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[Kyonashi]

Wow, what happened here? Saw the thread title after following the advent calendar and thought 'Oh cool, some discussion on that list', didn't expect such a vitriolic reaction. It's a fine list, and I certainly agree with their top pick. It's about the response to a game and the experience that game gives you, regardless of if it's episodic or not. And I'm pleased there's some stuff on there I can stick my teeth into that I haven't heard of yet.

 

[Corto]

More people should play Desktop Dungeons. That is all. Merry Christmas and Peace to all men of good will. *raises glass of champagne*

 

[aeolist]

I have been meaning to pick up The Swapper since I heard about it on Idle thumbs. Keep forgetting about it.

the swapper is amazing, one of the best puzzle games i've ever played

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Merry Christmas and Peace to all men of good will. *raises glass of champagne*

 

[Miker]

John, if I might have something to say about RPS' normal coverage:

For console-oriented genres that show up on PC, please /please/ get someone who has some experience in said genre to do a Wot I Think. The silliness and dismissiveness of the articles about fighting games (Street Fighter), character action games (Metal Gear Rising), and other similar games is, in my opinion, becoming tiring.

I'd love for you guys to get somebody who knows their way around the genre to talk about such games - talking about a game's merits instead of making fun of its over-the-top cutscenes would go a long way in improving your coverage, if you ask me.

For the record, I'm still bitter about Alec's article on Might and Magic: Clash of Heroes on PC. You were a DS owner, John - how could you let that happen?

 

[Unicorn]

Oh man. John having to spell it out to GAF. Keep it classy GAF.

 

[CouldBeWorse]

How can 2/5 of a game be the best game of the year?

Think of some modern games like short seasons of television (like Sherlock or Black Mirror).

You judge what's been released.

 

[ebullientprism]

the swapper is amazing, one of the best puzzle games i've ever played

Yeah its on the todo list before this steam sale ends.

 

[John Kowalski]

Jeez, goty lists are dangerous stuff.

 

[NullPointer]

If that still leaves us with over 24, we begin the arguing. Or we gang up on one person and tell them their pick is stupid and they smell. Eventually, through a combination of complaining and giving up, it's wittled to 24, and that's the list.

This is scientifically proven to be the most bestest and super precise method for this kind of thing.

I heartily approve.

 

[mujun]

Jeez, goty lists are dangerous stuff.

Yep.

The terrible stuff that results in difference of opinion doesn't surprise me as much whenever I see what happens in threads like this.

How can it be so hard to comprehend that different like different things and judge things based on different criteria and in different ways.

 

[jimboton]

Sad to see Rogue Legacy and Brothers on there (most overrated games of the year) while Sonic Racing Transformed and Volgarr the Viking are nowhere to be seen (best games of the year along with Spelunky).

But at least Spelunky gets a mention, it's a worthy GOTY.

None of the RPS writers are very much into 'gamey' games, particularly those that demand a great deal of patience and skill. But I agree, Spelunky is a worthy #1 of any list, any year.

 

[MRORANGE]

20 of those games were voted for in the Steam GOTY awards, so I'd say it's a pretty accurate list from a PC GOTY perspective.

 

[bishoptl]

Rock Paper Shotgun, while occasionally going off the rails, is still fuck awesome. Keep up the good work.

 

[Garrus Vakarian]

20 of those games were voted for in the Steam GOTY awards, so I'd say it's a pretty accurate list from a PC GOTY perspective.

Yes it is good to have a list relevant to PC, helps immensely when you are in the market for exclusives on the platform.

 

[inm8num2]

The more discussion about adventure games, the better.

 

[LordJim]

The more discussion about adventure games, the better.

I can't exactly trust someone who said Myst sucks compared to Gone Home on that regard, but GAF is fine

 

[Lotto]

If I made a list of games I really enjoyed this year, KRZ would definitely be on it. At the end of the day it's a freaking GOTY list.

 

[Ogimachi]

rather ashamed that this even warranted an explanation.

It didn't. He did it because he wanted to address criticism, every other journalist can do the same. Some people are complaining about the reactions in this thread like there's no context in which a GOTY list could be considered terrible.
That and RPS has a history of never admitting they were wrong, even when their audience pointed out every shitty argument and fallacy during the ME3 debacle or the Blizzard interview (where their response was quite the opposite of an apology).

 

[MaximoffZero]

Wow, what happened here? Saw the thread title after following the advent calendar and thought 'Oh cool, some discussion on that list', didn't expect such a vitriolic reaction.

I can't believe the number of people here who were all upset because they didn't realize that RPS was PC-only. I figured that out the first time I was on the site, on the first page noless. Mind Boggling.

 

[inm8num2]

I can't exactly trust someone who said Myst sucks compared to Gone Home on that regard, but GAF is fine

Myst is a very divisive game. Some love it, some hate it. I don't quite get the hate - I think Myst gets a lot of undeserved flack for the games that tried to be Myst ("Myst clones" aka slideshow games) but weren't very good.

Adventure game opinions seem to always be wildly all over the place to me, since the genre definition can be rather broad. Then you get into discussions about story vs. gameplay, which is more important, etc. Hence all the arguing over games like Gone Home or Dear Esther.

 

[Can Crusher]

But this wasn't what this list was, you're just holding a supremely biased opinion that a game has to be high budget for someone to actually enjoy it to the point of it being their GOTY.

Why in the world would you otherwise dismiss a list such as this? I mean, I'm pretty certain these were the games these people enjoyed the most during this year, and it certainly does speak to people like me who have zero interest in AAA games (also, excuse the hypocritical statement, I was actually aware of the irony while typing it). I have barely been reading other GOTY lists because they all contain the same AAA console games that I would never pay full price for. The exceptions are fantastic, and there are definitely more of those now than there used to be a couple of years ago... but still.

I didn't dismiss the list, and I've yet to dismiss these lists with smaller games. I might have differences of opinions on certain entries, or the omission of certain games, but that's for discussion purposes which are the point of these threads, unless I'm supposed to just read them as news and keep my opinion to myself.

In my Gaf GOTY list I only mention The Last of Us, and a 2012 lttp which is Journey. Not an independent game, but I would say it's still a fairly small production by a small team that doesn't adhere to AAA conventions. I'm an opinionated guy, and there would be no point in commenting these lists if I couldn't point and laugh at a couple of picks, debate the process of selection, etc etc etc

You're wrong about the high budget part, but you call it how you see it.

 

[HK-47]

Myst is a very divisive game. Some love it, some hate it. I don't quite get the hate - I think Myst gets a lot of undeserved flack for the games that tried to be Myst ("Myst clones" aka slideshow games) but weren't very good.

Adventure game opinions seem to always be wildly all over the place to me, since the genre definition can be rather broad. Then you get into discussions about story vs. gameplay, which is more important, etc. Hence all the arguing over games like Gone Home or Dear Esther.

On top of the fact that you could argue that neither Dear Esther or Gone Home have particularly great stories. Gone Home's attempt at telling a story not just through audio logs but a variety of props is a starting point but its also just another game cribbing more then it needed to from SS2. I'm interested in where Gone Home is going with how it tells its story but it wasnt as risky as I had hoped on top of failing to give all the characters adequate development. I also found the major plot line pretty cliche and the secondary plot much more interesting.

On Dear Esther...lets just say I did not enjoy having that model shoved into Amnesia, which is so far ahead of The Chinese Room in mechanics married with story and setting that I'm still miffed at Frictional for allowing it to happen.

 

[Felix Lighter]

I'm glad I came back to this thread. Sanity won out this time!

 

[inm8num2]

I'm glad I came back to this thread. Sanity won out this time!

Doesn't it always win out?

 

[Felix Lighter]

Doesn't it always win out?

Nah, there are plenty of threads that spiral deeper and deeper into batshit insanity.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Well, I like this decision.

 

[Weltall Zero]

.

Oh hey, cool to see you here. I just wanted to say that your site is the only one I check regularly anymore, and I really wish there was an analogue of it for consoles, too. Unfortunately, ever since the GIA's demise back during the pleistocene (and its recent reanimation as a shambling corpse notwithstanding) it seems it's not to be.

But hey, I got GAF, which is even better than most sites (most of the time...), so I can't complain!

It didn't. He did it because he wanted to address criticism, every other journalist can do the same. Some people are complaining about the reactions in this thread like there's no context in which a GOTY list could be considered terrible.

It's one thing (legitimate though ultimately fruitless) to complain about a GOTY list's picks. It's another to suggest that the list itself has an ulterior motive, like "being hip". That's particularly obnoxious when those making the accusations reveal (and revel in) their ignorance by asking that console games are covered or that the list is faulty because they haven't heard about those games.

That and RPS has a history of never admitting they were wrong, even when their audience pointed out every shitty argument and fallacy during the ME3 debacle or the Blizzard interview (where their response was quite the opposite of an apology).

Disregarding whether that's true or now, what the hell does that have to do with anything? Stop poisoning the well.

 

[Codeblue]

I love lists that have little to no overlap with my own. So many games to check out.

Last time RPS got me into a game, I was playing a two month long game of Neptune's Pride with some friends and became a cynical, paranoid mess for the entire duration and it was amazing.

 

[Coffee Dog]

I disagree with a lot of that list, but jesus, its better than just handing it to Bioshock or some other crowd pleaser. They have opinions and they stick by them. Its why i still read RPS after disagreeing with them pretty often.

And the sheer fact that john walker had to come in gere and justify himself? Come on GAF. We're better than this.

 

[Weltall Zero]

I didn't dismiss the list, and I've yet to dismiss these lists with smaller games.

Previously on this channel:

*googles Desktop Dungeons*
Ahahahahahahahaha

 

[Yagharek]

John Walkers letter is hilarious and awesome, and a sad indictment on the mental deficiencies of the peanut gallery who cried about someone else's favourite game list.

 

[inm8num2]

Nah, there are plenty of threads that spiral deeper and deeper into batshit insanity.

Heh I know.

 

[Weltall Zero]

I love lists that have little to no overlap with my own. So many games to check out.

That's exactly my reaction as well. Isn't it the fucking point of these lists to begin with? Are people so insecure about their tastes that they need to have them validated and feel slighted when they're not? Isn't learning about what could be your next favorite game infinitely more valuable than a stupid five-seconds ego trip? I admit I don't understand people sometimes.

 

[inm8num2]

On top of the fact that you could argue that neither Dear Esther or Gone Home have particularly great stories. Gone Home's attempt at telling a story not just through audio logs but a variety of props is a starting point but its also just another game cribbing more then it needed to from SS2. I'm interested in where Gone Home is going with how it tells its story but it wasnt as risky as I had hoped on top of failing to give all the character adequit development. I also found the major plot line pretty cliche and the secondary plot much more interesting.

On Dear Esther...lets just say I did not enjoy having that model shoved into Amnesia, which is so far ahead of The Chinese Room in mechanics married with story and setting that I'm still miffed at Frictional for allowing it to happen.

I haven't played Gone Home so I can't comment on that, but for Dear Esther I did enjoy the story, or whatever there was resembling a story. It was a beautiful experience. I do agree it was disappointing that formula was applied to Amnesia. I think Frictional just wanted to capitalize on the high level of interest they'd garnered for Amnesia, but they were working on something else and didn't want to stall that project. So, they outsourced it. Win-win, I suppose.

 

[HK-47]

I haven't played Gone Home so I can't comment on that, but for Dear Esther I did enjoy the story, or whatever there was resembling a story. It was a beautiful experience. I do agree it was disappointing that formula was applied to Amnesia. I think Frictional just wanted to capitalize on the high level of interest they'd garnered for Amnesia, but they were working on something else and didn't want to stall that project. So, they outsourced it. Win-win, I suppose.

Well I dont know how smart it is to let another studio make such drastic changes in the follow up to the game and name that really put you on the map. Luckily Soma looks to be getting things going back in the right direction.

 

[ebullientprism]

Previously on this channel:

GLOL.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

It didn't. He did it because he wanted to address criticism, every other journalist can do the same. Some people are complaining about the reactions in this thread like there's no context in which a GOTY list could be considered terrible.
That and RPS has a history of never admitting they were wrong, even when their audience pointed out every shitty argument and fallacy during the ME3 debacle or the Blizzard interview (where their response was quite the opposite of an apology).

and the criticism of this list didn't even really warrant being addressed since most of it boiled down to people not recognizing that they were a PC site and/or moaning over the lack of big budget games while absolutely failing to even list the games that were "missing". of course there are contexts where a Game of the Year list could legitimately be considered terrible. most of it wasn't what ballooned this thread to 11 pages and counting.

 

[TheExodu5]

Very cool list, with a lot of titles that were previously unknown to me.

Honestly, I'm not surprised by the Indie to AAA ratio. Indie games are a serious driving force behind innovation on PC right now, and many AAA games, while still very good in their own right, are delivering somewhat stale experiences.

 

[sohois]

Their list serves as a painful reminder that I really haven't played enough games this year. Only played Papers, Please and The Swapper from that list, wish I could get around to some of the others.

Any of the list F2P, other than Card Hunter?

 

[inm8num2]

Well I dont know how smart it is to let another studio make such drastic changes in the follow up to the game and name that really put you on the map. Luckily Soma looks to be getting things going back in the right direction.

I didn't say it was smart, but it was a win-win for Frictional and TCR. Frictional gets to work on their upcoming game while maintaining and broadening the Amnesia fanbase. Chinese Room gets paid to work on something that isn't much of a stretch in their design, but it's wrapped in a recognizable name.

 

[chris121580]

Great response by John! It's a shame it had to result to that. The entitlement by some of the posters here is just pathetic and sad.

 

[curlyfriski]

This reductionist attitude is just as bad, if not worse, as the hipster name-calling from the other side.

On-topic: No Path of Exile is a crime against humanity.

Sounds accurate to me.

 

[denx]

I skipped the last couple of pages of bickering, so excuse if I'm missing anything important.

RPS' list looks fine, although it does omit a lot of solid indies that released this year. RPS sure does love their "narrative experiences" type of games.

I putted together this list for fun. It's composed of 24 games (like RPS' list) that were released on PC this year. Honestly I've actually not played most of the games on this list. Most of the games here I included because of their reviews and general public reaction to them / word of mouth. See what you think.

- Dota 2
- Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons
- Europa Universalis 4
- Papers, Please
- Gone Home
- The Swapper
- Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag
- Rayman Legends
- Shadow Warrior
- Saints Row 4
- Gunpoint
- Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm
- The Stanley Parable
- Teleglitch
- Spelunky
- Valdis Story: Abyssal Gate
- Call of Juarez: Gunslinger
- Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon
- Rogue Legacy
- Volgarr the Viking
- Don't Starve
- State of Decay
- Metro: Last Light
- Skullgirls

 

[Htown]

Hello you lovely fruitcakes. I'm John Walker, one of RPS's editors, and I'll try to explain a few of the things about which people are confused/VERY CROSS.

1) So yes, Rock, Paper, Shotgun is a PC site. Not "tends toward PC", or "is mostly about PC". It's about PC. We're a site that has exclusively covered PC gaming for over six years. We all own consoles, we all play console games, but our website is about PC games alone. Why? Because six years ago there were no PC-dedicated sites, so we started one. That seems to have worked out okay.

An awful lot of people seem annoyed we don't point this out "often enough". We kindasorta figured that having it written at the top of the site on every page might give it away? Perhaps we'll make it flash.

So that hopefully goes some way to explaining why there aren't any console games in our articles about our favourite PC games of 2013.

2) Let me explain, in its entirety, how we pick our list:

Our annual calendar is a list of our ("our" being the six of us - Jim, Alec, Nathan, Graham, Adam and me) favourite 24 games from the year. There's no agenda, no conspiracies. We list out all the games we covered favourably in the year in a Google Doc, everyone puts their name by games they want to see on the list, and we get rid of those that no one picks. That gets us down to about 30-40. Then we go through again, looking at games with only one name by them, and see how passionate that person is that it make it. So, say Hexcells. I was the only name, but I would have gone on a rampage with a scythe if it weren't included. But then I was also the only name by Ittle Dew, and wasn't passionate that that make it. If that still leaves us with over 24, we begin the arguing. Or we gang up on one person and tell them their pick is stupid and they smell. Eventually, through a combination of complaining and giving up, it's wittled to 24, and that's the list. Everyone with their names by the games writes a contribution for that day's article.

Those that are left over, all those games that didn't make the cut, get put into the Leftovers - articles we put up over the holidays that give them their honourable mentions. So to all the "Where's Shadow Warrior/Gunpoint/Binfinite/etc?" questions, the answer is in the Leftovers. Games that either didn't receive enough votes, or enough passion, to get in the top list, but still may well be great, and in another year may well have got in. You may well STRONGLY disagree. Awesome! Good stuff. I'd be interested to see your list too.

3) The indie to mainstream ratio surprised us too. Which hopefully indicates that this is not our attempting to, um, look cool? Good heavens, I wouldn't know how to try. We just picked which games we liked best! As a website we don't distinguish between AAA, AA, indie, or whatever, in terms of what gets coverage. We just write about PC games. This year more of our favourite games happened to be independently published. Sorry to disappoint hipster-spotters. But AssCreed 4, Dishonored DLC, XCOM, Gunslinger, Saints Row IV... they're not exactly from indie studios!

4) I didn't make Gunpoint, more's the pity. That's Tom Francis, formerly of PC Gamer, sitting atop that pile of gold. We all know Tom very well, and have seen how he dances when drunk, and have played Peggle on his digital projector.

5) Yes, Kentucky Route Zero is episodic, and only two of those episodes are out. HOW DARE WE?! It's pretty simple. The first two episodes of KRZ were our favourite gaming times this year. It doesn't matter if the next three episodes are just the developers' farting onto a table. It doesn't change that our favourite time with a game in 2013 was KRZ. That's it.

6) DOTA 2 was on last year's list. You will eventually come to terms with this.

7) Robert J. Sullivan - our talent has just reached 4.8% of IGN's, so not long to go.

I think most of people's outrage could be addressed if they read the big piles of lovely words we've written explaining why each game has been picked. I mean, I realise it's much easier to instead post here rhetorically DEMANDING to know why, but then I'm passive-aggressive.

I shall forever remain surprised by people's fury when our list doesn't uncannily match their own. But then I shall also go on to become furious when I read someone ele's list that doesn't match mine. I'm nothing if I'm not a hypocrite. So I get it - it's frustrating when your own opinions aren't reflected. But shhhhhhh, shhhhhhhh, it's going to be fine, shhhhhhh, just go to sleep now, c'mon, that's it, shhhhhhh now.

John Walker
Editor - www.rockpapershotgun.com

Great post, thanks!

Anyone who responds again and makes it clear they didn't read John Walker's explanatory post before doing so isn't gonna be back till next year.

I thought we weren't doing this kinda "gotcha" banning any more.

 

[crusnik]

If I made a list of games I really enjoyed this year, KRZ would definitely be on it. At the end of the day it's a freaking GOTY list.

I didn't play all that many PC games this year, but of the ones I did play, KRZ was near the top in awesomeness. Especially episode 2.

 

[TheExodu5]

Great post, thanks!



I thought we weren't doing this kinda "gotcha" banning any more.

Not to speak on the mods' behalves, but generally you're expected to at least read the OP before posting in a thread. Seeing as how John's post is outlined in the thread title and the OP, it's not unreasonable. Anything less could easily be seen as thread shitting.

 

[foxtrot3d]

Sounds like a bunch of hipster rationalization, tbh.

What he said.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Great response by John! It's a shame it had to result to that. The entitlement by some of the posters here is just pathetic and sad.

Not surprising sadly, given the build up to the console launches and the influx of new members over the last several months combined with inane end of the year GOTY posturing.

 

[Alex]

Gosh. There are so many games I want to play.

I have this problem just between PC and 3DS, hell, I could probably cut out 3DS and still never get through it. Yet my dumbass still buys all this new hardware. I gotta stop at some point.