Support NeoGAF

[KyanMehwulfe]

I would think this would be even more important if the First Person mode is actually in the game right?

I mean it wouldn't make sense for them to let you go into FPS mode if when you did everything looked like garbage.

I think it can even out. In a TPS, sometimes you can cheat on certain textures that are higher up and out of the general field of view. Like, above windows and stuff like that. But roofs and such can be more important. FPS can be the opposite. Same with NPCs on screen version vs your PC on screen. I'm speaking pretty generally of course, depends on the game.

I don't think it'll matter much for GTA V because basically every inch of every building is already very detailed and unique. The default camera, especially driving, is already so low and often rather close that the field of view won't be much different in FPS. Just a general resolution increase should be enough for any 'closer up' to textures side effect of adding FPS mode.

I already drive around GTA V a fair bit in FP mode already and I never really see poor textures that are hidden in TP mode.

 

[Vhagar]

What a joke, no game should be that big.

You're going to be in for a rude awakening this generation.

 

[opticalmace]

This wouldn't bother me except that you can't pause downloads on the PS4. They really need to fix that soon. It seems like something that should be simple, no?

 

[Spinluck]

You're going to be in for a rude awakening this generation.

Not quite, I'll stick to physical copies for the most part--outside of the occasional download only titles.

 

[Data West]

Not quite, I'll stick to physical copies for the most part--outside of the occasional download only titles.

Physical copies aren't.. smaller.

 

[Bsigg12]

Not quite, I'll stick to physical copies for the most part--outside of the occasional download only titles.

That doesn't change how big the games are...

 

[neogaffer1]

Not necessarily. As patch data on Xbox One overwrites any altered files (rather than keeping the original files and loading the patch on top, like 360), the final disc space used is almost always smaller than the sum of the game and patch separately. It's possible the difference won't be huge, but it'll probably be at least notable. I'd be willing to bet at least a couple gigs less than 65.

Most of the Content Update is new content, not just a title update with revised data.

 

[Visualante2]

4gb VRAM recommended: confirmed

 

[lord pie]

Why ?

What could possibly be added to make it 50GB ?
.

Pretty easy answer actually: Textures.

Textures have always been the largest assets (including things like lightmaps, which are textures too).

Thing is, if you are to double the resolution of a texture, you quadruple it's size (512x512 -> 1024x1024). Additionally, for last gen, BC1/DXT1 was the goto texture compression format for RGB textures and most normal maps - but with the new consoles BC7 is going to be more commonplace due to its drastically higher quality.
Problem is, BC7 is 2x the size of BC1

So basically, it's quite easy to see an 8x texture size increase happening.

 

[Altered Juice]

Not quite, I'll stick to physical copies for the most part--outside of the occasional download only titles.

yes quite! you still have to install those bad boys to play!

 

[RedSwirl]

I feel like there are at least two things some games can do in order to not be so goddamn big:

1) Try to use more real time cut scenes and fewer FMVs. Metal Gear Rising is like 18GB of FMVs and 5GB of actual game. WTF.

2) Don't force everyone to download all eight languages of uncompressed audio.

 

[Shin-Ra]

We have rumors of First person view & now there is something about needing the PlayStation Move Navigation controller for motion controls. I have a feeling GTAV for PS4 is going to let you hold the DS4 like a gun while using the Navigation controller to walk around.

Or just have the DS4 as your virtual hand when in first person mode.

Someone's just forgotten to take out the irrelevant specs from a standard template.

How does this work,since you can't pause downloads on the ps4, and if you turn it off the DL stops?

It continues downloading in standby.

These remasters seem to be taking up a lot of space, MCC collection needs a 20GB update, Tlou being around 40GB and now this.

Is there something about remasters that make them really big? Because this seems strange to me.

1080p60 prerendered cutscenes, higher res assets (4x texture res, all audio assets updated to the highest bit rate ATRAC9 codec), 2 DLC map packs, Left Behind story DLC, audio commentaries. I think the size still differs quite a lot by region/languages included.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

I feel like there are at least two things some games can do in order to not be so goddamn big:

1) Try to use more real time cut scenes and fewer FMVs. Metal Gear Rising is like 18GB of FMVs and 5GB of actual game. WTF.

2) Don't force everyone to download all eight languages of uncompressed audio.

The problem is that GTA has like 5 million hours of audio and a ton of unique assets. It's kinda impossible to make this game small.without sacrificing quality (which they're already doing)

 

[ambar_hitman]

Its high time sony allowed PS4 game back ups to HDD. I already have around 350gb full on my ps4 and don't want to swap HDD now as all my downloaded games will be lost.

 

[SRTtoZ]

Bigger isn't always better.

Who told you that?

 

[MR BLACKMAGIK]

What is the maximum capacity for the Blu-ray discs used on next gen consoles?

 

[SRTtoZ]

What is the maximum capacity for the Blu-ray discs used on next gen consoles?

The disc isnt the limitation, I believe its the readers. 50gb I think.

 

[andrerobot]

1080p60 prerendered cutscenes, higher res assets (4x texture res, all audio assets updated to the highest bit rate ATRAC9 codec), 2 DLC map packs, Left Behind story DLC, audio commentaries. I think the size still differs quite a lot by region/languages included.

ATRAC still exists????!

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Jesus that is big. A download cap on your Internet could make on demand games useless for some this gen.

Depending on how improved it is, I may have the same Goty two years running

 

[SFenton]

Its high time sony allowed PS4 game back ups to HDD. I already have around 350gb full on my ps4 and don't want to swap HDD now as all my downloaded games will be lost.

I can't believe Sony doesn't allow external drives like X1 does. Honestly, that's a killer feature this gen that I wasn't even *thinking* about until like two months before both consoles launched.

 

[SZips]

I can't believe Sony doesn't allow external drives like X1 does. Honestly, that's a killer feature this gen that I wasn't even *thinking* about until like two months before both consoles launched.

On the flip side of the coin, it's super easy to just upgrade the internal HDD on the PS4 compared to the XB1. That takes the sting out just a bit.

 

[Surface of Me]

Shieeet, how big will GTA6 be?

On the flip side of the coin, it's super easy to just upgrade the internal HDD on the PS4 compared to the XB1. That takes the sting out just a bit.

Cant you just get an internal as big as an external?

 

[statham]

On the flip side of the coin, it's super easy to just upgrade the internal HDD on the PS4 compared to the XB1. That takes the sting out just a bit.

I can take my external XBO drive over to my brothers, log into my account and play every game with him without downloading nada. external is the way to go, I don't lose the internal which I use for apps and small games, and keep my external for big games. Have a 2tb external and the 500gb internal.

 

[Shin-Ra]

ATRAC still exists????!

I don't know the exact advantages of the format for game application, presumably a good balance of size, quality and decode time. Without the licensing cost of alternatives.

Here's another proprietary Sony technology I spotted on the back of Kingdom Hearts HD 1.5 ReMIX's boxart.

SBMV Extend

The primary disadvantage of 8 bit color depth physical home media software movies is the presence, from time to time, of an artifact best known to consumers as “banding”. This used to be a far more frequent problem back when a certain major studio was routinely bit-starving their titles while using the VC-1 codec for compression and luckily, these days, banding is now more of a rarity but, it still can be identified on some new titles. SPHE has largely eliminated this banding problem since instituting, on the production of all titles, the use of SBMV, which is a dithering solution that produces superior color gradient quality. You can verify the SBMV logo on the back of the Sony Blu-ray cases. See pic on bottom right for the graphic thinking behind the solution….

Anyway, when you watch 8 bit color depth at home on your display, banding can be due to a multiplicity of causes…one cause being that when, for example, a 12 or 10 bit motion picture is converted in the mastering suite to the final 8 bit 4:2:0 colorspace used by Blu-ray. If sufficient care is taken by the operator during this stage and proper tools are available (see SBMV above, for example) and adequate compensatory bitrates are used, then banding usually can be well mitigated. So, a primary advantage most people see if 10 bit color depth were employed with Blu-ray software media is that the operator wouldn’t need to dither (whatever the solution be) as dithering is a bandaid remedy and leads to decreased codec efficiency.

http://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/20091026_324414.html

 

[dreamfall]

I'm so ready!

 

[tuna_love]

On the flip side of the coin, it's super easy to just upgrade the internal HDD on the PS4 compared to the XB1. That takes the sting out just a bit.

It's not really that hard to plug a USB hard drive into an xbox

 

[Black Republican]

that's crazy.

can the xb1 do external storage? This is only the beginning and I won't want to delete 70GB's to make room for something down the road.

Yea it takes external

 

[EASTC0AST_GH05T]

Geez. Thank God for physical. It'd take me well over a day to download a file of that size.

I cringe at the idea of digital only with our speeds.

you will still need to install the game even with the disc.

 

[Kibbles]

MCC got it beat

 

[Net_Wrecker]

you will still need to install the game even with the disc.

PS4 installs take like 2 seconds relative to how long downloading 50 gigs would take for some people.

 

[Quixz]

Would take around 40 minutes if PSN was let use my connection at max. Ready here!

 

[NoSkillz187]

you will still need to install the game even with the disc.

it takes 3 seconds to install a game on the PS4. So for me it's get the disc version and wait a couple seconds to install, or 6 hours to download. And sure there is pre-load which is great but I delete games to make room for others, so I would still end up dling in the future if I wanted to play it again. So I'm disc all the way this gen.

 

[zychi]

it takes 3 seconds to install a game on the PS4. So for me it's get the disc version and wait a couple seconds to install, or 6 hours to download. And sure there is pre-load which is great but I delete games to make room for others, so I would still end up dling in the future if I wanted to play it again. So I'm disc all the way this gen.

what games do you own that "takes 3 seconds to install"

nba2k14, bf4 and infamous 2 all took almost an hour for me to even be able to play

 

[onQ123]

Someone's just forgotten to take out the irrelevant specs from a standard template.

What standard template tells you that you need the Navigation controller to use motion controls?

 

[Net_Wrecker]

what games do you own that "takes 3 seconds to install"

nba2k14, bf4 and infamous 2 all took almost an hour for me to even be able to play

An hour? Wat? From disc? I'm up and running with most games in 2-4 minutes tops. The PS4 install speed is actually one of the things that impressed me the most at launch compared to last gen.

 

[zychi]

An hour? Wat? From disc? I'm up and running with most games in 2-4 minutes tops. The PS4 install speed is actually one of the things that impressed me the most at launch compared to last gen.

go rent bf4 or nba. nba makes you play an entire game of sas v mia with no music, no commentary, and minimal sound effects before you get to actually touch a menu. its not exclusive to ps4, xbone does the same thing.

i was just calling bullshit on the last poster.

 

[SRTtoZ]

go rent bf4 or nba. nba makes you play an entire game of sas v mia with no music, no commentary, and minimal sound effects before you get to actually touch a menu. its not exclusive to ps4, xbone does the same thing.

i was just calling bullshit on the last poster.

I believe if you don't play the game while it installs, it installs much much faster. (nba 2k14 was like that)

 

[NJDEN]

We are going to take a step back and return to cartridges that you just slide in a slot on your console... Except each cartridge will be an SSD with the game on it.

Not really, but that's what it feels like... These sizes are insane and I'm seriously wondering what libraries are going to look like by the end of the generation. "I've got five different hard drives for my console, when I wana play a specific game I just swap the drives out" : P

 

[FunkyLounge]

Pretty easy answer actually: Textures.

Textures have always been the largest assets (including things like lightmaps, which are textures too).

Thing is, if you are to double the resolution of a texture, you quadruple it's size (512x512 -> 1024x1024). Additionally, for last gen, BC1/DXT1 was the goto texture compression format for RGB textures and most normal maps - but with the new consoles BC7 is going to be more commonplace due to its drastically higher quality.
Problem is, BC7 is 2x the size of BC1

So basically, it's quite easy to see an 8x texture size increase happening.

You quadruple the resolution. I don't get why people say this.

2x(512x512) =/= 1024x1024

It only makes sense, that the texture is 4x larger...

 

[Shin-Ra]

http://www.officialplaystationmagaz...-weapons-balanced-on-the-fly-without-patches/

“Pretty much,” says Boltjes. “Basically how that works is that we’ve split up our engine in such a way that instead of having to have everything to work you can download parts of it. And a large part of the game is obviously the weapons and gameplay mechanics.” Boltjes explains that the level itself isn’t actually the biggest chunk to download before diving into the game: “So before you can start playing we have to look at, well, what does the first level contain? Well it contains these enemy types, these weapons, these textures, these sounds etc.”

“We make a package out of that, and that’s the first bit you download which is a lot smaller than the entire game. So once you have that part and where it gets really interesting is that level 2 might have the same enemies types, just a few extra. So to play level 2 it’s actually not a lot more data to download. After you’ve done that first initial download, you start playing level 1, in the background it’s downloading level 2, level 3, level 4, depending on how fast your internet connection is. Hopefully, there’s going to be wait times, but hopefully there’ll be a lot less wait times than having to download the whole game.”

Some kinds of games and some developers will compartmentalise data better.

What standard template tells you that you need the Navigation controller to use motion controls?

The one that includes every possible bit of blurb that might be relevant to a game.

 

[NoSkillz187]

what games do you own that "takes 3 seconds to install"

nba2k14, bf4 and infamous 2 all took almost an hour for me to even be able to play

If it is taking you an hour to install games from a disc on the PS4 then something's wrong. At tops it takes me 2 minutes to install Diablo 3 and Shadow of Mordor.

 

[Scoot McNairy]

I want the digital version of GTA on my PS4, so I can play it whenever without having to put in a disk, BUT...this means I no longer have the physical map, which was awesome.

 

[zychi]

If it is taking you an hour to install games from a disc on the PS4 then something's wrong. At tops it takes me 2 minutes to install Diablo 3 and Shadow of Mordor.

You must have some magical bluray drive and magical hard drive if 42gb of data installs in 2 minutes for diablo.

Your 4 second install time jumped to 2 mins. I bet you can download the whole internet in 15!

 

[Alkastelca]

So anything new on that 2 weeks early rumors ?

I just found something interesting. That 300 000 $ extra is only available if you pre-order before 11.4. !
Why would they include pre-order within pre-order ?

Maybe just maybe because it releases on 11.4. and that would be 2 weeks early

 

[Tizoc]

So it's 50 GB for PC too?
Well I got a 3.0 USB Ex. HDD to store that sucker in so no worries~

 

[jem0208]

The MCC will be 65gb

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

MCC is 65GB.

 

[ExoSoul]

Maybe we'll finally get to see those heists.

 

[NoSkillz187]

An hour? Wat? From disc? I'm up and running with most games in 2-4 minutes tops. The PS4 install speed is actually one of the things that impressed me the most at launch compared to last gen.

You must have some magical bluray drive and magical hard drive if 42gb of data installs in 2 minutes for diablo.

Your 4 second install time jumped to 2 mins. I bet you can download the whole internet in 15!

I exaggerated about the 4 seconds. But like I said it takes 2 minutes at the longest to install games on the PS4 for me. I guess me and Net_Wrecker are lying just for the sake of lying, huh?

 

[Hip Hop]

The MCC will be 65gb

MCC is 65GB.

holy shit, that big?

including patch?

might have to go digital on that one as you can download the patch before the game is out.

If I go the disc route, I won't be able to play the game right away, waiting for the patch to download.