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[ZeroX03]

Some people here are really desperate to assume the worst of either IGN or ND.

Clearly something went down, Amy clearly wasn't planning to leave, judging by her Twitter she's just straight unemployed. Comments are kept vague. Who or what happened is a specific we probably won't get anytime soon, ND won't say anything for PR reasons, Amy won't go around badmouthing people anytime soon because it's immature/unprofessional and IGN won't reveal a source (if they even have one). We really don't have enough information to throw blame at anyone.

 

[plasmawave]

The fact that they won't tell us anything further apart from "things change", insist on dropping the whole affair to get back to making games, say they're setting the record straight to protect their employees (and not Hennig), and having nothing nice to say about Hennig, and having not heard a message from Hennig herself, pretty much seals the deal that this wasn't an amicable departure.

Earlier this week we had to confirm the regrettable news that Amy Hennig has left Naughty Dog. She will be missed and as we stated before we appreciate the significant contributions that she has made to Naughty Dog and the industry in general. We wish her the best.

 

[Carl]

But the idea of IGN transparent with the information they're hearing is what we should be ASKING for. Not condemning.

People make a fuss, when they act as PR mouthpieces, and then when they don't they get trashed.

No, personally I am happy to hear what they've heard. If it's wrong, it's wrong - but there's obviously more to it. It wasn't a planned or amicable split.

I'd rather they wait until they have solid information on an instance such as this, where it puts someone's career at stake.

 

[Dr.Acula]

Hey, a Somalian drug dealer said the mayor of Toronto smokes crack and they mayor denied it with more forceful language than ND is using, and we all know how that ended up.

The US govt. also told us they don't engage in domestic spying or warrentless wiretapping.

So while this statement is good to hear, it doesn't tell us anything about what happened. And if NDAs were signed as part of a severance package, then we'll never know.

 

[PsihoPerihelion]

Things change

Time to quote Peter Moore and his famous "things break." What a load of BS.

 

[Alucrid]

Crow. Crow everywhere.

 

[Jarmel]

It's a rumour until it's confirmed.

You know what i was getting at, no need to be pedantic.

If they heard from someone how something might have gone, and they believe it might be true, then why not report it? IGN did their job correctly, assuming the email didn't come from some random email.

 

[Terrell]

For those asking a complete account of what happened from ND... I ask you what company has fully disclosed the departure of an employee?

Not only it never happens, but i cant imagine th legal nightmare of doing so.

This is all on IGN.

Companies usually either disclose nothing or disclose everything, particularly when slander is involved.

The problem is ND tried to do things half way with their statement of "these employees weren't involved. Can we all shut up about this now??!?"

 

[bigjig]

To be honest I never really cared much for her work on the Uncharted series, but "forced out " or not, it still seems a pretty dodgy way to treat an employee of 10 years

 

[funkystudent]

So we complain when IGN are shills, but also complain when they report on something that doesn't suck the dick of a publisher / developer?

I think people just want more information on what "forced out" meant.

That could mean a million things from contract negotiations where she asked for too much money that Sony wasnt willing to pay so she left or to Neil and Bruce literally tossing her out the door like bouncers at a night club.


I wouldnt want them to out a source. Just follow up on their accusations.

 

[graywolf323]

nothing either Rohde or the Naughty Dog heads said really contradict IGN since they didn't refute she was forced out (Rohde just said he wouldn't use that term to describe it)

edit: all Naughty Dog did was deny that Straley and Druckmann were involved

 

[E92 M3]

Are Neil and Bruce some kind of rockstars at Naughty Dog?

 

[BurnOutBrighter]

Can you tell next weeks lottery numbers as well?

No, but I know there's a fire when I see smoke.

 

[Carl]

If they heard from someone how something might have gone, and they believe it might be true, then why not report it? IGN did their job correctly, assuming the email didn't come from some random email.

As i said, in any other situation i'd agree with you. But one as delicate as this, where they're potentially harming someone's career, i think they should wait until they have more solid information.

 

[Jarmel]

I'd rather they wait until they have solid information on an instance such as this, where it puts someone's career at stake.

Chances are they won't ever get solid confirmation as this was possibly done on a very high level and nobody involved in the gritty details is going to talk about it. Best IGN got was an employee who overheard arguments and yelling.

Some people here are really desperate to assume the worst of either IGN or ND.

Clearly something went down, Amy clearly wasn't planning to leave, judging by her Twitter she's just straight unemployed. Comments are kept vague. Who or what happened is a specific we probably won't get anytime soon, ND won't say anything for PR reasons, Amy won't go around badmouthing people anytime soon because it's immature/unprofessional and IGN won't reveal a source (if they even have one). We really don't have enough information to throw blame at anyone.

Pretty much this.

 

[Codeblew]

Hmmm....



Except you didn't "set the record straight" because there was no account of what actually happened.
There's fucking PLENTY left to say on the subject, Naughty Dog just doesn't want to embarrass themselves by telling us the truth of the matter.
This is some "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" bullshit.

It is more like, not commenting on former employees and risking a lawsuit.

 

[shwimpy]

I wonder if IGN is going to post the statement from Naughty Dog.

 

[StuBurns]

Are Neil and Bruce some kind of rockstars at Naughty Dog?

Where aren't they rockstars?

 

[plasmawave]

Companies usually either disclose nothing or disclose everything, particularly when slander is involved.

The problem is ND tried to do things half way with their statement of "these employees weren't involved. Can we all shut up about this now??!?"

I don't think ND or Sony had anything in plan to announce this unless IGN broke the news.

 

[atr0cious]

So we complain when IGN are shills, but also complain when they report on something that doesn't suck the dick of a publisher / developer?

Seriously, this site yells at IGN for not reporting on DRM issues and what-have-you, but as soon as they mention a negative rumor against their so called employers, no one wants to question this.

 

[LiK]

Are Neil and Bruce some kind of rockstars at Naughty Dog?

they are now.

 

[Pound_lb003]

I'd rather they wait until they have solid information on an instance such as this, where it puts someone's career at stake.

They've put their reputation, and their relationship with ND on the line - to repeat information they've heard from reliable sources. If it was wrong they've only damaged their own business, but they've done it with the reader's interests at heart.

Which seems to be a first for IGN.

 

[Takamura-San]

Companies usually either disclose nothing or disclose everything, particularly when slander is involved.

The problem is ND tried to do things half way with their statement of "these employees weren't involved. Can we all shut up about this now??!?"

They are more concerned about the employees. They stated that what happened with Amy, if anything, was on them.

And companies dont disclose anything unless they get sued, goes to court and goes into public record.

 

[Carl]

Chances are they won't ever get solid confirmation as this was possibly done on a very high level and nobody involved in the gritty details is going to talk about it. Best IGN got was an employee who overheard arguments and yelling.

Which still isn't enough, in my opinion, to put someone's career at stake. But obviously we disagree.

 

[plasmawave]

Those trashing IGN for posting it... Please don't let me find you discussing and revelling in GAF's own insider threads in your posting history, because I hope you realise it's all the same information.

People hear things, and repeat. It's not always 100%.

There's a massive difference between a gaming forum and a professionally run gaming site with millions of views.

 

[vpance]

Forced out as easy as a wet turd.

How much was she getting paid? 200k+? Maybe she was getting a cut of the sales on the games too after that many years. If you're flying that high you'd better have a presidential or founder title to hold onto.

 

[graywolf323]

Which still isn't enough, in my opinion, to put someone's career at stake. But obviously we disagree.

how did they put someone's career at stake? people get forced out in all businesses by others so it's not like this would have been some extraordinary circumstance that never happens anywhere, Druckmann and Staley don't have to worry about their careers being at stake coming off of TLOU even if the rumor was true, it just makes them look like assholes at worst

Amy? if anything that rumor makes people sympathize with her being suddenly unemployed even more

 

[atr0cious]

There's a massive difference between a gaming forum and a professionally run gaming site with millions of views.

Which of these is IGN?

 

[Tripon]

I wonder if IGN is going to post the statement from Naughty Dog.

Greg Miller retweeted it.
https://twitter.com/GameOverGreggy/status/441755693654085633

User Actions
Following

Greg MillerVerified account
‏@GameOverGreggy
.@Naughty_Dog responds to the @amy_hennig news from this week: http://www.naughtydog.com/site/post/statement_from_the_co_presidents1/ …

 

[plasmawave]

Which of these is IGN?

OH SHI...!

 

[BurnOutBrighter]

Earlier this week we had to confirm the regrettable news that Amy Hennig has left Naughty Dog. She will be missed and as we stated before we appreciate the significant contributions that she has made to Naughty Dog and the industry in general. We wish her the best.

This doesn't count as "nice". This is the default thing that people say when you leave somewhere, even if you're kicked out, because it saves face.

If you were well-liked and left on your own terms, your coworkers would have a lot better things to say than "we appreciate your contribution".

 

[Jonboy]

I think people just want more information on what "forced out" meant.

That could mean a million things from contract negotiations where she asked for too much money that Sony wasnt willing to pay so she left or to Neil and Bruce literally tossing her out the door like bouncers at a night club.


I wouldnt want them to out a source. Just follow up on their accusations.

Excellent point. I think it's what's made this into such a big deal. The whole "forced out" thing is huge and what it's specifically referring to is what determines how people should react to the news.

 

[bananafactory]

My exchange with Mitch from yesterday:

He promised to "dig further" but I notice that neither he nor IGN have updated the original article, and I informed them of this. Was unprofessional to begin with, and it's even more so to leave that kind of accusation up there. Right now it's the word of "their source" vs the word of Wells and Balestra.

 

[Vire]

So we complain when IGN are shills, but also complain when they report on something that doesn't suck the dick of a publisher / developer?

Posting unsubstantiated rumors that could be potentially damaging to people's careers is not only unprofessional, but flat out irresponsible.

If you are going to make accusations that some high profile developers forced someone out of a company, you damn well better back your claims up other than saying "I have my sources".

Mitch Dyer's article was so incredibly negligent, it forced the co-founders of Naughty Dog to make a personal statement coming to the aid of both Bruce and Neil and expounding on how much of an idiot he was.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I'm guessing with the rise of other talented people at naughty dog and all their new hires I guess they figured they didn't need to renew any contract with Hennig or anything.

Or maybe she wanted to take things in a direction that others didn't and decided to split. I don't get malicious vibes out of any of this. The IGN article made it sound like Neil and whoever were being little assholes and drove her out of a job or something. I just don't see it.

In the end it was probably mostly a business decision. As for IGN, something stronger than random sources claming things would have been nice but I guess they wanted to the hits on that one. Such is the internetz.

 

[Massa]

" But things change, and sometimes change involves very high profile individuals. "

Specially when that very high profile individual is instrumental to one of your most important franchises.

Both Rohde and accompanying Sony PR reiterated that Hennig’s departure from Naughty Dog wouldn’t hinder Uncharted 4’s progress, and that its development “is unchanged completely.”

Sorry but that's a load of bullshit. Uncharted 4 is not unchanged, it will suffer significantly from losing Amy's contributions over the next few months.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Hmmm....



Except you didn't "set the record straight" because there was no account of what actually happened.
There's fucking PLENTY left to say on the subject, Naughty Dog just doesn't want to embarrass themselves by telling us the truth of the matter.
This is some "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" bullshit.

Neil and Bruce had nothing to do with it. That's the only part of the entire story that was even in contention because any other aspect of it is simply an employee and employer terminating their relationship.

So I have three questions;

1) The presidents message doesn't say that she wasn't pushed out, specifically, it just says that Straley and Druckmann weren't involved. Does that mean someone else pushed her out, or was that part of the IGN post wrong, too?

2)And if she wasn't pushed out, at least on some level, why only deny that Straley & Druckmann weren't involved in what 'transpired'?

3) Will, as the IGN article said, Straley & Druckmann (or one of them) be taking over Uncharted 4?

1. "Pushed out" is just a term that the source was using to insinuate that someone who doesn't have authority directly over Hennig, applied some kind of pressure to have her fired. The statement from ND's Co-Presidents means she wasn't pushed out at all. Whatever happened was between Hennig and her Boss (or Bosses depending on how structure is at ND).

2. Because Bruce and Neil were the only ones taking a direct hit to their reputation. Saying their names made it appear that they were doing some underhanded stuff behind the scenes. None of that is true and ND wanted to make sure that that stopped.

3. Won't know until ND makes a statement about that. Whether they do or don't though, there will always be a stigma around them thanks to "sources" which usually amounts to office rumors.

It's pretty obvious SOMETHING went down. Believing IGN's account or not is irrelevant at this point. Nothing has been "cleared up", you can't replace false information with a VOID, shit doesn't work like that. All this statement does is raise even more questions than the validity of IGN's statement.

You're clearly upset and I have no idea what about. The part of the story about Neil and Bruce was the only drama. Outside of that, it's simply an Employer and Employee relationship ending. Maybe it was salary related, maybe it was title related, maybe it was creative issues, etc... However, barring Hennig coming out and saying something was offensively wrong.. there's nothing to be incensed about.

 

[Tripon]

Which still isn't enough, in my opinion, to put someone's career at stake. But obviously we disagree.

You keep on saying this but who else besides Henning is getting fired at ND?

 

[SketchTheArtist]

Remember the thread where more than half of the replies were painting Druckmann and Straley as solely responsible (based on the IGN rumor mind you) and treated them as monsters.

Freakin' GAF Hivemind sometimes....

 

[RyanPierre]

Following up on accusations that Mitch Dyer's article was vague to the point of being reckless rumormongering, sources claim details in the story were "forced out" prematurely.

 

[ReaperXL7]

nothing either Rohde or the Naughty Dog heads said really contradict IGN since they didn't refute she was forced out (Rohde just said he wouldn't use that term to describe it)

edit: all Naughty Dog did was deny that Straley and Druckmann were involved

The issue I have is that so far the majority are pointing the finger at Naughty Dog when it's very possible the reasons she is no longer employed could be of her own doing, or it could have been both parties with some degree of responsibility.

At this point it's come down to many either wanting to blame Neil and Bruce, or Naughty Dog but giving no thought to the idea that Henning herself could easily be responsible. I'm not going to lie I am curious as to if this story would be as big as it is if it did not have a tinge of "sexism" attached to it.

" But things change, and sometimes change involves very high profile individuals. "


Specially when that very high profile individual is instrumental to one of your most important franchises.

Both Rohde and accompanying Sony PR reiterated that Hennig’s departure from Naughty Dog wouldn’t hinder Uncharted 4’s progress, and that its development “is unchanged completely.”

Sorry but that's a load of bullshit. Uncharted 4 is not unchanged, it will suffer significantly from losing Amy's contributions over the next few months.

You have no way of possibly knowing this to be true, so I'm not sure why you believe that statement to be bullshit.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

IGN won't report rumours that are important or relevent to games but will happily put the reputation and careers of two people on the line for "news". That story should have stopped and started with Amy Hennig leaving unless they had something.

 

[Kinsei]

So we complain when IGN are shills, but also complain when they report on something that doesn't suck the dick of a publisher / developer?

I have no problem with them reporting on things that cast a developer or publisher in a negative light when they have proof, I do have a problem with them singling out one or two people and saying they did something without any proof to back themselves up.

Look at the thread posted about the article, people were out for blood because of that article. In this topic you have people just saying that the ND statement is damage control. I have no doubt in my mind that Amy didn't leave willingly or that there wasn't some sort of drama involved that led to her departure or else they would come right out and say it, but there is no proof that the two men implicated in IGN's article are to blame, and this whole fiasco has caused a serious blow to their (Druckmann and Straley) reputation.

 

[LiK]

Remember the thread where more than half of the replies were painting Druckmann and Straley as solely responsible (based on the IGN rumor mind you) and treated them as monsters.

Freakin' GAF Hivemind sometimes....

well, you said "half "so not technically a hivemind...

 

[Jarmel]

Posting unsubstantiated rumors that could be potentially damaging to people's careers is not only unprofessional, but flat out irresponsible.

If you are going to make accusations that some high profile developers forced someone out of a company, you damn well better back your claims up other than saying "I have my sources".

Mitch Dyer's article was so incredibly negligent, it forced the co-founders of Naughty Dog to make a personal statement coming to the aid of both Bruce and Neil and expounding on how much of an idiot he was.

If they have a legitimate source, they're not going to out him or her. Nor should they be expected to.

 

[Pyccko]

Pretty shameful reporting by IGN, but I suppose that's to be expected, really. Still very sad to see her go, but at least I can go into future ND games with a clear conscience.

 

[EL CUCO]

Could somebody put up the complete statement from ND here? The link isn't working for me

 

[Dr.Acula]

And companies dont disclose anything unless they get sued, goes to court and goes into public record.

...or if an employee left willingly.

 

[ReturnOfTheRAT]

IGN. SMH.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

The issue I have is that so far the majority are pointing the finger at Naughty Dog when it's very possible the reasons she is no longer employed could be of her own doing, or it could have been both parties with some degree of responsibility.

At this point it's come down to many either wanting to blame Neil and Bruce, or Naughty Dog but giving no thought to the idea that Henning herself could easily be responsible. I'm not going to lie I am curious as to if this story would be as big as it is if it did not have a tinge of "sexism" attached to it.

This is the first time I've seen sexism attached to it.