

[Winterfang]

Well, a lot of people (on NeoGAF) feel that the release of Kinect lead to a substantial dip in quality of MS first party games and an overall shift in vision that left "hardcore" gamers in the cold.

How come? Wasn't Horizon a refreshing take on the Forza series, Wasn't Halo 4 a game that pushed the 360 graphically, Judgement did a lot of cool things with the Gears franchise also. Third party titles all still great on the 360. The only dips I would say where Fable (which isn't a triple AAA franchise anyway and it was a spinoff) and the arcade titles, which are slowing down because there's' a new one coming.

The main difference is that Microsoft had last year to push their big games and this one will probably focus on the 720 and Sony had jack shit last year and push their PS3 swan songs to this one.

On the topic at hand, I like the idea of communal Achievements. You get one weekend to acomplish a goal, like 10,000 headshots or 200,000 miles driven or something more original but that I can't think at the moment, and once it's done everyone will get the achievement.

That's pretty cool, it reminds me of 1 vs 100 and that kind of great community fun where my finest moments in this gen.

 

[Family Fry]

Well, it's common knowledge that there's been no good games on the 360 since 2009. No, existing IPs don't count. XBLA doesn't count. Indies don't count. Kinect games lol don't count. Third parties never count. See? Crappy.

Don't forget your not allowed to count XBLA games that have entually came out on PC too.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Well, a lot of people (on NeoGAF) feel that the release of Kinect lead to a substantial dip in quality of MS first party games and an overall shift in vision that left "hardcore" gamers in the cold.

That has been true. But it's not saying that they haven't had any games. My issue is the rinse/wash/repeat Halo/Gears/Forza cycle. It got old for me 2 years ago but this was when MSFT was still in a decline for me. Kinect became a focus and you can see that it changed their focus. The thing is the 360 is popular so you will see most of the games on their platform as well as PS3 so by that nature it's easy to say they haven't been weak. They've just had the fortune of being popular so you get your yearly Call of Duties like every other platform. It's the distinguishing games that have caused me to be turned off. Not enough of them.

Now XBLA has been really consistent so it's irrational to knock that BUT so have other DD services with their own unique games.

I feel like MSFT was the best until 3-4 years ago while someone like Sony has been slowly battling and building their IP's while creating some new ones. It's not hard to be taken by their approach with PS4 as it's been overwhelmingly positive from just a games perspective. We know hardly anything else except the in depth tech talks we've had with Mark Cerny.

I guess this bring back the point that MSFT should be showing some games and hopefully dispel some of the rumors since the inertia of being 2nd to reveal isn't quite as exciting as being the 1st. That's a small part of why their reveal is lacking the spunk.

We'll all be glued come the 21st though

 

[enzo_gt]

Folks do realise that even if it did have always on and drm for every game... That all that could change with a simple firmware update?

all the arguing the toss about EDGE vs polygon and their comments... Its not beyond reason that they planned DRM / anti used games and always connected... But simply changed?

Unless that literally crushes the platform -which it likely won't if it does happen because gamers have proven they don't care with SimCity and Diablo III- there's a very small chance they'll change it.

These are those iron philosophies companies have that they will not compromise in fear of taking a blow to their egos. We've seen it with Maxis and SimCity, and I'm sure there are countless other examples of companies sticking by their mistakes and trying to save face.

 

[Durante]

Well, it's common knowledge that there's been no good games on the 360 since 2009. No, existing IPs don't count. XBLA doesn't count. Indies don't count. Kinect games lol don't count. Third parties never count. See? Crappy.

You are joking, but as someone who owns a ton of gaming platforms, I have to say that I didn't have nearly as many reasons to turn on my 360 in the past 3 years than, say, from 2006 to 2009.

 

[Montresor]

Well, a lot of people (on NeoGAF) feel that the release of Kinect lead to a substantial dip in quality of MS first party games and an overall shift in vision that left "hardcore" gamers in the cold.

The 3rd party software on the 360 makes that a silly notion either way. Even if Microsoft ends up never releasing another first-party IP, Xbox is drowning in good software. It may not be exclusive, but there is always going to be tons of great hardcore software.

I think a lot of Xbox fans just don't give a shit that the software they play is not exclusive. Myself included. Microsoft's first parties? Not exclusive. Halo and Gears show up on PC. Those great XBLA games? Not exclusive. Even if they're not on PSN as well, they eventually show up on Steam.

I really can't wait until Microsoft reveals their console. I'm getting tired of all the comedians scrambling over each other, trying to be the first to make the next hilarious Gold subscription or Kinect joke.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Don't forget your not allowed to count XBLA games that have entually came out on PC too.

Believe it or not though, many of us here own a 360 and a competent enough PC. It's not hard to want to invest on the PC version of some of these games because they will look better on PC and if it's an MP enabled game, some of us don't want to pay for XBL. I did end up buying Joe Danger 2 and Joyride Turbo recently for the kids despite the fact that I have the PS3 version.

As Durante said, it's not some stigma to say that the last few years or so have been down compared to the first few.

 

[Winterfang]

You are joking, but as someone who owns a ton of gaming platforms, I have to say that I didn't have nearly as many reasons to turn on my 360 in the past 3 years than, say, from 2006 to 2009.

Oh jeez, pardon me, I didn't knew I was talking to jeer majesty here. You can have all the consoles in the world but that doesn't mean your opinion or either more valid or that you don't prefer one over the other. It's still a purely anecdotal experience.

I have a 360 and a PS3 in my house. I use the PS3 for netflix and I buy/rent all my games on the 360. What does that means? absolutely nothing because that's just me and what I do doesn't represent the entire gaming market.

 

[Maximilian Kolbe]

So seems so many sites are pro MS or Sony
Then which site is pro Nintendo?

 

[jond76]

So seems so many sites are pro MS or Sony
Then which site is pro Nintendo?

The answer to that of course is..

"lol Nintendo"

I go to your church, by the way.

 

[Durante]

Oh jeez, pardon me, I didn't knew I was talking to jeer majesty here. You can have all the consoles in the world but that doesn't mean your opinion or either more valid or that you don't prefer one over the other. It's still a purely anecdotal experience.

I'm sorry that I offended you, the point of that interjection was not to brag that I own lots of gaming systems (I have no idea why you would even think that), it was to lend context to the rest of my post. The point is that GAF is full of people like me, and that as such the lack of excitement about 360 in its latter years is entirely understandable (without resorting to "fanboyism" arguments to explain it): for people who game on multiple platform it simply didn't have as much to offer anymore as it did during and for some time after its release.

So seems so many sites are pro MS or Sony
Then which site is pro Nintendo?

notenoughshaders.com

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Oh jeez, pardon me, I didn't knew I was talking to jeer majesty here. You can have all the consoles in the world but that doesn't mean your opinion or either more valid or that you don't prefer one over the other. It's still a purely anecdotal experience.

I have a 360 and a PS3 in my house. I use the PS3 for netflix and I buy/rent all my games on the 360. What does that means? absolutely nothing because that's just me and what I do doesn't represent the entire gaming market.

I suppose if we are judging things critically it bring many the conclusions we've had. That's why he noted (as well as I) that the last few years have not been as good as the earlier years.

You buying most of your games on 360 doesn't really change that. If you enjoy your games on 360 (for whatever preference suits you), that doesn't change the situation the last few years. If you enjoy playing CoD with your 360 friends as well as most of the games you buy then you're making sense.

That's doesn't stop us from being able to step back and analyze the last few years objectively though. Nor does it change what I've noticed in the weakening last few years on 360.

But that isn't stating that it's been garbage considering there's been 3rd party games and a steady stream of Halo/Gears/Forza. Unfortunately that grows old with me and have wanted more of what I saw from 06-09 than the last few years.

I also happen to have 2 other competent platforms in PS3 and PC. I leave my horizons open.

 

[enzo_gt]

The 3rd party software on the 360 makes that a silly notion either way. Even if Microsoft ends up never releasing another first-party IP, Xbox is drowning in good software. It may not be exclusive, but there is always going to be tons of great hardcore software.

I think a lot of Xbox fans just don't give a shit that the software they play is not exclusive. Myself included. Microsoft's first parties? Not exclusive. Halo and Gears show up on PC. Those great XBLA games? Not exclusive. Even if they're not on PSN as well, they eventually show up on Steam.

I really can't wait until Microsoft reveals their console. I'm getting tired of all the comedians scrambling over each other, trying to be the first to make the next hilarious Gold subscription or Kinect joke.

MS focuses on timed exclusivity more than anything. Play it now instead of waiting 2-3 years for it to show up on Steam. So instead of getting excited for Steam ports, players get excited for the actual release instead.

Believe it or not, this works and has value in the marketplace and as a form of exclusive, no matter how much people try to skew what exclusivity entails to fit their argument. If Halo 2 comes to PC years later, believe it or not console gamers don't give a fuck. It's already past the honeymooning period. Some XBLA games have shorter exclusivity nowadays amounting to maybe half a year to a year, but that's still significant in a world where gamers complain when a game releases for their platform or region a week later than others and port beg for days. And it does matter because you can see the huge difference it made early on in the 360's life.

 

[AssaTM]

The most hilarious thing about all of this is, it doesnt matter one bit what anyone on NeoGAF ultimately says or thinks. When both consoles launch and one of them is a better all-round entertainment package, the families of the world are going to be woo'd more by that package than "RAYTRACING!!!" the people that honestly think either Sony or MS use any hardcore gaming forum as a barometer are insane, this forum and other forums like it did not, do not and will not ever influence 50/60/70 million+ people buying a console. Yes it is fun to debate, but at times there is no debate here, when people say "omg MS must be so scared, look at this negativity" yeh a few thousand people are complaining about something that will never affect them, i'm sure they are absolutely beside themselves, the same also goes for Sony. Perspective is required because this is supposed to be a forum, not a "i'm calling the shots on how this billion dollar company must be feeling, because I know best, not them" gimme a break, a forum is for discussion not ridiculous statements

 

[Lyude77]

So seems so many sites are pro MS or Sony
Then which site is pro Nintendo?

The ones with Nintendo in the title - basically sites that only cover Nintendo.

The most hilarious thing about all of this is, it doesnt matter one bit what anyone on NeoGAF ultimately says or thinks. When both consoles launch and one of them is a better all-round entertainment package, the families of the world are going to be woo'd more by that package than "RAYTRACING!!!" the people that honestly think either Sony or MS use any hardcore gaming forum as a barometer are insane, this forum and other forums like it did not, do not and will not ever influence 50/60/70 million+ people buying a console. Yes it is fun to debate, but at times there is no debate here, when people say "omg MS must be so scared, look at this negativity" yeh a few thousand people are complaining about something that will never affect them, i'm sure they are absolutely beside themselves, the same also goes for Sony. Perspective is required because this is supposed to be a forum, not a "i'm calling the shots on how this billion dollar company must be feeling, because I know best, not them" gimme a break, a forum is for discussion not ridiculous statements

If the "no used games" rumor gets verified, I think that would be a big deal even for random people/families. Also, if the $500 rumor gets verified, that would be a huge deal too. 360 didn't take off until the good console went to $300.

 

[Alx]

You are joking, but as someone who owns a ton of gaming platforms, I have to say that I didn't have nearly as many reasons to turn on my 360 in the past 3 years than, say, from 2006 to 2009.

That's your problem here. It suppose that in the past 3 years, you played most multiplatform games on PS3. It's not that the 360 has no game, but the two "HD platforms" are mostly redundant, so once you choose one as your main platform, the other one becomes much less used. In my case, I've been spending the last 8 years wondering when to buy a PS3, and never did because most of the games I wanted were already releasing on the 360.
That's also why the success of the 360 isn't only based on exclusives, but on providing good reasons to play games on that support rather than the competitor's (lower price, community, sometimes slightly better versions, ...)

 

[Ninja Moomin]

It's hard to generalise. I do detect a more muted atmosphere here on GAF, but is this true in general?

As for GAF, I think it boils down to a few simple things. 1) This won't be the first next-gen reveal, so they don't have the advantage of novelty. 2) I think to a certain extent Sony has sucked a lot of air out of the room. They went first and their platform is ticking a lot of boxes. People may feel satiated. 3) Rumours don't give a lot to be excited about.

Sentiment can change quickly though, depending on what is shown from E3 on out. But PS4 was 'a first', it had a neutral-to-positive run-up of rumours, and the short timeframe between rumours and reveal didn't leave a lot of time for negative rumours to hang around like a bad smell. There was also a steady drip-drip of leaks after the PS Meeting was announced that kept discussion flowing up until the reveal. The reveal came surprisingly early, there was an unexpectedly short wait.

With Durango, I get the sense that to a degree, people are tired of talking about rumours. The wait for the reveal has been long, and the tone mostly negative. Someone leak a picture of the controller or something, or talk of some big exciting betrayalton!

this is what I find genuinely weird. MS have been GREAT at using the media in the past, remember the 360 'leaks', screens from Kameo, abstract shots of the controller.

this time there's been a tone of negativity and MS have ignored it.

it does not instil confidence that they are in tune with the market at all.

 

[Durante]

That's your problem here. It suppose that in the past 3 years, you played most multiplatform games on PS3.

Actually, I played all of them on PC. However, counting PSN and XBLA as well as retail releases, I bought 12 exclusives on PS3 over the past 3 years and only 2 on Xbox.

Now, I'm not making an argument that my taste is representative of the masses, but I also don't believe that it is entirely wrong to see the PS3 as having more real exclusives relevant to core gamers in the past 3 years than the 360, while this was not the case around 2007.

 

[Hoo-doo]

The most hilarious thing about all of this is, it doesnt matter one bit what anyone on NeoGAF ultimately says or thinks. When both consoles launch and one of them is a better all-round entertainment package, the families of the world are going to be woo'd more by that package than "RAYTRACING!!!" the people that honestly think either Sony or MS use any hardcore gaming forum as a barometer are insane, this forum and other forums like it did not, do not and will not ever influence 50/60/70 million+ people buying a console. Yes it is fun to debate, but at times there is no debate here, when people say "omg MS must be so scared, look at this negativity" yeh a few thousand people are complaining about something that will never affect them, i'm sure they are absolutely beside themselves, the same also goes for Sony. Perspective is required because this is supposed to be a forum, not a "i'm calling the shots on how this billion dollar company must be feeling, because I know best, not them" gimme a break, a forum is for discussion not ridiculous statements

Again. Nobody is saying this, and frankly, I personally couldn't give a fuck about which console is going to sell to the "families of the world" as an all-round entertainment package.
I have my own wants and needs, as does everyone else on the internet.

I mean, this is a gaming forum first and foremost. People on here care about games a lot.
Wouldn't it make sense for the console that puts gaming as it's core focus front and center to gain more positive attention than the console that does not?

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

You are joking, but as someone who owns a ton of gaming platforms, I have to say that I didn't have nearly as many reasons to turn on my 360 in the past 3 years than, say, from 2006 to 2009.

De gustibus... Besides, the competition's been much stronger in recent years than at the start of the generation, there's no denying that. That doesn't mean that what's been on offer on the 360 over the past few years suddenly sucks, there's just more choice across the board now, and it's natural that you won't see the same community cohesion that you did in the beginning. Many more market segments are being served now, and served more or less successfully, as software sales seem to indicate. You'd be hard pressed to come to that conclusion if forums like GAF, where Xbox 360 has apparently sucked for years now, were your only source of information. On GAF, Microsoft are failing the core gamers badly, whereas in reality core gamers are still doing an admirable job filling up Microsoft's coffers.

 

[R3TRODYCE]

Got intense in here again, I see.

 

[Boost]

Nothing new...

 

[AssaTM]

Again. Nobody is saying this, and frankly, I personally couldn't give a fuck about which console is going to sell to the "families of the world" as an all-round entertainment package.
I have my own wants and needs, as does everyone else on the internet.

I mean, this is a gaming forum first and foremost. People on here care about games a lot.
Wouldn't it make sense for the console that puts gaming as it's core focus front and center to gain more positive attention than the console that does not?

Not if you can do the games portion just as well as your competitor, while offering a better package overall, no. I think thats very unfair for people to jump to that conclusion before MS's console has even been revealed. Speculating is great fun and everyone loves to do it, but proclaiming a "side" before we even know anything official from this console is just mind boggling to me, and surely to many others as well