MilkyJoe
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It's a very grinding avatar, I won't lie.
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Xbox first-party is "critical" for Scorpio, says Spencer (Gamesindustry.biz)
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It's a very grinding avatar, I won't lie.
Samanosuke Akechi
Member
That's a lot of halos gears and forzas in three years Jesus lol Not much else there is be interested in either or even heard of.
Seems to be full price at both Amazon US and Amazon UK. Sea of Thieves has been a long term project for a big development studio, and as far as we are aware, it is their only major project. It is not small budget, or indie, even if it does end up releasing at a lower price point. After all, given Microsoft's desire to create games that are delivered as services over long periods, it's possible they plan to sell the game cheap and make money via microtransactions.
You can add an extra caveat to your list rules, I suppose, but chalking it off a list on the basis that it has a small budget seems patently absurd. The price you're seeing on some random marketplace doesn't actually tell you anything about the budget. This is a game that hasn't had a price, or release date announced.
MilkyJoe
Member
Well that original business plan went flying out the window days before it launched, so I imagine all that time and money was put elsewhere, on anything but games. Imagine if the kinect budget went into games for starters.
So You're suggesting people who owned X1 didn't buy for those reasons? I'd say it's simple as they didn't appeal to the Xbox Audience. Titanfall seemed to do well with all the circumstances you mentioned. Titanfall just appealed to the Xbox Audience.
Not saying the resolution stuff was the main reason those didn't do well, it was just amongst those.
My plan backfired. I thought everyone loved Gosling.
Let's start over as friends.
Damn son, that's cold.
MilkyJoe
Member
We do, but you make him look bad. Which I didn't think was possible.
Bruce Springsteen
Member
Sunset Overdrive was never going to be a commercial success with that art style, I'm a big fan of the game but I knew it was a niche before it even released
Night Angel
Member
When did 1P games become critical? I feel like I've heard this before, and yet there's still nothing to show for it.
How many more years do we get to trot out the "games take time" excuse? They've been in the console business for over a decade. This shouldn't be news to anyone, nor should it be something they're just now understanding.
They've been buying studios and either closing them without making a game or forcing them to work on old IPs (usually to the detriment of the old IP). Instead of fostering talent of their own, they've relied on throwing money at third party devs to create new XB games (which is good) or simply to keep games that already existed away from other platforms (I'm looking at you, ROTTR). It's obviously backfired given the current state of the market.
Are we to believe that Spencer had no authority until Mattrick was sacked? He's been in an influential position for years and yet MS Studios is in the worst shape it has ever been. Instead of games like HALO and GeoW being huge events and GOTY shoe-ins for me, I just don't care about them (which goes for a lot of gamers). What gives? As it is my XB1 was the worst console purchase I've made. It only exists to be a Netflix machine and "Xbox on" voice commands for my entertainment center (and I have a beefy gaming PC, soooo).
How many more years do we get to trot out the "games take time" excuse? They've been in the console business for over a decade. This shouldn't be news to anyone, nor should it be something they're just now understanding.
They've been buying studios and either closing them without making a game or forcing them to work on old IPs (usually to the detriment of the old IP). Instead of fostering talent of their own, they've relied on throwing money at third party devs to create new XB games (which is good) or simply to keep games that already existed away from other platforms (I'm looking at you, ROTTR). It's obviously backfired given the current state of the market.
Are we to believe that Spencer had no authority until Mattrick was sacked? He's been in an influential position for years and yet MS Studios is in the worst shape it has ever been. Instead of games like HALO and GeoW being huge events and GOTY shoe-ins for me, I just don't care about them (which goes for a lot of gamers). What gives? As it is my XB1 was the worst console purchase I've made. It only exists to be a Netflix machine and "Xbox on" voice commands for my entertainment center (and I have a beefy gaming PC, soooo).
killatopak
Member
One of the most successful 1st party games just launched a few weeks ago. Just imagine how the Switch sales would be without Zelda.
We can go back further. Why do you think og xbox got popular. It was Halo.
The goal posts keeps getting moved. When the argument that Microsoft has no exclusives is shattered then it changes to you shouldn't count Halo Forza and Gears because of x reason. OK, with that argument you shouldn't count Uncharted, Zelda, God of War, and other big Sony/Nintendo exclusives in their lists because of those same reasons.
While I agree Microsoft has work to do, this BS that they have no exclusives worth checking out needs to stop.
While I agree Microsoft has work to do, this BS that they have no exclusives worth checking out needs to stop.
Ms will be just fine because they get all the big third-party games and they sell very well to the Xbox audience. But if they want to be more then that just that they need to invest a tone of time, cash and energy.
The problem is that besides Spencer and a few other people I don't think the leadership at MS want to do that. The leadership at Sony want to fund games like the TLG, GR2, ect and they want to get niche Japanese games on their system.
The problem is that besides Spencer and a few other people I don't think the leadership at MS want to do that. The leadership at Sony want to fund games like the TLG, GR2, ect and they want to get niche Japanese games on their system.
Pathfinder
Member
I'm kind of getting sick of hearing this over and over from Phil and seeing no actual results, just cancelled games.
If he can't pull together this 1P thing with Scorpio, I'm likely to become a Sony-only guy. I'm tired of words without actions.
If he can't pull together this 1P thing with Scorpio, I'm likely to become a Sony-only guy. I'm tired of words without actions.
I do believe it's fair to make comparisons, without all of "the usuals" included.
Remove Halo, Gears, Forza, Uncharted, God of War, Zelda, and Mario.
It's completely fine to compare what's left after that.
MisterR
Member
For whatever reasons, as reflected in sales and decreasing hype Gears and Halo haven't keep the same level of interest that Uncharted, GOW and Zelda have. People are tired of them and Forza just releases too frequently.
ShadowkillXNA
Member
Halo/Gears/Forza hold virtually no appeal to gamers who arent xbox fans already. Thats one reason I got rid of my xbox one along with a lack of a variety of good exclusives coming down the pipe. Gears 4, Quantum Break and Scalebound were three games I had interest in at one point but my interest in Quantum Break and Gears 4 faded out, and Scalebound was canceled.
I was primarily an Xbox and Xbox 360 guy the last two generations but I am firmly converted over to Sony now thanks in large part to their excellent first party.
If Microsoft gets their first party act together it wont happen overnight. Look at where Guerilla and Naughty Dog were years ago and where they are now.
To be fair I think he has a leash on him right now. He has no where near the power that Yoshida has at sony.
Yes and no
No one is saying having sequels to established franchises is bad. What is bad is a over reliance on stale IPs while not even trying to establish new ones.
Uncharted more or less is being shelved after the stand alone is released while ND moves onto a new IP and TLoU2 afterwards
God of War is in an entirely different genre than the previous entries so the franchise fatigue should be gone
Yeah i think so aswell.
Hugh Swank
Member
You make a good point, but I certainly believe the mass negativity towards Xbox, especially in the media, certainly had an effect on Xbox console sales, which in turn affects game sales.
As for people who already owned an XB1, I do believe the negativity aimed at SSOD & QB did play a factor in their final decision whether to buy them or not, even if they initially had an interest in the games.
I think Titanfall appealed to people across all platforms. Even though it took some flak for the exclusive deal with Xbox, I don't remember it being bashed as heavily as SSOD & QB. I do remember a lot of port begging for TF and a lot of happy folks when TF2 was announced as multiplayer. Anyway, Just my thoughts, I don't necessarily disagree with you either.
You have to take into account the fact that franchises like Uncharted and Zelda had extremely long hiatus periods in-between their mainline entries. God of War is being developed from a completely different perspective now with a focus on storytelling. That simply doesn't happen with Halo and Forza. They play their franchises safe (which works for a lot of Xbox fans, but doesn't others). In addition, Uncharted has effectively ended from a Naughty Dog standpoint. What would the Microsoft IP lineup look like if these devs could pivot to another new IP franchise in-between entries? Give people time to miss Halo, Gears, Forza while cultivating a new pool of IP. That way, people wouldn't have the mindset of "oh great it's just another Halo."
Microsoft must've changed their plans. While retailers had it for the price mentioned by you for preorder for a year, they recently raised it to 70. Lucky you if you preordered before that.
If not, just wait a month after release and you'll get it for 30 again.
Agnostic Priest
Member
I'd love to see 343 and the coalition tackle a different IP before returning to their halo and gears. I'd like to see either of them take on perfect dark, as a first or third person stealth sci fi game. New IPs are great but I feel like MS would rather reboot an old franchise.
That does make sense, and would explain why the games that were in the works before the changes haven't been able to get sequels.. Gears and Minecraft probably also ate that budget.
Problem is they now have a lot of ground to make up, while Sony just seems to be churning out quality games every month.
The thing is 343 and The Coalition were build from the ground up in to halo and gears factories, there was no intention for them to develop new ips at least for the time being.
And now that backfired, if you see the exclusives from microsoft that is posted on the top of this page from 14 exclusives that are already out nine are from the gears/halo/forza franchises, if you are a fan of those games great Xbox is for you but if you have no interest at all and want variety the what can you buy?
Jaguar Victory
Member
Halo 5 packs must be selling well enough if they still put 1 mil in the Halo championship pool.
Salty Hippo
Member
If that's the case then please shut the fuck up? Continuing to run your mouth with vague promises to spread false hope on gullible people when you are a powerless leader is not only unethical, but also incredibly dumb and bad for your business on the long term.
Fredrik
Member
Wait now, we've only had one proper Halo and Gears of War on Xbox One yet, the other were ports/remakes, same as for Uncharted. The last real entries in the series were released several years ago so I really don't see why they would need to take a break from them.
The Forza serie on the other hand has got a new entry more often, every year as of now, but the Horizon serie and Motorsport serie are so different and 2 years between new games of the same type is not too close imo. Can't wait to see the next Forza Motorsport!
hanspampel
Banned
down from 2.5 million last year
last year had crowdfunding via packs, this year MS got greedy
all this while more different payed reqpacks were released. even several esport team packs
Might as well throw in Gears of War 4 as well. When you rely on three big franchises to drive the majority of your first party and two of them are generally believed to be weak entrees in their respective series that's not good.
I think Phil understands this. It's why if you listen to any of his interviews he's excited about the idea of having a non Halo or Gears holiday to try and foster some of Microsoft's other IP mainly being State of Decay, Crackdown and Sea of Thieves.
Problem is I don't think any of these games are going to sell well which will make Microsoft even more adverse to investing in first party games. There's very little excitement for any of those games for the most part. Then add in how crowded this holiday is going to be with Shadow of War, RD2, Destiny 2, Battlefront 2, CoD: WWII, probably Assassin's Creed Empire, and plus what ever else is unannounced, what person will choose any of those MS games over these third party games?
And seven of those games haven't been released yet.
List wars are never good, but that one was particularly awful.
BoxManLocke
Member
Completely agree with this.
It's fine to continue with these franchises except they need a new one that has more appeal, especially worldwide.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I don't think God Of War is going to be as different as you seem to think. They have definitely mixed things up, but it's still a character action game.
MS already had the chance with this and didn't take it. Now it's either coming late, or possibly not at all.
Even after Phil Spencer personally paying lip service to the fans via the #SaveShenmue campaign and acknowledging that Shenmue III was the game most requested of him, when Yu Suzuki came to discuss Shenmue III the deal offered was inadequate.
They gave away a series with history on their platform to a competitor, and unwittingly allowed Sony to pull off that hearts and minds trifecta at E3 2015.
I don't see how I'm shadowboxing, considering you've been responding directly to me, and points I've explicitly stated.
I ask "do you think people would have suggested Double Helix prior to KI?", you answered that with a "yes". I'm now stating that nobody in fact did suggest Double Helix during those times, and that it's actually verifiable thanks to the forum having search capabilities.
A shortlist that any of us attempt to create would only account for what would be the most likely and/or obvious potential partners. It's easy to consider Certain Affinity, because MS has already partnered with them and they've already worked on Halo. So they likely would actually make a shortlist of potential studios for us. A shortlist of potential studios for Microsoft would be significantly longer, because they would have access to far more information that any of us would. Factually, there's likely very few potential partners at any time. If we take 10 random studios, then 8 or 9 of them are likely already working on something notable, whether revealed or not... but that's meaningless to any of us without those game actually being revealed, because otherwise any of the 10 can be the 1 project that we'd actually be looking for.
I'm not trying to suggest that it's very productive to simply state "they could be working with anyone" as though that automatically means that they are... however, it's a perfectly valid response to posts that try to frame the argument as though the lack of internal studios indicates a lack of potential first-party titles. Maybe you should actually follow the conversation all the way back to the post that started it, asking Who is going to make them? We know what almost all of their studios are up to. .
In hindsight it's easy to act like the partnerships have easily identifiable public metrics for their candidacy, but outside of historical links or a large studio going dark for an extremely uncharacteristic window of time, there's really not much to go on for people like us to draw up a shortlist of any kind. Before Forza Horizon, Playground Games weren't even a thing. Before No Man's Sky, Hello Games were just the Joe Danger guys. You make it sound as though "these guys did some AAA ports" makes a studio like Armature stand out as previously likely candidate, as though people would be suggesting Nixxes, Bluepoint, M2 and Backbone as likely to build the next Xbox exclusive. Basically what I'm saying is that your shortlist wouldn't actually be very short at all by the time you account for Double Helixs, Armatures, Creative Assemblys, Mistwalkers and the like.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Ummmmmmm
butman
Member
You aiming the wrong console pal.
God forbid no new games are announced at e3. Concern levels will be through the roof!
Sucks because it seems like Microsoft is in a situation where they're damned if they do and damned if they dont. Get new ip on system spend alot of money and people dont buy it "i hate microsoft"
" i wont buy a console that can be had for extremely cheap for just 1 game" " looks good but windows and Microsoft rubbed me the wrong way" " nope not after that scalebound cancellation, they lost me"
People want japanese games on there but how many people buy them on xbox? Seems like they need a fresh start.
Sucks because it seems like Microsoft is in a situation where they're damned if they do and damned if they dont. Get new ip on system spend alot of money and people dont buy it "i hate microsoft"
" i wont buy a console that can be had for extremely cheap for just 1 game" " looks good but windows and Microsoft rubbed me the wrong way" " nope not after that scalebound cancellation, they lost me"
People want japanese games on there but how many people buy them on xbox? Seems like they need a fresh start.
Im in it for Halo and I'm still disappointed.
MosquitoSmasher
Member
What the hell. That sucks but let's be honest, how great is this game gonna sell? We all know it won't be some big seller and MS knows this too. It sucks for us gamers with only an Xbox One that would love to have the game though.
MisterR
Member
Not everything is about how a game sales. Sometimes it's about building hype or mindshare. MS hasn't really got that.
Halo 5
Sunset Overdrive
Quantum Break
Killer Instinct
Forza Motorsport 5
Forza Motorsport 6
Forza Horizon 2
Forza Horizon 3
Sea of Thieves
Crackdown 3
Halo Wars 2
Gears of War 4
State of Decay 2
What a terrible list
First of all i have removed the ports and even then Sony has more such as Beyond, Heavy Rain, Unvharted Collection, Gravity Rush, Kingdom Hearts, Final Fantasy X and XII, Tearaway, WipEout, im gonna stop now or else ill carry on forever. To top it all off none of them are garbage like Halo MCC.
Ive removed the indie games, and again Sony has way more exclusive indie games. I dont wajt to even get started with a list becuase it would take me forever.
But lets compare the retail exclusives, im not listing garbage likr The Order or Killzone Shadowfall
Uncharted 4
inFamous Second Son
Nino Kuni 2
Nier Automata
Yakuza 0
Last of Us Part 2
Dreams
The Last Guardian
Gravity Rush 2
Persona 5
Final Fantasy VII Remake
Days Gone
Spiderman
Yakuza 6
Bloodborne
Dragon Quest XII
Knack 2
Death Stranding
Gran Turismo Sport
Until Dawn
Shenmue 3
Nioh
Street Fighter V
Ratchet and Clank
Horizon
God of War
Im too lazy to list super niche stuff like Tales of Berseria, King of Fughters and Guilty Gear Xrd etc. Or else the list would be too long.
I know people hate list wars bit seriosily compare the list not only Sony kills microsoft in quantity, but in quality as well as diversity. This is only thr retail sector, in the remaster and indie line up Sony offer more as well.
Sunset Overdrive
Quantum Break
Killer Instinct
Forza Motorsport 5
Forza Motorsport 6
Forza Horizon 2
Forza Horizon 3
Sea of Thieves
Crackdown 3
Halo Wars 2
Gears of War 4
State of Decay 2
What a terrible list
First of all i have removed the ports and even then Sony has more such as Beyond, Heavy Rain, Unvharted Collection, Gravity Rush, Kingdom Hearts, Final Fantasy X and XII, Tearaway, WipEout, im gonna stop now or else ill carry on forever. To top it all off none of them are garbage like Halo MCC.
Ive removed the indie games, and again Sony has way more exclusive indie games. I dont wajt to even get started with a list becuase it would take me forever.
But lets compare the retail exclusives, im not listing garbage likr The Order or Killzone Shadowfall
Uncharted 4
inFamous Second Son
Nino Kuni 2
Nier Automata
Yakuza 0
Last of Us Part 2
Dreams
The Last Guardian
Gravity Rush 2
Persona 5
Final Fantasy VII Remake
Days Gone
Spiderman
Yakuza 6
Bloodborne
Dragon Quest XII
Knack 2
Death Stranding
Gran Turismo Sport
Until Dawn
Shenmue 3
Nioh
Street Fighter V
Ratchet and Clank
Horizon
God of War
Im too lazy to list super niche stuff like Tales of Berseria, King of Fughters and Guilty Gear Xrd etc. Or else the list would be too long.
I know people hate list wars bit seriosily compare the list not only Sony kills microsoft in quantity, but in quality as well as diversity. This is only thr retail sector, in the remaster and indie line up Sony offer more as well.
MosquitoSmasher
Member
Really hope MS can pick themselves up when it comes to that because even though we don't have the exact numbers for Gears 4, if it had done incredibly well I bet they would have screamed it off the rooftops. How did Halo 5 do?
Xbox right now is great overall in my opinion, the way they keep improving the system with updates. For example the latest preview update that speeds up the dashboard a great deal. The fact that they really listen to the people when it comes to that. There is very little I dislike about how Xbox is doing, but one thing which is incredibly important and they really need to work on that.
I really don't want to be seeing a future where Xbox is no more and it's just Sony and Nintendo. I want them to deliver a great system with Scorpio where I'll play the multiplats the best looking and performing and I really hope they actually get some of the Japanese games. It remains to be seen how interested MS really is in actually bothering to keep offering a steady lineup of new IP. Maybe MS can manage fine with every year a Forza game, every three year a Halo and Gears game and here and there a timed deal with a third party. I would mention Crackdown's developer and Sea of Thieves as well but let's first see how well they do before actually counting them as permanent studios.
Xbox right now is great overall in my opinion, the way they keep improving the system with updates. For example the latest preview update that speeds up the dashboard a great deal. The fact that they really listen to the people when it comes to that. There is very little I dislike about how Xbox is doing, but one thing which is incredibly important and they really need to work on that.
I really don't want to be seeing a future where Xbox is no more and it's just Sony and Nintendo. I want them to deliver a great system with Scorpio where I'll play the multiplats the best looking and performing and I really hope they actually get some of the Japanese games. It remains to be seen how interested MS really is in actually bothering to keep offering a steady lineup of new IP. Maybe MS can manage fine with every year a Forza game, every three year a Halo and Gears game and here and there a timed deal with a third party. I would mention Crackdown's developer and Sea of Thieves as well but let's first see how well they do before actually counting them as permanent studios.
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