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[Bornstellar]

It's not a technological issue. For Titanfall 2 we rebuilt the Titans at a higher fidelity. Since we were doing 3rd person Titan embarks, their cockpits were built to look good in 3rd person, not to match seamlessly with first person.

That doesn't really answer why you guys decided to switch to 3rd person animations.

Personally, I'm not only bummed by that but by the fact that every Titan seems to share the same cockpit now and the HUD is no longer subject to the bounce off the chassis as it was in the first game. From a presentation standpoint, the TF1 approach is untouchable.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

That doesn't really answer why you guys decided you switch to 3rd person animations.

Personally, I'm not only bummed by that but by the fact that every Titan send to share the same cockpit now and the HUD is no longer subject to the bounce off the chassis as it was in the first game.

Well, they did 3rd person probably because they thought it looks cool as shit to have a Titan snatch you up and throw you inside their cockpit. And on paper, it is pretty awesome. In practice unfortunately it is just a bit too jarring and doesn't have that seamless immersion of 1.

 

[TheCanisDirus]

That doesn't really answer why you guys decided to switch to 3rd person animations.

Personally, I'm not only bummed by that but by the fact that every Titan send to share the same cockpit now and the HUD is no longer subject to the bounce off the chassis as it was in the first game. From a presentation standpoint, the TF1 approach is untouchable.

The 3rd person Titan transitions are such a step back IMHO. Such disorientation that TF1 didn't have. A constant 1st person view is so much better in every single way imaginable. One of my few disappointments with TF2. :'(

 

[Bornstellar]

Well, they did 3rd person probably because they thought it looks cool as shit to have a Titan snatch you up and throw you inside their cockpit. And on paper, it is pretty awesome. In practice unfortunately it is just a bit too jarring and doesn't have that seamless immersion of 1.

It is much cooler to see the same action of getting snatched by the Titan and sliding into the cockpit without a camera break and staying in first person. Same for executions. I think almost everyone agrees that it was better the way it was in TF1.

 

[TheCanisDirus]

It is much cooler to see the same action of getting snatched by the Titan and sliding into the cockpit without a camera break and staying in first person. Same for executions. I think almost everyone agrees that it was better the way it was in TF1.

Exactly. Though I do feel bad for Respawn as they're are probably a bunch of people who wanted/want 3rd person Titan transitions so it's likely a tough call on their part.

 

[Bornstellar]

Trailer for Ronin, https://twitter.com/Titanfallgame/status/772102195261104128

 

[Vitor711]

Exactly. Though I do feel bad for Respawn as they're are probably a bunch of people who wanted/want 3rd person Titan transitions so it's likely a tough call on their part.

I also vastly preferred the transitions in 1 - gave you a sense of scale for the Titan too. Really hope there's a mod for that on PC.

 

[KingV]

Trailer for Ronin, https://twitter.com/Titanfallgame/status/772102195261104128

The new Titans look pretty sick. I feel like they showcased the two most boring ones in the tech test

 

[Vincent Alexander]

I prefer the Titanfall entrance more in part 1 as well. I was just trying to get across that unlike some of their other changes in Titanfall 2, I'm not as confused by this one. I'm not a fan of it, and I would love them to death if they found the time to work back in 1st person. But at the end of the day, I think I understand what they were going for. And yeah---it's a cool idea.

 

[TheCanisDirus]

I prefer the Titanfall entrance more in part 1 as well. I was just trying to get across that unlike some of their other changes in Titanfall 2, I'm not as confused by this one. I'm not a fan of it, and I would love them to death if they found the time to work back in 1st person. But at the end of the day, I think I understand what they were going for. And yeah---it's a cool idea.

I personally have no idea why they would do it... aside from some art direction standpoint where aesthetics mattered more than gameplay for that transition. It just really disorients you.

 

[Diablohead]

Third person animations for entering a titan only really make sense if the camera stayed third person for titan combat, but it does not, the cut back to the players view after the animation is the worst part.

Thing about first person animations is that you get placed inside from your view, the hatch closes and suddenly you are in pitch black darkness, then the screens boot up and light up the cockpit like you are sitting in front of a few big tv's.

They lost all that charm making the animations third person.

 

[Argonomic]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

 

[TimeEffect]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

How is it tactically informative?

I actually love BF1 for this-- the animations boarding a vehicle are really neat and makes the vehicles feel like they are tangible things.

This would have been really cool in Titanfall, if we could embark in 1st person, and take a seat in the cockpit. Goodness, if you guys ever did VR, it would have been awesome.

Anywho, I think most people will get over it if you guys dont end up having the time or resources.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

What information are we getting that we weren't in first person?

 

[SmartWaffles]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

But even Battlefield 1 has a embark vehicle animation in 1st person now.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

Personally, immersion always wins out for me. Not to get too crazy, but thinking about it....immersion might be one of the most important parts of a game. Or any media, for that matter. Getting lost in a movie, a TV show, a game, or even a song---it has a lot of power.

You were a big proponent of the first person embarks. Good to know. So now I need to know how much money I need to throw at you to make this 1st person come back. I have a $20 in my wallet. I'm also really good at cleaning cars. Dishes. You name it.

 

[rackham]

You really have to explain how it's more informative. It should have been a decision you (as the player) decide. I mean, technically, playing with high mouse sensitivity is more informative you can view the battlefield faster but that doesn't make it right or necessary

 

[Gator86]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

Sure, why not. In the event that is the reasoning that decided it, why shouldn't players be forced to use discretion when going in and out of titans? I always thought that was part of the trade-off. You need to know when and where to enter/exit titans and have an idea of your surroundings.

 

[KingV]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

I feel like the first person embarks feel faster. Like, they may not be, but the lack of tactical awareness is understandable, because you can feel why it exists. Seeing it playing it out instead of living it play out makes it feel more annoying.

 

[Brakara]

But even Battlefield 1 has a embark vehicle animation in 1st person now.

Which is awesome.

And I think I'd rather have instant than some jarring third person animation. If you're going to kill the immersion then at least make it fast.

 

[Nokterian]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

I want immersion not information..sorry but if battlefield 1 can do it witch make you feel to go to in a tank or a car even. Titanfall 1 did this great because i went in a big ass robot didn't matter on how it went it just worked, doing 3rd person breaks the immersion as a whole.

 

[Bornstellar]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

You say this like there's no chance you could offer 1p animations in TF2 despite the universal agreement that the 1p way was much better.

At the very least, the player should get the choice.

And I don't find the 3p embarks to really provide much more info than 1p embarks. Even then, I think it's more fair to have the player temporarily lose some awareness when entering a titan. Same with executions. There is absolutely 0 reason to do 3p executions.

 

[Kordelle]

So now they even removed the EA Access discount...

what went wrong at Respawn after the first game

 

[Bornstellar]

So now they even removed the EA Access discount...

what went wrong at Respawn after the first game

Titanfall and TF2 are not first party titles.

 

[Kordelle]

Titanfall and TF2 are not first party titles.

Yarny had it, that was no EA studio either.
And even Battlefront with PS marketing had it.

 

[Brakara]

Titanfall and TF2 are not first party titles.

Titanfall is in the vault. And TF2 had an EA Access discount (10%) until recently.

I guess this means it's not going to be playable early for EA Access members either. It's like they really don't want me to buy their game...

 

[E92 M3]

Phase Embark speeds up the 3rd person animation. I loved it in the tech test.

 

[spannicus]

Nvm

 

[Argonomic]

What information are we getting that we weren't in first person?

You can see who or what is around your Titan.

You get a view of the combat area you will be facing when you take control.

In first person you can see a bit of the combat area at first, so sometimes you catch something useful, but you're more zoomed in (because your eye is the camera).

Then you're climbing in and sitting in the cockpit, so your fov is even lower. Sometimes you can see something usable out the cockpit door as it closes.

I completely hear that you guys are saying that the gain in battlefield awareness is not worth the loss in immersion.

 

[Sou Da]

You can see who or what is around your Titan.

You get a view of the combat area you will be facing when you take control.

In first person you can see a bit of the combat area at first, so sometimes you catch something useful, but you're more zoomed in (because your eye is the camera).

Then you're climbing in and sitting in the cockpit, so your fov is even lower. Sometimes you can see something usable out the cockpit door as it closes.

I completely hear that you guys are saying that the gain in battlefield awareness is not worth the loss in immersion.

If you were allowed to actually manually pan the camera around when the third person moments happen then I'd probably agree with you a bit more.

 

[Diablohead]

I don't see why third person was added when you already had a bunch of first person stuff set up from the first game, guessing that all the new mechs needed new animations and the decision was to just go third person... for some reason.

I still stand on the ground that titanfall 2 has too many unrequired changes in it's design.

 

[RichiRamjag]

I was a big proponent of the first person embarks on the first game. Some wanted embarking to just be instant like in BF. I did a lot of the implementation (scripting/prototyping) work on them, so I'm kind of biased in favor of them. I regret that we didn't find a way to offer both.

In spite of all that, given the option I would choose the 3rd person embarks in multiplayer. As immersive as the 1st person embarks are, they're not as tactically informative. Eventually I want information over immersion.

Oh give me a break. I'm typically informed of the inside of whatever wall or mountain I glitch into during the animation.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

You can see who or what is around your Titan.

You get a view of the combat area you will be facing when you take control.

In first person you can see a bit of the combat area at first, so sometimes you catch something useful, but you're more zoomed in (because your eye is the camera).

Then you're climbing in and sitting in the cockpit, so your fov is even lower. Sometimes you can see something usable out the cockpit door as it closes.

I completely hear that you guys are saying that the gain in battlefield awareness is not worth the loss in immersion.

Probably has been said a billion times before, but I really appreciate your feedback, acknowledging us here and there, etc. I know you can't always respond...or do everything everyone hollers about. But at least acknowledging you hear us means a lot.

 

[rackham]

You can see who or what is around your Titan.

You get a view of the combat area you will be facing when you take control.

In first person you can see a bit of the combat area at first, so sometimes you catch something useful, but you're more zoomed in (because your eye is the camera).

Then you're climbing in and sitting in the cockpit, so your fov is even lower. Sometimes you can see something usable out the cockpit door as it closes.

I completely hear that you guys are saying that the gain in battlefield awareness is not worth the loss in immersion.

To be completely honest, you shouldn't be able to see anything other than what you see in first person since that is actually all your character sees.


So saying it's about seeing the battlefield when you enter the titan isn't a good reason at all. If people were confused about where enemies were when entering their titan, they should have been looking at their minimap like every other competent shooter.

With the way you guys highlight enemies in glowing colors and this third person embark, I'm just honestly not sure what you were intending.

edit: to continue what Vincent Alexander said above me, I also appreciate talking to you guys. I'm sure it can feel like you're being attacked sometimes when people question every comma you write but I hope everyone at Respawn who responding to this stuff realizes that the annoyance and passion is coming from a good place.

 

[spannicus]

I don't see why third person was added when you already had a bunch of first person stuff set up from the first game, guessing that all the new mechs needed new animations and the decision was to just go third person... for some reason.

I still stand on the ground that titanfall 2 has too many unrequired changes in it's design.

Im thinking the same. In titanfall 1 i was aware of what was going on around me before i entered my Titan. This was never a problem for me plus i also had a shield to cover my ass while i got my bearings.

 

[Bsigg12]

If you don't know what's going on around you as you enter your Titan that should be on you. Making a change to add "tactical awareness" when there are no other instances of that happening seems backwards. What a strange decision.

 

[Applesauce]

A 3rd person animation would have really sucked the joy out of moments like this even against AI. You get a little disoriented at first but to me that adds to the chaos of the moment, which is a good thing imo.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

Just played some more Battlefield 1. Enjoyable enough, but the more I play it the more I just want to play Titanfall 2.

 

[Bornstellar]

Oh give me a break. I'm typically informed of the inside of whatever wall or mountain I glitch into during the animation.

This did happen to me on numerous occasions. Same for executions.

 

[erotic grandpa]

Yeah, while the 3rd person embankments and melee executions make for great trailers (and probably show off that cosmetic DLC ), I'd happily trade whatever momentary awareness those may offer for total first person immersion.

I melee killed my first doomed Titan playing the first game yesterday (still new, still learning!), and seeing my Titan rip the Pilot out of his Titan and crush him was something else. Haven't had it happen to me on the receiving end of things, but I can only imagine.

Cutting to third person just takes a lot of bite out of moments like that.

Anyway, to echo everyone else, thank you for the transparency and for wading through these fairly hostile waters. I still have high hopes for the sequel, but if you can work in some adjustments down the line, it'd be appreciated!

 

[wrongway]

assorted third-person stuff

I disagree, I think the new system is just disorienting. The sudden cut to the third-person camera doesn't line up with either your pilot or your mech. The camera is always canted off at some oddball angle, and if you dropped your mech near a structure, you could just end up staring at the inside of a wall. I found myself having to stare at the minimap every time I got into my mech so I could actually get myself turned in the proper direction as my screens came up. If I watched the actual animations play out, I'd end up derping around taking free hits like a moron until I regained my spatial awareness. The original's seamless first-person system never left me disoriented, never left me feeling like I was missing information. I already knew what was around my titan when I ran up to it, and there was never any disconnect in orientation. If I were given the option in TF2, I'd pick first-person and never look back.

 

[Calderc]

All I wanna do is play Titanfall 2. Even going back to Titanfall feels like your missing a limb with no grappling hook.

Please bring the tech test back until launch. I beg you Respawn. You have the power.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

You can see who or what is around your Titan.

You get a view of the combat area you will be facing when you take control.

In first person you can see a bit of the combat area at first, so sometimes you catch something useful, but you're more zoomed in (because your eye is the camera).

Then you're climbing in and sitting in the cockpit, so your fov is even lower. Sometimes you can see something usable out the cockpit door as it closes.

I completely hear that you guys are saying that the gain in battlefield awareness is not worth the loss in immersion.

I kiiiiind of understand the thinking here? But during my time in the tech test I never found this to be the case. In the end, once you're locked in to the animation of getting into your Titan, you're locked in. It doesn't really change what you can and can't do about your surroundings. Personally, I already know more often than not what's going on around me at the time I call in my Titan anyway so when I call it in, my eyes are purely fixated on the really jarring third person switch, not anything else.

In first person, all I can see is what the camera will show, so I'm far more likely to potentially see an enemy right in front of me given that's wha the camera will show.

But again, that's just me I guess. To me, the third person switch is far from the worst problem in the game.

 

[E92 M3]

All I wanna do is play Titanfall 2. Even going back to Titanfall feels like your missing a limb with no grappling hook.

Please bring the tech test back until launch. I beg you Respawn. You have the power.

I am feeling the thirst, too.

 

[Poster#1]

But even Battlefield 1 has a embark vehicle animation in 1st person now.

That's all what needs to be said really.

 

[spannicus]

You dont even see the Titans ripping out the pilots anymore. The first game had a ton of attention to detail. TF2 seems to have cut a few corners since we're getting a campaign.

 

[Chronospherics]

What information are we getting that we weren't in first person?

It increases your field of view while keeping your camera's direction consistent.

I know people are pretty set on first person animations here, but c'mon, surely you can see why a third person perspective actually provides a lot more information than first.

It shows you if anyone is around your titan directly, while retaining the camera perspective in front of you, therefore giving you more awareness of what's going to be directly in front of the Titan, once the screens turn on. That's quite a bit of extra information.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

It increases your field of view while keeping your camera's direction consistent.

I know people are pretty set on first person animations here, but c'mon, surely you can see why a third person perspective actually provides a lot more information than first.

It shows you if anyone is around your titan directly, while retaining the camera perspective in front of you, therefore giving you more awareness of what's going to be directly in front of the Titan, once the screens turn on. That's quite a bit of extra information.

I suppose, but the camera jumping to 3rd person is jarring enough that it takes me a moment to get my head straight before I can even process the information I'm now getting in 3rd person. Though I don't want to exaggerate, and jarring might be too strong a word. In the end, I completely understand it's purpose. I just don't feel like it quite nailed it.

 

[GravyButt]

Titanfall is in the vault. And TF2 had an EA Access discount (10%) until recently.

I guess this means it's not going to be playable early for EA Access members either. It's like they really don't want me to buy their game...

Hmm weird I preordered about a month ago and luckily got the discount. Sort of bummed about not getting early access. Any reason for this that we know of?!

 

[excaliburps]

I kiiiiind of understand the thinking here? But during my time in the tech test I never found this to be the case. In the end, once you're locked in to the animation of getting into your Titan, you're locked in. It doesn't really change what you can and can't do about your surroundings. Personally, I already know more often than not what's going on around me at the time I call in my Titan anyway so when I call it in, my eyes are purely fixated on the really jarring third person switch, not anything else.

In first person, all I can see is what the camera will show, so I'm far more likely to potentially see an enemy right in front of me given that's wha the camera will show.

But again, that's just me I guess. To me, the third person switch is far from the worst problem in the game.

Yep, it's not the biggest thing. Some here act like it is though. I mean, I get both sides, but if you're not playing a game just based on this, that's kinda extreme (not you, just saying out loud).

I am feeling the thirst, too.

Same. I played Black Ops 3 and funnily enough, found it slow. Can you imagine that?! I master prestiged Black Ops 3 and found it too fast at times and now I find it slow.

Just played some more Battlefield 1. Enjoyable enough, but the more I play it the more I just want to play Titanfall 2.

Same here. They both scratch different itches, but the clunky and slow movement from BF1, really makes me miss running fast, sliding, hooking myself up, etc.

If Respawn nails the progression system and whatnot (which I hope they will), I can see more people staying with it. Like it or not, that whole "carrot on a stick" thing works.

Out of curiosity's sake. Say, Respawn announces a TDM with AI (if not outright Attrition) mode and then shows a fly-by of a few more "wallrun" friendly maps, would on the fence people be satisfied? Or are there more and bigger issues they need to address that's logistically plausible to implement before the game releases?