serenewarfare
Banned
Rumors now are that the OLED iPhone won't ship until late October.
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WSJ: Apple to unveil iPhone 8, iPhone 7s and more on September 12
- Thread starter chadskin
- Start date
BeardyChan
Member
Well the cat is out of the bag with the new imessage emojis that seem to use facial recognition for quicker responding and recording reactions to send to friends.
Really sad about the issues with the screen touch id problems. The alternative touch id power button was a smart idea as well as a suitable replacement. Apple cut it really close with these new models to give as much time as possible to fix issues, but alas here we are. It could be something that is lurking in the new phones waiting for a potential update in the future though.
CosmicGroinPull
Member
Purely basing off that animated face in that 9to5mac article, the detection angles look extremely limited. Oops.
Meus Renaissance
Member
I think the most surprising thing about all this is the lack of outrage, or even criticism, from the press at large when it comes to these omissions. Apple have in the last few years removed significant components of their hardware for what can be described as, at best, dubious reasons.
Now, in order to shave off the bezels at the top and bottom, Apple are removing TouchID. At what point do journalists begin to admit the consumer experience is worsening on Apple hardware?
I'll never forget the interview where Phil Schiller reasoned the MicroSD card slot wasn't ideal because "things stick out", and then suggesting consumers get a USB reader, not realising that it would mean a dongle and thus an even larger thing "sticking out". And if that wasn't ideal, he suggested transferring images from your DSLR via Wifi.
That is the sort of interview, or mindset, that would get sales people fired. And yet that is coming from senior management. It should send alarm bells ringing.
Now, in order to shave off the bezels at the top and bottom, Apple are removing TouchID. At what point do journalists begin to admit the consumer experience is worsening on Apple hardware?
I'll never forget the interview where Phil Schiller reasoned the MicroSD card slot wasn't ideal because "things stick out", and then suggesting consumers get a USB reader, not realising that it would mean a dongle and thus an even larger thing "sticking out". And if that wasn't ideal, he suggested transferring images from your DSLR via Wifi.
That is the sort of interview, or mindset, that would get sales people fired. And yet that is coming from senior management. It should send alarm bells ringing.
Zeyphersan
Banned
Outrage would be unwarranted at this point since we dont know how the user experience is impacted since none of us have used the new solution
I think it's really awesome. The leaks make it seem like the perfect phone. Exactly the shot in the arm needed to bury the competition.
I have a fun idea: wait until Tuesday before jumping to conclusions
https://9to5mac.com/2017/09/08/how-setting-up-face-id-iphone-8-will-work/Heres how setting up Face ID on the iPhone 8 will work
Continuing our deep dive with the leaked iOS 11 GM build, were discovering more about the upcoming iPhones facial recognition system. Rumored to be the new authentication system, the Face ID setup should look familiar to many Touch ID users.
Earlier this evening we began sharing images and videos discovered in the iOS 11 GM leak. One of these videos was a short clip showing a Finder-like face tilting about. After searching a bit further, weve gotten further indications into just how setting up Face ID will work.
What was referenced as Pearl ID in previous leaks, looks to be Apples upcoming Face ID feature set to replace Touch ID.
Similar to the Touch ID experience, users will be required to create a passcode for when Face ID isnt available. Once one has been created, iOS guides users towards getting their faces recognized and loaded into the system.
In the first step, users are asked to gently move their heads in a circle, while looking at the screen. The instructions go on to explain that Face ID performs better when all angles of your face are captured. Unlike Touch ID, if Face ID wasnt able to perform a full capture, users can exit and finish later on. After running two full Face ID captures, the process is complete.
When configuring Face ID, the setup process provides helpful hints to guide users along. Messages telling users to Hold your iPhone 10 to 20 inches from your face and Tilt your head downwards/left/right/upwards were discovered in the GM strings. The Face ID setup also detects when the face is obstructed, out of view, or if another face is present during the setup.
The strings in this view may point out that the configuration area is not fully fleshed out as one line mentions: Lines for privacy lorem ipsum and potential second line that might include.
Below that, we see mention of settings that fall in line with Touch IDs settings. These strings, which will most likely appear on a page titled Face ID & Passcode, mentions an option to use Partial Capture. This sounds like it could be the experience when a user hasnt completed a full facial capture, but would still like to use Face ID with what it did grab.
Interesting to note is that the Face ID setup mentions being aware of when a user is looking at the phone. This falls in-line with previous discoveries:
Attention is detected when you are looking at the screen. When attention is detected, iPhone does not dim the display.
It sounds as though the new iPhone will be smart enough to stay on as you look at the device instead of dimming right while youre in the middle of a good read.
Follow along as we continue to discover everything we can in the latest iOS 11 leak. We started the evening off with iOS 11s new attention grabbing wallpapers, details on the upcoming LTE Apple Watch and carrier options, and more information on the upcoming iPhones Portrait Lighting, and updated AirPods.
Yeah, the whole port story is very inconsistent. They left the jack on the MacBooks because they are "pro" devices yet sell MBA and rMB which clearly aren't meant for "pro" use. I wish they had removed the jack on the rMB and replaced it with a second USB-C. Would've been way more versatile and useful.
Then we have USB-A to lightning on the iPhones and iPads - you need a dongle to connect them to your MB. wtf? Most features like file transfer and debugging are already wireless but some stuff still requires or benefits from a physical connection.
Lack of SD slot must be maddening for photographers and video editors. That's the sole omission I can't understand.
Fletch, the SD thing was about MBs. I think everybody can see why having an extra SD card will negatively impact the phone experience. It was a mess when I used an Android phone that allowed for it.
Daffy Duck
Member
This face ID thing is expected to only be on the 8 isn't it?
Meus Renaissance
Member
There is fundamentally no logical way a system that relies on your face is more convenient and easier to use than a system that relies on your finger print. The concept itself leads to serious questions:
- What if you're wearing a hat?
- What if the reflection off your glasses prevents eye detection?
- What about when the NFC machine is a turnstile at a subway station meaning you have to face your phone flat down onto it?
- The ports of the Macbook were removed to shave off 3mm.
- They were also removed to encourage adoption of USB-C, but you'll need to carry dongles with you. Because obviously you want a lighter, thinner laptop so you have room for these in your backpack.
- The iPhone doesn't have a USB-C port, and even the 8 seems to retain the Lighting port, thus undermining the whole "new technology" rationale.
You might be able to rationalise one, or two, but what you have is a contradiction of ideas. Worse yet, it harms the experience. You're either using a dongle, or limited to Lighting earbuds. And now, we're trying to think of ways a selfie-system is more convenient than a finger print.
Meus Renaissance
Member
Why are people complaining about having to buy expensive headphones that you'll need to charge? That's a good question. I don't have an answer.
Backfoggen
Banned
Damn, all colors come with a black front. I actually started liking the way the white dummies looked.
Bluetooth headphones are like $25, and one charge lasts multiple days. It's really only a big deal to people who make it one. Everyone else only benefits.
White faced phones were a mistake since day one. RIP
Where did you read this?
I always have been a silver user because I love that color but the way the small bezels looked on the 8 sure didn't look good to me so I was thinking of switching to a black model.
If the front is black for every color I'll stick with my precious silver.
Same here actually, I kinda dig the silver dummy with white bezels now after seeing it for a while
KGI report from today https://9to5mac.com/2017/09/08/iphone-8-3d-sensors-all-colors-black-front/
E: Seems like the new side button won't be an actual button anymore like the home button on iPhone 7. https://twitter.com/_inside/status/906403417450532864
Meus Renaissance
Member
Some people don't want to wear headphones (something on their heads), and so earphones are the natural alternative. But they are wired anyway, so it makes little sense to go wireless. Unless you want to have individual earbuds and carry them in a small case.
My Sennheiser earphones are cheap and have excellent sound quality. Ignoring the question of price and battery, I don't think there is really an alternative which offers me the same benefits.
Backfoggen
Banned
https://9to5mac.com/2017/09/08/iphone-8-3d-sensors-all-colors-black-front/
Nothing confirmed until next week obviously but it makes sense I guess. For me, iOS is such a bright OS that I prefer a white front. It even looks kinda cool with the display off. Black is a little boring.
Its not scanning your eyes, its 3D facial recognition.
We heard reports of a potential iris scanner earlier this year but they've not amounted to anything.
http://appleinsider.com/articles/17/09/09/inner-workings-of-apples-face-id-camera-detailed-in-report
In a note to investors seen by AppleInsider, KGI analyst Ming-Chi Kuo details the components, manufacturing process and behind-the-scenes technology that make Apple's depth-sensing camera tick.
Referenced in HomePod firmware as Pearl ID, and more recently as "Face ID" in an iOS 11 GM leak, Apple's facial recognition system is expected by some to serve as a replacement for Touch ID fingerprint reader technology. As such, the underlying hardware and software solution must be extremely accurate, and fast as well.
According to Kuo, Apple's system relies on four main components: a structured light transmitter, structure light receiver, front camera and time of flight/proximity sensor.
As outlined in multiple reports, the structured light modules are likely vertical-cavity surface-emitting laser (VCSEL) arrays operating in the infrared spectrum. These units are used to collect depth information which, according to Kuo, is integrated with two-dimensional image data from the front-facing camera. Using software algorithms, the data is combined to build a composite 3D image.
Kuo points out that structured light transmitter and receiver setups have distance constraints. With an estimated 50 to 100 centimeter hard cap, Apple needs to include a proximity sensor capable of performing time of flight calculations. The analyst believes data from this specialized sensor will be employed to trigger user experience alerts. For example, a user might be informed that they are holding an iPhone too far or too close to their face for optimal 3D sensing.
In order to ensure accurate operation, an active alignment process must be performed on all four modules before final assembly.
Interestingly, the analyst notes the ambient light sensor deployed in the upcoming iPhone will support True Tone display technology. Originally introduced in 2016, True Tone tech dynamically alters device display color temperatures based on information gathered by ambient light sensors. This functionality will also improve the performance of 3D sensing apparatus, Kuo says.
The analyst believes the most important applications of 3D sensing to be facial recognition, which could replace fingerprint recognition, and a better selfie user experience.
Kuo believes all OLED iPhone models — white, black and gold — will feature a black coating on their front cover glass to conceal the VCSEL array, proximity sensor and ambient light sensor from view. The prediction is in line with current Apple device designs that obscure components from view.
Thanks for the link. I appreciate it.
I'm really glad if this is indeed the case. Phew.
I'm sure Apple have this nailed, but I have so many horrible experiences of camera based biometrics that Im just naturally sceptical. That article talking about needing to tell people to move closer/further away gives me flashbacks to airport biometric scanners. Urgh.
Also still unsure this will have enough off-angle support so there will be ole ty of edge cases where you need to look more squarely on, lean over or pick up the phone from your desk etc. First world problems, sure, but compared to the simplicity and speed of TouchID v2 that could be frustrating
That also looks basically like a teeny tiny Kinect - IR camera, RGB camera, ToF sensor, IR Laser emitter..
Also still unsure this will have enough off-angle support so there will be ole ty of edge cases where you need to look more squarely on, lean over or pick up the phone from your desk etc. First world problems, sure, but compared to the simplicity and speed of TouchID v2 that could be frustrating
That also looks basically like a teeny tiny Kinect - IR camera, RGB camera, ToF sensor, IR Laser emitter..
Meus Renaissance
Member
Apple will tell us why Face ID is better on stage next week. "That was in the past, whereas this is the future." How could they ever bring it back again then with this talk? Having both Face ID and Touch ID in a future model? Is that ideal?
Backfoggen
Banned
Thinking about it, I guess the white front would have looked terrible with fullscreen content because of the notches. Leaving them black would lead to two ugly black compartments separating the display from the bezel, filling them white would be jarring when it's dark cause you'd have two zones of white shining bright.
What we need is a display that's white when off. 👍
What we need is a display that's white when off. 👍
Black faces would be the best news ever. Black backgrounds will save battery life on OLED, so the trend of big white backgrounds because of how many SKUs had white bezels wasn't going to last
I might actually buy a non-black phone this year!
Zeyphersan
Banned
Ill ask you the same question Ive asked others whove raised these questions: do you believe Apple hasnt thought of these extremely basic use cases?
Im not saying it will be flawless or even better, I know very very little about how it works. But do you think they havent tested hats or glasses? Or even using it for Apple Pay in different contactless scenarios?
CosmicGroinPull
Member
I have an even more fun idea. I amuse myself by speculating about the phone, and people do not feel the need to defend a phone that's not out yet and from a company they have no material stake in.
Zeyphersan
Banned
Expressing perceived flaws in a phone thats not out yet and no one has used based on a gif: amusement
Defending the phone by suggesting people wait until the announcement for real information: bad for some reason
I just want to make sure I understand
You're way too sharp man, nothing gets past you.
How many times has this dumb theory been said before a product announcement and ever actually been correct?
How many times do all the "it's obviously intentional leaks to make you think it's bad!" believers have to be wrong until they learn?
Atraveller
Banned
And give up quality sound for something that is more expensive, harder to repair, and has a shorter lifespan? No thanks.
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
Is any of this confirmed? Also, headphone jack aside, typically when Apple changes something they give you a better way to do it.
Probably not. They are making a push for AR applications, and want talent with experience in that field. (not that the front camera won't be related to this, but Primesense will likely add more value than improving face unlock.)
Yes, I feel the same way. But then I remember the kind of fingerprint and biometric scanners that I used before TouchIDand that I still use at work. How slow and finicky they were. Apple's solution was so far ahead it was not really comparable. So I have hope.
michaelius
Banned
Modern Android Phones have caught up with storage speed - and anyway that is bullshit reason to remove sd card because you don't need super fast storage for your pictures or music or movies.
And there's little issue of Apple selling higher storage options for insane markup which clearly shows us what was real reason.
Mr. Wonderful
Member
The red dot on the LTE Apple Watch looks awful. Hope it's an LED of some sort.
Doc Holliday
SPOILER: Columbus finds America
Ugh I would love this phone a lot more if it wasnt for the stupid notch and no Touch ID.
The obsession with getting rid of bezels is so annoying.
The obsession with getting rid of bezels is so annoying.
CosmicGroinPull
Member
Don't think there's anything wrong with maximizing screen space within a phone case though. It would be great if I can have a Plus sized screen in a regular iphone form factor. I just don't want any of it if it's going to be in the same case I've used for years now.
The Faceless Master
Member
what's $1000 for something you will carry with you and use every day?
i was ready to drop $950 on a Note 8.
then, of course, the $425 discount for Note 7 owners happened, but i was initially 100% ready to pay $950
They're just going sell you a chip that can be implanted in your head. Rename it IHead. You have to pay for the procedure though. IPeople still buy it though because they need that apple in their life.
PeterLegend
Member
My friend just posted a photo of the new iPhone, I dont see a touch id on the screen...
He works at a cellphone place...he's a manager...
Who knew posting images was this hard lol, but he posted the pic on facebook, not sure why'd he would post fake images.
He works at a cellphone place...he's a manager...
Who knew posting images was this hard lol, but he posted the pic on facebook, not sure why'd he would post fake images.
The Faceless Master
Member
and you didn't re-post it because you don't want your friend to get fired... right?
edit: nvm
edit 2: tinypic is a banned host
edit 3: but the fronts are supposed to all be black...