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[manueldelalas]

Did you expect the Vita to have a UMD drive?

Would have been nice for people having a PSP with UMDs I guess, like the GBA port on the DS. Necessary? no, welcome? hell yeah!

 

[Huff]

You can play (almost) every GB game on a GBC.
You can play (almost) every GB and GBC game on a GBA.
You can play (almost) every GBA game on a DS.
You can play (almost) every DS game on a 3DS.

almost play?

?

 

[Michan]

No you aren't. You keep your UMD while buying a digital license (that you didn't have before) for a reduced price. You're paying a price to own two "copies" of a game.

Perhaps you should be correcting everybody in this thread. Even the title contains the word. You know what is meant by it.

Right...and the Vita does that.

There are two types of PSP games:

1. Games that are pressed on UMD discs.

2. Games that are sold as digital downloads.

The Vita is not backward compatible with category 1, because it lacks a UMD drive.

The Vita is backward compatible with category 2.

If you are angry that the Vita isn't fully backward compatible with PSP (since category 1 doesn't work), then fine. But to claim that it doesn't have some level of backward compatibility is flat-out false, since category 2 does work.

I wonder what percentage of PSP's games were sold by PSN over retail. Because, especially considering the success of the PSP Go, I really can't imagine it being in the double digits.

It wouldn't be difficult for Sony to create a simple way to connect your PSP to your Vita, system installing with a sumcheck that way. They've already proved they can run PSP titles. Nintendo did something similar with system transfer from DS to 3DS.

 

[H_Prestige]

almost play? Also, lol PSP go (although it's probably the best handheld ever made IMO, still trying to find one on the cheap to hack it to the infinite)


Now, that's what I call thinking. Congratulations (let's see how Sony try to stop you)

.

Err, why would Sony try to stop you from buying something from PSN? The above poster isn't conning them. It's no different than me buying FFVII on PSN and then selling my original CDs.

 

[manueldelalas]

?

Stealth edit from Duckroll, he missed the word "play" (or I missed the word, I can't tell with stealth edits)

 

[androvsky]

Yup, this is the real strange thing happening. Why can't someone play run the God Hand DVD on a non-BC ps3? I can't think of any technical reason, other than the memory card issue (which I still don't understand how that works because the game itself must be programmed to save to memory cards 1/2, and not Sony's new ps2 save system right?)

I haven't played any of the PS2 Classics yet (I already own all the titles I've wanted so far), but the memory card issue sounds like the game still thinks it's saving to regular memory cards (hence the 8MB card x 2 file size), it's just the emulator puts the saves in a different spot. If one could trick the emulator into reading a disc, I'm sure it'd work just fine.

 

[duckroll]

Stealth edit from Duckroll, he missed the word "play" (or I missed the word, I can't tell with stealth edits)

I didn't edit anything, wtf.

 

[manueldelalas]

I didn't edit anything, wtf.

I missed the word then, sorry (to explain the context). Go on, nothing to see here.

 

[UncleSporky]

EDIT: whoops

 

[androvsky]

It wouldn't be difficult for Sony to create a simple way to connect your PSP to your Vita, system installing with a sumcheck that way. They've already proved they can run PSP titles. Nintendo did something similar with system transfer from DS to 3DS.

It wouldn't be difficult for anyone with a hacked PSP to copy every title they've ever bothered to download to a Vita, you mean. Like I said to duckroll, if simple checksums prevented piracy, the PSP wouldn't have any piracy.

 

[Lance Bone Path]

What's the point of talking about what Nintendo would have done if they were making a Vita?

Nintendo probably couldn't make anything like the Vita without either major sacrifices to B/C or to a reasonable price.

 

[test_account]

Would have been nice for people having a PSP with UMDs I guess, like the GBA port on the DS. Necessary? no, welcome? hell yeah!

It could be nice to have indeed, but it would increase the pricetag and it would also have to be thicker in design. I wouldnt take a higher pricetag and a thicker design just to get a UMD drive in the PS Vita, especially when i have a PSP. But did you expect the PS Vita to have a UMD drive when you first heard about the Vita? If you didnt, then i wonder how you expected full PSP BC

 

[rainking187]

Yeah, I'm not gonna pay $10 per game for stuff I already own. I guess the price is in case people borrow UMDs or sell the games after they get the DD version, but it kinds of screws over people that aren't planning to do either of those things.

 

[Omikaru]

Now, that's what I call thinking. Congratulations (let's see how Sony try to stop you)

.

Are you mocking me?

 

[UncleSporky]

I can just see Agent X arguing in favor of a 3DS without DS game support.

WRONG it's TOTALLY backward compatible, there are TWO TYPES OF DS GAMES: the physical ones, and DSiware! So look, the 3DS is backward compatible! I don't know wtf you all are complaining about.

Now that, thehypocrite, is a straw man.

 

[Curufinwe]

No you aren't. You keep your UMD while buying a digital license (that you didn't have before) for a reduced price. You're paying a price to own two "copies" of a game.

Yup, it was just another false claim by Michan to add to the list.

 

[Michan]

Why do we get this crusade for a dead optical format nobody liked, but nobody really cared about emulated PS2 games on PSN? My Slim is perfectly capable of reading (and authenticating) PS2 discs, and we know PS2 Classics are emulated.

Perhaps you don't remember, but there was outrage when Sony announced removal of BC from PS3. Fortunately, it was pretty far into its lifetime and many people already had a PS3 that supported their PS2 library.

However, there was very high demand for 60GB original PS3s (hardware BC). Their selling prices on eBay were getting outrageous a while after they left the market. Before returning to Europe from N.A., I sold my 60GB for more than its original retail price, when other units were widely available for much less.

 

[H_Prestige]

I haven't played any of the PS2 Classics yet (I already own all the titles I've wanted so far), but the memory card issue sounds like the game still thinks it's saving to regular memory cards (hence the 8MB card x 2 file size), it's just the emulator puts the saves in a different spot. If one could trick the emulator into reading a disc, I'm sure it'd work just fine.

If the emulator puts the save in a different spot, I wonder why it can't do the same for ps2 save files already on a ps2 virtual memory card.

 

[manueldelalas]

Are you mocking me?

No I'm not. It's the best option there is, honestly.

 

[Huff]

Yeah, I'm not gonna pay $10 per game for stuff I already own. I guess the price is in case people borrow UMDs or sell the games after they get the DD version, but it kinds of screws over people that aren't planning to do either of those things.

You're not repaying, you are buying another copy.

 

[mr_chun]

I'd be in if it was like 99 cents a pop. But these prices are way too high just to be able to play games I already own on a different console.

 

[Michan]

Yup, it was just another false claim my Michan to add to the list.

Name the other false claims. "Transfer" is included in the very title of this thread and seems to have become the label for this service. There must be about 20 people on the first page who used the term.

 

[manueldelalas]

You're not repaying, you are buying another copy.

Let me get this right.

You pay ten, you download the game, and the UMD game is still usable and you can resell it?

Then it's not as bad, you could even make some money doing this...

 

[UncleSporky]

You're not repaying, you are buying another copy.

He said he wouldn't pay for anything he already owned.

Buying another copy = paying for something you already own. You've already got one copy, you don't need another.

Let me get this right.

You pay ten, you download the game, and the UMD game is still usable and you can resell it?

Then it's not as bad, you could even make some money doing this...

This is true, but buyers beware. The used PSP market is going to be a minefield of titles that won't be registerable on the Vita. In fact I'd expect prices to drop quite a bit.

 

[H_Prestige]

Name the other false claims. "Transfer" is included in the very title of this thread and seems to have become the label for this service. There must be about 20 people on the first page who used the term.

And they would be incorrectly describing it just like you. This service is called UMD Passport. If you can find the word "transfer" in any official Sony press release, I'll gladly eat crow

 

[test_account]

Let me get this right.

You pay ten, you download the game, and the UMD game is still usable and you can resell it?

Then it's not as bad, you could even make some money doing this...

Correct. It is no tranfering going on. It is just that you get a discount on the PSP game if you register the UMD I think that the PSP games will also be sold in the PSP store for full price for those who dont have the UMD.

 

[H_Prestige]

Let me get this right.

You pay ten, you download the game, and the UMD game is still usable and you can resell it?

Then it's not as bad, you could even make some money doing this...

Yes. Did you think the UMD would explode after registering it?

 

[androvsky]

Perhaps you don't remember, but there was outrage when Sony announced removal of BC from PS3. Fortunately, it was pretty far into its lifetime and many people already had a PS3 that supported their PS2 library.

However, there was very high demand for 60GB original PS3s (hardware BC). Their selling prices on eBay were getting outrageous a while after they left the market. Before returning to Europe from N.A., I sold my 60GB for more than its original retail price, when other units were widely available for much less.

I also happen to have a 60GB PS3, went YLOD about 8 months ago. Fortunately my reflow managed to keep it alive this long, but I'd rather just let the new systems play PS2 games.

So why the crusade for the least liked optical format ever? So far the only alternatives I've seen are Sony sponsored mass piracy, or sending in your UMDs for download codes (which would still involve a fee and you wouldn't get to keep your disc).

If the emulator puts the save in a different spot, I wonder why it can't do the same for ps2 save files already on a ps2 virtual memory card.

I'm guessing it's because they're afraid of hacked PS2 saves possibly causing an entry for cracks; I get the impression the PS3 shuts down some of the OS and security systems during PS2 emulation, which is why the controllers have to resync even with the PSN downloads.

 

[manueldelalas]

Correct. It is no tranfering going on. It is just that you get a discount on the PSP game if you register the UMD I think that the PSP games will also be sold in the PSP store for full price for those who dont have the UMD.

Woa! then that's awesome news, will buy a used PSP and "used" games (pretty sure everyone not a pirate buys and rip their games, so most used games should be in awesome condition) and play all the games I've missed =). Old UMDs will sell for 10 dollars or less.

Yes. Did you think the UMD would explode after registering it?

I thought they'd do something to try and make them unusable.

 

[Quixzlizx]

The most amusing part of this BC argument is that the Vita is BC with PSP games.

 

[Huff]

He said he wouldn't pay for anything he already owned.

But he doesn't own the game in a version that can be played on the vita. He doesn't have to buy it.

Buying another copy = paying for something you already own. You've already got one copy, you don't need another.

Sure. I didn't need to buy Mario RPG on VC again, but I did. No one needs anything. I did it because I wanted to. And my snes doesn't work that great anymore.

 

[UncleSporky]

The most amusing part of this BC argument is that the Vita is BC with PSP games.

The most amusing part of this statement is that the Vita is not BC with the most common type of PSP game in circulation.

 

[Michan]

It wouldn't be difficult for anyone with a hacked PSP to copy every title they've ever bothered to download to a Vita, you mean. Like I said to duckroll, if simple checksums prevented piracy, the PSP wouldn't have any piracy.

The PSP has piracy for other reasons. Like iPhone, Vita is an always-wireless system. A simple ping to a Sony-owned server goes an awful long way to prevent piracy.

And they would be incorrectly describing it just like you. This service is called UMD Passport. If you can find the word "transfer" in any official Sony press release, I'll gladly eat crow

Then perhaps you should request a title change to avoid getting confused.

 

[Quixzlizx]

The most amusing part of this statement is that the Vita is not BC with the most common type of PSP game in circulation.

It's not BC with a form of media that everyone hated/mocked Sony for using.

 

[UncleSporky]

It's not BC with a form of media that everyone hated/mocked Sony for using.

Yet it was tolerated, and now everyone hates/mocks Sony for not allowing them a more elegant solution to continue playing it on newer systems. Y'know, the same sort of BC that everyone else has been doing for years.

Truly a company worthy of our praise and purchasing dollars.

 

[test_account]

Woa! then that's awesome news, will buy a used PSP and "used" games (pretty sure everyone not a pirate buys and rip their games, so most used games should be in awesome condition) and play all the games I've missed =). Old UMDs will sell for 10 dollars or less.

The only downside is that not every game is supported (at least not yet). The game need to excist in digital download format for it to work. And some games might be more expencive than others. But i'm under the impression that most of them will be somewhere around $5 to $10.

 

[Michan]

I also happen to have a 60GB PS3, went YLOD about 8 months ago. Fortunately my reflow managed to keep it alive this long, but I'd rather just let the new systems play PS2 games.

So why the crusade for the least liked optical format ever? So far the only alternatives I've seen are Sony sponsored mass piracy, or sending in your UMDs for download codes (which would still involve a fee and you wouldn't get to keep your disc).

Too bad about your 60GB. I've personally moved on from my PS2 collection, but it was a blessing when I had only a handful of PS3 games.

But there is no crusade for UMD. Moving parts are always a bad choice for a portable. The crusade is for entitlement, and being able to play your existing software the go without having to drag two game systems around.

 

[Huff]

Yet it was tolerated, and now everyone hates/mocks Sony for not allowing them a more elegant solution to continue playing it on newer systems. Y'know, the same sort of BC that everyone else has been doing for years.

Truly a company worthy of our praise and purchasing dollars.

news to me

id say most people are indifferent

 

[UncleSporky]

new to me

id say most people are indifferent

You're absolutely right, Quixzlizx was wrong in his statement that everyone mocked/hated UMD.

 

[Quixzlizx]

Yet it was tolerated, and now everyone hates/mocks Sony for not allowing them a more elegant solution to continue playing it on newer systems. Y'know, the same sort of BC that everyone else has been doing for years.

Truly a company worthy of our praise and purchasing dollars.

I'd rather have no UMD drive than have one, so the lack of UMD drive makes Sony more likely to get my purchasing dollars. This UMD Passport program is also a net positive, even though I don't plan on ever using it, since it's better than nothing. I'm not going to praise a corporation for offering me a product, though.

 

[kunonabi]

They aren't punishing anyone. If you don't want to pay, you can just play your game on PSP. They aren't destroying your UMD, or your PSP.



We don't know what Square Enix games will be supported as of yet.

But if that's such a problem for you why didn't you buy a PSP?

Too expensive for the limited amount of titles I want.

 

[H_Prestige]

The PSP has piracy for other reasons. Like iPhone, Vita is an always-wireless system. A simple ping to a Sony-owned server goes an awful long way to prevent piracy.


Then perhaps you should request a title change to avoid getting confused.

I'm not the one who's confused. If you realized this isn't a transfer program but a discount program, you probably wouldn't be outraged anymore. Unless PSone classics costing money also outrages you.

 

[Shig]

No you aren't. You keep your UMD while buying a digital license (that you didn't have before) for a reduced price. You're paying a price to own two "copies" of a game.

Yeah, that's a fair summary.

Ideally, Sony would have headed off this shitstorm a bit by throwing download codes in with UMDs late in the PSP's life, to kinda bridge the transition. I'm sure many people would have used that code and resold the UMD, of course, but good luck finding any solution that doesn't end up with those sorts finding some way to capitalize.

The effect of folks being scared off of UMD purchases because they strongly suspected they'd have to rebuy those games down the line if they ever got a Vita was probably as bad or worse than the theoretical fallout of people buying copies and then flipping them immediately. And the latter would have paid dividends in consumer goodwill.

 

[Huff]

You're absolutely right, Quixzlizx was wrong in his statement that everyone mocked/hated UMD.

Or you all are both right and

it was (will be) tolerated

Edit.

I guess you missed all of the people on GAF complaining about it being proprietary, battery-sucking, and slow-loading (all of which are legitimate grievances, which is why I'm glad it's gone now).

I was speaking of the BC issue. Not the format.

 

[Curufinwe]

Name the other false claims.

A DVD player is not backwards compatible with VHS tapes. A CD player is not backwards compatible with vinyl or audio tape. Duckroll already pointed this out, and yet you continue to try and twist the definition of backwards compatibility until it loses all meaning, and ignore any system that doesn't have BC such as the DSi.

All other entertainment mediums are backwards compatible.

 

[Quixzlizx]

news to me

id say most people are indifferent

I guess you missed all of the people on GAF complaining about it being proprietary, battery-sucking, and slow-loading (all of which are legitimate grievances, which is why I'm glad it's gone now).

 

[Curufinwe]

I'm not the one who's confused. If you realized this isn't a transfer program but a discount program, you probably wouldn't be outraged anymore. Unless PSone classics costing money also outrages you.

He would also need to be outraged that Sony and MS don't give us a digital license for all our disc based games that we could download and install to any machine we're signed into, including their next gen consoles once they are released.

 

[demigod]

You're absolutely right, Quixzlizx was wrong in his statement that everyone mocked/hated UMD.

And he's right. UMD is slow as fuck. Why would you play it on UMD if you own the copy when you can rip it and play it on memory stick for faster load time and less battery consumption? I'm betting you don't even own a PSP.

 

[UncleSporky]

I'd rather have no UMD drive than have one, so the lack of UMD drive makes Sony more likely to get my purchasing dollars. This UMD Passport program is also a net positive, even though I don't plan on ever using it, since it's better than nothing. I'm not going to praise a corporation for offering me a product, though.

It would probably be more accurate to say you'd rather have no UMD drive if having one would increase the price of the system and would mean that new games would still be using that format.

If it was present in the way that the GBA slot remained on the DS (that is, it's only there for BC) and didn't increase the overall cost of the system from $250, surely you'd consider that superior? You'd be able to buy and play UMD games for much cheaper than on PSN, and there'd be none of this BC mess for the general public to sort out that might make them reconsider their purchase.

It's in your best interest for others to be happy, after all - the more hardware sales, the more software support.

I guess you missed all of the people on GAF complaining about it being proprietary, battery-sucking, and slow-loading (all of which are legitimate grievances, which is why I'm glad it's gone now).

The only grievance of these three that will have truly been eliminated on Vita is the slow-loading. While the cards themselves won't suck extra battery, the battery life is functionally no different from the PSP's.

 

[Huff]

It would probably be more accurate to say you'd rather have no UMD drive if having one would increase the price of the system and would mean that new games would still be using that format.

If it was present in the way that the GBA slot remained on the DS (that is, it's only there for BC) and didn't increase the overall cost of the system from $250, surely you'd consider that superior? You'd be able to buy and play UMD games for much cheaper than on PSN, and there'd be none of this BC mess for the general public to sort out that might make them reconsider their purchase.

It's in your best interest for others to be happy, after all - the more hardware sales, the more software support.


The only grievance of these three that will have truly been eliminated on Vita is the slow-loading. While the cards themselves won't suck extra battery, the battery life is functionally no different from the PSP's.

It be bigger, louder, heavier, and have an even worse battery life. No I would not want a UMD drive on the vita.