I would like to see Luna standing up and with another pose before I draw any conclusions.
She doesn't seem so petite in the artwork from Duscae's ending.
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Stella has been removed from FFXV; Itamuro writing game; Demo 2 June 9; FFXV not @ E3
- Thread starter LiK
- Start date
I would like to see Luna standing up and with another pose before I draw any conclusions.
She doesn't seem so petite in the artwork from Duscae's ending.
Yes but even so, what's the issue? FFXV will ship in 2016. Dissidia is an arcade game which will be released later this year in Japan, and they have stated that there will be at least a year of exclusivity for arcades before they bring it to home consoles. Arcade games such as these are constantly updated while in service. I'm not seeing the issue. Noctis definitely won't be in the game when it first launches, lots of characters won't. They'll be releasing more as time goes by.
Spiritwalker
Member
Luna looks like a fake doll creature made by a horny developer. Stella was a much better design, and anyone who can't tell the difference between the two is blind.
LowParry
Member
What I really don't understand is why they felt the need for rename her to "Luna." Fine, they might have changed some sections of the story and maybe even gave her a different role, but if they didn't rename her there was less chances of the backlash being so strong. She looks like Stella, so why not just leave her name as it is and just give her a different role and explain that they were still sticking to the original vision but her previous role didn't fit the story if they wanted it to be self contained. They might've even been able to play it off and stated that they didn't deviate from the original vision at all if they played their cards right
For one, I actually really like Kingdom Heart's lore and world building... up until Dream Drop Distance anyways. That alone is enough for me to assume that Nomura's original vision was worth a damn.
The reason he's given a lot of creative reverence is because he managed to create a franchise that was widely praised as the next potential major franchise that could be on par with Final Fantasy. At least up until he (or management?) decided to keep spinning the games off onto handheld consoles
I've linked this before on a different thread on FFXV, but Nomura has stated in interviews that there were times he wanted to push his prototypes to release. I'm going to assume that means that he had a pretty decent working build at least, and it wasn't just concept stuff
EDIT:
http://www.novacrystallis.com/2013/...xv-and-kingdom-hearts-development-philosophy/
For one, I actually really like Kingdom Heart's lore and world building... up until Dream Drop Distance anyways. That alone is enough for me to assume that Nomura's original vision was worth a damn.
The reason he's given a lot of creative reverence is because he managed to create a franchise that was widely praised as the next potential major franchise that could be on par with Final Fantasy. At least up until he (or management?) decided to keep spinning the games off onto handheld consoles
I've linked this before on a different thread on FFXV, but Nomura has stated in interviews that there were times he wanted to push his prototypes to release. I'm going to assume that means that he had a pretty decent working build at least, and it wasn't just concept stuff
EDIT:
I found the link
http://www.novacrystallis.com/2013/...xv-and-kingdom-hearts-development-philosophy/Megidolaon
Member
Yeah, I forgot it's exclusive for a year to arcades.
Well, if FFXV can release before the end of 2016 it's fine.
Mentally, I still have it pegged for 2020 though
lol ^
Yeah, I really don't like to be the guy to paint the devil on the wall but I have a feeling that this thread could go to shit real fast now.
Maybe let's change the topic real quick.
To be honest, at first I actually liked the name "Stella" more, but "Lunafreya" actually grew on me pretty fast, and now I prefer it better.
LowParry
Member
Talk about Cindy. Everyone loves/hates Cindy!
Well I'm not even mad at it, I just don't really understand the thought process behind renaming her. It almost feels like it was done to show the world that they made changes to the original vision, which would inevitably piss off all the old FFVXIII fans
Could be as simple as lore reasons.
The moon is a significant part of the imagery since 2006. Naming Luna after that isn't a coincidence.
Thinking about the fans and trying to please them at every turn is just a stupid thing to do.
But they try and do just that in every single ATR by their own words, no?
I said at every turn.
They can look and say all the right things, but at the end they're the ones making the final decision and they have their own creative intent.
ULTROS!
People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
Still don't get why they didn't name the blonde girl Stella instead. I mean unless there's a completely story related spoiler in having the name Luna (or Lunafreya), I still don't see the point and it will add confusion.
I'm actually surprised to hear that Cindy was designed by Ferrari. They said it was a collaborative effort last time.
Of course there is a story reason, lol. Just how there was a reason behind Stella's name.
The name isn't the problem. Whatever they changed, they obviously felt that it was for the better. The problem is that they could have come clean sooner but decided not to.
Zomba13
Member
PLOT TWIST! : Luna is actually tied to the moon which plays a big part in her fate!
It's really clever you see because the name Luna is Latin for "moon".
Megidolaon
Member
They heard the backlash and wanna blame the gaijin?
Zomba13
Member
LowParry
Member
Stella in Latin is "star".
Luna in Latin is "the moon".
Star. Moon. Star. Moon. In the name of the Moon.....no. Would a valid complaint is that the name Stella isn't Japanese enough versus Luna? Would people relate the name Stella more to Seinfeld? I just don't know anymore. I'm emptying my cup of care tonight.
Well in that case they easily could've changed the lore to fit with stars, considering they changed something as important as Stella's role/character. Not many people knew much about the relevance of the moon to the lore, and they could've easily played it off as "night sky with stars" being the imagery that they were emphasizing.
That way, there's less backlash and they could've played it off as not having changed anything since the lore is less visible while having been rarely discussed in the past.
CrimsonSquall
Member
Stella was better. Can I live with Luna? Of course I can, not too big of a compromise but I would still like to see something similar to that infamous scene of Noctis facing off against Stella.
But that wouldn't make sense with what little we know about the game. It's absolutely stupid to think about the backlash and not make whatever decision benefits the final product.
Backlash and salt will come, but that can be washed away. You can't fix bad changes to the final product that were made in favour of the vocal minority.
Zomba13
Member
It would have be so good if Stella/Luna is like the Vergil to your Dante. Someone on equal footing who you have to fight against, maybe with her own crew of girls to fight against your boys. I just love rival characters that contrast with the protagonist.
Surely you know it's just marketing, right? They're going to do what they want, and make the fans feel involved along the way.
We'll never know whether the changes are bad or not, so I get where you're coming from, but it's exactly because we know so little about the game that they could pull it off and avoid any unnecessary backlash. From a marketing perspective, it's not stupid to think about the backlash because even if we're a vocal minority, it doesn't mean our sales don't matter at all.
That being said, I completely understand your point. I just hope they'll eventually tell us how it benefit the final product and why they made the decision.
NHarmonic.
Member
Well, Luna's introduction to us is basically her sitting in a house, looking at the camera, with a slight expression of determination.
Now compare it to Stella's fucking amazing display. And that's not even getting to their designs.
It's not that difficult to see why people can be mad about it. Yeah, it's only judging by what little we know (managed to knew) about both games, but tbh, that scene with Stella evokes a lot more as a character, regarding of what would've been in the actual game.
I'm watching that ATR at the moment and just found that bit interesting.
This basically means Final Fantasy Versus XIII is deader than dead. They will not make concessions with respect to the original game from now on out it seems.
However, Tabata also said this:
Make up your own mind whether or not this is a good or a bad thing.
This basically means Final Fantasy Versus XIII is deader than dead. They will not make concessions with respect to the original game from now on out it seems.
However, Tabata also said this:
Make up your own mind whether or not this is a good or a bad thing.
#21stCenturySquare
I do wonder how much of that is down to a vocal minority with most people who'd bother with games like FF actually being fine with whatever. Or ignoring a game can still be VERY successful even with turn based but wanting to chase the larger market (which I guess is kind of demanded of them anyway)? I do imagine some of these Kickstarters and other events must leave them second guessing some though, the climate actually seems friendlier for that on consoles than it has been for the last console generation.
Aeriscloud
Banned
You know, it could be worse. Luna could be Lightning.
There's still time.
There's still time.
Wow, reading this thread is more entertaining then discussing Socrates's use of the elanches (the Socratic method) on Plato's brother.
The thing is that one is in dire need of two things, popcorn, and perspective.
here is what Tabata said in the ATR 6.0 that aired yesterday
"Stella Presented as the heroine to play opposite Noctis in Versus XIII. The team wanted to keep her as a heroine and pursued ways to tie her into Final Fantasy XVs design, but we found it difficult to make sense of her character and role within the new game. So then they thought, Do we want to recreate Stella in a different role and image, or do we want to start over with a new heroine? After a lot of consideration, the team decided not to include Stella and go with a new heroine named Luna, who has a different role in the story."
Now most of you probably glanced at the above and jumped the gun way to early or took it out of context, so lets see if we can sort it out.
Tabata is saying that the character that was Stella in the Final Fantasy Versus XIII draft the problems that Tabata and the others encountered with Stella are simply that the character herself and her role were not very clearly defined and that she as a character was very vague.
In order to convert Final Fantasy Versus XIII into Final Fantasy XV they needed to flesh out Stella's character and that would mean basically rewriting a new character at that point, so Tabata and the others were left with a choice.
Do we want to recreate Stella in a different role and image, or do we want to start over with a new heroine? After a lot of consideration, the team decided not to include Stella and go with a new heroine named Luna, who has a different role in the story."
The choice they made was to create a new character called Luna who is probably a spiritual successor to Stella's character, the key thing is Luna has the same image as Stella and has an altered role in the story.
Note that her role is altered and not her as a character, or her part as a proxy for Noctis.
So some of you are probably are probably wondering why not change the character and keep the name if that's the case?
The answer is simple, it is a gesture of respect to the character that Nojima(?) created, please do remember that the team working on Final Fantasy XV is an all stare cast of people.
Now that we have established that the character is still the same and that the only changes are to her role and her image doens't calling Tabata a lair bit....much?
Tabata wants XV to be a game that is self contained and starts, and ends with XV, if he needed to change Stella's name, role, and image then I think that he should be thanked for not making Final Fantasy XV into a trilogy and drawing things out over sequels that no one really wants or needs.
He is trying to make Final Fantasy XV the best game it can be, and in order for him to do that he had to change Stella as a character and increase her depth as a character.
Guys, gals, Kagari, Tabata is saying that in the draft Stella's character was too shallow, and that rewriting that same character with the same name would be an insult to Nojami's (?) character and his direction.
Luna wears the same clothes that Stella wore, and by all intents and purposes she will probably stand apposed to Noctis later in the story, just not in the same role.
Also remember Tabata covered the 3(!) changes in the conversion form Versus to XV and Luna being a damsel in distress was not one of them. Come on that's like the Tomb Raider Reboot was supposed star Laura Croft as a damsel in distress because.........reboot?
Guys, reserve any judgments or preconceived 'opinions' until you play it yourselves, when you play the game and have actually seen Luna and interacted with her as a character THEN tell me if she is a damsel in distress or if she was a character that added depth to the games story.
This is like deciding which university your kid is going to go to when it is still fetus and hasn't even chosen a gender.
Trick
Out
The thing is that one is in dire need of two things, popcorn, and perspective.
here is what Tabata said in the ATR 6.0 that aired yesterday
"Stella Presented as the heroine to play opposite Noctis in Versus XIII. The team wanted to keep her as a heroine and pursued ways to tie her into Final Fantasy XVs design, but we found it difficult to make sense of her character and role within the new game. So then they thought, Do we want to recreate Stella in a different role and image, or do we want to start over with a new heroine? After a lot of consideration, the team decided not to include Stella and go with a new heroine named Luna, who has a different role in the story."
Now most of you probably glanced at the above and jumped the gun way to early or took it out of context, so lets see if we can sort it out.
Tabata is saying that the character that was Stella in the Final Fantasy Versus XIII draft the problems that Tabata and the others encountered with Stella are simply that the character herself and her role were not very clearly defined and that she as a character was very vague.
In order to convert Final Fantasy Versus XIII into Final Fantasy XV they needed to flesh out Stella's character and that would mean basically rewriting a new character at that point, so Tabata and the others were left with a choice.
Do we want to recreate Stella in a different role and image, or do we want to start over with a new heroine? After a lot of consideration, the team decided not to include Stella and go with a new heroine named Luna, who has a different role in the story."
The choice they made was to create a new character called Luna who is probably a spiritual successor to Stella's character, the key thing is Luna has the same image as Stella and has an altered role in the story.
Note that her role is altered and not her as a character, or her part as a proxy for Noctis.
So some of you are probably are probably wondering why not change the character and keep the name if that's the case?
The answer is simple, it is a gesture of respect to the character that Nojima(?) created, please do remember that the team working on Final Fantasy XV is an all stare cast of people.
Now that we have established that the character is still the same and that the only changes are to her role and her image doens't calling Tabata a lair bit....much?
Tabata wants XV to be a game that is self contained and starts, and ends with XV, if he needed to change Stella's name, role, and image then I think that he should be thanked for not making Final Fantasy XV into a trilogy and drawing things out over sequels that no one really wants or needs.
He is trying to make Final Fantasy XV the best game it can be, and in order for him to do that he had to change Stella as a character and increase her depth as a character.
Guys, gals, Kagari, Tabata is saying that in the draft Stella's character was too shallow, and that rewriting that same character with the same name would be an insult to Nojami's (?) character and his direction.
Luna wears the same clothes that Stella wore, and by all intents and purposes she will probably stand apposed to Noctis later in the story, just not in the same role.
Also remember Tabata covered the 3(!) changes in the conversion form Versus to XV and Luna being a damsel in distress was not one of them. Come on that's like the Tomb Raider Reboot was supposed star Laura Croft as a damsel in distress because.........reboot?
Guys, reserve any judgments or preconceived 'opinions' until you play it yourselves, when you play the game and have actually seen Luna and interacted with her as a character THEN tell me if she is a damsel in distress or if she was a character that added depth to the games story.
This is like deciding which university your kid is going to go to when it is still fetus and hasn't even chosen a gender.
Trick
Out
Zoe
Member
How the hell is she petite?
LowParry
Member
Honestly, that ship has sailed. I just see no reason to see Lightning in anything mainline FF. Of course we still have our Remake/Remasters of FFXIII to look forward to.
encephalon
Member
I'm guessing a damsel in distress? I no longer hold any hopes for this game. Surprise me, square enix.
Cornbread78
Member
Man, all these changes. This going to be a long wait until they tune up all these changes. Huh?
They only sold through 60% of shipment there IIRC.
LowParry
Member
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
Versus is dead; Long Live XV
Liquid_015
Gold Member
Nevermind.
Same clothes... spiritual successor... why not just keep her as Stella if she was more of a blank slate to begin with?
Isn't it more of an insult to can her and have the new character steal her clothes? LOL. Unless Stella will be in a different game altogether...
Isn't it more of an insult to can her and have the new character steal her clothes? LOL. Unless Stella will be in a different game altogether...
Was Versus ever really alive? Barely, it seems.
MagnaderAlpha
Member
Versus IS dead, just like Final Fantasy Agito XIII is dead(not to be confused with Final Fantasy Agito). Remember, it was originally aimed to be on mobile, and even looked somewhat different when the first gameplay was revealed. Remember this? Gameplay footage of when it was on mobile. Like Versus, there there's obviously some concepts that were carried over into it's new version(Type-0), but also obvious aspects that were just totally dropped. This isn't new. The only game that was sorta unscathed was FFXIII, but even that one didn't follow through with all the initial concepts they had planned for it. Early after announcing FFXIII, Square said that battles would be fought on the world map(no transition). There's also the bit about all the content they cut out(that they claim you could make an entirely separate game from).
Liquid_015
Gold Member
It's not the dissidia writer. It's someone who worked on Dissidia.