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[borghe]

It is interest free until you actually get the game so until then it is an interest free loan. Because other investors or banks would require a return on their money in addition to the principal amount.

The interest of fun and excitement of a new Shenmue game are probably worth it. But monetarily it is an interest free loan.

You really don't understand how kickstarter (or venture capitalism) works. Boyes laid it right out in the youtube clip.

a) sony isn't publishing this. yes they will see licensing fees and likely a cut based on their investment.. but only the same they see from any third party or invested external project.
b) projects on kickstarter are NEVER expected to have kickstarter and their ONLY source of funding. Kickstarter is merely a SINGLE source of funding. The same way most projects in this world see funding from a multitude of places. That people always get pissy when a Kickstarter project gets funding or publishing from an external-to-the-dev company just goes to show exactly how many people truly don't understand how venture capitalism and investment work.
c) the kickstarter is simply there to say (as it OFTEN IS), "is there interest in this?". Big money kickstarters are rarely there to say "give us this money as it's all we have to spend". It's more a gauge of interest. "If we raise $2M on Kickstarter, we can assume to see another $5M in post-release sales, meaning we can probably raise another $3M in external funding", etc.
d) add a, b and c together and you can see exactly where Sony fits into this. They are merely another investor. The kickstarter was backed, Yu Suzuki (and probably sony) have an idea of how big the game will probably be at minimum, so probably have a reasonable idea on how much they can safely commit to the project for a return on investment.

I think it goes down to the PC version. Sony doesn't fund PC games. Somewhere, someone--Sega? Suzuki?--wanted a PC version and didn't want to pay for it. Sony pays for development and kickstarter funds the PC port.

Somebody here would prefer Shenmue 3 to be made on a shoestring budget?

At any rate, the game comes out unless something happens to Suzuki.

I believe PubFund (by Sony) merely stipulated an exclusive console launch. Pretty sure indie games came out under PubFund that saw PC releases simultaneous with PS3.. PubFund reimbursed 50% (up to $500K(?)) of the ENTIRE development of the project under those terms.. as long as it didn't launch on 360 or Wii/WiiU at the same time as PS3.

Sony really doesn't see the PC as a competing platform. The only thing Sony WON'T do is actually publish a game for PC.

 

[B_Boss]

Sigh.....amazing. Any chance we'll see a collection with the first 2 alongside 3? I own 1 and will own 3 but not 2 since I never owned an XB.

 

[xxracerxx]

I think it goes down to the PC version. Sony doesn't fund PC games. Somewhere, someone--Sega? Suzuki?--wanted a PC version and didn't want to pay for it. Sony pays for development and kickstarter funds the PC port.

Somebody here would prefer Shenmue 3 to be made on a shoestring budget?

At any rate, the game comes out unless something happens to Suzuki.

Street Fighter V.

 

[Windom Earle]

A lot of people don't seem to realise this. No-one has spent a cent as of now. If people aren't happy they simply are not spending money and are backing out. It's that simple.

Yup, on top of that we already knew yesterday 99% that Sony was behind this. Actual Shenmue fans are very happy that it is the case.

I am not even mad, this weird discussion is just more promo for the game. Thanks detractors!

 

[sometimes i game]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

 

[Moofers]

Father's Heaven...

 

[MiszMasz]

Nine Dragons.

 

[Faustek]

what the fuck is adam boyes? is there a smoother motherfucker out there? jeez. (in reference to that mod abuse)

For a while I thought this guy was the smoothest. uhm...Maybe NSFW. Depends on how boring you are I reckon.

Edit: From the Movie "Do the right thing"

 

[borghe]

Sigh.....amazing. Any chance we'll see a collection with the first 2 alongside 3? I own 1 and will own 3 but not 2 since I never owned an XB.

SEGA owns Shenmue, and thus those two games. It seems they've given the rights to Yu Suzuki to make them into movies, but I'm guessing they'd be less receptive to giving him the rights to port 1 and 2.

More likely is that this becomes INCREDIBLY popular (arguably already is) and SEGA decides to port the games themselves.

Spoiler

f2p for phones. please don't kill me.

 

[kyser73]

See I would be all for this, but the thing is that you could end paying for a product that is never made. I'm sure everything will go fine with Shenmue I'm just worried about publishers jumping aboard this train with other games and those projects falling through.

That's the 'risk' part of financial backing, investment or pre-pre-ordering or whatever you want to call it.

 

[Windom Earle]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

 

[4Tran]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

Some people also have the laughable impression that if you can't get all of your game funds through Kickstarter, your game is somehow tainted. It's like an illustration of the Dunning-Kruger effect where the less you know about a subject, the more you think you're an expert on it.

SEGA owns Shenmue, and thus those two games. It seems they've given the rights to Yu Suzuki to make them into movies, but I'm guessing they'd be less receptive to giving him the rights to port 1 and 2.

More likely is that this becomes INCREDIBLY popular (arguably already is) and SEGA decides to port the games themselves.

Spoiler

f2p for phones. please don't kill me.

Nah, Sega loves publishing on PC nowadays.

 

[kyser73]

A lot of people don't seem to realise this. No-one has spent a cent as of now. If people aren't happy they simply are not spending money and are backing out. It's that simple.

If you're going to put up cash into a project and can't be arsed to even read the T&Cs you deserve everything you get IMO.

 

[MiszMasz]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

Yes, Sony did this because they're desperate for $2mil that doesn't even go to them.

But please, enlighten us with your industry insider experience and knowledge.

 

[Somnid]

This should have been disclosed straight up when Yu Suzuki got on stage. I mean it's a tad scummy to angel invest only after fans throw down big bucks (the average pledge is quite high) but I think it's tolerable so long as people know that.

 

[4Tran]

If you're going to put up cash into a project and can't be arsed to even read the T&Cs you deserve everything you get IMO.

To be fair, this is going to be the first Kickstarter for a lot of backers.

This should have been disclosed straight up when Yu Suzuki got on stage. I mean it's a tad scummy to angel invest only after fans throw down big bucks (the average pledge is quite high) but I think it's tolerable so long as people know that.

Fans dropped big bucks because they're entralled by the idea of a new Shenmue game and because they wanted the rewards. I doubt very many are going to be upset that the game is going to be bigger than they expected because Sony is willing to open their chequebook.

 

[Galactic Barret]

See I would be all for this, but the thing is that you could end paying for a product that is never made. I'm sure everything will go fine with Shenmue I'm just worried about publishers jumping aboard this train with other games and those projects falling through.

Don't you get a refund once a project fails? I'm sure if a big publisher were to skip with a relatively paltry (for a big pub) 1-2M, the backlash from fans, stockholders and legal entities would be enough to prevent someome like Acti or EA from running with *your* contribution.

I see few real negatives to this. It could be a game changer for gamers and developers alike.

 

[kuroshiki]

This should have been disclosed straight up when Yu Suzuki got on stage. I mean it's a tad scummy to angel invest only after fans throw down big bucks (the average pledge is quite high) but I think it's tolerable so long as people know that.

.....

Sony giving Yu suzuki a prime stage of their prime time conference call.

Kickstarter goal 2 million, for game previously created with over 50 million dollars.

I don't know man. It was all in the writing. No one who's sane enough will believe Sony just gave Yu a spot because 'lol we like you', nor no one should believe 2 mil is enough to make any decent B-tier game.

 

[Littlefang]

That's the 'risk' part of financial backing, investment or pre-pre-ordering or whatever you want to call it.

I guess I'm just saying if Sony had some accountability if this project fell through I would be all for it. But as it stands, Sony is making it's consumers take a risk with no guaranteed product. And I understand that is what kickstarter is, but I don't think a large dev should be doing this.

 

[Infernostew]

Street Fighter V.

Is Sony funding a port of the game to PC?

 

[_StreetSonic_]

Exactly. Can we kickstart a new Parappa please?!

I was hoping Parappa 3 would get announced. :/ I thought Parappa 3 was more likely than Shenmue 3.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

I mean, your post is nonsense, but what thought process did you go through to get the impression that the Kickstarter funds come free to them?

 

[xxracerxx]

Is Sony funding a port of the game to PC?

They are helping fund the game.

 

[Atomski]

No funding = no interest in the game = no need for Sony to invest money = no Shenmue III

Have you thought this way yet?

Surely there are other ways to gauge interest rather than just straight up taking people's money up front.

This is a trend I don't like.. KS has always been about getting away from publishers and supporting small developers. Now we have big publishers who want to take less risk putting their finger in the pie. I think it will hurt those small developers who actually can't make a dime.

 

[harSon]

Has the kickstarter been updated to reflect this news?

 

[BlackRock]

I really hate this "use a kickstarter to gauge interest" approach that's been going around.

I'm not sure I like it either since backers don't share in profits. Still, it's a way to see if gamers are willing to put their money where their mouth is.

 

[prwxv3]

For the last time sony does not get any of the kickstarter money.

 

[4Tran]

I guess I'm just saying if Sony had some accountability if this project fell through I would be all for it. But as it stands, Sony is making it's consumers take a risk with no guaranteed product. And I understand that is what kickstarter is, but I don't think a large dev should be doing this.

Sony is committing and risking way more money than the Kickstarter campaign will garner, so does that count as accountability?

 

[Infernostew]

They are helping fund the game.

On PS4, yes. Are they funding the PC port or is Capcom doing the port?

 

[HomerSimpson-Man]

This should have been disclosed straight up when Yu Suzuki got on stage. I mean it's a tad scummy to angel invest only after fans throw down big bucks (the average pledge is quite high) but I think it's tolerable so long as people know that.

Really though would it matter now? No money has actually changed hands, there is a month left to increase, decrease or straight up remove your pledge.

People know a day later, and have the save exact power to take and give still.

 

[boredandlazy]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

That 'free' money where they lose out on later sales because they have to give a 'free' copy to all the backers?

 

[OboroShogun]

Anyone thinking this game was ever gonna be made with just Kickstarter money is nuts. Even many other beloved projects use Kickstarter as a springboard to attract other investors. If I recall correctly Mighty No 9 is one such project.

The truth of it all is that first off, Even the 4 million dollar stretch goal being achieved would be like 1/5 conservatively of what this game's cost will be forget about the basic 2 million goal. Secondly, Sony is STILL taking a big risk on this game. They will still likely spend way more than what this Kickstarter is going to bring in.

This is a collaborated effort. This isn't a Sony game. They are just partnered and Mr Suzuki is coming up with his portion of the cash in the most effective way possible, while allowing his venture partner to make sure it's a viable partnership.

People overly up in arms about this need to be realistic about the scope of this project and modern game development costs. If it wasn't this way, it simply wouldn't exist. I am personally thrilled and grateful that Sony is partnering when no one else would even entertain it and for that I say thank you.

 

[Flying Toaster]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

Well, I am broken...

 

[GavinGT]

Thank you Sony for helping to make my dream come true.

 

[Juraash]

Honestly I have no idea where the hype for the first two comes from. I never had the chance to play either. But I feel like I should support this through KS or a purchase when it comes out. Saving these older, niche games/franchises is a wonderful thing. Sure the KS thing is a little odd but Sony is throwing money at it just the same. Seems to me they care enough to save it and that in and of itself is great.

 

[4Tran]

Surely there are other ways to gauge interest rather than just straight up taking people's money up front.

This is a trend I don't like.. KS has always been about getting away from publishers and supporting small developers. Now we have big publishers who want to take less risk putting their finger in the pie. I think it will hurt those small developers who actually can't make a dime.

There are other ways to gauge interest. They indicated that Shenmue III would fail, which is why it didn't get made for 14 years.

On PS4, yes. Are they funding the PC port or is Capcom doing the port?

Sony is probably funding the game period. And as an investor, they stand to make money off the PC port as well as the PS4 version.

 

[CambriaRising]

Surely there are other ways to gauge interest rather than just straight up taking people's money up front.

Preorders.

 

[Moofers]

Nine Dragons.

Mother's Earth...

 

[legend166]

It's basically a 3 year long pre-order program.

The 'it's just to gauge interest thing' makes no sense when the Kickstarter gets to $2 million with what, 30k backers? Do you think they've gone from thinking the game is not viable to suddenly being viable because 30k people have said they'd buy it?

 

[Galactic Barret]

This should have been disclosed straight up when Yu Suzuki got on stage. I mean it's a tad scummy to angel invest only after fans throw down big bucks (the average pledge is quite high) but I think it's tolerable so long as people know that.

Could it be, maybe, that backers were hopeful something like this would happen, for security issues?

Did you back S3? Not to be an ass or anything, but does it affect personally? I understand it could set a precedent, but that could be a good thing.

Surely there are other ways to gauge interest rather than just straight up taking people's money up front.

This is a trend I don't like.. KS has always been about getting away from publishers and supporting small developers. Now we have big publishers who want to take less risk putting their finger in the pie. I think it will hurt those small developers who actually can't make a dime.

I felt kickstarter was less for getting away from big publishers and more not being able to get a publisher, big or otherwise. At the end of the day, these KS initiators have the right to refuse these offers from someone like Sony, MS or whoever but the purpose was never to gain allegiance or loyalty. It was always about money to get their project made and out to more people.

Have you ever watched Shark Tank? Kickstarter is something a inexperienced company can put on their "resume" to sway investors into funding or outright buying their IP. As long as initial investors receive whatever item(s) they were promised, the inexperience company is free to do as they deem is most beneficial toward that goal AND profit.

 

[TalonJH]

I'm just saying, let's stop being disingenuous. If Sony JUST wanted to gauge interest, then that experiment is over. The interest is there. Cancel the kickstarter.

But Sony also wants the money from the people so they can spend less. Money that they possess as of this very moment themselves to use.

(For the record, before someone calls me out, I hold this opinion with every Kickstarter that goes for external funding, not just this one)

I back it within 2 hours of the announcement. I would be pissed if I got a email saying sorry, here is your money back. I backed the game because I wanted it. At no time did I think 2 million was enough to fund a game that historically costed more that 50 million without adjusting for inflation. Hell, now that I think about it, I posted this in the morning before the news was clarified.

It's not like they are going to make the game off of 2 mill. They will need at lest 10 mill and Im not sure if they would get that through Kickstarter and it would still have Sega's name on it. Didn't Senmue cost over 50 mil in the 90s. They also have to convince Sega to let them make it since they own the IP. Sony is probably paying the rest of what is needed. It seems like it's similar to Igarashi's Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night where the Kickstarter is to get things started and show a publisher that there is interest.

It may be slightly shady but this was dead.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=168301464&postcount=861

I understand though. I wouldn't want this to happen to popular games but for things like this I will gladly open my wallet. If Mega Man Legends has a similar campaign I do it again. I'm getting everything I want out of this.

 

[superseohyun]

It seems like the majority of the people in this thread have no idea how game development and market research work.

They used kick starter to get free money. They can do simple focus group testing and market research to determine how big of a hit this would be and identify market interest.

But that doesn't print money.

lol market research...
Nobody thought of that in past 20 years!

 

[MiszMasz]

Mother's Earth...

Comrades.

 

[Moofers]

It's basically a 3 year long pre-order program.

The 'it's just to gauge interest thing' makes no sense when the Kickstarter gets to $2 million with what, 30k backers? Do you think they've gone from thinking the game is not viable to suddenly being viable because 30k people have said they'd buy it?

Yes. This is the foundation of the thinking behind Kickstarter campaigns. 30K backers putting money up front in a day is a big deal. There's money there. By the end of this thing it'll be twice that if not more. As long as they follow the model Bloodstained set, it could raise $10M. Any game that raises $10M with that weak pre-pre-pre-pre-alpha footage is something that has fans. From there the marketing writes itself once the game is close to launch. Look at all the press it is already getting. This campaign will prove once again that the customer is always right and the publishers DONT always know what we want.

 

[xxracerxx]

On PS4, yes. Are they funding the PC port or is Capcom doing the port?

They are funding the game, so they will see some revenue back on any of the versions of the game most likely (SFV).

Just because they may not be doing the PC port for SFV doesn't mean that this Kickstarter for Shenmue are the funds for a PC port.

Surely there are other ways to gauge interest rather than just straight up taking people's money up front.

Certainly not surveys, I would just click yes and then never buy the game.

 

[Moofers]

Comrades.

Warehouse number 8.
*click*

 

[4Tran]

It's basically a 3 year long pre-order program.

The 'it's just to gauge interest thing' makes no sense when the Kickstarter gets to $2 million with what, 30k backers? Do you think they've gone from thinking the game is not viable to suddenly being viable because 30k people have said they'd buy it?

It lets Sony know whether all of the vocal internet support for Shenmue is substantial or if it's just hot air.

 

[Neff]

Check the FAQ on the KS

What am I looking for?

 

[xxracerxx]

What am I looking for?

The wording:

Will there be a physical copy reward for PS4?
The Shenmue 3 Kickstarter will only be offering the digital download version for the PlayStation Network.​

Backers of this will only get a digital download for the PS4 (if that is what they chose), that doesn't mean there will not be a physical release.

 

[Rapscallion]

Guys, I'm worried...

If you pledge 30 dollars you get a digital copy of the game. I imagine a lot of shenmue fans will pledge at least 30 dollars for the digital copy, meaning they'll most likely not buy the game when it's released. That will effect sales quite significantly. Granted, a lot of fans would double dip and buy a physical copy (I know I will), but a lot of fans will just be happy with that digital copy.

Maybe I'm just crazy. Maybe I shouldn't even be worried. Maybe Sony is expecting a loss on this game.