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Danny Elfman on scoring Justice League, Return of His Theme and Williams' Superman

P

Penguin

Member
Elfman on scoring Justice League

You’ve just been in London recording the score for Justice League. It’s been 28 years since you scored Batman. What was it like going back into the DC universe?

It was great. It was like I never left because I’m using the same thematic material that I used back then. It never actually went away [Laughs.] It just was great fun.

There are a few little fan moments. I instated a moment of the Wonder Woman theme that Hans Zimmer did for Batman Vs. Superman, but I also had two minutes where I had the pleasure of saying, “Let’s do John Williams’ Superman.” and that for me was heaven, because now I have a melody to twist, and I’m using it in an actually very dark way, in a dark moment. It’s the kind of thing that some fans will notice. Some won’t. It’s a moment where we’re really not sure whose side he’s on.

The people at DC are starting to understand we’ve got these iconic bits from our past and that’s part of us, that’s part of our heritage -- we shouldn’t run away from that. Contemporary thinking is, every time they reboot something, you have to start completely from scratch -- which, of course, audiences will tell us again and again, is bullshit. Because the single-most surviving and loved theme in the world is Star Wars, which they had the good sense to not dump for the reboots. And every time it comes back, the audience goes crazy.
Click to expand...
We're getting John Williams Superman theme and return of Elfman's Bat theme?

o_O

Did you write new themes for such characters as Flash and Aquaman?

I created very simple motifs. There are so many themes, you can’t just do a big theme for everything. So i created a motif for Flash, for Aquaman and Cyborg -- but they’re very simple things, and [DC] understood. I said, "These things may never be used again, but I’m giving you all the components, should you wish to have things to build on." So they either will or they won’t, but that’s how I approach a project like this. You have to take the attitude that this is the beginning of a mythology and it all matters, it all comes to fruition, and with any luck they will.

I loved the people I worked with, they were wonderful. The DC guys were great. I kept talking about the DNA of John Williams in this other theme -- using the DNA of Batman in these other variations, which were not the Batman theme -- but it all derives from that... Musical themes are like genes, you carry the DNA along and it creates these subtle connections which are perceived on an unconscious level. It’s funny because I’m terrible at puzzles, but I love musical puzzles. It’s a different part of my brain.
Click to expand...

http://www.billboard.com/amp/articl...ice-league-joss-whedon-gus-van-sant-interview
 
S

SpaceWolf

Banned
Elfman's Spider-Man theme is practically up there with William's Superman theme as far as I'm concerned.

I’m using it in an actually very dark way, in a dark moment. It’s the kind of thing that some fans will notice. Some won’t. It’s a moment where we’re really not sure whose side he’s on.
Click to expand...

Sigh. Hoping this doesn't mean the return of dark, brooding Superman.
 
A

AMUSIX

Member
Penguin said:
We're getting John Williams Superman theme and return of Elfman's Bat theme?

o_O
Click to expand...
Based on what he said? Not really.

For Batman, he's working with the same thematic material. Which means he's using the same comics/images/sources to determine the overall style, and then composing the new theme based on that. He may still quote his old theme, since it's all WB, and he has access to it, but that old melody won't be the Bat's main theme.

As for Superman's, it sounds like he's toyed with it enough that people unaware of it won't recognize it, but others will appreciate it's inclusion.

I'm thinking this is going to be an OOT/"where's the main theme" sort of thing.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
We're getting the Williams Superman theme and the Elfman Batman theme in the same movie?!!?

IPiJ5pf.gif
 
A

a916

Member
That's the weirdest way to let this bit of news release...

I'm excited and I think Zimmer's MOS OST is amazing. It would be great to have a bit of both... a hint of Williams but continue with Zimmer because that's more fitting.

It's a moment where we're really not sure whose side he's on.
Click to expand...

Jesus Christ Elfman, spoilers much?
 
S

Sgt. Kabukiman

Banned
Neat. DC has some legendary musical leitmotivs. They should use them.
And this bit confirms what most of us have suspected:

It’s a moment where we’re really not sure whose side he’s on.
Click to expand...
Superman is probably gonna be resurrected by Steppenwolf.

SpaceWolf said:
Elfman's Spider-Man theme is practically up there with William's Superman theme as far as I'm concerned.
Click to expand...

Hulk was great as well, very underrated score.
 
C

CreepingFear

Member
Wasn't our own Bobby Roberts in favor of resurrecting Superman to be less emo? The theme has to match the script and acting for this to work.
 
B

Bobby Roberts

Banned
Okay, SO:

Obviously we're talking about the resurrection here? And at that point he's warping some of Williams' work?

I'm thinking maybe this might be the Krypton theme, and not the main title march. Although you can tweak the march, melodically, to be ominous.

I do hope he doesn't 100% jettison the Man of Steel theme, because that is also valid, and legitimately good, theme for Superman.
 
C

Chained Prometheus

Member
Wait, we're seriously getting Elfman's Batman theme again? :O

If so, I'm gonna enjoy that moment in the film so much. Even if the rest of the movie ends up being a mess, I'm going to enjoy the hell out of hearing that theme again.
 
J

JB1981

Member
I just read that and it doesn't sound like the movie will have full-blown orchestral themes of these scores but subtle cues and variations? Am I reading this properly? The article is written in a confusing manner
 
H

HomerSimpson-Man

Member
moltonasty said:
This is weird af lol. I know they're iconic themes but they're also completely different versions of these characters.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I remember when Batman Begins came out, people were playing around with the Batman original theme with trailers, but it really didn't fit with Nolan's movie in the grand scheme of things as the theme has a bit of a whimsical flair to it that fits Time Burton's but not Nolan's film. Sounds like it's taking cues from the original themes instead of trying to shoehorn it in Justice League.
 
C

civilstrife

Member
Because the single-most surviving and loved theme in the world is Star Wars, which they had the good sense to not dump for the reboots. And every time it comes back, the audience goes crazy.
Click to expand...

Shots fired.
 
S

Sgt. Kabukiman

Banned
Bobby Roberts said:
Okay, SO:

Obviously we're talking about the resurrection here? And at that point he's warping some of Williams' work?

I'm thinking maybe this might be the Krypton theme, and not the main title march. Although you can tweak the march, melodically, to be ominous.

I do hope he doesn't 100% jettison the Man of Steel theme, because that is also valid, and legitimately good, theme for Superman.
Click to expand...

Well he's saying it happens in a scene where everyone is unsure about which side Superman is on. So yeah, he's been resurrected and somehow turned by the villains or whatever. The heroes are on their guard, the music is somber and then... These first few notes followed by a smirk. That's my fanboy prediction.

Agreed about the MoS score, but it doesn't appear that Elfman is doing that, just throwing some old references in the mix.
 
kunonabi

kunonabi

Member
Return of some classic elements is good to hear even if it just little nods here and there. Hopefully Zimmer's trash is just left in the garbage and Elfman puts in work that isnt as dull as his Spider-Man stuff.
 
A

a916

Member
Because the single-most surviving and loved theme in the world is Star Wars, which they had the good sense to not dump for the reboots. And every time it comes back, the audience goes crazy.
Click to expand...

But they aren't reboots...
 
T

Truant

Member
While I appreciate the classic Superman theme for what it is, I personally think the Zimmer theme is vastly better on pretty much all fronts.

Burton's Bat theme is good also, should be a nice throwback to the films, as well as the animated series.
 
A

Anth0ny

Member
There are a few little fan moments. I instated a moment of the Wonder Woman theme that Hans Zimmer did for Batman Vs. Superman, but I also had two minutes where I had the pleasure of saying, “Let’s do John Williams’ Superman.” and that for me was heaven, because now I have a melody to twist, and I’m using it in an actually very dark way, in a dark moment.

The people at DC are starting to understand we’ve got these iconic bits from our past and that’s part of us, that’s part of our heritage -- we shouldn’t run away from that. Contemporary thinking is, every time they reboot something, you have to start completely from scratch -- which, of course, audiences will tell us again and again, is bullshit. Because the single-most surviving and loved theme in the world is Star Wars, which they had the good sense to not dump for the reboots. And every time it comes back, the audience goes crazy.
Click to expand...

HKFG8Rb.gif


THE Superman theme and THE Batman theme should always be around. Always.
 
J

JB1981

Member
Truant said:
While I appreciate the classic Superman theme for what it is, I personally think the Zimmer theme is vastly better on pretty much all fronts.
Click to expand...

I like Zimmer's score well enough but WHAT

Also this seems like it was a Whedon decision through and through
 
B

Bobby Roberts

Banned
Sephzilla said:
And as the 75th anniversary short proved, to me, you can transition from one theme to another pretty well
Click to expand...

Yeah, the most popular remix of mine is one that isn't popular because of how I flipped any beats or anything (the drum mixing is not good, honestly - I pulled a no-no and only mixed on a single set of headphones/speakers) but because I blended The Planet Krypton, the Main Title, and What Are You Going to Do together pretty cleanly.

https://soundcloud.com/geekremixed/last-sons-a-man-of-steel

If I can weave those two together, damn sure Elfman can do it.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
The only really big hot take I'm gonna drop in here is that I like Hans Zimmer scores but I generally think his scores for superhero movies in particular kind of suck (aside from the main Man of Steel theme). Elfman restoring bits and pieces of the classic themes is extremely welcomed

Bobby Roberts said:
Yeah, the most popular remix of mine is one that isn't popular because of how I flipped any beats or anything (the drum mixing is not good, honestly - I pulled a no-no and only mixed on a single set of headphones/speakers) but because I blended The Planet Krypton, the Main Title, and What Are You Going to Do together pretty cleanly.

https://soundcloud.com/geekremixed/last-sons-a-man-of-steel

If I can weave those two together, damn sure Elfman can do it.
Click to expand...

That's not bad! I agree with you on the drums bit too
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
Truant said:
While I appreciate the classic Superman theme for what it is, I personally think the Zimmer theme is vastly better on pretty much all fronts.

Burton's Bat theme is good also, should be a nice throwback to the films, as well as the animated series.
Click to expand...

William's Superman theme is THE Superman theme.

DC uses it all over the place for Superman, whether it's in video games, amusement park rides, or wherever they need an iconic Superman song.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
William's Superman theme is THE Superman theme.

DC uses it all over the place for Superman, whether it's in video games, amusement park rides, or wherever they need an iconic Superman song.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the William's Superman theme has stuck with the character for like 40+ years now through multiple incarnations of the character. It's not just the Reeves theme anymore
 
J

jett

D-Member
Excellent decision to use the GOAT superhero theme, although I really liked Zimmer's theme too. Although I wonder how much it will be used, as Elfman himself says people might not even notice it. :p WB definitely shouldn't run away these iconic pieces of music on what should be pretty much a fan celebration.
 
J

- J - D -

Member
I don't like this unless they are actually doing a multiverse crossover and bringing in Keaton Batman and Reeve/Routh Superman.
 
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