The only thing I think they should have copied from CoD are the personal challenges, like getting so many cumaltive kills with a specific weapon, landing a flamesaw in the grill of a jugg, killing it. Things like that as alternatives to get experience. Because, now I think people are only being dicks with talon just to grind XP until they unlock everything.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Twisted Metal |OT| Don't Eat. Don't Sleep. Play
- Thread starter Pranay
- Start date
Coordinate. No one is getting better by running away. Actually do something first instead of running to the devs crying about balance. "All my teammates were too lazy to learn how to deal with Talon so it must be unbalanced." The game is only a week old. You should be complaining about your teammates instead.
Riposte
Member
Not sure I would call it a problem, well it more of a problem at a certain level of play, but teamwork doesn't naturally occur in "pubs". Like at least in Call of Duty players can easily hold other players in check making the map/enemy positions a knowable thing to use for flanking. (Of course this has been less the case in recent game of that series because of how fucked up spawns have been lol.) In addition to that getting rammed by teammates (Diablo Pass ugh) and having them eat up your missiles makes them feel like a thorn in your side (I could see how it would be a matter of balance though, to help out an outnumbered driver). You also end up with moments where you have three other guys surrounding you and instead of it being an all out of brawl they are all going after you. Those combination attacks sound awesome, but also completely out of reach. Team Hunted at least has something built into the game to direct players into a central (as does Nuke). I still end up playing a loner in all of these.
So I like DM more and since about Halo I've always hated those modes since they felt too random. I actually feel like there is quite a bit of strategy to be learned in poaching kills. Unfortunately I think Talon might get away with more shit in DM and Juggernaut just racks up a high K/A/D just by being able to stay alive so long in the middle of the chaos with so many outlet for points.
So I like DM more and since about Halo I've always hated those modes since they felt too random. I actually feel like there is quite a bit of strategy to be learned in poaching kills. Unfortunately I think Talon might get away with more shit in DM and Juggernaut just racks up a high K/A/D just by being able to stay alive so long in the middle of the chaos with so many outlet for points.
Bumblebeetuna
Gold Member
Like 1 person in every 5 games has/uses a mic and no one really coordinates in this game. Plus Talon is pretty broken. I can see why people would want to leave an unbalanced game so that they can go some where and enjoy playing. Wouldn't someone better learn how to attack Talon players in a room where they aren't heavily outnumbered and getting stomped?
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
I strongly dislike Outlaw. Why does he get an automatic turrret that swivels and can spam blood missiles simply by pressing a button while Roadkill has to manually charge up for blood missiles which takes forever and even then he has to aim them.
Tokubetsu
Member
The blood missiles is only on his alt, and the alt can only do 180. Regular special swivels 360 though, and fires grenades instead of missiles but yea it can be rough. Special itself isn't TOO powerful, but it's great for finishing people off that are running away. Great finisher.
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
180 is still better than 0 like Roadkill. Don't understand why they decided to make it that much better than Roadkill's special. Is Roadkill's very weak armor and barely faster movement suppose to make up for it?
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
Reading comprehension? I never complained about balance or Talon. All I'm saying is if my teammates back out of the server I'm going to do the same. Explain to me how I'm supposed to coordinate something when my teammates have left?
ElRenoRaven
Member
Yup. That's where his special shines. The alt is great but you do have to keep them in front of you. The few times I've been able to get a game in I find people are starting to get wise to the alt. When they see it's the missiles they'll drive at you and past you forcing you to turn. So it does take some thought to use. The regular is great for when they're running or you have someone coming up from behind you. It's a lot weaker though then the alt. So I have no problem with outlaw. Ironically he's my favorite right now since I haven't gotten much time to play to unlock Sweet Tooth. So many don't bother using his alt because it doesn't do it 360 like the regular and they really miss out. It's great for longer ranges. He's normally my favorite along with Axel.
Speaking of Axel. I do still feel he is overpowered somewhat though from my playtime with him. I still firmly believe that the war wheel special should not freeze someone into place. I've gotten pretty damn good with it. You freeze them then bam over top and back up and they're done. It's very nasty. If they could still move at least they could get away from me backing up over them. Hell I've even gotten a few one hit kills with his special on a freshly spawned vehicle with it. Not talking about a reaper either. I'm talking roadkill, Kamikaze, etc.
That part was meant for Tokubetsu, who said Talon should have been cut from mp and started this discussion.
And I dunno, for teams to really be effective you should have mics, otherwise team games are more like free for alls with friendlies. Teams certainly won't be effective if they run from challenges rather than learning from them. The game needs a patch so you can choose teams in ranked mode for more effective teambuilding.
Perhaps Talon will need to be nerfed. It's just way too early to judge and if everyone just runs away it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.
In the demo, which had no unlocks, I could get my ass kicked with Talon. Felt pretty balanced there. People need to learn to target Talon, block sniper lasers and unlock turbo dash/darkside/reaper and use stalker/swarmers on it. Being in the air can be Talon's biggest advantage and disadvantage.
ElRenoRaven
Member
Hmm. I wonder if that's due to the amount of people playing have dropped off a ton. After all it seemed to run smoothly back when the game wasn't out in the public. If so then that's not a good thing. Course who knows. Maybe they're getting it fixed. Think I'll be giving it a shot tonight.
Helscream
Banned
Concerning recent comments about Outlaw, Roadkill, Talon, Axel.
Outlaw's alt special is good period and has a 180 FOV. So as long as you can tap R2 while driving simultaneously you will end up doing decent damage.
Now compared to Roadkill moves too slow for the amount of health/armor the vehicle has. And considering the small FOV you have to use the alt special. You really need the extra speed to stay on target. The only advantage it has over Outlaw's special is that once you charge it up you can focus entirely on driving while the Special just spams away.
Talon I think should have a less FOV when aiming with mega gun bullets. To be able to auto-lock with them on compared to ground vehicles having to be much more accurate to make the mega gun bullets connect. Also Talon should not be able to constantly use the special. Once the 100 rounds is spent. It should returns back to 3rd person view and you have to reselect the special again to fire. I say this because when using a vehicle like Darkside who has a turret. Once the ammo is dried up. It returns back to normal special and the Turret retracts. I have to wait another 3 seconds for that Turret to pop back up to use the alt special again. With a game as face paced as this, those 3 seconds can make a big difference.
Axel and his special is way too damn strong. I don't know how or what causes is it, but there have been times when I was killed in one hit with the Warwheel while using Death Warrant at 90%. I just find it silly that a vehicle that agile can do that much damage with a Ram. Then add the "freeze" animation on top of that it can get really frustrating.
Out of the entire game Talon/Axel are the only two vehicles that piss me off at times. Because like with Roadkill alt special is damage over time that takes nonstop focus and accuracy to do maximum damage. Then someone like Axel can just give me a love tap for 90 points of damage. Darkside's ram only goes up to like 78 and that takes a lot more effort and accuracy on the end of the player because of the sluggish handling of Darkside.
Outlaw's alt special is good period and has a 180 FOV. So as long as you can tap R2 while driving simultaneously you will end up doing decent damage.
Now compared to Roadkill moves too slow for the amount of health/armor the vehicle has. And considering the small FOV you have to use the alt special. You really need the extra speed to stay on target. The only advantage it has over Outlaw's special is that once you charge it up you can focus entirely on driving while the Special just spams away.
Talon I think should have a less FOV when aiming with mega gun bullets. To be able to auto-lock with them on compared to ground vehicles having to be much more accurate to make the mega gun bullets connect. Also Talon should not be able to constantly use the special. Once the 100 rounds is spent. It should returns back to 3rd person view and you have to reselect the special again to fire. I say this because when using a vehicle like Darkside who has a turret. Once the ammo is dried up. It returns back to normal special and the Turret retracts. I have to wait another 3 seconds for that Turret to pop back up to use the alt special again. With a game as face paced as this, those 3 seconds can make a big difference.
Axel and his special is way too damn strong. I don't know how or what causes is it, but there have been times when I was killed in one hit with the Warwheel while using Death Warrant at 90%. I just find it silly that a vehicle that agile can do that much damage with a Ram. Then add the "freeze" animation on top of that it can get really frustrating.
Out of the entire game Talon/Axel are the only two vehicles that piss me off at times. Because like with Roadkill alt special is damage over time that takes nonstop focus and accuracy to do maximum damage. Then someone like Axel can just give me a love tap for 90 points of damage. Darkside's ram only goes up to like 78 and that takes a lot more effort and accuracy on the end of the player because of the sluggish handling of Darkside.
NeverFailPlan
Neo Member
Do we know how the skill rating is calculated?
Talon might be a little too good with the mega guns, yeah, but if it didn't have more autoaim than ground vehicles it'd be impossible to hit anything with them. The big difference between Talon's turret and Darkside's is that Talon's turret greatly reduces its FOV, making it highly susceptible to side and back attacks and sniper shots (hard to see the laser in turret mode). When Talon use its special is the best time to attack it because it loses FOV and mobility. Another thing that sort of nerfs the turret is how wonky its auto aim is. Sometimes it will switch targets for no reason, or absolutely refuse to target an enemy for no reason. And the tail can swing in and throw you off target.
So far I'd say fall damage from freeze missiles is the best solution if Talon needs to be nerfed. A full fall will take out half its HP.
I think a fun thing to do in team games like you said would be to pick up a teammate using Roadkill and make Roadkill actually effective. It'd be a rain of death from above with blood missiles and tri-gunner bullets.
The most damage I've ever done with Axel in 1 hit was 90 and that was with a war wheel combo. He has pretty low armor and hitting with his special is not really easy; fast cars can easily out maneuver him and bigger cars can ram him to death/shield. If you ram someone too fast he will pop out of his special after one hit, and if you go too slow you do no damage. He has this tendency to get stuck leaning backwards and moving slowly.
Tokubetsu
Member
Aww man, really? I like Meat Wagon but was hoping I'd enjoy Shadow more.
I hear lobbing his casket bombs into Iron Maiden is pretty effective.
Liberty4all
Banned
Shadow is awesome. He has amazing speed and manouverability ... His specials damage is time based ... The longer its moving before hitting somebody or detonation the more damage it does. I regularly get between 60 - 90 dmg with it.
quinntendopower
Banned
i was playing yesterday on twisted for a bit, and didn't even know what was going on when I got head shot!
the A/I is relentless with those, i died 10 times or more by them lol.
the A/I is relentless with those, i died 10 times or more by them lol.
http://community.us.playstation.com/thread/4669326?tstart=0
This was a forum post on the official twisted metal forums about various estimated values. These illuminate the difference between Death warrant, Roadkill, and Outlaw. If it is to be trusted, Roadkill's blood missiles do more damage overall in addition to the handsfree firing.
Vehicle ---- ---- Special 1- Special 2 - Energy Regen --Special Regen
Death Warrant ---- 33 -------- 64 -------- Normal --------- 19 sec
Roadkill ------------ 55 -------- 97 -------- Normal --------- 39 sec
Outlaw-------------- 45 -------- 70 -------- Normal --------- 30 sec
When you got killed in an instant by Axel, perhaps that was caused by him using the shotgun sidearm simultaneously.
I feel like Axel is just like Talon. He's great in chaotic car pile ups where they can slip in unnoticed and really case some havoc. But when its one on one and players know how to deal with Axel, he is actually quite exposed. A shield or two to block the freeze and keeping your distance renders axel effectively neutered.
On another note, roadkill kinda sucks in comparison to death warrant. He has less health. His secondary 3rd-level special is harder to trigger in combat situations than DW's 2nd-level, even though it does more damage. It also regenerates at half the speed. So in terms of damage over time, DW does more damage than Roadkill with their secondary specials. Roadkill's slower special regen rate, also makes him suffer more from shield blocking his special, as well as being frozen amid using his special. The only thing that roadkill gets in compromise, other than a more damaging special are his mines, which are very situational in terms of effective use.
Come at me bro. 0 damage is probably because they sheilded. Shadow is perfect.
Revolutionary
Member
I honestly think it's bugged. There were several times where I broke line of sight and they still got a headshot on me a second or two later. They have Spectre sniper rifles or some shit.
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
I don't use Shadow myself but my clanmate does and he's pretty beastly with it. The secondary special allows you to lob the coffin a crazy distance. Though he must think I'm stupid sometimes. Driving around in the open and I see a giant purple aurora, hmm I wonder if I should drive into that.
Another thing to note, Reaper's secondary special is also really good. Another clanmate of mine got up on top of the cliffs on Diablo Pass and would shoot the RPG into the road, then I'd fool someone into chasing me and I'd lead him right there, then BAM 80 points of damage and I whip around and finish him off.
Is there a reason my old and new custom skins aren't showing up. Last night I made a couple new skins. One downloaded to the console and then when I tried to refresh to get my other new one all of my custom skins, some from a few days ago, disaappeared. All night they wouldn't return. I tried again a few minutes ago, and still nothing.
Is there a time frame where it takes it all down temporarily as it updates in the background? How do I get that shit back?
Is there a time frame where it takes it all down temporarily as it updates in the background? How do I get that shit back?
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
It's a bug with the system. What I found works for me is when you are using the skin tool make sure you are signed off of PSN, and when you are using PSN make sure you are signed off of the skin tool. I did that and all my skins came back.
GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
I'm torn about getting this game. I really like Twisted Metal 1, 2, and Black, but as someone who isn't especially interested in online the pared down single player stuff sounds like a drag. Did they ever explain why there are only a handful of characters in story mode? That stuff used to be at the core of replaying the game in single player.
Was going to be a download, multiplayer only game. Sony wanted a retail release, so they needed a singleplayer.
Tokubetsu
Member
Just had my first laggy game. The two talon players took 1st and 2nd but I still came out positive. The one juggernaut player was pretty bad too. I think he placed high only because no one knew to avoid him but still. He got one kill on me and that's because I was low on health, fighting off a meat wagon and he blind sided me with a ram. Still managed to ruin his shit a couple of times =). Had like six assists against the Talon players. I always run out of missiles when they have a sliver of health left and then someone steals the kill.
Really hurting MP wise. Spent about 20 minutes trying to get into a game last night. Failed to connect with all but two, but ended up getting kicked from them for "poor connection related reasons."
TM JP NeoGaf clan needs more luv.
Also can't bring myself to play anyone but Kamikaze and Reaper. Everyone else just seems too slow. Was nice playing with Sweet Tooth and seeing how much damage he could take - just man, dat lack of speed. ;.;
TM JP NeoGaf clan needs more luv.
Also can't bring myself to play anyone but Kamikaze and Reaper. Everyone else just seems too slow. Was nice playing with Sweet Tooth and seeing how much damage he could take - just man, dat lack of speed. ;.;
Tried that and still nothing. :c
CreateNowSleepLater
Member
Anyone get the Bradly guide? How is it for MP?
Found a strange glitch while testing a new skin in training mode: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0GGpBIkM9E
BurningNad
Member
That has happened to me too... even when not using custom skins. Kind of annoying. =\
Nope. It's random, small distances get me either 20 or 50 points of damage. I've never got above 60 even though I've used the coffin at a very very long distance before. If it was 0 wouldn't the red X come up?
It'll explode on health semi's too. I've seen the 0 dam. pop up, but didn't know what caused it. Point blank is 20 damage. I've seen it do 95, but only fired from reverse. I've seen 90 other times. Sometimes it does seem random, but overall I trust the oscillating coffin. I trust it to avenge all those that have died from the contests brought on by Calypso.
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
Finally getting MVP consistently as Roadkill. not an up-close combat fighter so the rocket side arm helps a ton. Biggest worry on the battlefield is running into a Meat Wagon who has saved up 3 of the darn near impossible to dodge (without using the environment) specials that do.
TimeEffect
Member
What fucking bullshit that this game's unlocks are balanced.
Fuck Talon.
Spent a game where two Talons allowed players to launch a nuke, while they camp in the fucking air and use their special to instantly destroy nukes.
That is bullshit. You cant play against something like that when they get this lazy, cheap tactic handed to them while the rest of the team has to suffer and use this shit aim system to lock on to the right opponent in the air and knock them down, while other players try to dry hump the living life out of them, and god forbid the aiming decides to stick to the opponent I want and go freaking nuts.
Talon players are not balanced, and they love to pussy out and get the fuck out when they know they will lose a battle. Of course, they have access to parts of the map that I don't, and this area (Sunsprings) just happens to spawn TWO healths for them. If my freeze even manages to land and not get screwed over by their view of the field, then hope to god that it doesn't land them in an area of the map you cant access, like a rooftop or hilltop. And of course, with their maneuverability, they can easily shield, freeze, and stay right above you while your finicking to get an aim on them.
Coordinating an effective strategy with a bunch of morons who wont even help you when you are launching is painful and 10x harder than the tactic they are given. In the event that a Talon player is at least on my team as well as theirs, I have to hope that they are smart enough to see what's happening and stop these guys, but I can't do shit until I get to unlock Talon.
I know I'm bitching, but the game of Nuke I played was beyond frustrating. The tactic of Talon players letting you launch a nuke while they camp god knows where on the map is nonsense. I have to guide missiles, while their special destroys the hell out of a Nuke from the best vantage point in the game.
I'm not going back to Nuke, especially with Talon players in it as these sort of gameplays will dominate. Really hope that was a one time thing, I see great combat with ground vehicles and honest, reflex and strategy based planning and killing, but a Talon player's skill level is set real low, and an actual good Talon player, or worse, two (as it was my case) will fuck you up like nothing else.
Fuck Talon.
Spent a game where two Talons allowed players to launch a nuke, while they camp in the fucking air and use their special to instantly destroy nukes.
That is bullshit. You cant play against something like that when they get this lazy, cheap tactic handed to them while the rest of the team has to suffer and use this shit aim system to lock on to the right opponent in the air and knock them down, while other players try to dry hump the living life out of them, and god forbid the aiming decides to stick to the opponent I want and go freaking nuts.
Talon players are not balanced, and they love to pussy out and get the fuck out when they know they will lose a battle. Of course, they have access to parts of the map that I don't, and this area (Sunsprings) just happens to spawn TWO healths for them. If my freeze even manages to land and not get screwed over by their view of the field, then hope to god that it doesn't land them in an area of the map you cant access, like a rooftop or hilltop. And of course, with their maneuverability, they can easily shield, freeze, and stay right above you while your finicking to get an aim on them.
Coordinating an effective strategy with a bunch of morons who wont even help you when you are launching is painful and 10x harder than the tactic they are given. In the event that a Talon player is at least on my team as well as theirs, I have to hope that they are smart enough to see what's happening and stop these guys, but I can't do shit until I get to unlock Talon.
I know I'm bitching, but the game of Nuke I played was beyond frustrating. The tactic of Talon players letting you launch a nuke while they camp god knows where on the map is nonsense. I have to guide missiles, while their special destroys the hell out of a Nuke from the best vantage point in the game.
I'm not going back to Nuke, especially with Talon players in it as these sort of gameplays will dominate. Really hope that was a one time thing, I see great combat with ground vehicles and honest, reflex and strategy based planning and killing, but a Talon player's skill level is set real low, and an actual good Talon player, or worse, two (as it was my case) will fuck you up like nothing else.
Seventy_X_Seven
Member
You only get 2 or 3 Talons per game of Nuke. What I do when I notice the other team is using Talons is I abandon the objective and hunt them down, sacrificing any points I could of gained that inning in return for easier points in later innings.