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The Wonderful 101: Kamiya "focus on fun, not length..." [Update: Inaba comments]

Why not both?

All the classic action games as far back as thirty-some-odd years ago are classic precisely because they focused on being as potent as possible. Focusing on length seems to usually be a mistake, yet many modern games today do just that, much to their detriment, and that's without doing anything new but mining the past for game ideas and execution. I'd say his direction is probably for the best.
 

VanWinkle

Member
Very disappointing. It's not like I care MORE about length of the game than how fun it is, but you need to have enough content to justify a retail price. I want to feel like I got my money's worth.

Maybe it will have a lower price of entry like $29.99 or something. That would make it easier to decide if I want to get it.
 
Very disappointing. It's not like I care MORE about length of the game than how fun it is, but you need to have enough content to justify a retail price. I want to feel like I got my money's worth.

Maybe it will have a lower price of entry like $29.99 or something. That would make it easier to decide if I want to get it.

I killed Rising in two days, and even then, I felt it was worth the 60 I got it for.

Considering it's Plat, you'll probably have a shit ton of stuff to unlock
 
It always amuses me that the people who typically complain about a P* games length are normally the same people who have trouble beating even the default difficulties.
 

Daingurse

Member
I killed Rising in two days, and even then, I felt it was worth the 60 I got it for.

Considering it's Plat, you'll probably have a shit ton of stuff to unlock

That doesn't matter if you don't feel compelled to even do that extra content in the first place. Playing through a game on a harder difficulty is something I rarely do, the only exceptions are games I love. I'd rather be playing a different game than doing the same content again, only harder.

Unlocks are basically the same, unless I feel VERY compelled to get said unlock(Super Sonic, that's worth trudging through shit, for example). Normally though? Not compelling enough for me to even bother.

Edit:EatChildren below me makes excellent points. I have always struggled with the action genre because of this, I either: eat the retail price, rent the game, or wait for a price drop. I enjoy action games, but rarely feel compelled to play thru them again, any time soon after completion of the story mode.
 

Beth Cyra

Member
In the past, I probably would have bitched about this. However now adays I'm really digging being able to play a game and have it done in a session or two, so all this does is really make me want the game more.
 
Have you done research on this or something? How would you know that?
I can read.

The point is a P* game is built from the ground up to be replayed on several difficultes. If you are playing it right you will still clock in way more hours in a P* game than a typical AAA franchise bar multiplayer.

That extra content that would extend the life of the game? its in the upper difficultes/optional. Bayonetta for example, is a totally different game in infinate climax mode. Lets not forget the Alhehim portals and the lost chapter.


No one gives COD, Battlefield or Halo shit about the lengths of the campaign because the real game is multiplayer. Same thing applies here
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Assuming too much at this point is unwise, Kamiya rolls with the troll.

However, if it's anything like Platinum's best games, the focus will be on replayability and unlocks. It reminds me of the Vanquish situation (though Vanquish did suffer from not having unlockables as Bayonetta or Rising): on paper 6 hours sounds short. In practice Vanquish is a 3rd person bullet hell shooter for all practical intents, and doesn't feel short when you're actually playing through it.
 

EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Very disappointing. It's not like I care MORE about length of the game than how fun it is, but you need to have enough content to justify a retail price. I want to feel like I got my money's worth.

Maybe it will have a lower price of entry like $29.99 or something. That would make it easier to decide if I want to get it.

Is a single playthrough game length the only metric of monetary value for you? What if, hypothetically, The Wonderful 101 draws parallels to Bayonetta in game design? As in, the combat system is deceptively deep, and the game designed as a whole to throw the player in tightly constructed, fast paced, highly varied encounters. And then, based on a multitude of unlockables, you're encouraged to play through the experience again, master your skills, master new equipment, and discover different ways to conquer your foes?

I ask this because the action brawler genre is generally very much like this: short, highly replayable. And they don't require less work than any other title three or four times as long. These are games where the development time of design, testing, and polish is spent on second-to-second gameplay, where every moment is as meticulously and brilliantly constructed as possible.

Value is relative of course, so I can totally appreciate people who just prefer longer games to feel they've got their money's worth. But I also think this genre is a rough one to criticise when it comes to length. Kind of like a fighting game, to a certain extent. Most of those have single player options that can be breezed through in one or two sittings. But people stick around for the unlockables, the multiplayer, and mastering the very tightly designed combat system. That's where the game length is. Not in a single player adventure, but the mastering of mechanics.
 
More like "Content Tourist Outrage: Round 118"

"content tourist"...never heard that one, what an excellent term.

A game can afford to be "short" if it's mechanically complex and/or challenging. The time spent playing comes from exploring and mastering the underlying systems and from overcoming difficult obstacles. To put the start-to-finish length of this type of game up against games comprised primarily of fluff isn't really a fair comparison.
 
if it's 60$ it's a ripoff.

you want fun > lenght? a playthrough of Final Fight cost you 0.25$, 60$ buys you 240 playthroughs, that's fuckin value, not this.
 

Broach

Banned
Platinum Games takes complaints too seriously. So what if those "kids" are saying that they won't buy Revengeance cuz it's 5 hours. Just let them be. You know your audience.
 
Quality over quantity for me for games for sure, so its good news. I understand how it can be worrying for a lot of potential buyers though.

I never finish games these days unless they are quite short :(
 

Birathen

Member
I have 1000h+ in Dark souls and still going, anything less and full price is a ripoff. A short game with replayability value can get you pretty far. Hoping that's the case here.
 

Roto13

Member
if it's 60$ it's a ripoff.

you want fun > lenght? a playthrough of Final Fight cost you 0.25$, 60$ buys you 240 playthroughs, that's fuckin value, not this.

You can play The Wonderful 101 240 times if you want. And it's probably longer than Final Fight, so it's a much better value.
 

.la1n

Member
I am okay with this, my most replayed games this generation are Metal Gear Rising and Bayonetta, the former of which is a very short game but easily the most fun I have had with a game in as long as I can remember.
 

Pistolero

Member
Not a problem at all if the title offers some replay value. I remember that outside of RPG and adventure games, most products during the 16-bits era had ridiculously short campaigns, which wasn't reason enough to discard their fun factor.
 

gryz

Banned
with all the comments in here I wonder why people even bother making games at all. you don't deserve good games.
 
What would you give The Wonderful 101 on a 1-10 scale? Considering you've played it, of course.

i have no idea what this is, so i'll let it slide.

You can play The Wonderful 101 240 times if you want. And it's probably longer than Final Fight, so it's a much better value.

wtf? no one gonna finish it 240 times, like no one finished a Platinum game 240 times. do you know anyone who did it?

i used Final Fight for a reason, since i finished it at least once a week for 7 or 8 years straight. you do the math.
 
Hopefully Nintendo does some advertising for this game and doesn't send it to die.

It would benefit from commercials on Cartoon Network and Nickelodeon.
 

Neff

Member
I finish almost every game I buy in days. So what?

He'll be glad to know that I replay them, a lot, and I think with this statement he's merely preemptively deflating the game length controversy briefly suffered by MGR. I must have beaten that about 6 times now, and Bayonetta despite its 10-15hr game is one of the most replayable games ever made.

Bring it.

Is a single playthrough game length the only metric of monetary value for you? What if, hypothetically, The Wonderful 101 draws parallels to Bayonetta in game design? As in, the combat system is deceptively deep, and the game designed as a whole to throw the player in tightly constructed, fast paced, highly varied encounters. And then, based on a multitude of unlockables, you're encouraged to play through the experience again, master your skills, master new equipment, and discover different ways to conquer your foes?

I ask this because the action brawler genre is generally very much like this: short, highly replayable. And they don't require less work than any other title three or four times as long. These are games where the development time of design, testing, and polish is spent on second-to-second gameplay, where every moment is as meticulously and brilliantly constructed as possible.

Value is relative of course, so I can totally appreciate people who just prefer longer games to feel they've got their money's worth. But I also think this genre is a rough one to criticise when it comes to length. Kind of like a fighting game, to a certain extent. Most of those have single player options that can be breezed through in one or two sittings. But people stick around for the unlockables, the multiplayer, and mastering the very tightly designed combat system. That's where the game length is. Not in a single player adventure, but the mastering of mechanics.

This should be on a shiny plaque somewhere.
 
I said before that the only thing that could potentially stop this game from greatness was if it was short but I appreciate his honesty(watch the game be 20 hours long) and I still couldn't pass it up unless it's mediocre quality and nothing in the videos so far tells me it will be.

I hope it has unlockables as cool as Viewtiful Joe's, never got to play as them :[
 

Roto13

Member
i have no idea what this is, so i'll let it slide.



wtf? no one gonna finish it 240 times, like no one finished a Platinum game 240 times. do you know anyone who did it?

i used Final Fight for a reason, since i finished it at least once a week for 7 or 8 years straight. you do the math.

So you obviously know the value of a short game with high replayability. So I don't know why you're being so weird.
 

John Harker

Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
Makes me want it even more. Almost every game I've played the past couple years have felt way too long, too stuffed for the sake of hitting some bullet point in length size. Games need to be shorter (for me, at least), and not stretched with endless corridors and repetitiveness. I'm fine with 10-12 hours. I shoudn't be 18 hours into co-op on dead space 3 and not done yet!
 

VanWinkle

Member
Is a single playthrough game length the only metric of monetary value for you? What if, hypothetically, The Wonderful 101 draws parallels to Bayonetta in game design? As in, the combat system is deceptively deep, and the game designed as a whole to throw the player in tightly constructed, fast paced, highly varied encounters. And then, based on a multitude of unlockables, you're encouraged to play through the experience again, master your skills, master new equipment, and discover different ways to conquer your foes?

I ask this because the action brawler genre is generally very much like this: short, highly replayable. And they don't require less work than any other title three or four times as long. These are games where the development time of design, testing, and polish is spent on second-to-second gameplay, where every moment is as meticulously and brilliantly constructed as possible.

Value is relative of course, so I can totally appreciate people who just prefer longer games to feel they've got their money's worth. But I also think this genre is a rough one to criticise when it comes to length. Kind of like a fighting game, to a certain extent. Most of those have single player options that can be breezed through in one or two sittings. But people stick around for the unlockables, the multiplayer, and mastering the very tightly designed combat system. That's where the game length is. Not in a single player adventure, but the mastering of mechanics.

The length of a single playthrough certainly isn't my only metric. Like I said, I don't care more about how long the game is than how fun it is, but it's certainly important for me. I tend not to replay single player games often. It just doesn't interest me much, so for me I appreciate when a game's single player has substantial content, especially when the game doesn't have multiplayer. I don't buy action brawler games very often for this reason (I'm interested in MGR, but not until it drops heavily in price), so I was hoping this game would have a lot to do since it looks really neat.

with all the comments in here I wonder why people even bother making games at all. you don't deserve good games.

Lol, what? The vast majority seem to be totally fine with this and a few [like me] are just disappointed because we would like more content for a high retail price. You are clearly far too personally invested in this.
 
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