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[Famassu]

So basically either IGN's source was wrong about Drunkman and Straley being involved or Naughty Dog is stretching the truth in their statement to protect their reputations.

I'm not even sure what are the surnames of these two people, they've been written in so many ways in this thread (and I have a shitty name memory). Though I'm pretty sure it's not Drunkman.

Nevertheless it's clear she didn't leave on good terms so I imagine somebody is to blame for her departure.

How is it clear? Nothing points out that she didn't leave on good terms and nothing is pointing out she did. It's all speculation at this point either way. Resigning/being fired is never fun, so in that way, sure, it probably wasn't a happy moment, but resignations don't always have some huge drama behind them.

 

[Kieli]

Does Uncharted and the Naughty Gods have some sort of super-powered stupid ray?

Because, holy hell.

8/10

Conspiracy work-place accusations.

Mai gauwd.

 

[Famassu]

The term "Creative differences" exists for a reason.

Sure, but even that never really sounds good. Maybe the reason is because Amy doesn't want to draw any kind of spotlight on her, maybe it's because they don't want to burn any bridges after a hard break up. Either way, it's their decision to not say much at this time and silence doesn't always mean there must be some unimaginable horrors that must have happened for such an esteemed developer to leave such an esteemed development company and not spill the beans on what happened.

 

[Kieli]

It's like Uncharted wields some sort of super-powered gamma dumbass/stupidity/idiocy ray.

Because sweet baby Hezus on ribbed-back steak.

First, it was 8/10. Now, it's this.

 

[AngryMoth]

I'm not even sure what are the surnames of these two people, they've been written in so many ways in this thread (and I have a shitty name memory). Though I'm pretty sure it's not Drunkman.

How is it clear? Nothing points out that she didn't leave on good terms and nothing is pointing out she did. It's all speculation at this point either way. Resigning/being fired is never fun, so in that way, sure, it probably wasn't a happy moment, but resignations don't always have some huge drama behind them.

Haha you're right my bad, it's 'Druckmann'. Ok it's not 100% clear she didn't leave amicably but I think the fact that they're being coy about it and that she is staying quiet gives a good indication that something went down.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

People would much rather discuss this than discover the clues about Uncharted 4 Naughty Dog has left around the Web. Kinda tells you where some people's interests lay.

 

[noobasuar]

Why are some people calling for the topic to end because it is "none of our business?" It actually is our business. Naughty Dog made it our business. They put these people out there on press events, interviews and more for gamers to read and watch so that they can connect to the fans and sell their products. That is how these people actually become known. They are trotted out there as a face of a franchise or as part of a company. So when news breaks that involves one or more of these faces, we're just supposed to shrug and say "Oh, it's none of our business!" Sorry, it doesn't work like that. You can't have it both ways.

Since Naughty Dog is loved by many people on this board any type of negativity directed at the company is going to be met with people trying to shut down the discussion as quickly as possible. Even PR can't do damage control half as well as members of Gaf can.

You can bet if this happened at some company like Ubisoft with Jade Raymond being let go then the tone would be very different since most people don't really care enough about Ubisoft.

Maybe we all should have kept our mouths shut when Jeff Gerstmann was let go from Gamespot since clearly that was none of our buisness, right?

 

[Figboy79]

I think what ND's statement was clarifying that Neil and Bruce weren't responsible. Evans and Balestra run ND. If anyone fired someone as high profile in the company as Amy, it would be those two not a game director and writer.

I'm not saying egos weren't involved, or if there was some internal strife that lead to this outcome, but Evans and Balestra would be the ones to make the call.

What transpired between Amy and ND is none of our business, which is why I think the statement from ND was vague. We don't need to know the particulars and every "juicy" detail. Feel free to imagine all sorts of raised voices, curse words and tears, but know that you'll never know what happened behind closed doors, and you don't have to know.

I'm sure many of us wouldn't want every detail of our lay off/firing known. It's clear Amy more than likely was let go, and didn't leave on her own accord, or they'd have said it. Just give the woman, and by extension, ND, sone respect and privacy. I'm sure nobody is happy at this outcome. Hell, we had to let 5 people go last week, a few who have been with the company for nearly a decade, making games and building the company to what it is. Everyone was upset, not just the affected parties. These things happen in the industry all the time.

EDIT: NO, it's not any of our business. Just because someone is in the public spotlight doesn't mean they owe us anything in regards to their lives. They aren't obligated to inform us of every beat and tick of their existence. In short: we don't own them. They dob't belong to us, and it's just a little bit disturbing that some people think they are owed an explanation because she happened to be involved in some entertainment they liked.

 

[PJV3]

Since Naughty Dog is loved by many people on this board any type of negativity directed at the company is going to be met with people trying to shut down the discussion as quickly as possible. Even PR can't do damage control half as well as members of Gaf can.

You can bet if this happened at some company like Ubisoft with Jade Raymond being let go then the tone would be very different since most people don't really care enough about Ubisoft.

Maybe we all should have kept our mouths shut when Jeff Gerstmann was let go from Gamespot since clearly that was none of our buisness, right?

There would be a better discussion if the reasons were clearer. If you have any real light to shed on the situation it would be appreciated.

It's possible she was forced out for legitimate reasons even if she doesn't agree with it.

 

[mclem]

People would much rather discuss this than discover the clues about Uncharted 4 Naughty Dog has left around the Web. Kinda tells you where some people's interests lay.

The web's an awfully big place. The smarter option is to wait until someone behind the ARG starts innocently prompting people in the right direction.

 

[mclem]

EDIT: NO, it's not any of our business. Just because someone is in the public spotlight doesn't mean they owe us anything in regards to their lives. They aren't obligated to inform us of every beat and tick of their existence. In short: we don't own them. They dob't belong to us, and it's just a little bit disturbing that some people think they are owed an explanation because she happened to be involved in some entertainment they liked.

I think it's unfair to equate 'being curious' with 'feeling owed an explanation'.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

IGN should be ashamed of themselves.

 

[Atomski]

I love how they pretty much answer nothing..

Rumors usually start for a reason... Im guessing she was not very happy when she left.

 

[Koppai]

Would be cool if she left to found her own development company :3

To me it feels like she moved on because she wanted to work on something new I bet and the company said no.
Kind of like how Keiji Inafune wanted to keep making Mega Man games and Capcom said no, so he left and now has Mighty No. 9 and that eShop game.

 

[Raytow]

Since Naughty Dog is loved by many people on this board any type of negativity directed at the company is going to be met with people trying to shut down the discussion as quickly as possible. Even PR can't do damage control half as well as members of Gaf can.

You can bet if this happened at some company like Ubisoft with Jade Raymond being let go then the tone would be very different since most people don't really care enough about Ubisoft.

Maybe we all should have kept our mouths shut when Jeff Gerstmann was let go from Gamespot since clearly that was none of our buisness, right?

oh, shut up, you aren't the right people to talk about fanboyism.

 

[prag16]

Why are some people calling for the topic to end because it is "none of our business?" It actually is our business. Naughty Dog made it our business. They put these people out there on press events, interviews and more for gamers to read and watch so that they can connect to the fans and sell their products. That is how these people actually become known. They are trotted out there as a face of a franchise or as part of a company. So when news breaks that involves one or more of these faces, we're just supposed to shrug and say "Oh, it's none of our business!" Sorry, it doesn't work like that. You can't have it both ways.

I agree with you. I lean towards "where there's smoke there's fire" on this so far, but we just don't know enough. But stating that we shouldn't talk about it because "it's not our business" is laughable, and that type of attitude only presenting itself to any significant degree because Naughty Dog is held in such high regard around here.

I personally called for it to end not because I'm defending ND and feel it's none of our business. I called for it to end because after the first few pages it's just been going in circles. There is nothing to gain here at this point, and some people have gotten fairly combative.

Until we have additional information (which will spawn another topic; new news new thread) the only thing that can happen is further bickering with no result.

 

[raebodep]

People would much rather discuss this than discover the clues about Uncharted 4 Naughty Dog has left around the Web. Kinda tells you where some people's interests lay.

Maybe these are the clues!



I think Straley and Druckmann were involved in some way, if not, she probably would have struck down dyer's story like she did the 4chan rumor. I don't see any well wishes from those two either. That Dyer retweet is also interesting.

 

[Corto]

Since Naughty Dog is loved by many people on this board any type of negativity directed at the company is going to be met with people trying to shut down the discussion as quickly as possible. Even PR can't do damage control half as well as members of Gaf can.

You can bet if this happened at some company like Ubisoft with Jade Raymond being let go then the tone would be very different since most people don't really care enough about Ubisoft.

Maybe we all should have kept our mouths shut when Jeff Gerstmann was let go from Gamespot since clearly that was none of our buisness, right?

How is it like inside that box of yours? How do the circumstances surrounding Jeff Gerstmann leaving Gamespot equate Amy Hennig leaving Naughty Dog? Besides the end result for each of the involved? Stop stirring shit.

 

[test_account]

It's pretty obvious SOMETHING went down. Believing IGN's account or not is irrelevant at this point. Nothing has been "cleared up", you can't replace false information with a VOID, shit doesn't work like that. All this statement does is raise even more questions than the validity of IGN's statement.

Maybe someone has already mentioned this, but the part about Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley "forcing out" Amy Hennig has been cleared up though. This is what IGN first wrote:

"Sources claim Hennig was “forced out” by The Last of Us’ Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley, and explained that Uncharted may now come under their control."

You're right that it hasnt been cleared up why she isnt working at Naughty Dog anymore, but i'm sure that Naughty Dog just wanted to clear up that Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley didnt had anything to do with it.

 

[Liamario]

She didn't leave on a happy note and that's likely all we'll ever know.

 

[prag16]

Maybe someone has already mentioned this, but the part about Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley "forcing out" Amy Hennig has been cleared up though. This is what IGN first wrote:

"Sources claim Hennig was “forced out” by The Last of Us’ Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley, and explained that Uncharted may now come under their control."

You're right that it hasnt been cleared up why she isnt working at Naughty Dog anymore, but i'm sure that Naughty Dog just wanted to clear up that Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley didnt had anything to do with it.

The problem (and the reason this conversion has continued on and on and on) is that they haven't really cleared anything up. Saying "these two guys weren't involved" then providing zero additional information other than "no for serious we're not gonna tell you anything but just trust us" doesn't really accomplish a whole lot since it's obvious that SOMETHING went down. But going in circles isn't helping anything. Hopefully this topic dies down until we get some kind of new info.

 

[EmptySpace]

People would much rather discuss this than discover the clues about Uncharted 4 Naughty Dog has left around the Web. Kinda tells you where some people's interests lay.

but naughty dog wants you to focus on their games and not some trivial thing. games are more important, amirite?

there's a reason why people are so into this. yeah you make great games, but people are also interested in the people who are in the forefront of those games.

 

[prwxv3]

Did IGN call Evan Wells, Evan Walls?

 

[Respawn]

This is ridiculous. You want IGN to out a source because you believe the PR statement that Naughty Dogs gave out. Next you're going to tell me that Putin is right in the whole Crimea mess.

This reply is laughable as f. Two people were called out with damaging reputation comments. You do know people go to court for these things? If you throw my name in the mud I will damn well hold you accountable. You all need to stop with this source bullshit.

 

[test_account]

The problem (and the reason this conversion has continued on and on and on) is that they haven't really cleared anything up. Saying "these two guys weren't involved" then providing zero additional information other than "no for serious we're not gonna tell you anything but just trust us" doesn't really accomplish a whole lot since it's obvious that SOMETHING went down. But going in circles isn't helping anything. Hopefully this topic dies down until we get some kind of new info.

True, i just wanted to mention that they (Naughty Dog) wanted to clear up that Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley didnt have anything to do with it, which is what IGN first wrote that their sources said. It doesnt clear up anything regarding why Amy Hennig left indeed, but it does at least clear up that Neil Druckmann and Bruce Straley wasnt the reason.

 

[Sephiroth503]

The problem (and the reason this conversion has continued on and on and on) is that they haven't really cleared anything up. Saying "these two guys weren't involved" then providing zero additional information other than "no for serious we're not gonna tell you anything but just trust us" doesn't really accomplish a whole lot since it's obvious that SOMETHING went down. But going in circles isn't helping anything. Hopefully this topic dies down until we get some kind of new info.

They have cleared up the fact that the two ND employees in question were not involved. That clears up 50% of the discussion. They don't have to tell anyone why someone was let go either other than the person themselves and it will likely be a long time before we ever do hear anything and any NDAs expire.

 

[Maninthemirror]

They have cleared up the fact that the two ND employees in question were not involved. That clears up 50% of the discussion. They don't have to tell anyone why someone was let go either other than the person themselves and it will likely be a long time before we ever do hear anything and any NDAs expire.

And maybe the person who was let go asked ND not to make it public. She might want her privacy on this matter more than what others are allowing her to have

 

[pelican]

IGN should be ashamed of themselves.

IGN is the scourge of videogame "journalism".

As an adult gamer I find their site rather horrific, and I'm not a big fan of their quantity over quality approach.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

Unless you have inside information one way or the other, it's just someone's word against another's (IGN vs ND).

I've worked in the marketing realm for a few years now and have learned to never trust any official statements issued out from large companies - you're lucky if the people who slapped their names at the end of the statement even reviewed the letter, let alone wrote it.

 

[holysan]

Why give a shit about some rumors and not just believe what Naughty Dog says?

 

[Kiant]

IGN should be ashamed of themselves.

Mitch D should be ashamed, but with the way he was marketing his article over twitter I don't think he gives a shit.

 

[atr0cious]

Why give a shit about some rumors and not just believe what Naughty Dog says?

Naughty Dog could've tweeted their good luck wishes to Amy, before the IGN rumor, but they didn't say anything until Gaf had a 20 page thread, and then didn't even back up their talk, other than to say, the guy paying the bills fires people.

 

[noobasuar]

Why give a shit about some rumors and not just believe what Naughty Dog says?

Why should people blindly believe what Naughty Dog says though? I would hope most people employ enough critical thinking skills to not take everything people say at face value.

 

[Alucrid]

Why should people blindly believe what Naughty Dog says though? I would hope most people employ enough critical thinking skills to not take everything people say at face value.

That's why I generally obtain my deductions from cryptic retweets

 

[holysan]

Why should people blindly believe what Naughty Dog says though?

Why not? And what exactly do you hope to achieve by pursuing them? Let’s say the rumors are true, then what?

 

[noobasuar]

That's why I generally obtain my deductions from cryptic retweets

Better to do that then;

My favorite video game company = must be the most amazing people = they would never lie to me.

She could have retweeted any number of people that we're talking about that situation. She could have even created her own tweet which would have taken five seconds. But no she choose to retweet and associate herself with someone that supposedly defamed and slandered her coworkers.

 

[Alucrid]

Better to do that then;

My favorite video game company = must be the most amazing people = they would never lie to me.

She could have retweeted any number of people that we're talking about that situation. She could have even created her own tweet which would have taken five seconds. But no she choose to retweet and associate herself with someone that supposedly defamed and slandered her coworkers.

If you look at other retweets, a few if them are also by Sony employees. Maybe this rabbit hole goes deeper. Maybe it goes all the way to Tretton.

 

[IchigoSharingan]

It's a little weird to see a bunch of people so readily accept that it isn't any of our business, and stating that we should move on. We're on a dedicated gaming enthusiast forum that even had threads about Hideo Kojima's food tweets. I don't think it's unreasonable for people to be interested in knowing the reasons why a celebrated industry figure is parting ways with a celebrated developer.

And forget that since they so adamantly proclaim it's none of our business yet they're in this thread with just as much curiosity.

 

[PJV3]

Better to do that then;

My favorite video game company = must be the most amazing people = they would never lie to me.

She could have retweeted any number of people that we're talking about that situation. She could have even created her own tweet which would have taken five seconds. But no she choose to retweet and associate herself with someone that supposedly defamed and slandered her coworkers.

Perhaps how she feels and the reality are different, Disagreements happen and this time the bosses sided with others.

It doesn't mean co-workers plotted her exit.

 

[Blader]

Why should people blindly believe what Naughty Dog says though? I would hope most people employ enough critical thinking skills to not take everything people say at face value.

Why would Naughty Dog make an official statement explicitly saying Druckman and Straley weren't involved -- a statement that they are by no means obligated to make -- if the opposite was true? Why invite that trouble when they never needed to say anything at all?

If you want to start using critical thinking skills, start questioning why anyone should place any kind of journalistic value and particularly Mitch Dyer.

 

[DarkKyo]

Wow. Nothing like "Amy left to pursue opportunities elsewhere?"

"Things change?"

All I get from that release is "forced out."

I don't get what you're getting at, is this a bad thing? If you want your next game to be as good as it can possibly be and that requires staff changes, why aren't you entitled to make those changes? It sucks she's out of a job at Naughty Dog but you're saying "forced out" like they did something immoral to her. What kind of a world would this be if people kept employees on based on not wanting to hurt their feelings?

 

[prwxv3]

Better to do that then;

My favorite video game company = must be the most amazing people = they would never lie to me.

She could have retweeted any number of people that we're talking about that situation. She could have even created her own tweet which would have taken five seconds. But no she choose to retweet and associate herself with someone that supposedly defamed and slandered her coworkers.

If we are going to use twitter as evidence then I guess Neil did not do anything since he is still being followed by Amy.

using twitter as evidence of anything is stupid

 

[noobasuar]

Why would Naughty Dog make an official statement explicitly saying Druckman and Straley weren't involved -- a statement that they are by no means obligated to make -- if the opposite was true? Why invite that trouble when they never needed to say anything at all?

If you want to start using critical thinking skills, start questioning why anyone should place any kind of journalistic value and particularly Mitch Dyer.

To you're first question I would say they came out and said something because of all the negative responses from people saying thier done with Naughty Dog, not buying another game from them, etc. They obviously don't want thier company to be perceived in a negative light.

As to your second question I would think IGN has way more to lose by tarnishing its reputation with Naughty Dog than it would have to gain from putting up a rumor that they made up.

 

[Maninthemirror]

Better to do that then;

My favorite video game company = must be the most amazing people = they would never lie to me.

She could have retweeted any number of people that we're talking about that situation. She could have even created her own tweet which would have taken five seconds. But no she choose to retweet and associate herself with someone that supposedly defamed and slandered her coworkers.

You seem to be saying the way she retweeted means she was wronged so she must have been wronged and nothing else. You are seeing it from her point of view when in fact the correct point of view can be anyone even naughty dog execs who fired her

Just because nd made the game doesnt make them right and just because she was a good story teller doesnt make her right

We don't have any facts in the matter apart from she was let go

 

[Loakum]

He won't agree but yet he isn't saying it...... So In other words...

She was forced out.

This.

 

[Tripon]

This reply is laughable as f. Two people were called out with damaging reputation comments. You do know people go to court for these things? If you throw my name in the mud I will damn well hold you accountable. You all need to stop with this source bullshit.

If ND thought that IGN committed libel and thought it was worth it to sue for damages, they should do so. On that same token, IGN would not knowingly run a false rumor just for clicks on the very same premise. Nobody likes a lawsuit. This isn't some guy on his blog being passed info, this is IGN, part of a larger corporation that understands what they can and can't publish.

But that's not what you were calling for, you wanted IGN to out a source for your own personal need to denigrate the source, IGN, and whatever else you find fault in this story. Frankly, that's disgusting.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Regardless, the fact that Amy hasn't refuted the rumors like Naughty Dog is telling. Her silence is a hundred times louder than Naughty Dog's denial.

She's probably afraid of getting rape and death threats from the hordes of shitheels out there.

 

[noobasuar]

If ND thought that IGN committed libel and thought it was worth it to sue for damages, they should do so. On that same token, IGN would not knowingly run a false rumor just for clicks on the very same premise. Nobody likes a lawsuit. This isn't some guy on his blog being passed info, this is IGN, part of a larger corporation that understands what they can and can't publish.

But that's not what you were calling for, you wanted IGN to out a source for your own personal need to denigrate the source, IGN, and whatever else you find fault in this story. Frankly, that's disgusting.

Well said.

 

[Crimson_Gold]

If ND thought that IGN committed libel and thought it was worth it to sue for damages, they should do so. On that same token, IGN would not knowingly run a false rumor just for clicks on the very same premise. Nobody likes a lawsuit. This isn't some guy on his blog being passed info, this is IGN, part of a larger corporation that understands what they can and can't publish.

But that's not what you were calling for, you wanted IGN to out a source for your own personal need to denigrate the source, IGN, and whatever else you find fault in this story. Frankly, that's disgusting.

When you want an issue to go away, you don't start a huge lawsuit. You also don't sue one of the major distributors of information for your industry. It would be starting a battle that wouldn't end well at all. Lawsuits aren't the best way to resolve all issues. I thought people would see that there are many layers to this entire business relationship thing.

 

[Netherscourge]

Maybe they heard it from Cboat?

Spoiler

j/k