Barack Lesnar
Banned
Gemüsepizza;44529530 said:
This poor guy got hammered in the replies after his post. No wonder he doesn't post anymore
Edit- looked in his history and seems he does still post once in a while
-
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Wii U has 2GB of DDR3 RAM, [Up: RAM 43% slower than 360/PS3 RAM]
- Thread starter Horse Armour
- Start date
This poor guy got hammered in the replies after his post. No wonder he doesn't post anymore
Edit- looked in his history and seems he does still post once in a while
Damn. He was pretty much right on the money.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I was getting ready to say.
Arkam is still a poster. I was also one of the few that told people to back off. He's one of the only reasons we know the featureset of the GPU is a shader model and a half more advanced than the PS3/360 GPU's. He's also the reason we know the capability is similar to their GPU's. I'm guessing he meant triangle and pixel crunching.
Not exactly tech savvy (which he himself admits) but he happened to be in the right company at the right time with great memory retention. So we salute you and your service Arkam.
Fighting for reality instead of popularity.
And that is not an indictment on others. Just pointed truth.
shinra-bansho
Member
It wasn't just arkam that incurred the wrath of WUST groupthink. Those threads were plagued by undue hostility to anyone or anything that was remotely negative.
Father_Brain
Banned
True, which is (part of) why we no longer have general-purpose platform-specific megathreads. I think that was for the best.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Does anybody know the bandwidth speed of the ram in the PlayStation 2 and XBox?
Trevelyan9999
Banned
So this is basically just Nintendo magic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=y9uYCU8jFiU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OHUwDShrD4&playnext=1&list=PL7982B2177A8DA0D2&feature=results_video
These were running on pre-alpha dev kits. What's the big surprise that ports of current gen games that were made for older hardware have some performance issues on Wii U? Every time a performance hiccup occurs on a Wii U it seems that the hardware is to blame and not the developers. Wasn't it just confirmed that Wii U can run Unreal Engine 4 and Unity Engine 4?
Slower RAM and lower clock CPU be damned, those demos are more than enough convincing to me and it was confirmed that the Wii U dev kits had several enhancements since that time and not the opposite. If Gearbox and Epic are impressed with the Wii U and have already confirmed that it's more powerful than current gen hardware and even considered "next gen" due to it being modern technology, why did everyone all of a sudden jump off the cliff with these ports that in no way indicate what the Wii U is actually capable of when a game is developed for the system itself?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=y9uYCU8jFiU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OHUwDShrD4&playnext=1&list=PL7982B2177A8DA0D2&feature=results_video
These were running on pre-alpha dev kits. What's the big surprise that ports of current gen games that were made for older hardware have some performance issues on Wii U? Every time a performance hiccup occurs on a Wii U it seems that the hardware is to blame and not the developers. Wasn't it just confirmed that Wii U can run Unreal Engine 4 and Unity Engine 4?
Slower RAM and lower clock CPU be damned, those demos are more than enough convincing to me and it was confirmed that the Wii U dev kits had several enhancements since that time and not the opposite. If Gearbox and Epic are impressed with the Wii U and have already confirmed that it's more powerful than current gen hardware and even considered "next gen" due to it being modern technology, why did everyone all of a sudden jump off the cliff with these ports that in no way indicate what the Wii U is actually capable of when a game is developed for the system itself?
Barack Lesnar
Banned
^ UE4 can run on cell phones. The UE4 the way we think of it (the tech demos we've seen) would be super downgraded for the Wii U, but it'll be still be able to 'run' it, just like cell phones can.
Uno Venova
Banned
I lurked that thread from time to time and yeah, pretty much.
Yeah its struggling with modern engines and has the worst versions of several games. Clearly it will ace the next gen engines.
You don't have to tell me.
Remember the Kotaku article calling it a "performance orphan"? Turns out it's going to be absolutely true.
I'd like to point out that the Wii U is rendering two scenes in the bird demo.
Flawed logic. If next-gen engines are built around the idea of the modern architecture (and if PS4/Nextbox share similar architectures as Wii U), then Wii U should have an easier time dealing with those ports than from PS360.
Those "modern engines" are actually old engines, designed for old hardware. It's absolutely possible, likely even, that Wii U performs better with next generation engines like UE4.
lol this again. What exactly is modern about Wii U aside from a GPU that is only "modern" in the sense that ATI doesn't make anything worse? Slow PPC processor and slow RAM?
What if Nintendo downgraded the specs in the final hardware?
Glorified G
Member
I don't think the 'modern architecture' of ms & sony next gen systems will consist of having slower ram than their predecessor's.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
UE3 and Anvil Next are not old engines by any stretch of the imagination. And UE4 still isn't confirmed for Wii U.
Hiro_Kunimi_80
Member
well..
technically all the demos shown during E3 2005 were running on playstation3 pre-alpha kit
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Nintendo designed it in during 2010-2011.
No, and they most likely never will (except for there being 2GB total). But this is what has been found in the machine, it doesn't need confirmation.
DonMigs85
Member
The problem is even on GameCube very few third parties really cared to push the hardware. Most of the good looking games were from Nintendo, Capcom, Factor 5 and Square (Crystal Chronicles was quite the looker). Most of the others were about on par or slightly better than PS2, some actually worse.
They never will.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
How was it found? Has it been reproduced?
Thunder Monkey
Banned
UE4 isn't confirmed for WiiU, but it is one of the supported platforms for it.
That probably means some 3rd party stripped away features until it could run on WiiU.
Hearing that it runs at anything close to featureset parity with the engine at large would be the shocking thing.
Could the reason for the slow main system ram be due to the architecture of the Wii U?
Given Nintendo and IBM have both said the Wii U has a large amount of eDRAM, could it not be that this memory pool is sufficient for developers when they need high bandwidth and low latency memory to feed the GPU and CPU?
If so would this not explain why the DD3 memory's bandwidth is lower then the Xbox 360 and PS3s.
It doesn't make sense to me that Nintendo would go for 4x the total system RAM + eDram, a more powerful and capable GPU, faster rom drive read speeds, and then gimp the entire system with piss poor memory bandwidth, CPU, ect etc. Not putting such an approach past Nintendo, but historically they've tended to be quite thorough and balanced in their console designs.
Given Nintendo and IBM have both said the Wii U has a large amount of eDRAM, could it not be that this memory pool is sufficient for developers when they need high bandwidth and low latency memory to feed the GPU and CPU?
If so would this not explain why the DD3 memory's bandwidth is lower then the Xbox 360 and PS3s.
It doesn't make sense to me that Nintendo would go for 4x the total system RAM + eDram, a more powerful and capable GPU, faster rom drive read speeds, and then gimp the entire system with piss poor memory bandwidth, CPU, ect etc. Not putting such an approach past Nintendo, but historically they've tended to be quite thorough and balanced in their console designs.
Man, I would hate to see someone try to port an Unreal engine 2 game on the Wii U, it'll run at 5 fps.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Little. It wouldn't have been an issue. They just didn't want to pay more.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Board complexity was probably a factor as well.
CoffeeJanitor
Member
Or maybe there are actual reasons behind the conclusions people are making.
The console was opened up and examined.
It's an absolute joke, all gen they cry about tech meaning nothing and yet the slightest bit of dissapointing hardware news sends them on hissy fits.
Honestly just what do those devs know...
No, it is not.
The engines we are using now are not that much different from what we will have next gen. This is not like PS2 to PS3, we are in the same rendering paradigm and it will stay like that for sometime.
Developers will be standardizing on 720p next gen. It's the most widely adopted HD video output out in the market.
It isn't only heat, you would also need 8 chips instead of 4 for 2GB of say GDDR5.
-> More complex motherboard -> Higher price not only for the faster RAM but for the whole design
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Could be because most of them never believed tech means nothing.
They always knew if they could have Pixar quality Nintendo 3D today for cheap they'd take it.
I don't think tech is that important. But it still has it's uses. Seeing tessellation used as intended for the first time is going to be interesting. As is the transition to deferred rendering and by extension truly realtime Global Illumination.
Are these technical boons necessary to create a beautiful videogame? Nope. You can still create beautiful software with 1998 era tech. But they are impressive. And in some ways could significantly improved development.
So you're saying it will potentially be easier?
edit: I'm just being a smartass with that last answer. You don't have to respond seriously D.
Well, game complexity also plays a role, obviously.
Kind of like running Wii games on a PC with a much more powerful CPU than the Wii. Let's not even get started on the GPU. It's just not optimized for the hardware.
Actually lherre all but confirmed that it now is. Obviously nothing official or concrete, and it may not matter all that much, but still.
Edit: Though thinking back, he was being very cryptic and I think maybe was misunderstood.
Edit 2: Ok I'm still fairly new here, why is his name showing in red?
TOAO_Cyrus
Member
The last two generations should have taught you that tech demos don't mean shit.
As for eDRAM making up for it, it might allow for decent AA and IQ but it wont help for games that make heavy use of textures like Skyrim and Rage.
Depends on how different the new hardware is from the hardware the old engines were designed for. Quite different in this case.
Father_Brain
Banned
How, exactly? Nearly all realtime tech demos I can recall have been matched and often exceeded by actual games.
Trevelyan9999
Banned
It's funny how people are freaking out about port performance when this was discussed at length and expected in the old Wii U speculation threads. Where's BG when you need him? lol
Ports from current gen games need "work" to run on the Wii U decently, just like a PC does. I have a decent PC running 2 GTX 460's 1GB GDDR5 in SLI on a i52500k overclocked to 4.5GHz and the frame rate still hiccups every now and then when playing the PC version of Black Ops........the Wii U is simply a newer architecture and when the developers learn it better and won't be porting games trying to make modified Xbox 360 code work on it, then we'll see what the system can do.
In regards to the Tech Demos, Nintendo has never "lied" about what they've shown graphically on past systems....in fact they've always surpassed what they've shown early on. The Wii U will be no different.
Ports from current gen games need "work" to run on the Wii U decently, just like a PC does. I have a decent PC running 2 GTX 460's 1GB GDDR5 in SLI on a i52500k overclocked to 4.5GHz and the frame rate still hiccups every now and then when playing the PC version of Black Ops........the Wii U is simply a newer architecture and when the developers learn it better and won't be porting games trying to make modified Xbox 360 code work on it, then we'll see what the system can do.
In regards to the Tech Demos, Nintendo has never "lied" about what they've shown graphically on past systems....in fact they've always surpassed what they've shown early on. The Wii U will be no different.
I agree. This gen actually seems to have been the most realistic in terms of tech demos.
Mutanthands
Member
About right now, I would love to know what John Carmack thinks about the WiiU. It would be illuminating. Wonder if he'll ever get hands on with a dev kit...
The madden and killzone demos have been reached?
Motorstorm tech demo was the biggest load of bull.
Not even CryEngine 3 could match that.