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WikiLeaks releases video of US Apache helicopter (now with added RPGs)
- Thread starter DogWelder
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The video is shocking only in that it got released. It's foolish to assume that the U.S. military hasn't killed thousands of innocents.
Jesus Killed Mohammed
4 Charged in Rape of 14 Year Old Iraqi (P.S. They murdered her whole family)
For the record, the U.S. military is not evil (although it has its fair share of crazies). War as a whole is evil. People who push war as a solution to problems are evil.
Jesus Killed Mohammed
4 Charged in Rape of 14 Year Old Iraqi (P.S. They murdered her whole family)
For the record, the U.S. military is not evil (although it has its fair share of crazies). War as a whole is evil. People who push war as a solution to problems are evil.
SimpleDesign
Member
The thing is, Americans in general don't give a fuck about stuff like this. It's at a point now where people will proudly stand up to defend the patriot act and torture.
It's fine to kill innocent people in the name of stopping the "terrorists" but God forbid we spend money helping to heal and educate our fellow citizens. Only then is government over stepping it's boundaries according to these sociopaths. If the private sector isn't making a profit it ain't worth doing.
It's fine to kill innocent people in the name of stopping the "terrorists" but God forbid we spend money helping to heal and educate our fellow citizens. Only then is government over stepping it's boundaries according to these sociopaths. If the private sector isn't making a profit it ain't worth doing.
BobTheFork
Member
Suddenly, I'm thinking this has the potential to be very crazy and dangerous. I'm assuming at some point, the government may attempt to physically stop them from doing this that is a shit-storm waiting to happen... unless something good is on TV tonight and then no one will notice or care.Zamorro said:
Sickboy007
Member
The Guardian said:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/05/wikileaks-us-army-iraq-attack
The Pentagon report:
http://file.wikileaks.org/file/us-intel-wikileaks.pdf
Dabookerman
Member
Wait, so none of the american news outlets are allowed to report this?
delleps said:
Hey, if the war was taking place in your country, and on your street, and God forbid your innocent family was killed by some soliders, would you still be saying "I mean yeah it sucks that people died...but hell, it's a war. People die?" don't be such a naive twat.
Dabookerman said:
more like afraid.
Enosh
Member
did you miss the whole convoy of vehicles in the video?Jayge said:
you think the helicopter and the convoy were both there just by chance?
hell they even had coms with each other, it's not unreasonable to assume that the helicopter crew was tasked with providing support for the convoy
iirc there is even chatter that the convoy is under fire and a group of men with what looks like RPGs and AKs looks a lot like a an ambush, especialy if one leans over the corner and looks in the direction from where the convoy came with what looks like an rpg
Dabookerman said:
http://www.seattlepi.com/national/1155ap_us_iraq_shooting.html
And if they're afraid, then they're letting freaking Seattle cut off their balls.
OriginalThinking
Member
daw840 said:
B, buu, buu but what? You seriously can't justify this? You are the kind of enabler who actually makes this kind of thing possible, y'know sort of shrugging your shoulders and accepting that nearly a dozen people died, but hey shit happens right? Wrong. The complete lack of verification on the ground or from any other source that these people were a threat and the fact that deadly force was authorised on the basis of somebody staring from a mile way and thinking that a camera was an rpg should raise questions about military protocol. But fire first, ask questions later right?
Wow. I feel sorry for the families of those journalists and those apache pilots who have to live with this for the rest of their lives. Thinking about it though I'm not sure I wouldn't have done the same thing under the same circumstances. There's no way I would have been able to tell those were cameras on that screen.
Well that much is obvious.daw840 said:
Make up your mind; were they hostiles "providing cover" for other completely unseen mystical invisible hostile soldiers killing other random U.S. soldiers, or was it a case of mistaken identities? You're contradicting yourself. Are you justifying the attack because they were potential hostiles or are you justifying it because the chopper gunner thought they were potential hostiles? And what does "but..." imply? But what? But that's what happens when a war is going on? But they shouldn't have been out in the street looking like arabs? But the soldiers "thought" they were hostiles so it's unfair to blame them because of their poor judgment? Where were you going with that?
It's always interesting to peruse these 'U.S. military just killed someone' threads and observe public opinion, which seems to vary depending on who is currently sitting in the White House.
Granted, I've only skimmed through 7 pages, but I haven't seen our commander in chief take the brunt of GAF's outrage up the tailpipe like his predecessor. :lol
Granted, I've only skimmed through 7 pages, but I haven't seen our commander in chief take the brunt of GAF's outrage up the tailpipe like his predecessor. :lol
Dabookerman
Member
Why the fuck would news outlets be afraid to post this kind of news?? Isn't that their job? It's not like America is some sort of fascist regime where posting news that make the government or military look bad will get you killed..
LegendofJoe
Member
Dabookerman said:
No, it's just that mainstream media in America, for the most part, is composed of a bunch of pussified twats.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
GreekWolf said:
It should be. The fact that nothing has changed in regards to the way the military operates and how information is shared simply proves it's the same shit from a different asshole.
http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/bmr9w/reddit_i_submitted_the_wikileaks_story_to_cnn/
Reddit, I submitted the WikiLeaks story to CNN iReport. Go comment and show the mainstream media that it's more important than Tiger Woods.
submitted 2 hours ago by ducttape36
[...]
ducttape36 [2 hours ago]
Holy shit, they took it down
Sickboy007
Member
GreekWolf said:
If you think hard enough maybe you could even understand why it so.
blame space
Banned
Considering this happened in 2007...GreekWolf said:
Appalling as fuck... =(Tntnnbltn said:
PjotrStroganov
Member
NOS.nl says that Dutch computer expert Rop Gonggrijp helped in decoding the video.
Dabookerman
Member
Josh7289 said:
Military should only ever be used as defence or helping people. That's what I thought they were there for.
For one they didn't know the apache was in the area so of course it wasn't in danger. And two it was troops in the area who had previously taken fire that were in possible danger. But yeah, disgraceful.pakkit said:
I will say it was not "concrete". And the van is certainly a grey area, but I'd say given the circumstances it was in the wrong place, wrong time. Given the options: van is some random civilian helping wounded (where you just unleashed hell), or given the circumstances, someone who knows the guys you just opened up on. If I were in their shoes I'd open up on the van too once I got the green light. But that's just me of course.Scipius said:
The van attack is not something you can take out of context. And if you don't like reality (an apache attack helicopter massacring a group of people, legitimately), eject.iamaustrian said:
To the people defending this i'd like to ask; how do you explain the leak to begin with?
Someone in the US military risked a lot to get this video out. Why would anyone take that risk if everything in the video was perfectly kosher?
To me the leak only makes sense if it was done because someone felt that these people were getting away with murder, and just could not stomach it. And he would have to be pretty sure about it as well. Maybe there are other explanations, but i just don't see them.
That's my take on it anyway. And when they ask for permission to shoot, the report they give about how armed they were, well it just does not match what i see in the video. I saw one AK and no RPG in that image. Would these guys have been given permission to shoot everyone if they had reported "we have 12 people here, one of them is carrying a rifle"?
Someone in the US military risked a lot to get this video out. Why would anyone take that risk if everything in the video was perfectly kosher?
To me the leak only makes sense if it was done because someone felt that these people were getting away with murder, and just could not stomach it. And he would have to be pretty sure about it as well. Maybe there are other explanations, but i just don't see them.
That's my take on it anyway. And when they ask for permission to shoot, the report they give about how armed they were, well it just does not match what i see in the video. I saw one AK and no RPG in that image. Would these guys have been given permission to shoot everyone if they had reported "we have 12 people here, one of them is carrying a rifle"?
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Humankind as a whole is evil.pakkit said:
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2010/tables/10s0295.pdf
US crime statistics per year - ~20,000 murders - 100,000 forcible rapes - 1,000,000 aggravated assaults.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Body_Count_project
There are roughly the same number of murders in the US per year as their are civilian deaths per year in a warzone from the Iraq conflict.
War isn't a special case, conflict exists everywhere in the world, and there are always people who are eager to kill, people who are indifferent to killing and people who are forced to kill to protect themselves and those they love.
The video is terrible, but the pilots/gunners of the helicopters thoughtthey were doing the right thing - they were trying to protect the troops on the ground.
LegendofJoe
Member
mello said:
Well both MSNBC and Fox News are ostensibly propaganda outlets in my mind so there's no reason for them to report on this because they'd be biting the hand that feeds them.
Dabookerman
Member
mello said:
So, what you're saying is. Don't trust american media?
Because many militaries exist out of self defense. Ever since the end of isolationism, the US has been an aggressor, but I understand that war is an inevitability and, thusly, the existence of a military is not an act of aggression or evil.Josh7289 said:
You can always use the "it could be worse" argument.poppabk said:
Also, it's worth noting that civilian deaths reported in warzones are almost always underestimated.
Dabookerman
Member
womfalcs3 said:
The internet.
Wilkommen.
PjotrStroganov
Member
dogmaan said:
Dude, it has been said before, it's not the heli the supposed rpg posed a threat to. An Apache is generally used to provide intel to and cover fire for ground personnel.
zerokoolpsx
Member
I still don't understand how they mistaken cameras for Ak-47's and RPG's. Seriously, damn.
OriginalThinking
Member
poppabk said:
Whilst laughing and generally acting in y'know the serious manner that the killing of multiple people deserves.
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