Suppose the avatar doomed ya, my friend
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Super Smash Bros Wii U & 3DS Thread 4: New Year, Old Arguments
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
Suppose the avatar doomed ya, my friend
Most normal people don't care about the honor of inclusion.
They just wanna play as their favorite character. And to be honest, they aren't wrong. Why the hell should they care about anything other than her being playable?
" you should be glad she is in the game"
" I wanted to play as her so i am not glad. I am disappointment and sad, I dont really give a shit about honor or whatever.I just wanted to play as [insert character here ]"
"It must be punch-out because they didn't put a mario ref in." (?????) Anyway, if it's based off of the Wii version, they can use the Wii version ref.
How about "That would be stupid as a stage hazard. If other punch-out characters are in they should be ATs."
I also wouldn't equate a slow trickle of innocuous pictures with the occasional bit of actual information "teasing", in the sense that none of the pictures have been meant to be dissected to such a degree (new characters movesets notwithstanding), or are really open to extrapolate other content from.
He does have a tail, but it disappears after he turns to Samus.
*Avatar quote*But he was my favorite character in Smash 64!
Dedede looks really big in that pic, sending all theories about Ridley to the trash can. Thanks Sakurai for the prefect timing in the Smash cycle.
As C.Olimar788 illustrated, making most of Ridley's body part of the background (so the hit box stays in the reasonable size) could be a solution. I'm pretty sure someone working on the game can come up with great ideas or designs that translate pretty well into the game.
Some of these reactions are just damn horrible. Why the fuck are all of these people expecting SUPPORT CHARACTERS to be playable? These characters are perfect for assists yet they still insist on whining? It's like they want a high class mugen game or something.
Freezie KO
Banned
Well, I didn't say anything about honor. You did. I'm saying that those reactions are crazy because there's no reason to be so hyperbolic about a character that had a very real chance of not making the game at all.
It's not about honor, and it's fine to want to play as any character you want. If I want to play as Soren from Fire Emblem Path of Radiance, hey, that's cool. But I wouldn't have an extreme reaction when he's not playable because such an expectation would be completely out of whack.
......
what do you think this meant?
1) I assume like most of us you have no idea what goes on at the magical land of nintendo. So lets not... assert the bolded shall we.
and
2)Crazy reactions aside, it find it impressive. That many people care, a bit crazy bit eh impressive.
I woudn't compare those two things. The bolded would apply more to soren than ashley.
Freezie KO
Banned
That people might be happy to see a character they enjoy in a game they enjoy.
No, let's assert the bolded. A side character from a C-tier franchise has a lesser chance of appearing than other more popular characters. Period.
That level seems like a weird place to include Ridley (that IS Ridley, right?). Sakurai must be messing with us at this point.
And I will say it again.
Why should people care if they aren't playable?
There you go, asserting things you don't know about again. On many levels.
Freezie KO
Banned
Because it's better than nothing?
I'm honestly surprised you're even arguing this. Go look at the other Smash Bros. titles. There are three of them. Count how many playable side characters from C-tier franchises there are. How many compared to more popular characters or franchise protagonists?
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Smashgaf, pls
Freezie KO
Banned
Okay. Let's talk hitstun.
Like I said in the Ashley thread, Wario Ware actually has more games than Star Fox, so if the former is C-tier I'd hate to consider what Star Fox is. If we consider Wario's games as a whole, well the numbers overshadow Star Fox completely. And yet the latter has three characters in Smash. I honestly don't think people expecting another Wario character have their head in the clouds. And if their favourite is Ashley why not root for her?
Ashley isn't a side character. While Wario is of course the main star, all the other game designer characters (that's actually what they are) are pretty much on the same level due to how the game is structured. They are stars of each chapter in "the story". Side characters would be people like Manager Joe or Jimmy T's family.
Ashley isn't a side character. While Wario is of course the main star, all the other game designer characters (that's actually what they are) are pretty much on the same level due to how the game is structured. They are stars of each chapter in "the story". Side characters would be people like Manager Joe or Jimmy T's family.
Freezie KO
Banned
RIP-tier.
Many people don't care about anythng besides the playable cast, hell I would argue most since smash is a main stream game.
Considering that, anything lower than playable, or boss . IS nothing.
Star fox.
Star fox will probably have 3 characters in the new smash bros. And possibly 4.
Star fox, STAAAAAR FOOOOOX.
I'm not saying that less popular franchises get less characters , its true to very large degree. However I am arguing that isn't the only thing, that could keep a character from being in , because wario is one of the most notable nintendo characters, period. And his games would have a bit more pull, along with all that, a few key nintendo franchises have gone MIA atm. So, I dunno wario games existing at the moment shows that he doing a bit better than a lot of the smash contestants. As someone said earlier sometimes a character becomes an assist trophy because a move set couldn't have been thought up .
All I am saying is, you have no idea what actually happened so lets not assert one thing as if that is the reason why, or sole reason why. Because you don't really know , nor is it obvious at this point in time.
also
STAR FOX.
also all of this.
Freezie KO
Banned
But I didn't assert popularity as the sole reason. Are you reading my posts at all?
Here's what I said:
and
Basically, don't get your hopes up about any minor characters being playable because there's a very real chance they won't make the game (as many minor characters won't).
and
Minor characters have a lesser chance of being playable or even appearing. Ashley is a minor character.
I suspect these are two statements you agree with, but you've fortified your antagonism so much that you can't walk it back.
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
Sakurai decided to put a generic boxing ring stage in Smash for because there is nothing left to take from Nintendo games. Smash has used EVERYTHING.
Freezie KO
Banned
Ashley is a minor character in the grand scheme of things and a side character in the Wario Ware series in particular.
Rosalina may be a minor character overall, but she's a side character in Nintendo's premier franchise.
Eh, the Wars series has had 12 releases spanning 20 years, and in three smash games has only seen a single AT and a couple stickers. I don't think number of games is a very good metric for anything here.
Or, I was arguing that in the context of the character Ashley it might not be the most applicable, because we have no idea why she was decided to be an assist trophy and maybe just maybe we should hold off untill we have more information.
My whole point is that you have no actual idea what the decision making process was, in a game where star fox has 3 maybe 4 people in it. And a game headed by sakurai the man who left cutscenes out because "people would just watch them on youtube"
But it seems you don't intend on reading my responses and imply i am being oppositional just for the sake of opposition. Maybe that makes you more assured in yourself, or makes you feel better. I dunno. However when you are ready to read the things, i am here.
I'M FINISHED!
Um exCUSE me Sakurai but CLEARLY the best choice for Smash Bros would be my fav niche character HOWEVER you are clearly INCOMPETENT and
If I prefer Ashley and Red over Rosalina and Luma does that make me a satanist?
Who cares because Wario Land is a better series and deserves a rep
Wario is in the game.
But that's WarioWare's Wario who just happens to have his classic costume
but in all of seriousness, I'm even surprised that Ashley even made it in as AT. I don't really expect the Wario series to have another character unfortunately. I'm sort of disappointed that this also may mean that the series is just WarioWare and no Wario Land stuff once again, but I may be hopefully wrong.
Kind of my point. To argue Ashley had no chance just because Wario Ware is "C-tier" in a game that doesn't really have any rules in regard to character selection is pretty silly, especially when a series like Star Fox show this is true. I was also just pointing out that Wario Ware isn't a C-tier series imo.
I mean someone yesterday argued that Skull Kid as an assist was a sign of who and who doesn't have a chance because he is a major character which is rather laughable. Even people can't even agree on who and who isn't important how are we meant to know what Sakurai's opinion on this same issue is?
Even though Brawl had a Ware based assist?
A Link to the Past
Banned
It's weird, I never even really wanted Ashley, and now that she's an AT, I'm feeling disappointed that she isn't playable.
Red Arremer
Member
I'm wondering what happened to Kat & Ana.
Also, in regards to the discussion going on: I don't agree with how Freezie KO is wording it, but I do agree with his point that the reactions are very hyperbolic. Whether Ashley had a good or bad shot to get in, it doesn't matter. If you base your decision to buy/play a fighting game on literally only one single character in a roster of what is likely going to be over 40, you obviously never intended to buy it for, well, the game itself.
I've been wanting Ridley to be playable in Smash more than any other character since the first game, he hasn't been playable in either Melee or Brawl, likely will not make it into Smash 4 either, yet I bought and enjoyed these games a lot, and will also even double-dip for 4. Because I'm a fan of the games, and the series as a whole.
Also, in regards to the discussion going on: I don't agree with how Freezie KO is wording it, but I do agree with his point that the reactions are very hyperbolic. Whether Ashley had a good or bad shot to get in, it doesn't matter. If you base your decision to buy/play a fighting game on literally only one single character in a roster of what is likely going to be over 40, you obviously never intended to buy it for, well, the game itself.
I've been wanting Ridley to be playable in Smash more than any other character since the first game, he hasn't been playable in either Melee or Brawl, likely will not make it into Smash 4 either, yet I bought and enjoyed these games a lot, and will also even double-dip for 4. Because I'm a fan of the games, and the series as a whole.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Couldn't care less Ashley isn't playable. She was only a support character, whereas Starfy has his own games and still didn't make it.
Couldn't care less Ashley isn't playable. She was only a support character, whereas Starfy has his own games and still didn't make it.
Technically every character in a wario ware game is a protagonist, so I hae no idea what you mean really. Her name isn't on the box?
Couldn't care less Ashley isn't playable. She was only a support character, whereas Starfy has his own games and still didn't make it.
Oh man, I would have been so pissed if Starfy got the playable fighter treatment.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
I know
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Whatever, her name isn't on the box. Starfy's name is on five, count 'em, five games. Better than all your faves.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
starfy is a star, ashley is a witch
iMorphball
Banned
Are we honestly arguing WarioWare vs Star Fox?
WarioWare vs Star Fox
Were you people even alive when the SNES was around?
Was there WarioWare?
I had no idea this Ashley character existed, but I'll be damned if I meet anyone who doesn't at least know what a Barrel Roll is. Any gamer, that is.
WarioWare vs Star Fox
Were you people even alive when the SNES was around?
Was there WarioWare?
I had no idea this Ashley character existed, but I'll be damned if I meet anyone who doesn't at least know what a Barrel Roll is. Any gamer, that is.
WarioWare vs Star Fox. Smh. Hmph. WarioWare vs Star Fox...
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
And im the starfox fan here.
TheCongressman1
Member
It's easy to see why a character from a spinoff game series isn't going to be given a spot.
Look at Brawl:
All characters are from larger or notable titles, and only the main cast are candidates.
Spinoff or sequels only include the main character.
Other non-mainline characters have some kind of relevance to Nintendo past.
Look at Brawl:
All characters are from larger or notable titles, and only the main cast are candidates.
Spinoff or sequels only include the main character.
Other non-mainline characters have some kind of relevance to Nintendo past.
iMorphball
Banned
Oh, you mean Fox McCloud's best bud and Fox McCloud's rival?
Who's Ashley? Is she from that compilation of mini games that turned Wario into the joke character of the Mario franchise? That one series that Nintendo made instead of giving us a new Wario Land game?
...
You may answer.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
slippy is fox's best buddy, fox and falco are in a love and hate relationship bordering rivals, they tell eachother to go fuck themselves sometimes.
Red Arremer
Member
For the sake of the discussion:
The whole "game X deserves Y amount of reps because it's Z amount of popular/best-selling" argument is pretty flawed from the start given the fact that the very first game started us off with Ness as a character, we went on to Ice Climbers etc.
Falco was chosen as roster filler for Melee when Sakurai felt he could use some of the remaining time to beef up the roster a bit, and was kept because a lot of people seemed to enjoy him since out of the 6 clones, he is one of the 3 that made it - the other 2 are from the Zelda franchise.
And, out of the other 3 Star Fox members that aren't Fox, Falco is probably the most fit to be a character in a fighting game - he's got that friendly rivalry with Fox going and all.
Wolf has been Fox's "counterpart" and is the villain of the series most fit for Smash. I also believe that Sakurai wanted Wolf in Smash because he likes the idea of a feral humanoid fighter utilizing claws etc., or just liked the character.
Falco and Wolf also are significantly more important to their respective franchises - Falco has been in every game of the series, Wolf has been in every game but the very first and Adventure (but also as playable in the games after Adventures), and both characters also have importance to the plots of the games they appear in.
Ashley is one character in a pretty big roster of characters who you play a bunch of minigames with. She joined the WarioWare cast very recently with the first DS game - there's other characters like Mona, Jimmy T or Orbulon who have been in the series since the first game (and also made appearances in all the games following) and thus are, by default, more important to the series than Ashley, simply due to their seniority.
Fully expecting one character that isn't the lead from a cast of around 20 "playable" characters and then throwing a tantrum in response to that character not making it into Smash as a playable character is a bit over the top, in my opinion.
FTFY.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
FTFY.
how naughty.
Why does it matter what system Wario Ware first appeared on? Age doesn't have any bearing on the roster. Should we scrap Olimar because Pikmin wasn't an SNES game?
I think this topic has resulted in some confusion. It seems people think those arguing why Ashley could have been a reasonable prediction for a fighter are upset that she is only an assist. This isn't the case, we are simply explaining why people may have had this thought.
There also seems to be a lot of strange hate for the Wario Ware games.
iMorphball
Banned
I do that with my best friends, too.
Fact of the matter is, Falco and Wolf are two incredibly important characters in what used to be one of Nintendo's big franchises. Sure, it's been a while since we've had a game, but let's not forget that Fox's inclusion in Smash had included each of the three games, and he was among the first characters to be shown for SSB4.
Wario joined Smash with Brawl. WarioWare does not have a legacy or importance like Star Fox does.
Pic of the day. A group shot of the big guys. How much bigger are they compared to Mario?
DK got some sharp knees.