The AAA market has shrunk considerably as of late.
The indie sign has exploded on Steam and is starting to make some headway with console players via PS+. Previously, outside of a few larger indie games, most were ignored in the console space.
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Amazon FireTV Announced and Released [$99 box, $40 controller, game capable STB]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
The AAA market has shrunk considerably as of late.
The indie sign has exploded on Steam and is starting to make some headway with console players via PS+. Previously, outside of a few larger indie games, most were ignored in the console space.
McHuj
Member
What's worse is that it's even weaker than the ones in their own top tier tablets. I'd rather just play the game on the tablet then, it will probably be a better experience.
Most Blu Ray players do 90% of what this thing does. I'm perplexed as to why anyone would spend $99, a sum that actually buys a decent Blu Ray player today, for something like this. I have a Sony Blu Ray player that is like 3 years old that has all the important apps this thing does. The newer ones are far better, I'm sure.
At least the Apple TV streams stuff off iOS devices.
I just don't see what market this serves.
At least the Apple TV streams stuff off iOS devices.
I just don't see what market this serves.
This is true, but the contraction is coming from sales lost to the Wii audience that transitioned over to mobile. So there will be a total hardware sales contraction, but I would be extremely surprised if the 160m units of 360/PS3 aren't surpassed by the PS4 and Xbox One.
tensuke
Member
No kidding. And how about Angry Birds? On mobile, free, or $.99. On Playstation, $40. On actual consoles you pay certain amounts because you expect certain levels of polish, quality, production, content. On mobile you pay much, much less, if at all, because you expect certain things from there. If you bring a mobile game to a mainline console, you do not price it as a real console game, because the platform hasn't changed the game in any meaningful way, it's just another place to sell it.
I hope that the Fire TV really pushes game support, I mean Amazon did buy some studios for just that. Hopefully it can propel those "mid-tier" games to the spotlight. AAA console games take millions of dollars to create and market, and years of development time. Mobile games typically cost very little to produce, and less time, but we're all familiar with mobile games and I don't think anyone wants a console to play them (sorry Ouya). What we need are games that harken back to the PS1/2 content era. By today's standards, the graphics may not be the best, but they're still a cut above mobile and give actual gameplay experiences that you don't see on Android or iOS. That's the kind of gaming I want to see return. If the Fire TV promotes that, I'm all for it. If that's not what it turns out to be doing, well, at least it did something different in the meantime.
outunderthestars
Banned
The fact that your proposed solution is to plug a laptop into a tv shows how out of touch you are with general consumers.
I don't see why that's relevant. Simply discounting the most popular home console of last generation certainly makes it easier to ignore the contraction, sure.
AstroNut325
Member
There simply isn't enough compelling content or features to choose this over the Roku or AppleTV. You said in your previous post that you see this doing well and better than AppleTV... how are you coming to such a conclusion? Did the Kindle's beat the iPads?
crazygambit
Member
It's supposed to be there already (at least the logo was there during the reveal), but no clue on how it works and if it's closer to Plex HT or the stuff you get on a Smart TV which is a huge fucking difference. They really should have handed some of these before to tech sites. How do you expect people to buy something with so little info. I'd love to read a thorough review of it.
I think this gen will sell less than the last, but I attribute that more to the unexpected success of the Wii and the poor sales of the Wii U. I think at the end of this gen we'll find that the sales of the PS4 + Xbox One > PS3 + 360.
I meant to say that publishers are making more money on individual titles, maybe as a result of them choosing to release fewer, but bigger budget releases. Saying that they are making more money is me not choosing the right words.
I'm not under the illusion that profits are at an all time high. While console sales were up, software sales have gone down from 6th to 7th generation and will likely go down for the 8th. And maybe I am misguided in thinking this, but I do believe it is a result of publishers putting their money on fewer releases and not from a lack of interest.
You said it yourself that Nintendo tried to get out of the traditional console market. They found short-lived success by doing that.
Well it's the same price, it has actual games, it has better hardware, it has a better interface, it's especially great if you're an Amazon user already. It also has about the same app compatibility but give it 6 months and it will probably lap Roku twice over. Really there's 0 reasons to choose anything else in the same class over this at the moment.
Oh god the plex thing just pushed me over the edge. I'm buying one, I'm selling ym Xbone. Anyone want an Xbone? Just $350! Brand new! Original box and everything.
Well the xbox one will be getting universal app support across windows platforms, possibly including plex and many others. Wouldn't bin it just yet
It appears we agree there will likely be market contraction, then. In turn I agree the Wii is primarily the cause, but I don't understand why people are listing this as a good thing, or something which can be dismissed. The Wii was by a wide margin the most profitable home console of last generation. Saying "well it's only contracting because all the profitable consumers are leaving" is pretty good cause for concern.
And also losing more money if those bigger budget releases flop. It goes both ways.
That's possible, and mirrors my own thoughts. The graphics/technical race has certainly been a chief catalyst of a lot of financial troubles for the industry.
God damn it! I just ordered this thing!
Someone stop me from impulse buying electronics!!!
AstroNut325
Member
It's called a wife.
I wouldn't be displeased with a FireTV either. If their appstream service is bringing content or even games that a much more high end, it could really be something special. It may also explain the influx of talent to amazon studios.
All in all, lots of good stuff everywhere soon. Pretty exciting!
outunderthestars
Banned
I don't recall saying that it would do better than the Apple TV, as it has had a seven year head start to reach 10 million units, with four million of those sold in 2013 (i think).
That said, I do believe that Free Time Unlimited, Gaming, Amazon Instant Streaming, an app store, and heavy promotion will make the device a success. I believe that there is a market for inexpensive games delivered digitally and played in the living room. I'm not confident that the FireTV will be the device that pulls it off, but it has the best chance of anything announced thus far.
TetraGenesis
Member
I ask this seriously, not rhetorically: Why should I want this if I already have a PS4? Other than buying it for the exclusive games, what would make this worth the money for me?
If I ever buy a microconsole it will be one from Amazon (I love them) but I'm having to look for reasons. :/
If I ever buy a microconsole it will be one from Amazon (I love them) but I'm having to look for reasons. :/
I did edit my comment, so maybe you didn't see it. But as you said "Nintendo tried to leave the traditional console market" (or something like that). In many ways, the Wii audience was not the traditional console market audience and the health of the system at the time shouldn't be the basis of the health of the industry. Looking back at the Wii-- third party games released on both systems found much more success on the 360 and PS3, despite the respective consoles selling considerably less and having a smaller install base.
I also think that there are very obvious mistakes Nintendo made with the Wii U (and plenty of them) that caused them to not recapture that lost audience.
But you've probably heard all of this before.
You should not. This is is supposed to compete with Roku and Chromecast. Playing games is just one of the features that separates this product from its competitors.
Do you do a lot of media streaming?
Black Door
Banned
At $130, what is better, this or a tablet?
AstroNut325
Member
DOH... my bad. I mistook your post for the one right after yours. I agree there are benefits over the competitors. But if I already have a competitor's product there really isn't much incentive for me to switch unless I'm heavily invested in the Amazon ecosystem. I hope it does well and I hope it sends a swift kick to Apple's butt for the AppleTV but I just don't see it happening. Especially since most TVs you buy today have apps integrated right into the TV. At least with the AppleTV you have airplay and the Apple ecosystem. If Apple brings the app store to the AppleTV it's practically game over for everyone else.
Edit:
My opinion: The FireTv from Amazon.
Where's the Game Streaming service?
I would be all for this if it had OnLive-like streaming of AAA games. That's what I kept waiting to hear about. Charge $150 for the device + controller, let people know you can play small mobile game titles natively...AND play the latest releases from the biggest developers via the Amazon Cloud*
(*really fast connection speed required)
But we didn't hear that today. And we may never hear it. Clearly gaming takes a backseat on this device. At least there's truth-in-advertising; Amazon called its Gaming ability a "Bonus."
.....Having said all that, I bought it for my spare TV. Now it can have some of the fun that my living room TV has had daily for years.
I would be all for this if it had OnLive-like streaming of AAA games. That's what I kept waiting to hear about. Charge $150 for the device + controller, let people know you can play small mobile game titles natively...AND play the latest releases from the biggest developers via the Amazon Cloud*
(*really fast connection speed required)
But we didn't hear that today. And we may never hear it. Clearly gaming takes a backseat on this device. At least there's truth-in-advertising; Amazon called its Gaming ability a "Bonus."
.....Having said all that, I bought it for my spare TV. Now it can have some of the fun that my living room TV has had daily for years.
I'm curious as to what kind of cross-platform support there will be for apps/games between the Kindle Fire/Amazon App Store and the FireTV. If I can play my existing Amazon App Store games (or free updates thereof) on the FireTV, it becomes more compelling.
Do you have an internet-ready TV or an internet-ready device hooked up to your TV/monitor? If so, there's little reason to consider the FireTV.
Do you have an internet-ready TV or an internet-ready device hooked up to your TV/monitor? If so, there's little reason to consider the FireTV.
It really is absolutely ridiculous at this point. Yet I am certain you could ask people about ps2 games, n64 games, 360 games etc and they would all gush about them
cookie-monster
Member
I'd like this but I don't want to start getting into HDMI switches and the headaches. I will wait to see if the UK version has any decent streaming services I guess. Still can't beat pirating TV shows for the bulk of my TV content, WDTV uber alles.
outunderthestars
Banned
Agreed. a $99 Apple TV with apps and games is a home run. Sadly Apple seems to be a bit too conservative for their own good at times.
There really isn't much of a reason. Then again you are comparing a $100 device to a $400 one. I might keep one just because it is easier to boot up for quick Netflix sessions and to have an actual remote. That and watch espn as I don't have cable tv but access to a login thanks to my job.
Jill Sandwich
the turds of Optimus Prime
Has that Google TV/OUYA smell about it, but it'll linger like a bad fart since it'll be constantly pumped with Amazon bucks.
Edit- The AppleTV has an App Store, its called AirPlay.
Edit- The AppleTV has an App Store, its called AirPlay.
outunderthestars
Banned
Graphics Horse
Member
It's not like it hasn't been rumoured to be happening this year too.
Begun, the microconsole wars have.
The Amazon Box is the first real attempt at pushing the Google/Apple paradigm to the set-top box realm in regards to games. However, Apple's, Google's, and Samsung's smartphones and tablets tend to be best convergence devices in the portable realm. If that is applied to the television, the video game console as defined by Sony and Microsoft is likely the best convergence device since it plays disc content, streams and plays digital media, as well as play the majority of games on physical or digital media.
Well, there will obviously be a contraction of the console market just on the fact that most of the 100 million Wii owners just up and left leaving the Wii U in its current DOA state. Whether this will affect that other 180 million or so which support the PlayStation and Xbox brands is the bigger question. I don't think it will, though Xbox One will lose market share while PlayStation will gain it. However, that 180 million that PlayStation and Xbox have has shown that the audience for traditional consoles hasn't grown beyond what the PS2 and OG Xbox managed back in the day, so it certainly isn't a growth market. It is possible that PlayStation and Xbox have achieved a sort of Coke/Pepsi duopoly at this point, namely two core gaming brands that are basically interchangeable for the majority of core gamers.
I think the better question is if something like the Fire TV will appeal to the MIA Wii audience, and if Google's, Apple's, and Samsung's eventual answer to it will cause that market to be split four ways. Systems like these likely won't appeal to the majority of the PlayStation/Xbox fanbase, but appealing to the former Wii fanbase is possible. Remember that the Wii and DS were pretty much the only platforms of their era that appealed to the casual market, while we now how Google, Apple, Samsung, and Amazon as the main companies trying to appeal to that market segment now.
At the very least, I'll give Kindle TV credit for being a better device for gaming than the Ouya and a decent enough multimedia device when compared to Roku and Apple TV. I would prefer a stock Android solution for $99 though and will wait on hearing if Android Apps can be sideloaded onto Kindle TV, as the majority of Android games I own are from the Humble Bundle.
They aren't porting anything, the game is already on android devices.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I was going to order one but I policed myself and realized my PS3 does everything I need it to do and destroys this thing as far as games go. I would rather get a Vita TV given how invested I am in the PS ecosystem. This is still a good price but I feel there are other devices which do a lot of the same.
It is discounting the audience. The majority of the people who bought PS3s and 360s (and contributed to sales of titles like GTA5) have minimal overlap with the Wii audience. Basically every person who bought a Wii as a casual gaming device for Wii Sports or Wii Fit no longer buys consoles. That will significantly contract hardware sale totals, but will have zero impact on the sales of core software like Call of Duty, Assassins Creed, etc. It is an incredibly important distinction.
Most profitable for the hardware manufacture maybe, but software sales did nothing on the Wii outside of Nintendo products and Just Dance. For software developers of core titles, 360 and PS3 far and away surpassed the Wii.
And the audience for the Wii was largely an audience that didn't exist prior to that specific console, yet the game industry existed and was profitable. It isn't a major concern because the industry is just shedding the fickle "blue ocean" market, which is a market very few companies managed to profit from last generation.
CaptainTiptop
Member
Dat Amazon Prime, man.
geordiemp
Member
Thank you ...made me laugh