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Project CARS PC Performance Thread

Salty Hippo

Member
Confirmed that the HUD eats at least 15fps if it's on

quick grabs with the phone



Gonna play with everything off until the new patch / drivers it seems LOL

To me it didn't change at all. Just to confirm, you change this on the start menu in-game, correct? I removed everything and the fps was the same. Maybe you need to restart the race for it to take effect?
 

T.O.P

Banned
To me it didn't change at all. Just to confirm, you change this on the start menu in-game, correct? I removed everything and the fps was the same. Maybe you need to restart the race for it to take effect?

Yeah, go to main menu, settings -> gameplay -> on the second page turn it off

You can't do it mid race
 

GHG

Gold Member
I agree with the game looking way worse than the bullshots that have been around for a while. The environment especially looks incredibly plain. Like from a game 10 years ago plain.

And I'm using 970 as well with everything possible set to max. Sorry, but the game just looks very disappointing.

What bullshots are these exactly?
 

Alo81

Low Poly Gynecologist
Confirmed that the HUD eats at least 15fps if it's on





Gonna play with everything off until the new patch / drivers it seems LOL

I'm like, 99% certain that the framerate drop is from the rear view mirror, not necessarily the HUD in general.
 

T.O.P

Banned
I'm like, 99% certain that the framerate drop is from the rear view mirror, not necessarily the HUD in general.

pcars2015-05-0921-27-v5upi.png

just tried and no, it's the HUD itself, could it be AMD specific?
 

Woffls

Member
What kind of performance should I expect on a 750 Ti SC in 1080p? Running a 5820k @ 4.3 with 16GB of DDR4. What resources will rain impact the most?
 

Salty Hippo

Member
Yeah, go to main menu, settings -> gameplay -> on the second page turn it off

You can't do it mid race

You can, actually. There's a HUD editor option that allows you to turn everything off mid-race. But I just tried to do it on the gameplay menu, still doesn't make any difference. I wonder if it's because I have reflections on medium. If you have it higher I think the mirror in the HUD eats more performance.
 

BNGames

Member
Here is my Benchmark video, I'm averaging 80fps with all details turned up with my dual GTX 980's

https://youtu.be/F34Q5qaCjn8

California Highway Full (Formula A) Demonstration
https://youtu.be/v4XwFJSMlnQ

Photo Mode/Editor:
https://youtu.be/m2ErQZCPhUA

PC Specs:
COOLER MASTER HAF X Blue Edition
COOLER MASTER Silent Pro Gold Series RS800-80GAD3-US 800W
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO
Intel Core i7-3770 Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.9GHz Turbo) - Overclocked to 4.3Ghz
(SLI) EVGA 04G-2983-KR GeForce GTX 980 Superclocked 4GB 256-Bit GDDR5 ACX 2.0 PCI Express 3.0
ASRock Z77 Extreme4 LGA 1155 Intel Z77
G.SKILL Sniper Gaming Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866 (PC3 14900)
Western Digital WD Black WD1002FAEX 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" ASUS Black Blu-ray Drive SATA Model BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS
(Shadowplay Dump Drive) SAMSUNG 840 EVO MZ-7TE120BW 2.5" 120GB SATA III TLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
(OS Drive) SAMSUNG 850 Pro Series MZ-7KE512BW 2.5" 512GB SATA III 3-D Vertical Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
 

Helznicht

Member
I figured we needed a thread like this. This game has to be the worst PC optimization that I can remember, and that includes AC Unity. I'm having such a hard time making this game playable on my 4590/970 G1.

First of all, it looks nothing like the bullshots even with everything on Ultra. Game is jaggy as fuck, but you can't jack it with AA because it's a such a huge performance hog. Second, the performance is completely different for dry and wet weathers. I had tweaked everything to get a somewhat steady 55-60fps on dry, but then if it's raining the framerate drops almost in half (35-40). I then decided to remove almost every AA option and just leave the basic MSAA. And I also changed everything from Ultra to High. Still can't get a steady framerate above even 50fps on the rain unless there are no cars in front of me.

What the hell is wrong with this game? Am I going to have to play with everything on medium and zero AA on a goddamn 970? This is insane. Anyone else having these issues? I'm surprised nobody made a Performance Thread for this game yet, makes me wonder if it's just me.

Thats an exaggeration. Yes the higher level of AA offered tanks fps, but you can get a clean look at a high framerate. The following settings on an i5 3.5 ghz and a gtx 970 never drop below 50 on Dubai, at night, full roster in a t-storm. under normal conditions never below 60 usually in the 80s. I use DSR and 50% smoothing to get rid of those last few jaggies, looks super clean.

bt9VnoW.png

h6Cq3Hu.png

tMOsPMK.png

5IzWs2V.png
 
I will do some performance testing down the line (970/3770K), only did some time trial so far with perfect 60. But I am sure that will change when more cars are on track. As for most games I recommend SMAA or MSAA for substantial performance gains.

What bugs me more is the shitty force feedback.
 

SMSRenderTeam

Neo Member
Hi Guys - we are going to create a separate account here shortly - "SMS PC Lead" to separate configuration and issues specific to PC more quickly. Hopefully NeoGAF mods will be quick to approves the new account.
 

The Cowboy

Member
Did a bit of a test on the HUD performance changing situation.

My specs.
AMD Phenom II X6 @ 4ghz, 8gb 1600 ram and an R9 280x @ 1100/1500.

It is indeed true (at least for me), the HUD does cause quite a massive FPS drop when its on - but only in certain views (in certain views you get the FPS drop no matter what). I did a few grabs comparing HUD on and off in 3rd person, complete clear view and 1st person (did this with and without mirrors - to see if they are the issue causing the drop when in in-car view).

3rd person.
Hud off - 68.5FPS @ 71% GPU usage.
Sh0gmPq.jpg

Hud on - 46.4FPS @ 58% GPU usage.
2Djxy6j.jpg


Clear view.
Hud off - 79.9FPS @ 75% GPU usage.
Jd1RRZ2.jpg

Hud on - 51.5FPS @ 58% GPU usage.
GUGI9Kf.jpg


1st Person.
Hud off - 48.4FPS @ 57% GPU usage.
UnlIxTU.jpg

Huff on - 47.9FPS @ 57% GPU usage.
nllw7z2.jpg


1st Person no mirrors.
Hud off - 48.4FPS @ 57% GPU usage.
62jk7I1.jpg

Hud on - 47.6FPS @ 57% GPU usage.
HHTy1fs.jpg
The HUD is very clearly causing a massive hit in the framerate and GPU usage in 3rd person and clear view (again, at least for me), yet in 1st person (in fact any in-car view) you get the framerate hit and GPU usage drop aswell (so its not just the HUD, its the in-car model aswell, or at least something in it) - so to get the best FPS you need to play in 3rd person or clear view with no HUD - any other way/view seems to gets a major FPS/GPU usage hit.
 

Sinistral

Member
PhysX being the core of the game may indeed be the culprit for the dubious performance on AMD cards. Game basically is overloading the cpu with calculations that are offloaded to nVidia GPUs. Was reading about it on the Anandtech forums.

HardOCP (Read entire thread for more shenanigans): http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1041593386&postcount=59
I've now conducted my mini investigation and have seen lots of correspondence between AMD and ourselves as late as March and again yesterday.

The software render person says that AMD drivers create too much of a load on the CPU. The PhysX runs on the CPU in this game for AMD users. The PhysX makes 600 calculations per second on the CPU. Basically the AMD drivers + PhysX running at 600 calculations per second is killing performance in the game. The person responsible for it is freaking awesome. So I'm not angry. But this is the current workaround without all the sensationalism.

Weird case on the SteamUser Forums: http://steamcommunity.com/app/234630/discussions/0/613957600537550716/#c613957600537622481

The HUD tests done above are really interesting too. I don't even have an AMD GPU right now. This is a prime example of horrible closed sourced proprietary Gameworks and nVidias shameful tactics. No buy from me.
 

RP912

Banned
Smh honestly I'm starting to feel a little bit of buyers remorse with this game. I love it, but the poor optimization is killing my love for the game. My rig is not that bad to run the game on at least medium settings or maybe high. I just hope for some type of update because it doesn't make sense that AMD users getting the short end of the stick.
 

The Cowboy

Member
Interesting stuff - edited out as the post is 2 posts up.
So if i read that correctly, if an NVidia user forces the game to use PhysX on the CPU it basically gets the same kind of performance situation that AMD users have by default, because AMD users have the PhysX forced onto the CPU by default?.

If this is true, how on earth can this be fixed for AMD cards?, can PhysX actually be forced to be run on AMD GPU's?.
 

Sinistral

Member
So if i read that correctly, if an NVidia user forces the game to use PhysX on the CPU it basically gets the same kind of performance situation that AMD users have by default, because AMD users have the PhysX forced onto the CPU by default?.

If this is true, how on earth can this be fixed for AMD cards?, can PhysX actually be forced to be run on AMD GPU's?.

The problem is still Driver overhead. SMS providing a DX12 variant is the most immediate solution. AMD can do as much as they can to reduce cpu bottlenecks that do happen in their drivers but without actually reverse engineering the blackbox that is GPU PhysX, it will only take them so far.
 

Ty4on

Member
Yea the AMD driver issues needs to be resolved. For the time being I just cut down on the extra stuff like environmental and reflection. I usually get like 40 to 60 fps depending on the magnitude of the race. The lowest fps I get is about 30.

After what we've learned I'm not so sure they're AMD's fault :p

Edit: Physx complicates things. Not used to it not being random particle effects.
 

Bradd12

Member
Im getting a weird bug where the game will sort of freeze if i hit a sign or something at high speed.
Something to do with physx perhaps?
 

Salty Hippo

Member
Hi Guys - we are going to create a separate account here shortly - "SMS PC Lead" to separate configuration and issues specific to PC more quickly. Hopefully NeoGAF mods will be quick to approves the new account.

It's cool that you guys are stopping by, looking forward to that.
 
Hi Guys - we are going to create a separate account here shortly - "SMS PC Lead" to separate configuration and issues specific to PC more quickly. Hopefully NeoGAF mods will be quick to approves the new account.

I'm curious if there is a way to see the FPS without a 3rd party application?
 

GHG

Gold Member
Here is my Benchmark video, I'm averaging 80fps with all details turned up with my dual GTX 980's

https://youtu.be/F34Q5qaCjn8

California Highway Full (Formula A) Demonstration
https://youtu.be/v4XwFJSMlnQ

Photo Mode/Editor:
https://youtu.be/m2ErQZCPhUA

PC Specs:
COOLER MASTER HAF X Blue Edition
COOLER MASTER Silent Pro Gold Series RS800-80GAD3-US 800W
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO
Intel Core i7-3770 Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.9GHz Turbo) - Overclocked to 4.3Ghz
(SLI) EVGA 04G-2983-KR GeForce GTX 980 Superclocked 4GB 256-Bit GDDR5 ACX 2.0 PCI Express 3.0
ASRock Z77 Extreme4 LGA 1155 Intel Z77
G.SKILL Sniper Gaming Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1866 (PC3 14900)
Western Digital WD Black WD1002FAEX 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" ASUS Black Blu-ray Drive SATA Model BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS
(Shadowplay Dump Drive) SAMSUNG 840 EVO MZ-7TE120BW 2.5" 120GB SATA III TLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
(OS Drive) SAMSUNG 850 Pro Series MZ-7KE512BW 2.5" 512GB SATA III 3-D Vertical Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)

Thanks for doing this.

Any chance you can do something similar to the 1st video but with circa 20 cars in stormy conditions?

I'm trying to weigh up going with sli 980's or a single titan x for this game.
 

BNGames

Member
Thanks for doing this.

Any chance you can do something similar to the 1st video but with circa 20 cars in stormy conditions?

I'm trying to weigh up going with sli 980's or a single titan x for this game.

Ill get on that tomorrow. In my experience so far though additional cars haven't done much to the FPS, Rain certainly has though.
 
I was wondering what settings I need to run this game under "worst" conditions and still maintain a locked 60. For now I am settling with everything maxed out, until I experience drops in the career.
 

The Cowboy

Member
A couple more tests on the HUD performance drop, only focused on 3rd person and clear (bumper) view this time, as nothing changes at all with the in-car views (i get the FPS/GPU usage drop no matter what in that view).

Weirdly, its not all the HUD views that cause a performance drop, its only the ones that have the speedometer on it - any other HUD view has no performance drop.
-
3rd Person.
Hud mode 1 - 47.1FPS (having the rear view changes nothing).
QKRv0QF.jpg

Hud mode 2 - 68.6FPS.
FJPzpUF.jpg

Hud mode 3 - 67.3FPS.
FYCW2Np.jpg

Hud off - 68.5FPS.
Sh0gmPq.jpg


Clear (bumper) view.
Hud mode 1 - 52.3FPS (having the rear view changes nothing).
4XHD71e.jpg

Hud mode 2 - 80.1FPS.
Q5CDjQx.jpg

Hud mode 3 - 78.4FPS.
pxWqBQG.jpg

Hud off - 79.9FPS.
Jd1RRZ2.jpg
So the Hud performance drop in 3rd person and bumper view only happens when using the 1st 2 Hud views (Hud mode 1 with and without the mirror at the top), as soon as you switch to any other Hud view of just turn it off - you get a performance increase.

I think it actually might be the speedometer causing it, i never thought to disable that on its own - will do that now

Edit.
Nope, hiding the speedometer does nothing at all, it still has the performance drop on Hud mode 1. Strangely though, when having it set to Hud mode 1 and hiding everything using the edit hud option in the pause screen (so there is no Hud visable) you still get the performance drop - so Hud mode 1 with everything hidden gets a performance drop, and the Hud actually turned off (using the main menu or d-pad left) has no performance drop - very weird.
 

Qassim

Member
I feel like the frame pacing in this game is amazingly good, better than most games I've played recently. I'm not sure if it's just me imagining it, but I get a remarkably smooth image, it feels very, very consistent even at a variable frame rate on a G-Sync monitor.

Maybe it isn't frame pacing, but something about it makes it feel so good.
 

BNGames

Member
Thanks for doing this.

Any chance you can do something similar to the 1st video but with circa 20 cars in stormy conditions?

I'm trying to weigh up going with sli 980's or a single titan x for this game.

Ask and Ye shall receive!

Ok so I set it up with 32 cars (The max count), and I set variable weather. Don't mind the driving too much, I was looking at the frames while I was driving so I screw up a lot. I noticed a bit of a hit, but for the most part it stayed near 60 even with the weather effects.

Check it out: https://youtu.be/Exz4TubkYCw
 
I just did some testing to see how much I need to turn stuff down under the following settings:

- Spa
- 20 cars
- Thunderstorm (1pm)

GTX 970, 3770K @4,3

As it stands, there is no way to reach a locked 60 under wet conditions with this amount of cars without turning things down A LOT.
Also there does not seem to be a single setting that eats the majority of performance (maybe besides reflections and MSAA?), but I'd like to see results from others. This thread is very low on actual content, maybe because of the bad OP.
 

The Cowboy

Member
Agreed with Windom Earle, it is a shame the thread is lacking in content :(.
-
Anyways, due to the AMD issue after a bit of tweaking I'm actually happy with a the PS4 settings (at least what's called the PS4 settings in the profile file) with extra FXAA (as the Ps4 does have a form of AA that just isn't listed in the file), the game still looks amazingly good at these settings and heck even in the rain my FPS was staying decent with 15 cars on the track. The PS4 settings for anyone interested are below, but you can find the data in your ProjectCars/Settings/PredefinedSettings.xml file (along with the Xbox One settings).

TextureFilter value="1"/> - Anisotropic x2 (its actually meant to be x4 i think)
TextureResolution value="2"/> - High
CarDetail value="1"/> - Medium
TrackDetail value="1"/> - Medium
ShadowDetail value="2"/> - Medium
MotionBlurLevel value="1"/> - Low
EffectsDetailLevel value="0"/> -
EmapDetailLevel value="1"/> - Environment Map - Medium
ReflectionEmapDetailLevel value="1"/> - Medium
AntialiasingSetting value="0"/> - OFF
AntialiasingMode value="0"/> - Irrelevant since it's off
FXAASetting value="0"/> - OFF
SMAASetting value="0"/> - OFF
MaxFrameLatency value="2"/> - Render frames ahead - 2
DetailedGrassEnabled value="1"/> - Low
LensFlareEnabled value="1"/> - ON
BloomEnabled value="1"/> - ON
HeatHazeEnabled value="0"/> - OFF
ExteriorLensFlareSetting value="1"/> - Full
InteriorLensFlareSetting value="1"/> - Full
GlobalSpecularIrradianceEnabled value="1"/> - ON
RainDropsSetting value="1"/> - YES
ScreenDirtSetting value="1"/> - YES
CrepuscularRaysSetting value="1"/> - YES
LampostLightsSetting value="1"/> - Post-Processing Filters - ON
StreachedHeadlightsSetting value="0"/> - OFF
VignetteSetting value="0"/> - NO
ParticleLevel value="1"/> - LOW
ParticleDensity value="1"/> - Medium
 

BNGames

Member
Agreed with Windom Earle, it is a shame the thread is lacking in content :(.
-
Anyways, due to the AMD issue after a bit of tweaking I'm actually happy with a the PS4 settings (at least what's called the PS4 settings in the profile file) with extra FXAA (as the Ps4 does have a form of AA that just isn't listed in the file), the game still looks amazingly good at these settings and heck even in the rain my FPS was staying decent with 15 cars on the track. The PS4 settings for anyone interested are below, but you can find the data in your ProjectCars/Settings/PredefinedSettings.xml file (along with the Xbox One settings).

I have an i5 7950 rig I'm gonna bend this on soon as well
 
Agreed with Windom Earle, it is a shame the thread is lacking in content :(.
-
Anyways, due to the AMD issue after a bit of tweaking I'm actually happy with a the PS4 settings (at least what's called the PS4 settings in the profile file) with extra FXAA (as the Ps4 does have a form of AA that just isn't listed in the file), the game still looks amazingly good at these settings and heck even in the rain my FPS was staying decent with 15 cars on the track. The PS4 settings for anyone interested are below, but you can find the data in your ProjectCars/Settings/PredefinedSettings.xml file (along with the Xbox One settings).

That is useful info, thanks! Did not expect to identify the PS4 settings that easily. Lots of medium in there.
 

Skyzard

Banned
I found these settings to be optimal for mostly dry weather but decent in heavy rain too. It does drop into the high 40s sometimes but it's mostly in the 50s. I can get it to hit 60 more but I don't want to sacrifice the quality, if I'm going to get slowdown anyway I might as well get used to it right :p This is just for rain. With regular weather it only drops during the start of some races that are packed out but not by much or for long, or some hot spots or stretches for a little bit. It's hard to get locked 60 without turning down settings more but then you get a less nice image, maybe some fuzz.

4770K - 4.4GHz / 780ti sc

Taking reflections down to medium would be nice but you get popup on the road reflections and it's a bit distracting.

Motion blur refers to quality not strength, I'm pretty sure.

Shadows still look bad at high and even ultra, and you still get the drawline anyway so I went for medium for the extra performance.

Setting AF to 16x and high quality in the control panel can help with road markings like on azure coast stage 1, the long highway stretch, the white pattern on the floor can be really fuzzy otherwise.

2560x1440
Texture Resolution: High
Anti-Aliasing: MSAA
FXXA: Off
SMAA: Ultra
Reflections: High
Environment Map: Medium
Car Detail: Ultra
Track Detail: Ultra
Shadows: Medium
Motion Blur: High
Render Frames Ahead: 1
Detailed Grass: Low
Particle Level: High
Particle Density: Medium
Stretch Reflections: Yes

You can get away with higher if you are only going to play dry. MSAA to high looks a bit smoother.
 

flashmouth

Neo Member
I have an i5 3570k and 16Gb mem, what will be better performancewise at 1080p:

GTX 960 or
GTX 770 both 2Gb?

There's a cashback promotion on 960s from Asus, would be around the same price of a used 770.
 

BNGames

Member
I have an i5 3570k and 16Gb mem, what will be better performancewise at 1080p:

GTX 960 or
GTX 770 both 2Gb?

There's a cashback promotion on 960s from Asus, would be around the same price of a used 770.

Dude just save your pennies and get a 970 at least.
 

AU Tiger

Member
Here's my setup

i7 4770k @ 4.6ghz
16gigs corsair vengeance ram
G1 windforce 980 clocked @ 1540mhz

I'm averaging around 40 fps at the start of a race with 31 opponents with everything maxed out @ 1080p

MSAA on, MFAA enabled, FXAA off, SMAA at ultra

One thing that I will note during my testing of the game when it was in alpha is that the detailed grass will hog performance pretty badly and honestly, the game doesn't really look much different (unless you're watching replays) if you just disable detailed grass all together.

When I turned off grass, I'd get damn near 20~30 fps in some areas. This was before they made some optimizations and changes to the way that the grass is rendered so it may not be as significant now. I have it currently set all the way up but plan to drop it to the medium setting and also pull SMAA down a little to see what that changes when tons of cars are on screen.

I agree with the game looking way worse than the bullshots that have been around for a while. The environment especially looks incredibly plain. Like from a game 10 years ago plain.

And I'm using 970 as well with everything possible set to max. Sorry, but the game just looks very disappointing.

WMD never had any bullshots for this game that were not captured directly from in-game play using the free cam photo mode.

They have it disabled for now (primarily because they don't want to have to deal with people getting their cameras stuck in a certain position with a filter and not know how to reset it. I guess they have other things they are wanting to focus on right now.

If they DO re-enable it, here was what all it could do.

- While in free cam mode, CTRL+K to adjust camera settings, which are positioned on numpad as following :
- 2 : increase pitch
- 8 : decrease pitch
- 4 : increase yaw
- 6 : decrease yaw
- 7 : increase radius
- 9 : decrease radius
- 1 : increase roll
- 3 : decrease roll
- "-" : increase field of view
- "+" : decrease field of view
ZQSD to move (WASD if QWERTY keyboard), left click to rotate camera, right click is like Z (or W)

- Once you have placed camera and angle like desired, you can activate Depth of Field to add even more realism :
- F3 : depth of field on/off
- F4 : reset depth of field default settings
- F5 : focus plane decrease
- F6 : focus plane increase
- F7 : decrease field
- F8 : increase field
- Shift+F5 : more sharpness
- Shift+F6 : more blur
- Shift+F7 : blur transition decrease
- Shift+F8 : blur transition increase

You can set filters too, with
- CTRL+P : cycle through filters
- CTRL+SHIFT+P : remove filters

- F1 key shows the developer menu, where you can change ambient occlusion settings and some HDR exposure settings

These are a couple of shots I personally took in photo mode, in game. Time of day, weather conditions, camera angle, DOF, etc all play a large roll in how everything comes together visually. The really really good shots you will see floating around of the game have had specific time of day/weather and camera angles chosen.

Try setting the weather type to hazy and start the race in the early morning hours around sunrise. To me, that always looked really great.

 
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