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R.I.P Denuvo - Tekken 7 and Dishonored 2 cracked
- Thread starter Elven_Star
- Start date
lol that's blatantly untrue
You can check the original source here. He talks about Witcher sales in Poland (for the series)
Hmm, the article I found was incorrect, I guess. It still sold a very healthy amount on PC, over a million in the first two weeks, I think.
The Greek Freak
Member
Haven't ever bought a game with Denuvo even after removal and will continue until they fold.
texhnolyze
Banned
Is it important whether the article is accurate or not?
We can see the numbers. The Witcher 3 sold a lot of copies without DRM from day 1.
It's pretty simple. Give PC gamers good products, they'll gladly give you their money. No need to be paranoid.
shacklesmcgee
Member
Why does GAF get so stupid when it comes to DRM or piracy? So many replies in here are just nonsense, why would publishers give up the entirety of their PC sales because a few people can pirate the game?
LelouchZero
Member
No one is defending anything.
I don't know about "most" not being lost sales but there are people who will pirate things and not contemplate buying them at all, you can't lose sales if they weren't going to buy it in the first place.
People also seem to be forgetting that piracy will thrive wherever it is possible, Consoles or PC it doesn't matter, there are modern consoles which you can play pirated games on, and the last generation consoles had a strong piracy scene.
Refusing to release PC versions of games because of an unknown quantity of people who will obtain ilegitimate versions is ridiculously silly, this is how you will lose sales, by not supporting the platform and profiting from the people who will buy the game.
There have been many titles which don't have Denuvo or are pirate-able and have become great successes on the platform, many of these titles have sold over a million copies.
Such as: The Witcher 3, Dark Souls 3, Grand Theft Auto V, Civilization VI, Fallout 4 and many others such as Borderlands 2 and Skyrim, these two games have been out for a couple of years but both games have sold over 6 million copies and have very active playerbases.
Just look at how successful Playerunknown's Battlegrounds is, it launched March 23rd this year and has sold over 2.9 million copies (going by Steamspy) in around 2 months and 14 days. That's almost the numbers Horizon Zero Dawn has done, which has allegedly sold around 3.4 million copies in around 3 months and 4 days. Of-course, there are differences in their pricing etc but it shows how successful PC Games can and have been.
Being concerned about people who have no intentions to purchase games and not releasing a PC version because of this is the worst thing any developer/publisher could do, there are millions of PC Gamers who buy games and support the developers, the PC platform makes money, this is why so many games have come, and are coming to PC such as Destiny 2.
Green Yoshi
Member
This. I wonder if piracy is still a big thing in the Western world. There was a lot of piracy on PS1 and PS2, but neither PS4 nor Xbox One are really affected by piracy. And on Steam there are so many cheap games you can choose from that it is rather unlikely that someone runs out of games instead of time for playing all those games. Services like Spotify, YouTube and Netflix have probably hurt piracy sites, too.
I could imagine that piracy is more common in countries like Venezuela. But who can blame them? Their currency is almost worthless and they have more serious problems at the moment.
I mean yeah it's quite important to acknowledge that it didn't sell more than the other platforms combined, since it wasn't even close to that. People shouldn't be using misinformation to strenghten their case. It's a bad look to make stuff up to justify something. Fake news.
We also see the numbers of Tekken doing better than any other fighters that didn't use Denuvo, checkmate huh? /s
Is it untrue? Witcher 3 has sold 3 million on Steam alone and that is a version that can only be exclusively bought on the Steam store. Adding the sales made on GOG, Physical versions and every other digital store where a GOG code was sold, that's easily 2 or 3 more million.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1116442 yes these aren't current numbers, but the shift would have to be very big for it to be true. It's still better than trying to guess what it could be. It's not like console players only buy games at launch.
And anyway, ofcourse game of the generation sells well.
jono51
Banned
Because it's infested with poorly paid, poorly trained corporate shills.
NullPointer
Member
Depends whether its only a few like you say, or a significant percentage of players using pirated copies.
But even then I'd naturally fall into the anti-DRM stance unless that DRM didn't noticeably effect game performance and was scheduled to be removed in a patch after 90-120 days or the like.
There is a middle ground to be found here. But its really up to the publishers to take those steps.
A little over a year ago when they claimed to have sold 10 million units, the number of owners on Steam was 1.5 million. I'd assume consoles sales have grown just as much this past year.
So far i've nothing against denuvo. But i had bad experiences with DRM in the past. Arkham City and Crysis Warhead had limited activations. Bioshock had it too iirc.
Pirates got the superior version. And i'm not talking about money. They had the hassle free version.
When publishers go out of their way to harass paying customers, that's bad business.
Pirates got the superior version. And i'm not talking about money. They had the hassle free version.
When publishers go out of their way to harass paying customers, that's bad business.
But they've also posted that they sell noticeably more copies on GOG than Steam so the PC number can easily be over 3 million at that point.
Lister
Banned
That was sales of the entire series not just witcher 3, wasn't it?
The game sold about a third of its copies on pc around release. Which makes sense given there were three platforms. I'm guessing the ratio is similar perhaps favoring the pc a bit now a days thanks to sales.
primasaurus
Member
This is only in response to pirating, that's were the ultimate blame lays
Criminals are the reason you lock your doors
They can play online but only with other pirates.
Green Ninja
Banned
I was just stating how these executives are going to think when they read news items like that.
If publishers think they can ramp up the sales by using DRM, they're flat out wrong.
As someone who lives in a third-world country and has been a pirate for years (from 2000 when I was 8 untill I got a Job in 2013), lemme fill you in on why MOST ppl resort to piracy: financial problems!
No matter how sophisticated of a DRM you use on your game, most of the pirates will wait for it to get cracked because they simply can't afford buying games, which due to currency exchanges they're way more expensive here, it's like one third of your income, you can't simply ask your parents to shell out that much, long story short, everyone likes to have a digital library like Steam with tons of features and the ability to play multiplayer games, it's the money that prevents this from happening.
I know this for sure, if it wasn't for piracy, I wouldn't have been a gamer now buying games legally and contributing to the industry.
Now the solution that I offer is providing local stores in all countries, local stores make the games way cheaper, they're proportionate to the country's economics and currency.
You can opt to go with DRM, it's your right to do so, but it's just a waste of money
As someone who lives in a third-world country and has been a pirate for years (from 2000 when I was 8 untill I got a Job in 2013), lemme fill you in on why MOST ppl resort to piracy: financial problems!
No matter how sophisticated of a DRM you use on your game, most of the pirates will wait for it to get cracked because they simply can't afford buying games, which due to currency exchanges they're way more expensive here, it's like one third of your income, you can't simply ask your parents to shell out that much, long story short, everyone likes to have a digital library like Steam with tons of features and the ability to play multiplayer games, it's the money that prevents this from happening.
I know this for sure, if it wasn't for piracy, I wouldn't have been a gamer now buying games legally and contributing to the industry.
Now the solution that I offer is providing local stores in all countries, local stores make the games way cheaper, they're proportionate to the country's economics and currency.
You can opt to go with DRM, it's your right to do so, but it's just a waste of money
Nailed it on the first page. I don't pirate games, because I can afford more than enough of then to keep me entertained (too many even, argh mein backlog...). If some poor kid with a hand-me-down shitbox PC and no money wants to pirate a game he has no other way of getting in order to fill his time and fit in at school, then I have no issue.
What bothers me is legitimate, paying customers being disadvantaged compared to pirates. With all my TV and movies on DVD, I'm stuck going through minutes of unskippable piracy warnings. My iTunes content is forever constrained to my Apple products (of which I no longer own, excellent) or my PC. Meanwhile, somebody who pirates the same content can store and watch it instantly on any device of their choosing.
What happens if you want to run your retail copy of a Denuvo game in 20 years, the authentication servers are down and you can't find the patches to remove Denuvo?
autoduelist
Member
I mean, ultimately, copy protection is anti-consumer by definition. With no DRM, we can easily make backups, transfer our games to a new PC, let our friends borrow it, and pretty much anything else we used to be able to do with older mediums.
Copy-protection assumes the worse - that you're a thief - and prevents you from doing many things you should be able to do in order to try to stop you from doing things you shouldn't do. That's inherently anti-consumer, even if you agree with its intent or are happy with the results.
poodaddy
Member
You're mistaken.
People fighting on behalf of denuvo are crazy. Piracy on PC games is a very small margin compared to legit copies sold.
People saying not to release games on PC because of piracy are even more rediculous and show a clear misunderstanding of the situation for devs. If anyone was actually being majorly affected by piracy we would see much fewer games on PC when clearly the opposite is true.
It's like telling movie makers not to release movies because 10,000 people watched a cam on their computer.
People saying not to release games on PC because of piracy are even more rediculous and show a clear misunderstanding of the situation for devs. If anyone was actually being majorly affected by piracy we would see much fewer games on PC when clearly the opposite is true.
It's like telling movie makers not to release movies because 10,000 people watched a cam on their computer.
Funkybee12
Member
Well what's the point of making it a big deal anyway.
Playing tekken 7 offline is like staying in training all day. no fun at all.
Whoever wants to enjoy the essence of Tekken will have to buy it.
Another story for single player based games though.
Playing tekken 7 offline is like staying in training all day. no fun at all.
Whoever wants to enjoy the essence of Tekken will have to buy it.
Another story for single player based games though.
Neverforget
Member
It's 2017 and companies still don't understand that DRM is useless and costly and will only hurt their legit customers.
But hey I guess their fear of "losing" sells is greater than common sense.
But hey I guess their fear of "losing" sells is greater than common sense.
Permanently A
Junior Member
"We should burn down the forest so those termites can't get to the trees"
Oh no I agree with you. I just meant in your example I am ok with Museums restricting pictures because it can do actual harm to the physical item.
Beerman462
Member
The simple answer is the large quantity of games launched on PC everyday with little to no DRM. Pirates find a way even on consoles. Trust in the strength of your product and watch the money roll in.
omnislayer
Member
I fucking hate DRM because my steam library(and my shelf for that matter) has games that I have to do stupid workarounds with just to launch after reenstalling them, games that only kind of half work now, and games that just DON'T FUCKING WORK ANYMORE. Games that I paid for.
If it has the potential to make games I bought unplayable after they go under like other drm scenes than it can fuck right off. I don't support any company that supports this shit. They don't need my money.
If it has the potential to make games I bought unplayable after they go under like other drm scenes than it can fuck right off. I don't support any company that supports this shit. They don't need my money.
Factually speaking, delaying a game because of DRM will affect its sales far far far far more than piracy will ever do. There is a reason Devs have started doing more and more day and date releases even without using Denuvo. Your "solution" is the most dumb one possible.
petran79
Banned
PS4 and XB1 userbase is also older and with more money to spend compared to the PS1,2 days. For younger audiences,PCs are much more affordabl
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CecilRousso
Member
It's not the norm, and it's not becoming the norm.
Sad Affleck
Member
I can't say I've had any issues with Denuvo but it is server-based and that means it has an expiration date. I don't want my games to stop working one day. Besides, we have yet to see any indication that strict DRM improves sales. Denuvo was very effective for quite a while, we should have noticed a spike in PC game sales by now. Publishers surely would have beaten us over the head with it if that were the case.
Steam's DRM solution is more than enough. Piracy really was a service problem as Gabe said and tthe complete recovery of the PC market helped by Steam proved it. PC games should be available worldwide day-and-date with any console versions if they exist and priced fairly for local markets. I would buy many more games day one if the prices in my country (Greece) weren't the same as the ones in much richer european countries.
Steam's DRM solution is more than enough. Piracy really was a service problem as Gabe said and tthe complete recovery of the PC market helped by Steam proved it. PC games should be available worldwide day-and-date with any console versions if they exist and priced fairly for local markets. I would buy many more games day one if the prices in my country (Greece) weren't the same as the ones in much richer european countries.
Dyson Industries
Banned
...what nonsense is this?
Man, it's only been like 5 days since the game came out. Always takes a bit for people to figure out how to add mods in any game, should be a little faster since it's Unreal but even then, we already got mods like story mode and treasure battle only costumes being able to be used.
Usually I would agree with you, but Tekken 7 on PC works pretty smoothly already. Runs on potatoes, looks amazing on beefed up PCs, and almost no issues to be found.
Titanfall 2 continues to fly under the radar.
Looks like the majority of the remaining uncracked Denuvo games are Origin or Uplay games, probably because nobody wants to bother with Origin or Uplay.
Hopefully the devs remove it from all games before the inevitable Denuvo shut down, rendering the games unplayable.
Hopefully the devs remove it from all games before the inevitable Denuvo shut down, rendering the games unplayable.
Bulletstorm is the perfect example on how Denuvo doesn't fucking work. It has been released for months and it sold 15k copies.
CecilRousso
Member
Price, market, timing, and luck is more important then DRM when it comes to sales. But then there's other aspects, like not wanting pirates that takes valuable support costs.
Isn't it online only? Even the singleplayer? Atleast that's what I heard.