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The UK votes to leave the European Union
- Thread starter Spring Drive
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I think my point flew over your head. All you say is valid which is why I used the poster's point against them.
Also, I should check that 2 glasses of red wine is still supposed to be good for health. I've been drinking it pretty consistently.
Exactly, I honestly expected him to come out saying we needed to stay in the free market at all costs...after all he played political games by not triggering article 50..
Look I may be wrong...I just think when push comes to shove in some back room at 4am a deal will be had to allow the EU and the U.K to move forward
frontieruk
Member
The guy was obviously a brexit supporter and would of been for a long time to of get the shirt made up, so he was a campaigner rather than being in the cool club so I can only assume you are accusing me of that...
And Commissioners nominated by democratically elected national govts and approved by democratically elected MEP's, with the Commission President now being the nominee of the largest party in EP elections.
They're in the process of kicking Switzerland out of the EEA. We take it on their terms or we don't take it at all. The EU has bigger fish to fry, like the US.
PJV3
Member
Should have been pretty obvious but I was talking about the guy in the picture.
City pressure doing work. There will be more rumblings as the weeks go on, and then potentially a big one pulling the trigger.
Brexiters brought a wooden spoon to a gun fight.
GamerMax73
Member
Again forget Cameron, he's irrelevant.
I think we all agree on that. The difference is really just on who will lose out in that deal. You seem to think that the EU will have to give the UK something to prevent uproar. From my perspective, it's probably more likely that the UK will just have to suck it up and not activate article 50, probably by calling a general election and electing somebody less dumb. Then things can slowly return to normal.
jellies_two
Member
Really! That's fascinating to consider you and many think that EU countries are anywhere near as states are to the USA. It is indeed a fantasy to imagine State X going it alone in USA when most never had an international profile.
But France or Germany to EU, is a completely different relationship. I guess you remember when the USA was being formed by force and the south didn't much like the idea? We are not even at that stage in EU because individual states were individual countries a few years ago, and still have all the institutions intact,
Language and culture traditions and so on are not so easily harmonized, nor should they be against people's will. if nothing else Quebec and Basque region and Iraq and a dozen other places teach us that every day. U.K. Is a bunch of us states already: regional dialects and traditions abound.
Harmonizing Europe via totally open borders while laudable on paper shouldn't be cheered on by Americans who would no more accept open borders with their immediate neighbors, even Canada, than fly.
I've been poping in and out of this thread but I haven't read it so much recently so sorry if I'm making a redundant point here, it's just something I've been thinking about.
If you want Britain to remain in the EU, don't direct your anger at leave voters in general. Direct your anger at the people in power who lied to them and promised them stuff they frankly never intended of delivering. Many of which, namely Boris and Gove most likely didn't actually want us to leave and were just using this as an opportunity to increase their own power within the Tory party. Leave voters know something is wrong, many of them have been screwed over by austerity, but then were told that it's the EU that is causing these issues. A message reinforced by the media and politicians, who have exploited voters through pure lies. Present that message now it has become increasingly clear.
If you want Britain to remain in the EU, don't direct your anger at leave voters in general. Direct your anger at the people in power who lied to them and promised them stuff they frankly never intended of delivering. Many of which, namely Boris and Gove most likely didn't actually want us to leave and were just using this as an opportunity to increase their own power within the Tory party. Leave voters know something is wrong, many of them have been screwed over by austerity, but then were told that it's the EU that is causing these issues. A message reinforced by the media and politicians, who have exploited voters through pure lies. Present that message now it has become increasingly clear.
I read today that the EU have yet to respond to Switzerland voting to introduce controls on freedom of movement? Also we a not Switzerland at all... Let's not play done our strength (our size)
Down with referendums!
Last I read one of the 7 or so that had submitted a bid had pulled out post referendum.
Has that changed now, have more pulled out?
Phantast2k
Member
https://twitter.com/BBCkatyaadler
Translator's note: Traditionally, 4 is unlucky because it is sometimes pronounced shi, which is the word for death in Japanese.
Translator's note: Traditionally, 4 is unlucky because it is sometimes pronounced shi, which is the word for death in Japanese.
TheLaughingStock
Member
There are quite a few countries within the EU w/o the exemptions the UK gets seeing unemployment comparable to the Great Depression. Even neoliberal economists lol such as Alan Goolsbee of the Chicago school have said things like, "Leaving is awful. The eurozone prospects are awful. Which is more awful? Awfully hard to tell."
Heseltine just said on Newsnight he wants Johnson & the Leave campaign to be put in charge of negotiating Britain's exist even if he doesn't become PM. He said the result would be so unpalatable to the public that either a second referendum or general election would stop us leave.
Elaugaufein
Member
This is probably backwards. The US doesn't struggle because money gets transferred from more successful states to less successful states at the federal level and no one seriously gets upset. The Euro is a currency union without that kind of fiscal union which means when a country falls on hard times the other countries take more self interested approaches like loans and austerity. Sometimes greater federal ties are positive.
Eta - Rereading I may have misunderstood your post if so I apologize.
Do you think increasing pressure from the City will be enough for the government to ignore the referendum result?
Are really going to kick back and watch all these major companies move out of the UK in order to appease 17 million people who don't like foreigners?
He doesn't care. Independence from the EU/the establishment stands above all for him, no matter the cost. It's an ideological thing.
maquiladora
Member
Of course. The EU is not going to give the UK some kind of special, sweet deal as that will set a precedent which might make the prospect of exiting the EU appear quite attractive to other nations, thus running the risk of collapsing the entire union.
iNvid02
Member
Johnson, gove, farage and everyone else who lent their face to that campaign, otherwise they are free to disown any deals. they need to be the ones returning to the UK public with our 'gr8 trade deal'
SporeCrawler
Member
Japan tp replace UK as next EU member?
Blaming Brussels is fine when they deserve it, misrepresenting facts and straight up lying to people are the problems.
No, once it's invoked, we're fucked no matter happens in those 2 years.
UK is not in the Eurozone. We have record levels of Employment.
Hiring will go down now.
#WelldoneLeavevoters.
No, once you invoked Articel 50 and the two years are up and no extension is granted (All 27 members of the EU have to agree) you are out and there is no stopping the process.
jufonuk
not tag worthy
The EU want to hurt cameron and UKIP for creating this mess. Not the people of UK and it's inhabitants from outside.
To let us fail causes instability everywhere.
They are two forward thinking for that .
We are not star scream in this analogy but Grimlock . To have grimlock under your control is a great thing.
We don't want to lead the EU but we like to pretend we are not controlled by it.
I like to think the Tories are in fighting much like the deceptions right now "Boris Johnson Superior, Terresa may inferior"
Yeah this doesn't make any sense . Bit please try to excuse me I'm facing an existential crisis while my country is slowly tearing itself apart.
To let us fail causes instability everywhere.
They are two forward thinking for that .
We are not star scream in this analogy but Grimlock . To have grimlock under your control is a great thing.
We don't want to lead the EU but we like to pretend we are not controlled by it.
I like to think the Tories are in fighting much like the deceptions right now "Boris Johnson Superior, Terresa may inferior"
Yeah this doesn't make any sense . Bit please try to excuse me I'm facing an existential crisis while my country is slowly tearing itself apart.
With the unanimous consent of the other EU nations.
So, like, probably not at that point.
If we choose that option we also lose thousands of jobs, the london financial centre. I doubt we'll have the 300 million spare that people want to go to the NHS.
Japan, joining with no Euro attached to it....they would do exceptionally well.
Bobnob
Member
by who's numbers?
GamerMax73
Member
I can't give a rat's arse what our American cousins want to cheer. As a Brit I think Europe is severed best long term by closer political union.
Why does political and economic union = loss of cultural identity? It doesn't, that's small minded thinking. We can and should celebrate our cultural differences while at the same time working together to improve everyone's life's.
The current EU problem is not cultural or language disparity. It's economic disparity. And now we're acting like the spoilt rich kid who doesn't want to share he's toys with his poor neighbours. Only now, that's economically backfiring as the pound and FTSE 250 do a Tom Daley impression.
Huh? ONS of course.
This is why we need an effective opposition. There needs to be someone to highlight what the EU does for us, the poor EU alternative made by Bojo, and also critique the current government for failing to look after the North with commitments to pump funding into deprived areas.
^ wishful thinking.
GamerMax73
Member
Kinda - as you say, greater federal/fiscal ties can be a good thing
It's too soon for statistics. But I've heard of many people, directly and indirectly, having job offers rescinded and even being let go. Companies haven't started to hire more, that's for sure.
Bobnob
Member
Well I haven't worked this week zero hours n all that(should of done better at school),my misses is probably going to work 30 hrs over the weekend or whenever.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
FPTP alone will make sure that never happens.
Labour might be destroyed though, especially at this rate.
Now you've said this, I just feel sorry for you. I don't even feel angry you voted leave. You are going to get so fucked over it's going to be brutal.
Of course there will be. But the contents of the deal will range from far shitter than what we have now, to slightly shitter than what we have now.
The EU has zero incentive to give us a better deal, and massive incentives to give us a worse deal.
Their response to Switzerland has been along the lines of "don't you fucking dare" and "if you do, we will fuck you with tariffs and trade embargoes".
Switzerland's government have sensibly decided to simply ignore their idiot population so far, we can only hope the same is true in the UK.
jufonuk
not tag worthy
EU wants 'closest links' with UK after Brexit says Cameron
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36656753
Norway deal and it looks like EU speak for get your fucking act together and we will talk properly and get it sorted .
Cameron Still trying to play the migration card.
I got a. Bizarre feeling that EU are dragging out the talks to let us get in shape. So we don't implode and to stabilise the economy.
Could the EU demanding the triggering of article 50 be pushed back some time so as not to give us a hard out but a slower less dramatic exit? So as not to collapse or cause miss migration out?
Despite this we will still have intelligence to share (ironic isn't it that word) as well as other assets
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36656753
Norway deal and it looks like EU speak for get your fucking act together and we will talk properly and get it sorted .
Cameron Still trying to play the migration card.
I got a. Bizarre feeling that EU are dragging out the talks to let us get in shape. So we don't implode and to stabilise the economy.
Could the EU demanding the triggering of article 50 be pushed back some time so as not to give us a hard out but a slower less dramatic exit? So as not to collapse or cause miss migration out?
Despite this we will still have intelligence to share (ironic isn't it that word) as well as other assets
Please tell me neither of you voted Tory last year. You should be bitching at your MP every week about being on a zero hour contract.
But also please tell me you didn't vote leave because of that...
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