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[rofif]

We are now fighting. Even 40fps gets you in a fight here.
This is why I never wanted modes on consoles. Just make a game up to the spec, if possible increase resolution for the pro and that's it.
All this graphics modes, fps modes and so on make people more demanding and in the end, puts the focus in the wrong place.
From what I understand - Most of you wouldn't play bloodorne nowadays if it was 4k30....

 

[StereoVsn]

Worth it to play next gen on aged pc specs at sub 25fps. Surely min maxing is what PCMR lives for?!

30-40 fps is basically handheld PC bread and butter.

 

[proandrad]

We are now fighting. Even 40fps gets you in a fight here.
This is why I never wanted modes on consoles. Just make a game up to the spec, if possible increase resolution for the pro and that's it.
All this graphics modes, fps modes and so on make people more demanding and in the end, puts the focus in the wrong place.
From what I understand - Most of you wouldn't play bloodorne nowadays if it was 4k30....

I’m a framerate snob but my main issue is no game released this gen, with a 30 fps cap, looks good enough to justify the framerate drop. These devs are just using the extra power to spend less time on optimizing their games to push the product out earlier. If they want to increase game prices people should expect a higher quality product.

 

[rofif]

I’m a framerate snob but my main issue is no game released this gen, with a 30 fps cap, looks good enough to justify the framerate drop. These devs are just using the extra power to spend less time on optimizing their games to push the product out earlier. If they want to increase game prices people should expect a higher quality product.

Fair enough

 

[Fbh]

We are now fighting. Even 40fps gets you in a fight here.
This is why I never wanted modes on consoles. Just make a game up to the spec, if possible increase resolution for the pro and that's it.
All this graphics modes, fps modes and so on make people more demanding and in the end, puts the focus in the wrong place.
From what I understand - Most of you wouldn't play bloodorne nowadays if it was 4k30....

Standards change.
I adored Shadow of the Colossus when it first launched on Ps2 at 480p with lengthy drops to 15fps during certain fights.
I wouldn't pay $60 for a 480p 15fps game now

 

[King Dazzar]

We are now fighting. Even 40fps gets you in a fight here.
This is why I never wanted modes on consoles. Just make a game up to the spec, if possible increase resolution for the pro and that's it.
All this graphics modes, fps modes and so on make people more demanding and in the end, puts the focus in the wrong place.
From what I understand - Most of you wouldn't play bloodorne nowadays if it was 4k30....

So basically change all games to your own personal preference and force it as fixed option onto everyone else. Gee, thanks.

 

[rofif]

So basically change all games to your own personal preference and force it as fixed option onto everyone else. Gee, thanks.

no. leave it for the developers. Keep the pc mustard race out of it.
I am not saying, I am not using 40 and 60fps modes. of course I do. But thats a different story

 

[Jayjayhd34]

That seems more like a theory than rumor. It's not out of normal for console to have settings that are lower than low.

 

[King Dazzar]

no. leave it for the developers. Keep the pc mustard race out of it.
I am not saying, I am not using 40 and 60fps modes. of course I do. But thats a different story

Yeah, well in fairness it already is up to the devs. And the devs have decided in many cases to give us options. PlayStation in particular are being great at pushing forward not only graphic options. But disability options and a massive and extensive choice of controller, audio and gameplay options too. its great. Long may many options exists as far as Im concerned. And in my world you can choose a fidelity mode and I can go with a performance mode. Happy customers. Happy days.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

If this is true it's an easy wait for deep sale. (Would reconsider if there's a decent 40fps mode)

Game doesn't look nearly good enough to justif not having a 60fps mode.

30fps in this age isn't about graphics. Graphics on consoles have become so scalable thanks to dynamic resolution systems, temporal upscalers and different graphics modes that when graphics are the bottleneck, i.e the GPU isn't able to reach 60fps because the computational burden is too high, devs can just lower resolution and settings to make the burden light enough for 60fps. We often call that performance mode.

The issue then is when lowering settings isn't possible I.e when the bottleneck is a CPU one not a GPU one. Why? Because most CPU workloads cannot be lowered as they are tied to gameplay. You can't make the AI dumber, lower the accuracy of the physics, lower the fidelity of the world simulation etc. because it will change the gameplay. At that point you'd be playing a different game, hence why this isn't done. 9 times out of 10 the reason we have 30fps AAA games on consoles is because the console CPUs are bottlenecking performance.

 

[SHA]

30fps didn’t become common until the 360/PS3 gen. Before than 60fps was more common.

Some PS2 games were 30fps, check df videos, it's a creative decision, Phil isn't saying something new.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

If this is true it's an easy wait for deep sale. (Would reconsider if there's a decent 40fps mode)

Game doesn't look nearly good enough to justif not having a 60fps mode.

Also if you don't want to run into this problem your only solution is getting a PC. Why? Because since at least the PS3 era PC CPUs have been grossly overpowered compared to console CPUs meaning while the consoles aren't strong enough for 60fps PCs are. Look at the PS3s cell when it launched in 2006 compared to Intels Core in 2006. Intel Core ran circles around the PS3, the Intel Q6600 was so fast that ages after it launched it played PS4 games just fine in 2015 despite being 8 years old. A modern example is Intel Skylake, it launched in 2015 when we were playing Bloodborne and The Order 1886 on consoles.

The Skylake 6700k is about to be 9 years old and it plays modern games including all the PS5 exclusives like Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart just fine. Why is that? Because the consoles have a Zen 2 eight core, Zen 2 when it launched in 2019 performed at the level of Skylake in 2015 because AMD was so behind. On top of this the console CPUs perform much worse than even the dirt cheap Zen 2 CPUs which allows the 9 year old 6700k to still dance just fine. A modern Intel 13400 or AMD 5600 demolish Skylake and as a result bear the crap out of consoles too and those are cheap CPUs not the best of the best like the AMD Zen 4 7800X 3D or the Intel Raptor Lake 14900k.

 

[Fbh]

30fps in this age isn't about graphics. Graphics on consoles have become so scalable thanks to dynamic resolution systems, temporal upscalers and different graphics modes that when graphics are the bottleneck, i.e the GPU isn't able to reach 60fps because the computational burden is too high, devs can just lower resolution and settings to make the burden light enough for 60fps. We often call that performance mode.

The issue then is when lowering settings isn't possible I.e when the bottleneck is a CPU one not a GPU one. Why? Because most CPU workloads cannot be lowered as they are tied to gameplay. You can't make the AI dumber, lower the accuracy of the physics, lower the fidelity of the world simulation etc. because it will change the gameplay. At that point you'd be playing a different game, hence why this isn't done. 9 times out of 10 the reason we have 30fps AAA games on consoles is because the console CPUs are bottlenecking performance.

I sort of get that but in order to accept it I'd also have to see some next gen AI, physics and world simulation. Maybe this game will have that and it will make all the other open world games with 60fps modes like Forbidden West, Elden Ring, Cyberpunk, Spiderman 2, RDR2 (well not officially but we've seen it's doable through modded consoles), etc, feel dated and last gen, and that would be cool.

If this game on Ps5/X1 does something equivalently impressive to what Nintendo is doing with ToTK on Switch hardware I guess I can accept 30fps. But that's not what I've seen from most gameplay videos.

The one thing some people keep bringing up is that colossus fight. But that's going to be what? 30 minutes in a 50+ hours RPG? I personally don't really care if a specifically heavy sequence has notorious framedrops but that's not an excuse for the less demanding parts (which usually make up most of the game) to be locked to 30fps.
I think Baldur's Gate 3 is a good example. The City in Act 3 is clearly too much for the console CPU and sees heavy framerate drops. But most of the other areas of the game, including all of Act 1 and 2, runs decently fine at 60fps with some smaller drops here and there.

 

[playsaves3]

Yep.. is marginally improved 30fps and nothing more.... is not some magical revolutionary miracle. If you dont like 30 fps 40 fps does nothing for you.

I think 40fps is enough to feel smooth without the soap opera effect in slower paced cinematic games

 

[playsaves3]

Also if you don't want to run into this problem your only solution is getting a PC. Why? Because since at least the PS3 era PC CPUs have been grossly overpowered compared to console CPUs meaning while the consoles aren't strong enough for 60fps PCs are. Look at the PS3s cell when it launched in 2006 compared to Intels Core in 2006. Intel Core ran circles around the PS3, the Intel Q6600 was so fast that ages after it launched it played PS4 games just fine in 2015 despite being 8 years old. A modern example is Intel Skylake, it launched in 2015 when we were playing Bloodborne and The Order 1886 on consoles.

The Skylake 6700k is about to be 9 years old and it plays modern games including all the PS5 exclusives like Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart just fine. Why is that? Because the consoles have a Zen 2 eight core, Zen 2 when it launched in 2019 performed at the level of Skylake in 2015 because AMD was so behind. On top of this the console CPUs perform much worse than even the dirt cheap Zen 2 CPUs which allows the 9 year old 6700k to still dance just fine. A modern Intel 13400 or AMD 5600 demolish Skylake and as a result bear the crap out of consoles too and those are cheap CPUs not the best of the best like the AMD Zen 4 7800X 3D or the Intel Raptor Lake 14900k.

Exactly the cpus in the consoles have been dogwater and I warned everyone that zen 2 was nowhere near overkill we should have used zen 3 it wasn’t the gpu (unless it’s rt) it’s always been the cpu

 

[Portugeezer]

The trailer seemed to show some sort of 60fps on PS5. Looked like uncapped with frequent dips, like FF16 (outside of combat).

 

[playsaves3]

Yes you lied when you said that you barely saw difference between 40 fps and 60 fps and at the same time 30 to 40 fps was omg life changing ... so this is bad faith argumentation and I dont engage in those ... you will have to try with the next sucker.

Nah, I'll just not buy the game. Loads of other titles that have better frame rate options. Besides, we have yet to see how it fares on PC too. Its already riddled with DRM, that much we do know.

You could wait for ps5 pro as well

 

[Esppiral]

The framerate was all over the place in the Showcase, I am fine with 30 fps, but at some points it ran below that.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Where did the 40fps doll touch you? It's a safe space.

Nope I'm not lying. 40 is a massive game changer for myself and others who don't have the specs to hit 60 with decent graphics settings. But 40 and decent graphics settings using a lower specced rig or Steam Deck etc is absolutely life changing. No more 30 is a big big deal.

 

[IDKFA]

I don't care. 30fps is perfectly fine. I'm still there day one!

 

[DenchDeckard]

40FPS is a minimum. If they hit 40FPS i can deal with that on console, if done well. 30FPS is a no go but luckily we have options and I'll go PC.

 

[TheGreatMusashi]

Ah yes!

We all know the eye can’t see above 24 frames per second.

Gentlemen Unite!

 

[King Dazzar]

Ah yes!

We all know the eye can’t see above 24 frames per second.

Gentlemen Unite!

Another good one is: "cinematic experience"

 

[Physiognomonics]

It's a Dragon's Dogma game. 30fps is all you'll get and you'll be happy. The problem is the engine and the devs.

 

[Bojji]

It's a Dragon's Dogma game. 30fps is all you'll get and you'll be happy. The problem is the engine and the devs.

Its RE engine, so far all games on it had 60fps modes.

 

[StereoVsn]

I think 40fps is enough to feel smooth without the soap opera effect in slower paced cinematic games

Yep, and on a 120hz TV it significantly reduces latency. And it looks and feels a lot better on OLED. It’s still not great but better than nothing.

 

[StereoVsn]

You could wait for ps5 pro as well

Rumor is Pro has same Zen 2 CPU. If the game is CPU limited Pro isn’t likely to help a lot.

 

[Roman Empire]

Rumor is Pro has same Zen 2 CPU. If the game is CPU limited Pro isn’t likely to help a lot.

This, the game seems to be CPU-heavy with all the interactions between Player x Environment x Enemy, NPC routines (look how the worst fps dips seem to occur in the main city footage), and the more non-scripted nature of the game's events.

 

[Bernardougf]

This, the game seems to be CPU-heavy with all the interactions between Player x Environment x Enemy, NPC routines (look how the worst fps dips seem to occur in the main city footage), and the more non-scripted nature of the game's events.

Maybe.. starfield came with the same talk talk about stacking sandwiches and the game dosent have nearly enough important stuff to justify the absence of 60 fps .... in the end what is important and pivotal to the game is the main gameplay/battles and main interactions, and if you want to throw as may shit as you can on screen that the player wont even be able to see and account for less them 10% of gametime is it even worth it ?

As some have said.. until now there is no game that in its core have justified the 30 fpa only option especially when compared with some top graphics titles we have already with perfect acceptable 60 fps modes.

So it may be creative vision limitations, but does it matter ? When the core gameplay maybe was perfect able to be run at 60 fps ? For some grass and lightning whoring ? Or some crowd interaction you cant even see or is irrelevant??? And than compromise the core game play experience???

Its is all speculation obviously, the game will come out and will be judged accordingly, and maybe will justify it all, but imho console gamers should expect better because they already have it and not settle for corporative talk bullshit and lazy devs.

 

[Freeman76]

The trailer seemed to show some sort of 60fps on PS5. Looked like uncapped with frequent dips, like FF16 (outside of combat).

Check out the trailer from yesterday, its on PS5 and very clearly 30fps with drops.

 

[Heisenberg007]

The framerate was all over the place in the Showcase, I am fine with 30 fps, but at some points it ran below that.

Yep. Felt the same way.

Unless the game is so good it blows everything away, I'd wait for a few patches (and a slight discount) before picking it up. If I can, I'd rather start the game after September when I get my PS5 Pro.

 

[Bojji]

Check out the trailer from yesterday, its on PS5 and very clearly 30fps with drops.

And looks bad too, lots of FSR2 (probably) motion fizzling. Also, this 30fps lock is totally deserved, look at that (MGS4) quality model:

 

[Bernkastel]

Shpeshal Nick suggested the game is 30 fps

I can now say with confidence, this will be 60 fps. lh032 no need to skip a 60 fps open world RPG by Capcom.

Lmao who's the GAF user that's linking this thread on reddit?

Who the hell is eldensoulsxx?

Has DRM on PC.

Consoles are DRM buddy. They have been since PS360 gen.

 

[Portugeezer]

Check out the trailer from yesterday, its on PS5 and very clearly 30fps with drops.

That's the trailer I'm taking about. Some parts were 60fps, so it seems like an uncapped framerate rather than a 60fps mode.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

I can now say with confidence, this will be 60 fps. lh032 no need to skip a 60 fps open RPG by Capcom.

Who the hell is eldensoulsxx?

Consoles are DRM buddy. They have been since PS360 gen.

Who said consoles weren't?
Capcom games weren't all DRM before and not every game has DRM on PC.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Lmao who's the GAF user that's linking this thread on reddit?

Lol! Link to this?

 

[Freeman76]

That's the trailer I'm taking about. Some parts were 60fps, so it seems like an uncapped framerate rather than a 60fps mode.

None of that was 60fps lol

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

I sort of get that but in order to accept it I'd also have to see some next gen AI, physics and world simulation. Maybe this game will have that and it will make all the other open world games with 60fps modes like Forbidden West, Elden Ring, Cyberpunk, Spiderman 2, RDR2 (well not officially but we've seen it's doable through modded consoles), etc, feel dated and last gen, and that would be cool.

If this game on Ps5/X1 does something equivalently impressive to what Nintendo is doing with ToTK on Switch hardware I guess I can accept 30fps. But that's not what I've seen from most gameplay videos.

The one thing some people keep bringing up is that colossus fight. But that's going to be what? 30 minutes in a 50+ hours RPG? I personally don't really care if a specifically heavy sequence has notorious framedrops but that's not an excuse for the less demanding parts (which usually make up most of the game) to be locked to 30fps.
I think Baldur's Gate 3 is a good example. The City in Act 3 is clearly too much for the console CPU and sees heavy framerate drops. But most of the other areas of the game, including all of Act 1 and 2, runs decently fine at 60fps with some smaller drops here and there.

It's honestly hard to say because devs tend to not give us a deep look into their code. If you look back during the end of the 360 era games had less impressive physics then what you saw in many PS2 games. Some games like Crysis still have a level of fidelity (like the foliage destruction and physics) that not even PS5 games show, Horizon Zero Dawn was criticized for not having much foliage sway interaction and that's nothing compared to the level of interactivity you saw in Crysis 1 in 2007.

The point is it's hard to know exactly where the power computational power is being spent sometimes, sometimes it's unnoticeable to the user but without it the game wouldn't function, sometimes features that were prioritized in the past like destruction and physics aren't as attractive for some devs today. Dragons Dogma 2 is an RE Engine game an engine built to make 60fps games. DA2 is made by Itsunos team, their last game DMC5 was a 60fps console game that looked gorgeous and ran amazingly well on all platforms. So I am inclined to be believe DD2 is 30fps for a reason, Itsuno has an excellent track record let's hope everything turns out well.

 

[Portugeezer]

None of that was 60fps lol

You're blind.

 

[King Dazzar]

I can now say with confidence, this will be 60 fps. lh032 no need to skip a 60 fps open RPG by Capcom.

Who the hell is eldensoulsxx?

Consoles are DRM buddy. They have been since PS360 gen.

Yeah, with PC's the DRM can be performance impacting though, with the likes of Denuvo historically known to cause stuttering and CPU spikes. I'm not aware of consoles DRM being as problematic.

Btw, how's your fanboy energy doing?

 

[playsaves3]

Rumor is Pro has same Zen 2 CPU. If the game is CPU limited Pro isn’t likely to help a lot.

I don’t believe the cpu rumors I do think it’s getting changed

 

[StereoVsn]

I don’t believe the cpu rumors I do think it’s getting changed

Dev kits are out. Manufacturing lines are already done for the most part of its to launch this year.

Unless all the leakers were completely off the mark, it’s a done deal.

Mind you, I would be glad to eat ‍ and be wrong here. Zen 4/5 CPU could do wonders for the console.

 

[playsaves3]

Dev kits are out. Manufacturing lines are already done for the most part of its to launch this year.

Unless all the leakers were completely off the mark, it’s a done deal.

Mind you, I would be glad to eat ‍ and be wrong here. Zen 4/5 CPU could do wonders for the console.

It’s possible you can still add some modifications to Dev kits even if they are out like adding more memory increasing or decreasing clockspeeds, improve ipc, and update architecture what you can’t do is add new hardware based on specific features like say an ai accelerator core or change the core and thread count once kits are out. Only reason I see zen 2 being used is if the pro is really only gonna be 500

 

[vkbest]

Check out the trailer from yesterday, its on PS5 and very clearly 30fps with drops.

The trailer was 60fps with drops

 

[Freeman76]

.

 

[Stuart360]

The thing is it doesnt even look that much better than the orig game maxed out on PC, i'm not even joking. The orig game is a piece of piss to run as well.

 

[Freeman76]

The thing is it doesnt even look that much better than the orig game maxed out on PC, i'm not even joking. The orig game is a piece of piss to run as well.

I was gna run through the original now that I have a gaming PC but didnt think it would be much different to the 'remaster' except for the obvious higher framerate?

 

[rodrigolfp]

The trailer was far from 60fps with drops.

Ftfy.

 

[Stuart360]

I was gna run through the original now that I have a gaming PC but didnt think it would be much different to the 'remaster' except for the obvious higher framerate?

Well i mean the 'Dark Arizen' version. I had no idea it was actually a remaster.
Point still stands though, it doesnt look far behind this in the gameplay segments and runs on a toaster.

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

From what I understand - Most of you wouldn't play bloodorne nowadays if it was 4k30....