shortly after CES doesn't make sense, unless perhaps they think it justifies a standalone announcement event?
At CES you have the likes of spike for coverage, then later in Q1 you have GDC. in between just sounds odd.
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PS4 Rumors , APU code named 'Liverpool' Radeon HD 7970 GPU Steamroller CPU 16GB Flash
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shortly after CES doesn't make sense, unless perhaps they think it justifies a standalone announcement event?
At CES you have the likes of spike for coverage, then later in Q1 you have GDC. in between just sounds odd.
McHuj
Member
Well remember that MS will not be at CES, but I don't that means we shouldn't expect a CES-like event from MS in the time frame of Q1. Sony did it with Vita in a January event.
If MS does announce that soon, it wouldn't surprise me if Sony follow suit soon as well.
I would also expect more rumors to start up as the announcement approaches.
If MS does announce that soon, it wouldn't surprise me if Sony follow suit soon as well.
I would also expect more rumors to start up as the announcement approaches.
This sounds like a very bad idea. There is too much of a drought in time between the launch and reveal. However, Microsoft might be ready for an earlier launch than we are all suspecting.
Canis lupus
Member
Sony announced the Vita after CES and before GDC in their own PS Meeting.
@thuway: not really, wether they announce it after CES or E3, it wouldn't change the plans to release it in fall 2013.
This is surprising since I was under the impression that MS originally planned to launch in 2014. Maybe they had a few plans in motion.
postal chaos
Member
Shortly after CES? There's a little football game that comes on in early February that is the most watched tv event every year. That would get the word out in a major way.
phosphor112
Banned
Those who expected 2012 for Durango are idiots.
Hardware doesn't bother me that much because I know Sony's first party developers can pull off some magic on 6 year old hardware at the moment, I do worry that they might be late to the party and that like last time they will be behind in sales and have to compete with two existing consoles on the market while also falling behind with 3rd parties.
specialguy
Banned
awesome stuff sweetvar. please follow up for us.
iamshadowlark
Banned
I said this earlier this year but no way next GDC comes and they aren't talking semi-openly about next-gen development.
H_Prestige
Banned
Remember what happened the last time someone tried to make a games console a supercomputer? I don't know what MS is thinking, especially with all this built in kinect stuff. Sounds like they're setting themselves up for a huge blunder.
systemfehler
Member
The insight itself is awesome, the information rather depressing. I hope for more than a "7700" in late 2013 and 720 being "stronger" sounds more like Tretton giving up on his promises and some corporate council overruling him.
MS waited for AMD to fix Sony architecture before starting their own designs.
CONSPIRACY!
McHuj
Member
Maybe Sony wanted to launch sooner then late 2013. Maybe the originally wanted a Spring 2013 launch in Japan.
McHuj
Member
Ask if Silicon Interposer or Stacking are being used.
I think the going rumour and all hints point at an APU alone, albeit an APU with GPU perf more akin to a dedicated GPU of today. The 7970 GPU citation in the title was a misread of the article in the OP. I'm surprised it was never edited in fact.
But anyway, yeah, maybe they had different schedules and MS's was longer in the first place. It's still surprising to me, if true, though, since prior indication seemed to be that MS was further along.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Ha, the phrase ARM security sounds like that old rumor about next Xbox having another set of processors that will be used in some kind of low power media playback mode will be true. I suppose they'll have arm chipset for that and the AMD chips with fast CPU+GPU for games.
You think the cost would be too high?
IF the timetables are correct, Sony will receive 2nd batch of chips for testing in November, and in December [+1 month if AMD taping lasts longer] they will know if they are good enough for full scale production.
Playstation Vita was publicly unveiled under the name of NGP on January 27th 2011, little more on GDC in March and official announcement on E3 in early June. I can see similar timetable repeating again with PS4. Even if they skip January unveil, something will be shown at GDC for sure.
Playstation Vita was publicly unveiled under the name of NGP on January 27th 2011, little more on GDC in March and official announcement on E3 in early June. I can see similar timetable repeating again with PS4. Even if they skip January unveil, something will be shown at GDC for sure.
specialguy
Banned
I can answer half these lol..., from common well sourced rumors to my own common sense...
I understand you wont take my word on it, and these are good questions anyway, but anyway.
I understand you wont take my word on it, and these are good questions anyway, but anyway.
iamshadowlark
Banned
By who exactly?
I don't think there's any doubt both consoles will have their own event.
specialguy
Banned
i raised some of the same objections as you though. I remember it was said, in fact AMD said it in an interview though I doubt I could find a link for you now, that when AMD was designing Wii and 360 GPU's at the same time, secrecy was like military grade, strictly no communication between the teams (that were on separate campuses in separate cities) was supposedly allowed. And this was for two consoles that were not really competing in the same space even (obviously the Wii being low performance). So how much worse should it be when the two consoles ARE directly competing?
his posts have the ring of truth though, for whatever reason, you can usually just feel such things. And he seemed to mention some key codenames in his early posts that really made BG respect him.
jeff_rigby
Banned
Originally Posted by iamshadowlark:
iamshadowlark said:
"The Chip" is likely a part of the SoC not the whole SoC and common between both PS4 and Xbox 720. The entire SoC is going to have other third party IP (other CPUs, DSPs, maybe FPGAs.). Thinking about it, the simpler core design that is shared by both is apparently the PS4 so it makes sense that it was first.
McHuj
Member
You may be right, but if we're at the point of both chips taping out (and multiple revisions), then more and more people are getting involved. The same people who designed the chip aren't going to carry it through tape-out and validation (they'll be supporting those efforts).
I wouldn't be surprised if hundreds of people were involved at this point. And with a number that high, someone will talk.
Hey ive got nothing against sweetvar, its the info he's been given that i'm doubtful of.
specialguy
Banned
Just because it's not what you want to hear doesn't make it not true.
Sony is in third place for a reason, they make bad decisions.
They could be thinking any number of things, but I bet two of their top priorities are "we cant lose a lot of money on this machine" and "we cant let xbox beat us to market, at least by much, again"
You aren't the only one.
It would be suicide for Sony to release a weak PS4 at a later date. But then Sony are under massive financial stress and they can't afford to lose too much money on the hardware but at the same time they can't have the PS4 costing much more than the next XBox.
I'm finding all this speculation fascinating though.
I'm finding all this speculation fascinating though.
well you are doing exactly the same thing. You have no knowledge or source and yet you write your opinion as some sort of inside info that you know is true. Double standrds?
EDIT: I would be glad to be proven wrong (maybe you share your source with us), but I am just point the obvious
My impression is that E3 is nowhere near as important as before, these companies need their flagship products to have their own show and prime time.
It's not desirable to unveil PS4 and Xbox next at the same time, for the first time, at E3, with the press splitting their coverage and attention, with the two products getting heavily compared and shitstorms happening whenever one has a better feature than the other.
Just to make an example the 360 presentation in 2005 was completely dwarfed by Sony showing target renders and tech demos at full specs. The poor J Allard was basically getting asked during interviews if their hardware was a turd...the day of the presentation....
That is something that they will be careful not to repeat, it's crucial to set the right mindshare since the beginning, you can't do that with a potential time bomb sitting in the nearby press room.
So I think that both PS4 and Xbox will be unveiled before E3 at dedicated events.
It's not about what I want to hear. It's about common sense, predictions from time tables, and a whole bunch of salt. I've worked in the games industry in a low level position for quite some time. Getting layed off, hired, layed off, eventually get's you into a position where you make enough friends to hear an iota of the grape vine. I don't even think any information BG has is true. The secrets involved in both of these products could cost AMD their business if they suddenly become a leaky boat. Your suggestion that his post rings of "a voice of truth", is also a hilarious suggestion.
Most websites will agree Microsoft is readying to fire on all cylinders. All quiet on the Sony front.
Not to mention the sudden drop in stock prices if Sony's console was worse off than Microsoft's next box. Sony will do the wait and see approach. Bank on it.
I'd be happy to wait a short amount of time. Original PS3 cannot be used as a yardstick, bluray fucked them over.
Easter 2014 with significant and noticable power differential would be ok. If its similar to 720, then get out Q4 2013
I'm also fine with some third parties not taking full advantage of potential increased power. On-par ports and amazing first party titles is good by me.
It feels like there is a jump in power just around the corner - either with stacking, process shrinks or whatever. If either of the HD twins' go for that, thats good for everyone (don't really care if its sony or not). It'll also benefit PC owners if they can persuade developers to use the higher power machine as the baseline.
Whoever launches later, Sony or MS, will have this advantage. Both cannot be targeting the same time frame. I predict a six month window in between launches. Both systems will be virtually sold out for the first year regardless.
This is the big gamble. Do you wait 6 months for things to cheapen up and insure yourself better third party development? Or do you launch first, reap early adopters, and have a headstart?
phosphor112
Banned
MS waited for AMD to fix Sony architecture before starting their own designs.
Lol, well...
first mover has the potential advantage of built up blue balls in a lot of us with such a long current gen, but yes, both will be sold out for the first year - Christmas 2014 is the first big fight I guess.
specialguy
Banned
not really.
ps3 was a full year after 360 and basically on par.
i doubt all the newfangled stuff you guys talk about will be ready in two years, let alone only 6 months difference.
it's probably more about what the manufacturer wants than time frame within reason. especially with lead times as long as they are nowdays.
I sort of disagree with the logic here.
Investors won't care about minor spec advantages or disadvantages. I think if anything investors would be FAR more concerned about any significant headstart a competitor might have.
The only way investors would care about spec is if the product failed to generate buzz with the target market. By the sounds of it - if this rumour was true - the perf differences won't be particularly large. If either system is coming in a relatively small bit either side of the other, and the spec in the OP is a rough guideline as to what to expect (albeit with more RAM, hopefully), I think both will be enough to deliver very impressive software. And that's what people will be looking at - is this a 'next-gen' machine, does it deliver a jump, is the software exciting etc. etc. If investors are satisfied that people have welcomed a system as desirable, they will be happy about the spec.
SlickShoesRUCrazy
Member
Microsoft isn't attending CES anymore remember?
they are trying to be more like Apple and just have their own standalone events.
Agreed. That's the first time i've heard that claim thuway made about Sony's next-gen strategy
The PS3 was a catastrophe of monumental proportions and we do not need to go down that road again. Economies of scale, large chip sizes, and foreign technology caused it to almost implode the PlayStation market.
Waiting for 2014, or six more months insures that whoever launches will be in a brand new architecture.
I think you should go back and re-read some of the older stuff I've posted. I've always said one thing, Sony is behind. In fact, I messaged BG before with the same notion if he's hearing the same thing, and he agreed with me.
Than again, GRAIN MEET SALT. This is all pure speculation, and nothing else. The idea of Sony launching later with inferior hardware is kind of silly. If MS were to launch later, I honestly believe they would take the extra time to target a higher performance out of the box as well.
Apophis2036
Banned
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