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Xbox One beats PS4 on Black Friday, according to market-research firm

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Elios83

Member
I think it's very likely that Microsoft edged out the PS4 in November because of price drops and crazy deals throughout the whole month (and they better should....otherwise the message would be that people don't want to buy this product whatever Microsoft does).
But this is just a survey....which has proved to be inaccurate last year as well.
 

Servbot24

Banned
Better console how? because it has some cross platform games at higher resolution?

Meh.

Considering only the hardware's gaming capabilities, PS4 is objectively better.

Multimedia functions and game library in consideration make the distinction completely subjective.
 
If MS "won" then good one them. I would be interested to see how they can keep the kind of deals they're offering going into 2015.

If they can't - then all if this is rather moot isnt it?

They can't, so you're right. While November will be a big deal around here, in the grand scheme who sells 100k more than the other guys just doesn't matter.
 
I'm kinda stunned at how badly Wii U faired in terms of deals presumably Microsoft worked with the retailers since they were all offering big discounts ($329) despite having 2 games free AND target giving $50 card on top, incredible deals

PS4 bundle also was a good deal since you got 2 of the highest rated games in years for free

Wii U was terrible value in comparison. best buy had it for $360 with 2 extra games, but personally I am not into platformers (or smash bros) so it would have been a waste of money for me (had they included say MK8 & zelda I would have been tempted)

I have bought some Wii U games on heavy discounts like W101 since I am buying a Wii U when X comes out. I really wanted to get one this Black Friday but the deals were just not there.
 
Because it's not "just a $50 cheaper price point" from where I'm standing.

Right now we're talking about a system that is selling for $329 in a huge amount of places with two games, and sometimes extra bonus deals like gift cards depending on what you're looking at. I mean Microsoft store that shit with another free game on top, it just no limit to how low they're willing to go this month.

PS4 for the most part - with ebay exception - has been $399, with TLOU and GTAV. Which isn't a bad deal and I think Sony was right keeping it at that price given their financial situation and the fact the PS4 was already selling quite decently.

So we're actually talking a $70 difference really at minimum, and stores are still throwing the kitchen sink in with it during Black Friday week. When you start adding in the way so many stores are incentivizing the Black Friday Xbox purchase - what a doorbuster really should mean - you're talking gaps that can range from $70-$130.

Couple that with a more compelling AAA exclusive lineup on average for the Holiday season, and I think they definitely have what it takes to match Sony's gap in September

We shall see.

But doesn't a sales lead like that depend on other factors, too?

Product appeal, mainly. I'm not saying this is the case for even the bulk of customers, but XBO-whether you think it fair or not-gained a rather nasty reputation after May/June last year. Then you saw momentum drop heavily in January, and deals start as soon as February (or March), for a system that just launched November the previous year! That sort of bundling/pricing trend isn't in line w/ what even casual consumers think of as healthy w/ a new console that's selling well.

That narrative's been the case for most of the year, up until this month actually, and now suddenly it's going to result in a massive leap ahead for the console that's only $50/$70/*$130 (tbh I've not heard of any deals putting it this low; all I know of is Target's gift-card offer that puts it at $329) lower than it's competitor, who was routinely $100 cheaper for 8 months, and never saw that kind of boost?

Alright, it's November. I get that much, but if that sort of boost happens I think it'd mean 3 things.

1: Sony massively undershipped for November (and BF) in NA. Don't see this being the case. Maybe didn't match launch shipments but definitely didn't under-ship either. Or maybe they did.

2: It's about a lot more than price: The only exclusives XBO has this holiday that I'd actually say are damn good, are FH2 and SO. MCC is broken so hard to recommend, and all the other exclusives are from earlier this year or launch. I guess w/ the lower price, casual consumers may take a 2nd look and say "well now I think this game is worth it since I've got extra money", for games they may've passed on before like Ryse or Killer Instinct. But by that notion that should still happen w/ PS4, even w/o a price cut, simply b/c shoppers tend to have more money on the holidays. This might be more of a thing when December comes and Sony maintains that price for any other bundles.

3: Massive momentum shift in favor of XBO for forseeable future: This just isn't happening. Not b/c it'd be impossible if the games were there...but they aren't there. For the first half of 2015 XBO is like a wasteland for new exclusive releases. MS just sucks at spreading out their releases, this is known. Meanwhile PS4 has at least two major AAA exclusives coming in the 1st half, and other stuff like Tomorrow Children and Guilty Gear coming in the 2nd half. XBO has the Halo 5 demo but that's just a demo; of what we know all they have for the holidays is Halo 5 and maybe Quantum Break, which I doubt b/c that's when RoTTR comes out and I don't know if MS wants to release a new IP only for it to be immediately swallowed up by that game.

So even if XBO does take the holidays....what do they honestly have in terms of games for 2015's first half to carry it? An OS update? That isn't a game, it's a software feature. They have indies like Cuphead and Oni that will probably come in the first half, but how many people will buy a $349 console to play them (personally I'd really like to play Cuphead myself but not for a $349 entrance fee)? Where are the AAA games in those months to help drive more sales?

..........

Like I said before MS has the money to just sit that out, but personally I think it's a lazy strategy; they should spread out their releases better and stop relying on just Nov+Dec like their lives depend on it, in order to show they care about satisfying gamers year round.
 

Cheech

Member
nope cause it will last you longer with better first party support, better specs AND all around better multiplats. Not just higher resolution but with more and better effects and improved framerates.

This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.
 

FrankT

Member
Sounds like MS will have an incredible holiday season. No doubt solidifying their number 2 position WW and looking very solid in the US. 2015 I have no doubt will be big. Good job Phil and Co.
 

Idba

Member
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

I dont always hate, but when i do, i really do it.

Also no, they didnt deserve 5/10.
 
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

Maybe you should check because otherwise your entire post is just conjecture.
 
Infoscout last Black Friday:

http://blog.infoscout.co/black-friday-console-war/

HVCOTbi.jpg


Methodology last Black Friday:

"Of over 102k shopping receipts tracked by InfoScout on Black Friday, slightly over 1,500 included purchases of a gaming console or console game. The data includes purchases at all major retailers carrying electronics including Walmart, Target, Best Buy, GameStop, RadioShack, and others. For more information related to our data and panel representation, visit our data page."

Aqua, maybe I'm missing it but why couldn't the XBO have won black Friday last year in NA and still lost November? The PS4 did have a better value proposition then and launched sooner in the month. It being a launch November means that black Friday wasn't as big a deal as sales were mega huge all month regardless.

Are you saying this survey is flat out wrong and XBO didn't win Black Friday or are you saying it doesn't matter because there was no correlation last year? Either way I think the premise is wrong when you consider my first paragraph.
 

kinoki

Illness is the doctor to whom we pay most heed; to kindness, to knowledge, we make promise only; pain we obey.
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

Don't drag Driveclub into the mediocrity of Knack and Killzone. Driveclub is one of the best racing games out there. And can stand proud next to any racer out there. (If you don't account for the shoddy online.)

Also, I think it's been proven that apart from Titanfall (which is an exclusive in the sense that you need to squint with your brain in order for the logic to work) no exclusive has mattered for hardware sales this generation, so far. That means that no matter the inherit quality of the titles only Titanfall has moved hardware to any degree. The only exclusive I can see move consoles next year is Bloodborne. Halo 5 and Uncharted 4 is selling to the, by then, established installbase.
 
Aqua, maybe I'm missing it but why couldn't the XBO have won black Friday last year in NA and still lost November?

No reason. Might have happened.

Are you saying this survey is flat out wrong and XBO didn't win Black Friday or are you saying it doesn't matter because there was no correlation last year?

Maybe Aqua sees different numbers, but I've never seen any NPD breakout of just individual days. I don't even think they get daily numbers from some retailers, so I don't know if anyone knows which box sold more on last black friday.

Plus, there's a lot that makes this particular survey unreliable. There's no reason to believe that this survey has any correlation to actual national performance.
 

DrM

Redmond's Baby
Is there any info on how many of ~182.000 receipts had consoles on it? They published the number in 2013 (more than 1500), but not this year.
 

Prine

Banned
nope cause it will last you longer with better first party support, better specs AND all around better multiplats. Not just higher resolution but with more and better effects and improved framerates.

Not true at all, multiplats haven't been so different such that the experience has been compromised significantly, X1 is more than capable of keeping up so far, and first party support is subjective. As a console that offers compelling content for gamers, x1 is just as worthy as PS4 based on your criteria.
 

InkUBus

Banned
I think will all the reports we saw last week with X1 outselling ps4 in UK plus this it's safe to assume that a lot of the last year was based on price point..but that's how I see it
 
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

I love how you're apply subjective thought like objective declarations. And you've forgotten InFamous; that actually sits pretty high up on Metacritic (personally I don't care for Metacritic), and you've forgotten about indie games like Resogun, which are also high up there. Unless indie games don't count, or something?

Do anime games count? GG Xrd's going to be the default best fighter this gen anyway, maybe until SF5, and that's a PS4 exclusive for the foreseeable future.

Maybe you should check on some things before stating uninformed opinions as fact.
 
Aqua, maybe I'm missing it but why couldn't the XBO have won black Friday last year in NA and still lost November? The PS4 did have a better value proposition then and launched sooner in the month. It being a launch November means that black Friday wasn't as big a deal as sales were mega huge all month regardless.

Are you saying this survey is flat out wrong and XBO didn't win Black Friday or are you saying it doesn't matter because there was no correlation last year? Either way I think the premise is wrong when you consider my first paragraph.

No reason. Might have happened.



Maybe Aqua sees different numbers, but I've never seen any NPD breakout of just individual days. I don't even think they get daily numbers from some retailers, so I don't know if anyone knows which box sold more on last black friday.

Plus, there's a lot that makes this particular survey unreliable. There's no reason to believe that this survey has any correlation to actual national performance.

I don't know why people keep thinking that post I made means the 2014 numbers are ridiculous. I never said that...the only thing I said is that you need to be skeptical about these results.
 

warheat

Member
Of course they will win November, it would a total disaster if they don't at that price. The question is if they can keep that price after BF, because if they don't, it would be hard to sell more.
 

Conduit

Banned
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.


Sorry man, but your post is pretty meaningless.
 

Death2494

Member
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

What happens at the beginning of 2015 when Microsoft moves the price back to $400? We also know Microsoft floods the retail chain around this time of year.
 

Curufinwe

Member
I love how you're apply subjective thought like objective declarations. And you've forgotten InFamous; that actually sits pretty high up on Metacritic (personally I don't care for Metacritic), and you've forgotten about indie games like Resogun, which are also high up there. Unless indie games don't count, or something?

Do anime games count? GG Xrd's going to be the default best fighter this gen anyway, maybe until SF5, and that's a PS4 exclusive for the foreseeable future.

Maybe you should check on some things before stating uninformed opinions as fact.

Injustice was another one certain people conveniently leave out despite including Titanfall as a highly rated Xbone exclusive.
 
Infoscout last Black Friday:

http://blog.infoscout.co/black-friday-console-war/

HVCOTbi.jpg


Methodology last Black Friday:

"Of over 102k shopping receipts tracked by InfoScout on Black Friday, slightly over 1,500 included purchases of a gaming console or console game. The data includes purchases at all major retailers carrying electronics including Walmart, Target, Best Buy, GameStop, RadioShack, and others. For more information related to our data and panel representation, visit our data page."

PS4 - 1138K
XB1 - 909K
360 - 647K
PS3 - 425K
WIU - 223K
WII - 83K

I don't trust this poll.
 

rpg_fan

Member
They can't, so you're right. While November will be a big deal around here, in the grand scheme who sells 100k more than the other guys just doesn't matter.

That's kind of my take as well. And of course I wonder how much xbox will suffer in 2015 now that the expectation is crazy-assed deals. I just can't see the division being allowed to just lose money forever trying to win some 'war' that mostly matters to us.

That being said, if losing a ton of money for two months really does turn around the perception, then maybe it's money well spent? Just a little hard to wrap my mind around hemorrhaging money being a good thing.
 
While it's hard to know if these numbers are accurate, what I will say is I found Sony's strategy in the US completely different to that in the UK.

Sony UK have really been pushing the system price and bundle wise to combat the XBone. Matching the £329 first drop, then again on BF dropping the price to £299 with game/s. and bundling the system with the MS marketed games, CoD/Fifa. They've done a great job of trying to stave of the MS threat. Yet in the US, Sony practically didn't do a lot from what I can see. Other than the BF bundles which was the same price as normal but with 2 free games (which is still good), they didn't look to be very competitive in pricing or bundling beyond that. And while that's been fine for most of the year, even with many MS promotions, an up to $70 cheaper Xbox with games is a big threat you can't ignore. Now I don't know how long MS can keep that up for and how much they can afford to lose on a system (which I'm very much assuming they will be) but it gives the platform momentum, especially when many millions of 360 owners will be looking to upgrade, that could turn the tide in the US to the other side.

Of course, I know Sony will still be very happy with what they're shifting at the price they are and no doubt making money, but it's weird to see how competitive they have been in the UK vs what they have or haven't done in the US. A massive market that Sony really could do with staying ahead in. We'll have to wait for the numbers but most signs would point to an XBone win. However big or small that is, it's still a market I think Sony need to fight harder for and I'm not sure the BF bundles were enough. It is just one month (or 2) and the lead I doubt will be greatly diminished but it means the XBone does gain momentum and ultimately the advantage if Sony don't get their finger out. I know next year Sony have a few exclusives early on which could help vs the XBone line up, but they'll need to get better competitively still IMO and a price reduction needs to happen if Nov/Dec aren't as strong as it should have been.
 

Xando

Member
They can't, so you're right. While November will be a big deal around here, in the grand scheme who sells 100k more than the other guys just doesn't matter.

I agree it won't count much, it's very entertaining to see GAF and MS hyping it up though :p
 
XBone does however for Sony.. .them Bluray royalties ;)

lol i had forgotten about that

This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

i don't always laugh at other's posts, but when i do, i laugh at this post


metacritic really? your gonna resort to that?

mad catz quality controller? hyperbole at it's finest

sony needing to "clean up" the quality of their games? smh
 

Brewmont

Banned
What happens at the beginning of 2015 when Microsoft moves the price back to $400? We also know Microsoft floods the retail chain around this time of year.

Who says that will definitely happen? I know they only list their discount through December, but depending on how well sales are, they may just keep it as is. So many things are subject to change, so it's weird seeing anyone post as if it's all set in stone.
 
While it's hard to know if these numbers are accurate, what I will say is I found Sony's strategy in the US completely different to that in the UK.

Sony UK have really been pushing the system price and bundle wise to combat the XBone. Matching the £329 first drop, then again on BF dropping the price to £299 with game/s. and bundling the system with the MS marketed games, CoD/Fifa. They've done a great job of trying to stave of the MS threat. Yet in the US, Sony practically didn't do a lot from what I can see. Other than the BF bundles which was the same price as normal but with 2 free games (which is still good), they didn't look to be very competitive in pricing or bundling beyond that. And while that's been fine for most of the year, even with many MS promotions, an up to $70 cheaper Xbox with games is a big threat you can't ignore. Now I don't know how long MS can keep that up for and how much they can afford to lose of a system (which I'm very much assuming they will be) but it gives the platform momentum, especially when many millions of 360 owners will be looking to upgrade, that could turn the tide in the US to the other side.

Of course, I know Sony will still be very happy with what they're shifting at the price they are and no doubt making money, but it's weird to see how competitive they have been in the UK vs what they have or haven't done in the US. A massive market that Sony really could do with staying ahead in. We'll have to wait for the numbers but most sign would point to an XBone win. However big or small that is, it's still a market I think Sony need to fight harder for.


not really. this xbone win isn't going to make ps4 lose.

it isn't like no one bought a ps4 the past weekend.

to people saying, "hope sony responds." i mean sony isn't going to respond to xbone selling 200k units more if overall ps4 is ahead by 5-6 million units.

also, this should've been the right price for both. we all know ps4 is more powerful so it makes sense that it is more expensive. too bad there's parity because i think sony is banking on theirachine's power to make it sell through better versions of the games.
 

Death2494

Member
Who says that will definitely happen? I know they only list their discount through December, but depending on how well sales are, they may just keep it as is. So many things are subject to change, so it's weird seeing anyone post as if it's all set in stone.

http://news.xbox.com/2014/10/xbox-one-special-savings

"The holidays are starting early this year as the Season of Xbox will begin on November 2, when Xbox One will be available for a special, limited-time promotional offer of $349 in the U.S. Special promotional pricing of $50 off the console of your choice applies to any Xbox One console, including special edition bundles, offering some of the year’s most anticipated games - Assassin’s Creed Unity, Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare and Sunset Overdrive. With Xbox One available at its best price yet, and savings up to $150 off select bundles, there’s never been a better time to own an Xbox One."
 

Mario007

Member
Who says that will definitely happen? I know they only list their discount through December, but depending on how well sales are, they may just keep it as is. So many things are subject to change, so it's weird seeing anyone post as if it's all set in stone.

And continue eating the costs for how long? This is a console that went from 500 to 350 in a space of a year. You can be damn sure they are making quite a big loss per console. A GAF already roughly worked out from MS financial papers that they expect Xbox losses to be around a billion when you look at the overal division's growth and the estimate for growth from other areas within the division that were predicted.
 

M.D

Member
http://news.xbox.com/2014/10/xbox-one-special-savings

"The holidays are starting early this year as the Season of Xbox will begin on November 2, when Xbox One will be available for a special, limited-time promotional offer of $349 in the U.S. Special promotional pricing of $50 off the console of your choice applies to any Xbox One console, including special edition bundles, offering some of the year’s most anticipated games - Assassin’s Creed Unity, Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare and Sunset Overdrive. With Xbox One available at its best price yet, and savings up to $150 off select bundles, there’s never been a better time to own an Xbox One."
The one thing I like about Microsoft is they never backtrack on their statements. If they say something, you better believe it!
 

Kuro

Member
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Sony's exclusives so far have been really damn bad, actually. I haven't checked, but I wouldn't be shocked if the average meta was in the 70s. And for some, like Knack/Killzone/Driveclub, that's EXCEPTIONALLY generous. Those games deserved 5/10 at best. Just straight up shit.

That's my biggest disappointment with the system, actually, besides the 2002 era Mad Catz build quality controller. I hope Bloodbourne is good.

At the end of the day, I'm glad both systems are selling well. But God, Sony needs to clean up the quality of their exclusive games.

I can't take anyone seriously when they say the DS4 is Mad Catz quality
 

PhatSaqs

Banned
And continue eating the costs for how long? This is a console that went from 500 to 350 in a space of a year. You can be damn sure they are making quite a big loss per console. A GAF already roughly worked out from MS financial papers that they expect Xbox losses to be around a billion when you look at the overal division's growth and the estimate for growth from other areas within the division that were predicted.
Kinect wasnt a price drop…
 
I don't know why people keep thinking that post I made means the 2014 numbers are ridiculous. I never said that...the only thing I said is that you need to be skeptical about these results.

Got you. To be fair you never really explained what you were trying to relay. So we agree that the two results you posted aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.
 
I don't know why people keep thinking that post I made means the 2014 numbers are ridiculous. I never said that...the only thing I said is that you need to be skeptical about these results.

Agreed.

But have you ever seen a daily breakdown? They've been threatening to go weekly for years now, but I've never heard they even had access to daily. Do you know?
 

Megatron

Member
Aqua, maybe I'm missing it but why couldn't the XBO have won black Friday last year in NA and still lost November? The PS4 did have a better value proposition then and launched sooner in the month. It being a launch November means that black Friday wasn't as big a deal as sales were mega huge all month regardless.

Are you saying this survey is flat out wrong and XBO didn't win Black Friday or are you saying it doesn't matter because there was no correlation last year? Either way I think the premise is wrong when you consider my first paragraph.


I think he's trying to discredit this firm because they said the xb1 won Black Friday and they didn't win November, so he thinks that somehow proves something.

Last Black Friday it was impossible to find a ps4 but I personally saw some xb1's but no ps4's. Sony sold their systems before Black Friday, they sold every system they shipped basically. So it's very conceivable and even likely that his survey was right.
 
not really. this xbone win isn't going to make ps4 lose.

it isn't like no one bought a ps4 the past weekend.

to people saying, "hope sony responds." i mean sony isn't going to respond to xbone selling 200k units more if overall ps4 is ahead by 5-6 million units.

also, this should've been the right price for both. we all know ps4 is more powerful so it makes sense that it is more expensive. too bad there's parity because i think sony is banking on theirachine's power to make it sell through better versions of the games.

But a MS win could give them an advantage and momentum going forward. It could be the start of MS consistently outselling the PS4. Which is the point I'm ultimately making. Give them an inch and they take a mile sort of thing. The XBone is now cheaper than the PS4 (and it's certainly not going back up in price) so MS has price on it's side now. There are millions of 360 owners yet to upgrade and when the time is right, now and in the future, are they going to opt for a more expensive system or the one they're more familiar with, which their other 360 mates may have perhaps upgraded to as well. And recently, with parity and games you're not seeing a huge difference, means the technical superiority of the PS4 isn't as strong or meaningful to most, as it was say 6 months or so ago. Price and power were certainly on Sony's side but one has been reversed and the other isn't so important to the masses if they are getting it for less and their friends have one too.

As I said, Sony will still be very happily with selling millions this holiday and MS winning takes nothing from that, but if they are behind and MS gains more traction, that lead can easily be wiped and gives MS the lead in a market Sony needs to really get behind and not let the competition steam roll them again like last time.
 

Broly

Banned
nope cause it will last you longer with better first party support, better specs AND all around better multiplats. Not just higher resolution but with more and better effects and improved framerates.

Debatable. Better specs, sure, those can or will (and must imo) result to better visuals. Better first party support is unclear so far. I don't expect the same first party draught as during the 360 era, Microsoft Sudios has grown significantly over the past years. Another thing which is not unimportant is the fact that Microsoft will unify the Windows store over all its devices, Windows 10 and Xbox One (and Windows Phone etc.) will share the same (app)store. This could be a big deal to many people. Neither consoles are by definition better than the other.
 

system11

Member
This isn't even close to true. The Xbone has had better exclusive games by any metric.

Don't know why people keep saying this as if it is true. It really depends on the games you like. I never liked the Halo series and Sunset Overdrive doesn't appeal at all. I don't care about LBP3 or a remake of a story based game I completed last year. As such on the 'retail exclusives' front they look about the same to me.

On the other hand I play quite a few indie titles and the PS4 has really shone in that department.
 

cakely

Member
The one thing I like about Microsoft is they never backtrack on their statements. If they say something, you better believe it!

Absolutely.

Absolutely no plans at all. We think Kinect is an integral part of our platform. All of the magical experiences that you get, both as a games-player and also the way you navigate the system are made even more amazing because of Kinect.

Kinect is part of the Xbox One. It is part of the experience that we're building. It's as fundamental to the platform as the controller is in many ways. It sounds like I'm making up an excuse, but I think someone [could say], 'What if I shipped Xbox One without a controller, because you would prefer a different controller than the one I'm shipping?
 

Ursiform

Banned
With what little data we have, it appears that the XB1 actually costs more to produce than the PS4 (ESRAM / size of chipset). They may make a few $ when selling @ $399, but $349 is pretty much a net loss.

Not only do you know for a fact that the bone is sold for a loss, you know the exact threshold within 50 USD. Please share this data.

MS's latest investor call had the following quote:



In the same quarter last year, their revenue was 4.7 billion. Given that they expect Surface revenue/profit to show an uptrend, that means they estimate that the Xbox business is going to contribute a billion dollars in lost revenue this holiday.

And it's not hiding a loss. It's that any negatives are offset by other profit streams, like XBLive revenue, Surface profits, etc. It's no different from other businesses, where the good parts cover up for the weaker ones.

You keep equating revenue and profit. A YoY loss in revenue doesn't say anything about the profitability of the division, let alone individual products.

Look everyone my opinion is that they are loss leading to some extent or another right now, but we needed to stop presenting it as a matter of fact.
 
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