nhlducks35
Member
Pretty sure the average Joe wouldn't give two shits about RAM
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PS4's 8GB RAM was kept secret from third-party devs until console reveal
- Thread starter Canis lupus
- Start date
Pretty sure the average Joe wouldn't give two shits about RAM
Whiteshirt
Member
They care about the amount, which is why big box stores try and sell laptops with 8GB. Even though 8GB is completely pointless in most cases.
DonMigs85
Member
Didn't stop PS2 from dominating even though Xbox had nearly double the RAM
Although they probably could, changing the amount of RAM is a much easier switch to make late in development than altering the APU, which has at least some custom silicon on-board and was designed over the course of years by AMD. Plus you have to consider than it changes the thermal envelope, power requirements, etc., etc. -- undoing what probably amounts to thousands of man-hours and a ton of development $.
Sapphire Dreams
Member
So the div kits WERE not representative of the PS4 final specs.
Truespeed
Member
That's the exact same argument I used way before we knew any PS4 specs. The significance of GDDR5 is totally irrelevant to the average consumer when you have half the RAM. Sony would have been killed from a marketing perspective trying to go up against a system with twice as much memory for about the same cost. They knew this and had no choice but to increase it to 8GB.
nhlducks35
Member
Okay.
"Hmm, I was gonna buy the PS4 because I liked the games and apps on it, but it only has half the RAM of the Durango! Guess I'll get the Durango!"
Said no one ever.
But that's because Sony had a huge software lead, much better developer support, a much more recognizable gaming brand, and multiple killer apps (GTA 3, MGS2, & GT3 come to mind immediately) that came out before the Xbox even launched.
Microsoft came out with a much more powerful console that, for most people early on, was only good for playing Halo: CE. The PS2's huge install base lead meant that most developers saw little value in enhancing games to take advantage of the power Xbox offered, and thus only first/second party, and a few third party games showed off the vast technical difference.
Most of the salient factors at work in that generation will be more or less rendered moot in the coming generation because both brands have similar recognition and the same launch window.
either Sony found Microsoft 8 GB offering a threat or their OS footprint is larger than they thought so they decided to go all out and double the initial 4 GB planning, there's no reason to keep third parties in the dark just to tell them some months before launch "hey you know, we really appreciate you were losing time optimizing your PS4 launch game for 4 GB... but the truth is we have 8 GB ! enjoy !" seems a bit silly and pointless to keep them uninformed, who really knows anyway.
SkullHydra
Member
I think the more probable situation would be...
"Hey honey, which video game system do you think we should get for our kids?"
"Well this one has eight ram instead of four, so it's probably better."
And you're crazy if you think Microsoft wouldn't use that higher number as a bullet point.
nhlducks35
Member
Are you serious with that example?
futnownarcade
Member
This is not a conspiracy, its common practice for dev kits of all consoles to change specs up until the release.
Specs is one thing, complete architecture re-factoring is another. Just upping the RAM to 8GB from 4GB is quite simple though.
Lagspike_exe
Member
Are you serious? No one outside forums even cares about these things.
SkullHydra
Member
Unfortunately, I am. I've overheard way too many conversations like that over the years by parents who have no idea what they're actually buying.
"Look at the 8 GB of fucks I don't give".
Open Source
Banned
They used to care about how many bits the CPU could address at once, so it's not outside the realm of possibility.
Also, blast processing.
PdotMichael
Banned
Is ram the new bit race of the 90s?
I mean no one cares about the faster cpu, gpu or ram of an Android smartphone but the Retina display of an iPhone was an important selling point. Technical features are only a selling point on a consumer level if there is a direct connection between user and hardwre.
I mean no one cares about the faster cpu, gpu or ram of an Android smartphone but the Retina display of an iPhone was an important selling point. Technical features are only a selling point on a consumer level if there is a direct connection between user and hardwre.
Here's how that conversation would actually go.
"Hey honey, which system should we get for our kids?" Mother asked
"Well, this one has eight RAM instead of four, so it's probably better." Father replied.
"What does that even mean? Oh, let's just get this one, it has Halo and I know Billy loves the halos." Mother picked up the Xbox packaging, but Father stood in place, unmoving as a mountain.
"Honey, what's wrong?" Mother looked uncomfortably at her husband, who had begun shaking somewhat. Father muttered something under his breath. "What's that, sweetie?"
"Eight..." Father's mumbling was more audible this time. "Eight gigabytes." Mother didn't understand, but began worrying as he started salivating. Slowly his gaze turned towards her. His eyes were bloodshot - no, it was more than that. They had become totally red, and cried tears of blood. Mother screamed in terror, and began to run, but he was faster.
"EIGHT GIGABYTES," he screamed, his voice joined by what sounded like a choir of demons. His clawed hands wrapped around her throat and squeezed tightly. "EIGHT GIGABYTES OF RAAAAAAAM." Mother's face began turning blue from asphyxiation as three armed guards pulled Father's hands from her neck and handcuffed him. She collapsed to the floor, gasping for air, tears streaming down her face at the sight of her possessed husband. As the police dragged him away, he just kept laughing, shrieking unintelligble nonsense, the only discernable phrase: "eight gigabytes."
Yeah, that's not going to happen.
Of the past 3 generations, in every one the most powerful console didn't win. Sony tried the "amazing hardware" approach with the PS3 and advertising cell. Guess what? Nobody gave a fuck about cell... at all.
Specs can sell PC's... games sell consoles.
UrSuLeTZuL
Banned
Mikey Jr.
Member
Maybe a conspiracy theory here, but I wonder if it was to blindside MS, so MS gets stuck with 4GB of ddr3 ram, while Sony has 8gb gddr5?
Is that possible?
Lets say for a minute that was true, there is enough time to up their ram to match Sony's at this point in time, right? I mean, there is still a lot of months left.
Is that possible?
Lets say for a minute that was true, there is enough time to up their ram to match Sony's at this point in time, right? I mean, there is still a lot of months left.
And nobody believed it. Was amazing to see the shock.
Bottlenecks are.
Durango has 8GB of slow ram combined with 32MB of medium ram for more vital functions. This is a puzzle/bottleneck devs will have to struggle with throughout it's life.
PS4 simply has 8GB of fast unified ram.
It's not a conspiracy or an illegal one to keep your competitor on your toes.
MS and Sony love to copy and improve from their competitors. I think it it was a great move they got MS in such a way they have to scramble to keep up. MS can easily keep up people thinking they can't are forgetting what happened last generation when it comes to ram.
At this point ram is the least of MS worries.
I don't think they kept it secret to pressure MS, they just didn't know until the last mp minute if chip densities would be available to let them do it.
The ring fenced OS RAM comment is interesting. Considering that previous kits had 4GB, hopefully Sony settled on a relatively low amount of ram for the OS (like 512MB) and don't feel the need to increase that
The ring fenced OS RAM comment is interesting. Considering that previous kits had 4GB, hopefully Sony settled on a relatively low amount of ram for the OS (like 512MB) and don't feel the need to increase that
TacticalFox88
Banned
Kind of insane. You have something so bizarre and crazy that when it leaks everyone's like "lol, fuck outta here with that bullshit."
Then Sony annouces it on stage then everyone's like "O__O!!! Da faq?!!?"
Console history is too random to say whether power mattered or not. If marketed well, and if word of mouth builds up, a more powerful console with the same range of games at a similar price could succeed if power is the primary differentiator between the two
Kibbles
Member
Had to pause with laughter >.<
alexandros
Banned
Specs do not affect purchasing habits of mainstream gamers directly, but they do have a notable effect indirectly. In my opinion, when the consumer wants to buy something, he values the opinions of his friends and especially those that are somewhat tech-savvy. The people most likely to purchase a new console at launch are hardcore gamers, people who generally do care about specs and differences in performance. A more powerful PS4 (as seems to be the case based on rumored Durango specs) could have a good chance at winning the lion's share of these initial purchases.
So down the line, a plausible scenario is this: Average consumer X wants to buy a new console. He asks his core console gamer friends and most of them have a PS4. Hmm. He asks some tech-savvy friends and they say that the PS4 performs better so it's a better buy. So average consumer X buys a PS4 and Microsoft loses the mainstream market.
Hopefully somewhere during the process, average consumer X talks to his PC gamer friends and they get him to buy a PC or at the very least a Steambox
But specs do matter, unless Microsoft provides an incentive to the mainstream audience that is too appealing to ignore.
So down the line, a plausible scenario is this: Average consumer X wants to buy a new console. He asks his core console gamer friends and most of them have a PS4. Hmm. He asks some tech-savvy friends and they say that the PS4 performs better so it's a better buy. So average consumer X buys a PS4 and Microsoft loses the mainstream market.
Hopefully somewhere during the process, average consumer X talks to his PC gamer friends and they get him to buy a PC or at the very least a Steambox
But specs do matter, unless Microsoft provides an incentive to the mainstream audience that is too appealing to ignore.robertsan21
Member
hopefully they had it all planned out, keep this secret and hope that MS would go for a lower RAM specification.
I do hope we see better looking games on PS4 than 720 just for the lulz! would be awesome to see the fanboys fight over it haha
I do hope we see better looking games on PS4 than 720 just for the lulz! would be awesome to see the fanboys fight over it haha
WolfForager
Member
Surprisingly a number of my friends who I've heard talking about the PS4 have said something along the lines of "I hear it has stupidly fast RAM and lots of it". Not sure how that will hold up once MS release the Nextbox specs though...
Maybe something that should curtail my enthusiasm about "the average joe" a bit is the fact that I'm an engineering student and hang around with other engineering students... Yea that could be a factor alright...
Maybe something that should curtail my enthusiasm about "the average joe" a bit is the fact that I'm an engineering student and hang around with other engineering students... Yea that could be a factor alright...
This. A decade ago, the RAM was a bottleneck in my PC, laptop and console. Nowadays it doesn't bother me, my laptop barely uses its 4 GB.
Not correct. 8 Gb was thrown around since September last year. The reason for the change was that yields (and therefore price) of parts were better than expected.
Also, they have been pretty cagey about a lot of things about the hardware and software to combat leaks.
GoldenHelmet
Member
That's it, I'm keeping my mouth completely shut in future... :-/
How come, others say the same as me, but it seems to be my comments that get syndicated and reposted EVERYWHERE...
How come, others say the same as me, but it seems to be my comments that get syndicated and reposted EVERYWHERE...
Betrayer of hope
Banned
When killzone moves away from 30fps to the hallowed 60fps standard then perhaps we can say woah with all the system specs.
As of now all the memory on earth makes no difference if your games are still stuck with last gen mentality
As of now all the memory on earth makes no difference if your games are still stuck with last gen mentality
That is more about processing power.
It actually does. He's indirectly indicating that the PS4 might/does have specific memory allocated to the running of the OS (which is run via the "Companion Processor").
polyh3dron
Banned
Article became retarded right there. More RAM does not double your frame rate, for fuck's sake.
lmao
FrozenCell
Member
exactly
I think that's the key thing here. Specs alone have no impact on your average buyer, but if the games work better on one platform than the other or something like that, then it could swing it.
The rumored "PS4 is better because it has 8 gigabytes of RAM" crowd just doesn't exist.
I see you hopping thread to thread with this, but 60 FPS is a choice. They could've easily targeted 60 FPS if they choose to, but they obviously choose to add as much graphical detail as they can at 30 FPS.
ThisWreckage
Banned
To be frank, I only expect the first/second party studios to fully utilize the 8GB of RAM in the first place. I'm sure it will make life easier for third parties, but I certainly don't expect them to go above and beyond.
SirIgbyCeaser
Banned
Mark, but 4gb was enough... I can't afford all these artist assets... EVERYTHING UNCOMPRESSED NO MORE COMPRESSING.
Ask your average CoD player how much ram is in the 360 he is playing on right now. Go ahead I will wait.
the average joe doesnt care about ram for sure.
not even my friends, who are fucking pc geniuses cared about the ps4 reveal.
- 8gig? lol... sony finaly arrived in 2006 now?
- its 8gig ddr5.
- so what?
(starting to google and read about it) ah yeah nice. but who cares
standard consumer will take a look at the box and see
- the price
- bluray / home cinema functions
- tv functions
- games
- extras included (aka kinect and stuff)
- media center and web surfing stuff
no one gives a shit about less ram if your console is capable of thousand things and has the same games the competitor has. especially if its cheaper.
i am pretty sure both consoles will do thousands of things. so its more important who is easier accessible for the user.
e.g. ps3 menus were just ridiculous. no way to find anything in there. thats stuff sony has to care about.
/edit
of course you ll have a graphical benefit IF the consoles will be so different. BUT will the standard user see it (textures, view, etc) and are the devs going to put more effort in ps versions?
/edit2
sorry, pretty OT now
not even my friends, who are fucking pc geniuses cared about the ps4 reveal.
- 8gig? lol... sony finaly arrived in 2006 now?
- its 8gig ddr5.
- so what?
(starting to google and read about it) ah yeah nice. but who cares
standard consumer will take a look at the box and see
- the price
- bluray / home cinema functions
- tv functions
- games
- extras included (aka kinect and stuff)
- media center and web surfing stuff
no one gives a shit about less ram if your console is capable of thousand things and has the same games the competitor has. especially if its cheaper.
i am pretty sure both consoles will do thousands of things. so its more important who is easier accessible for the user.
e.g. ps3 menus were just ridiculous. no way to find anything in there. thats stuff sony has to care about.
/edit
of course you ll have a graphical benefit IF the consoles will be so different. BUT will the standard user see it (textures, view, etc) and are the devs going to put more effort in ps versions?
/edit2
sorry, pretty OT now
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