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[Keihart]

This kind of makes my head hurt. People aren't "jealous" or trying to "downplay significance" when they point out where Uncharted 4 is poorly paced or mechanically lacking. They're pointing it out because they know the game can be better, and they want ND to continue pushing themselves to make better games. Creators benefit from well-meaning constructive criticism.

To be clear: UC4 is an extremely polished game; it's incredibly gorgeous (the best-looking game I've ever seen); and the storytelling and characterization is top-notch (some plot holes and weak motivations aside). But when it comes to the actual gameplay, it's pretty easy to spot the seams — the demarcation between meaningful player involvement (i.e. controlling the tempo of battle, swinging around the map, ambushing enemies, etc), and the ho-hum tedium of everything else: interacting with highlighted items, moving crates, or executing fairly automated jumping/climbing in super-linear environments.

I appreciate the move away from the over-abundance of combat, but as others have noted, ND still hasn't found an engaging way to spend downtime in these games. Replaying some of these levels will be a bit of a slog once the story is known and the intrigue/sense of discovery is no longer driving us onward. Scotland already felt long in the tooth, and that was the first time through when the witty banter, plot twists, and breathtaking vistas were all new. Imagine how that'll hold up when those superficial qualities are old hat and you're just left with gameplay that half of the time is barely there.

For my tastes, from an actual gameplay standpoint, ND doesn't come close to touching developers like From Software, Platinum or Nintendo — three devs who, at their very best, have a much more rigorous focus on engaging mechanics. There's definitely room for ND to grow in that respect. ND is untouchable when it comes to making cinematic experiences that rival Hollywood productions, but there's still so much more they can do in terms of rich and nuanced gameplay.

All that being said, I'm confident they'll get there. They're incredibly talented folks, and I admire their vision and heart. I just want to see them get better and better.

If you take all the encounters of U4 and take out the time between them i would put it up there with Vanquish as the best TPS and just as replayable, but it would have a lot less apeal to other people.

If anything , the weak parts of the game are not the heavy gameplay ones but the ones that try to make the narrative interactive. They are in a really hard place right now, is kinda like they are triying to mix Life is Strange with Vanquish or something, wich is awesome but pretty hard to blend in a seamless way i think.

 

[Deleted member 80556]

Very good interview. What a shame about the cut swordfight between the young versions of Sam and Nate. That would've highlighted the final boss more. But the game's amazing as it is.

Now, let me just tell you Neil that you should do a Blade Runner inspired game. Come on. You want it. We want it. Win-win.

 

[Nasbin]

It's been something special to watch ND really grow as a studio over the years, from the childhood innocence of Crash to the awkward teenage angst of the Jak years, to the burgeoning maturity of Uncharted, and finally the very much adult stories of TLOU and U4.

Hopefully they're replaced with other people who are intrigued by the more conscious pacing.

That's me, thanks Neil and Bruce for crafting what is far and away my favorite game in the series.

 

[Alucrid]

The cut cooking, fetch and sword

Spoiler

would have been a nice way to introduce the mechanic before the final fight

content all sound really great. Too bad they didn't make it in to the final game.

 

[Ducktail]

Really surprised how skillful the interviewer is. You can see he knows his stuff.. great read.


And I'm glad Neil is stating the slow pacing is a concious decision. It really does make you more engaged with the story. I just fucking love Uncharted 4 as the game has hit all the right notes with me.


Bless you, ND.

 

[Curufinwe]

If chapter 4 and 16 were the only slow and restrictive moments of the game then there wouldn't be a contingent of players complaining about the pacing of the game. It's not the fact that there are slow moments, it's the fact that they're not very engaging especially on repeat runthroughs of the game whereas something like UC2 is a masterclass in game pacing.

I prefer the pacing of U4. Seems like a lot of people do.

 

[Crossing Eden]

I prefer the pacing of U4. Seems like a lot of people do.

The pacing has been one of the biggest criticisms of the game. Because out of all the flaws that's probably the biggest.

 

[CHC]

Really surprised how skillful the interviewer is. You can see he knows his stuff.. great read.

Definitely. This is one of the first pieces under "Glixel" (that new videogame-centered branch of Rolling Stone) and so far so good. This is the kind of thing games journalism should strive for. So many outlets are really just about rephrasing press releases, as opposed to getting something primary and personable like this interview.

 

[prwxv3]

The pacing has been one of the biggest criticisms of the game. Because out of all the flaws that's probably the biggest.

There are just as many people praising the pacing. The game is pretty divisive in this regard. I personally loved the pacing.

 

[DeepEnigma]

There are just as many people praising the pacing. The game is pretty divisive in this regard. I personally loved the pacing.

Same here. I found it just right where I wanted it to be.

 

[Curufinwe]

The pacing has been one of the biggest criticisms of the game. Because out of all the flaws that's probably the biggest.

And every Uncharted game before it was criticized for having too much shooting. You will never please everybody.

 

[Schryver]

Spoiler

Savage Starlight*

Haha yeah don't know what I was thinking about there. I am interested in that game but not sure I will even play it. Edited

 

[SunBroDave]

The pacing has been one of the biggest criticisms of the game. Because out of all the flaws that's probably the biggest.

People upset with pacing need to realize that this is not a game you can rush through to get to all the story beats. There are several times where the story takes Nate to an open area that he needs to basically hike around and explore for hours, and yeah, it's gonna take the players a few hours to basically hike around and explore.

 

[Wagram]

Bravo to Neil and Naughty Dog for the beginning third of Uncharted 4. I can't tell them enough how refreshing it was to not even have a gun in Nate's hand for so long.

 

[NavyPharaoh]

The LD as I call it was always a way to hate on Uncharted. It's still a game, even if it has movie elements it's a damn game. No other game is expect to adhere by this because their stories are shit, but if u have a good story you have to?

This interview makes me admire Druckmann even more, if that's even possible. i love the Amy Hennig reference in the credits as well. I thought they handled the series perfectly and I'm day one on anything they release moving forward. I can't wait to see what Amy is making and the same goes for Druckmann.

 

[Manny Calavera]

I prefer the pacing of U4. Seems like a lot of people do.

I think the pacing in UC4 is one of the biggest strengths of the game. I just love to admire the stunningly detailed visuals and feel like I'm on adventure in all the beautiful locations. Chapter 16 was actually one of my favorite chapters in the whole game. Just loved the atmosphere at night with the full moon shining through the windows and just taking your time exploring this huge mysterious mansion. Really loved all the little details in the house and the fact you could listen to Beethoven with the gramophone. I thought the chapter was a nice change of pace to the rest and added some great variety to the game.


I did my first playthrough on hard and it took me a bit more than 20 hours. So I really took my time and still missed almost half of the treasures.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Hi Neil! Great work on the game!

At first I did think that they were going to go the wet blanket Elena route, but they definitely didn't. I really liked what they did with her.

 

[Manny Calavera]

Bravo to Neil and Naughty Dog for the beginning third of Uncharted 4. I can't tell them enough how refreshing it was to not even have a gun in Nate's hand for so long.

Definitely agree with you and couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Crossing Eden]

And every Uncharted game before it was criticized for having too much shooting. You will never please everybody.

And this game doesn't successfully balance the two. Go figure.

People upset with pacing need to realize that this is not a game you can rush through to get to all the story beats. There are several times where the story takes Nate to an open area that he needs to basically hike around and explore for hours, and yeah, it's gonna take the players a few hours to basically hike around and explore.

No one wanted to rush through to get through all the story beats. There's not even hours worth of meaningful exploration in the game, despite how big some of the environments are, there's usually a bunch of dead ends and only one main path for the vast majority of the game. There's some very clear cases of straight up padding with some pointless moments, like, there's a moment where they basically make fun of how often Drake has to use a crate to advance through an area, and then unironically use that same crate mechanic multiple times after that point throughout the game. And it wouldn't even be as mind numbing if the mechanics were actually more interesting instead of being borderline automated. If there were multiple paths that led to different dialogue in a lot more sections, and a lot less repetition, as well as making use of the game's mechanics there really wouldn't be an issue there. Like, it's pretty hilarious that the key to a bunch of ancient pirate puzzles is a crate on wheels that signs very little signs of corrosion, it's very videogamey in comparison to the rest of the game itself.

 

[pixelbox]

People upset with pacing need to realize that this is not a game you can rush through to get to all the story beats. There are several times where the story takes Nate to an open area that he needs to basically hike around and explore for hours, and yeah, it's gonna take the players a few hours to basically hike around and explore.

See the exploration is crap in the uncharted series. There's nothing that engages you other than visuals and once you're past that you quickly get bored.

 

[NullPointer]

There's some very clear cases of straight up padding with some pointless moments, like, there's a moment where they basically make fun of how often Drake has to use a crate to advance through an area, and then unironically use that same crate mechanic multiple times after that point throughout the game.

They did this exact thing with the sliding in Scotland too. Even Nate and Sam are exasperated by all the sliding, hoping it would be over soon, but nope!

 

[fastmower]

Do the people who like the pacing have multiple play throughs? I feel like the flaws become super apparent once you've beaten the game.

 

[Curufinwe]

And this game doesn't successfully balance the two.

In your opinion. The vast majority of reviewers think it does.

 

[chrominance]

Great interview.

I might need to go watch that Feminist Frequency review, because I also got the angle Druckmann describes. In fact, I'd almost go a step further and say

Spoiler

Elena seems to understand subconsciously that Nate needs an adventure in his life, and that the Malaysia job would be a relatively safe way to indulge without having him get shot up or double-crossed or hanging from the landing gear of a cargo plane

. It was very clear to me that the biggest issue was

Spoiler

Nate not trusting Elena to come to her with his problems, and not that she disapproved of his gallivanting

. It's actually kind of my favourite part of the story, or at least of the relationship.

Cutting the

Spoiler

sword fight

kind of sucks because it would've been a great callback, but on the other hand

Spoiler

I hated that fight for being very unclear--it felt like it was so easy to just loop the same actions constantly and run out of time, when what the fight really needs you to do is come close to death a few times to proceed to the next phase

.

 

[Curufinwe]

See the exploration is crap in the uncharted series. There's nothing that engages me other than visuals and once I'm past that I quickly get bored.

Fixed that for you.

 

[Manny Calavera]

Do the people who like the pacing have multiple play throughs? I feel like the flaws become super apparent once you've beaten the game.

Only just finished the game for the first time yesterday but I'm already planning to start my second playthrough on crushing. At some point I'll probably play for the third time on easier level and get all the collectibles I'll miss during my first two playthroughs.

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

I don't think he waved it off, he made a conscious choice to make many parts of the game slower and less shooty. In general, this meant that there were less shooty bits to intersperse which is why the pacing changed.

Personally I enjoyed the change. Its just slower which I dont think is bad, just opinion-based.

I know he made a conscious choice; I'm talking about his dismissive tone towards criticism of that choice. One thing I will say is that UC4 has made me very excited for the latest Tomb Raider when it finally comes over to PS4 - I was expecting it to make me lose interest in the port.

 

[Crossing Eden]

They did this exact thing with the sliding in Scotland too. Even Nate and Sam are exasperated by all the sliding, hoping it would be over soon, but nope!

Scotland was one of the better paced chapters imho, maybe because it doesn't try as hard as possible to slow the player down. I mean, it's quite telling that the walk cycle we see more than anything else in this game, no matter the location is named:Relaxed. On repeat playthroughs and ESPECIALLY during a legitimate attempt at a speedrun the game gets into order 1886 territory in how often it wrestles control away.

 

[NullPointer]

I know he made a conscious choice; I'm talking about his dismissive tone towards criticism of that choice. One thing I will say is that UC4 has made me very excited for the latest Tomb Raider when it finally comes over to PS4 - I was expecting it to make me lose interested in the port.

I think it has a good chance of a more positive reception since it definitely tilts far more towards combat (including stealth) and more open exploration, along with better treasures. That is, if the port isn't half-assed or sent to die.

And of course maybe the Uncharted single player DLC or co-op modes to come could help inject more action into the game for those who felt it was missing some of what made the previous games tick.

 

[The Lamp]

Hi Neil.

You almost lost me with the exploration chapters that had almost no combat, but you held onto me with the occasional gun fights that were awesome.

Make the mid-chapters where I'm wandering around less boring next time

But great multiplayer.

It's interesting to hear about that bit that was cut out...

See the exploration is crap in the uncharted series. There's nothing that engages you other than visuals and once you're past that you quickly get bored.

Yep. There's no large scale environmental puzzles to solve (all puzzles are confined to one area), no useful items to scavenge or people to find (other than the notes, ok), the expanded environment is pointless and just there for aesthetics, which can be really boring in comparison to other games that have real reasons to explore their environments.

The exploration gameplay in here is just the worst in terms of gameplay mechanics. It is almost pompous in that it is just there just to get you to wander around in a pretty environment.

 

[CrichtonKicks]

Do the people who like the pacing have multiple play throughs? I feel like the flaws become super apparent once you've beaten the game.

Yes. I didn't even critical path things nearly as much as I expected to for a second play. Was just as good, if not better, as the first time.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

And every Uncharted game before it was criticized for having too much shooting. You will never please everybody.

The thing that seems to get lost in this discussion is that 2 of the first 3 Uncharted games didn't really have good combat design. So of course there's this sense that people were asking for less combat, but the highest rated and most breathlessly paced title in the series- that also has the most enemies- is UC2. And now that they finally got combat mechanics to a level that's more than just "good," they reduced the enemy count significantly, placed encounters farther apart from each other, barely make any use of creative linear combat, and slooooooowed the game way down and reduced intensity overall.

The game is story first, and theme first more than any of the others ever were. And while I always enjoyed the story, the reason I replayed UC2 as much as I did came from the way it was paced and designed as an action shooter. If that campaign was about 11 hours long, at least 9 of them were brilliantly paced. UC4 on the other hand is now 14-16 hours long featuring half walk+ talk climbing, a few wide combat bowls, a handful of linear encounters, a few easy (and visually uninspired) puzzles, and a bit of light adventure/interactive story/whatever you want to call those sections. So yeah, that's cool for the person more interested in the story, or the one-and-done player, or the virtual photographers, but those of us that enjoyed replaying the games for the flow of what's objectively the most mechanically complex and dynamic part of the game- combat -are now left with a title that has staggered pacing, and never really snowballs into a nice forward momentum for a sustained period.

I, personally, don't think the pacing/tone of UC4 makes sense for this series. Hell, I actually think TLOU was better paced and sustained its energy much more effectively than this game. It's like a strange hybrid of an adventure-drama with interactive narrative, WAY more not-difficult-or-exciting traversal, and oh yeah there are spikes of action. A game that wants to have its cake and eat it. That's a tough list of ingredients to balance, and looking at it as the 4th game in a series of over the top pulp adventure shooters, I don't think the balance is right.

But ND's carving a different path now so what can I do. Fueled by the "experience" players and critics who fawned over Left Behind, this is what they're making now. I'm sure whatever they make next will be more like this as well, but at least I'll be ready for it next time.

 

[todahawk]

Hi Neil.

You almost lost me with the exploration chapters that had almost no combat, but you held onto me with the occasional gun fights that were awesome.

Make the mid-chapters where I'm wandering around less boring next time

But great multiplayer.

It's interesting to hear about that bit that was cut out...



Yep. There's no large scale environmental puzzles to solve (all puzzles are confined to one area), no useful items to scavenge or people to find (other than the notes, ok), the expanded environment is pointless and just there for aesthetics, which can be really boring in comparison to other games that have real reasons to explore their environments.

The exploration gameplay in here is just the worst in terms of gameplay mechanics. It is almost pompous in that it is just there just to get you to wander around in a pretty environment.

It's gorgeous and immersive, I love just wandering around in Uncharted. I swam around and down into the shipwrecks just soaking it all in for a long time. I've gone back to that section too... It's like a mini vacation. "Marco!"

 

[Kevin Shields]

The thing that seems to get lost in this discussion is that 2 of the first 3 Uncharted games didn't really have good combat design. So of course there's this sense that people were asking for less combat, but the highest rated and most breathlessly paced title in the series- that also has the most enemies- is UC2. And now that they finally got combat mechanics to a level that's more than just "good," they reduced the enemy count significantly, placed encounters farther apart from each other, barely make any use of creative linear combat, and slooooooowed the game way down and reduced intensity overall.

The game is story first, and theme first more than any of the others ever were. And while I always enjoyed the story, the reason I replayed UC2 as much as I did came from the way it was paced and designed as an action shooter. If that campaign was about 11 hours long, at least 9 of them were brilliantly paced. UC4 on the other hand is now 14-16 hours long featuring half walk+ talk climbing, a few wide combat bowls, a handful of linear encounters, a few easy (and visually uninspired) puzzles, and a bit of light adventure/interactive story/whatever you want to call those sections. So yeah, that's cool for the person more interested in the story, or the one-and-done player, or the virtual photographers, but those of us that enjoyed replaying the games for the flow of what's objectively the most mechanically complex and dynamic part of the game- combat -are now left with a title that has staggered pacing, and never really snowballs into a nice forward momentum for a sustained period.

I, personally, don't think the pacing/tone of UC4 makes sense for this series. Hell, I actually think TLOU was better paced and sustained its energy much more effectively than this game. It's like a strange hybrid of an adventure-drama with interactive narrative, WAY more not-difficult-or-exciting traversal, and oh yeah there are spikes of action. A game that wants to have its cake and eat it. That's a tough list of ingredients to balance, and looking at it as the 4th game in a series of over the top pulp adventure shooters, I don't think the balance is right.

But ND's carving a different path now so what can I do. Fueled by the "experience" players and critics who fawned over Left Behind, this is what they're making now. I'm sure whatever they make next will be more like this as well, but at least I'll be ready for it next time.

Net Wrecker, minus the number of encounters or the pace or set pieces. Which combat do you prefer between UC2 and UC4 - meaning encounter design, gunplay, hit reactions etc. ?

 

[cjtiger300]

Really surprised how skillful the interviewer is. You can see he knows his stuff.. great read.


And I'm glad Neil is stating the slow pacing is a concious decision. It really does make you more engaged with the story. I just fucking love Uncharted 4 as the game has hit all the right notes with me.


Bless you, ND.

This. I have high expectations for Glixel

 

[Fancy Clown]

Really interesting interview.

I kinda would have rather the boat setpiece stayed at its proper point in the game since that chapter needed an action peak, and the swimming to the shore could have helped emphasize his isolation since you're really not alone for very long. It would be an interesting parallel to the desert sequence in 3.

But for all they cut and tinkered, they made an incredibly cohesive game in the end. Still wish there were a bit more combat but ND clearly stuck to their vision for the pacing of the game.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

The pacing has been one of the biggest criticisms of the game. Because out of all the flaws that's probably the biggest.

It's more polarizing than actually being a legit concrete issue.

This is coming from someone who thought the pacing was an issue.

 

[The Baron Count]

It's more polarizing than actually being a legit concrete issue.

This is coming from someone who thought the pacing was an issue.

I would say it's kind of an issue when people are as divided on something like this as they are. And yeah, I was honestly glad to read Gaf after I beat the game so I could see that I wasn't the only one that thought the game dragged it's feet at quite a few parts.

 

[Kevin Shields]

It's more polarizing than actually being a legit concrete issue.

This is coming from someone who thought the pacing was an issue.

I had a big problem with the pacing on my first playthrough but really thats when comparing it to UC2 which had amazing pacing for a balls to the wall action game. This is going for something different. Appreciating it more on second playthrough but I'm only up to Madagascar and I haven't hit the worst lulls.

 

[WordsintheWater]

The pacing was fine to me, I liked doing all the mundane things at the beginning, set up the story beats and themes nicely. I haven't done a second playthrough yet though and my opinion may change.

 

[lukeskymac]

I can see why people would defend the pacing as "not bad", but to think it's an improvement over previous Uncharteds? Ugggghhhhhhh.

 

[SunBroDave]

I can see why people would defend the pacing as "not bad", but to think it's an improvement over previous Uncharteds? Ugggghhhhhhh.

Not to be that guy, but it's infinitely better than in UC3.

 

[TripOpt55]

Love hearing about some of the cut content. I definitely would have welcomed some of those in this game. Good interview overall.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

Net Wrecker, minus the number of encounters or the pace or set pieces. Which combat do you prefer between UC2 and UC4 - meaning encounter design, gunplay, hit reactions etc. ?

That's hard to answer without including pace and variety, which are huge parts of what I like about UC2. It's not a simple answer for me.

MECHANICS is definitely UC4. No question. Everything you do in combat feels, looks, and sounds better in UC4. Gunplay, hit reactions, animations, AI, etc.

But PACE and VARIETY is stronger in UC2 IMO. That game makes way more use of unique, smaller linear encounters, while UC4 leans on wide stealthable arenas. So yes, while the average encounter in UC4 feels better to play, the average encounter in UC2 feels more unique within the flow of the game, and comes at you at a more regular pace.

UC4 takes the snowstorm from UC2 and the ship graveyard from UC3, and spreads them across the game (Chp. 8, 10, 14, 17, 18). That's cool, but there's this whole other side of UC combat that feels neglected. The kind of smaller forced encounters that would've been featured in a Chapter 6, a Chapter 12, a Chapter 13, a Chapter 15, a Chapter 21, had this game been designed like UC2, or even UC3.

My favorite chapters in UC4 are 8, 9, and 17. They have the best mixture of traversal elements, combat, and pace I'm talking about. If my posts aren't clear enough, just replay those and that'll explain everything. I wish the game had many more of those chapters. Even Chapter 11, which is the "BIG AND CRAZY" chapter, goes from 0 to 10 to 0 to 10. There's very little middle ground. Very little connective tissue that keeps the game warm without turning the fire off completely.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

As someone who appreciated the more open areas and exploration that entailed, I definitely liked the reduced combat. It made the combat encounters seem that much more important and allowed them all to be, really, quite different and have their own puzzles and approaches.

 

[lukeskymac]

Not to be that guy, but it's infinitely better than in UC3.

Barely. And we all know what Uncharted I was implicitly talking about.

 

[tr1p1ex]

UC4 was 4 hours too long. Interview explains why. They kept in crap even if it wasn't fun because they thought the story needed it. They even took the word fun off their focus tests to help this out which then allowed the testers to rate the game higher. This seems to be a slippery slope.

I think they are barking up the wrong tree here in terms of the future of games. This direction leads to movies and tv. Pretty soon they will get the novel idea of why even make the player hold the left analog stick up and hit the triangle button every 3 minutes? We could just have the player do nothing. That way they can just kick back on the couch and enjoy the show. No wonky camera. No retarded AI. No janky controls. No immersion breaking on-screen prompts. The future is nigh!!!

/half-serious /half-jest.

 

[Stampy]

I never liked Uncharted games too much, the combat was just a bit boring for me. But so far with 6 chapters in, I'm amazed with how much I'm enjoying this game.

 

[Servbot24]

"Neogaf-My sick obsession" should be a slogan haha.

I like the bit about Neil not getting caught up in people's complaints about the pacing of the game early on.

I thought it was immaculate and was a nice ramp up to the action while giving a lot of character focus into Nate, Sam and Elena.

For sure, the pacing was excellent. This is a good example of when it's best to ignore the fan feedback, they would have ruined the opening.

 

[MegaSackman]

People here thinks that the gameplay and the story have to serve the action, they say that they don't want wall to wall action but they clearly think that it's the main thing and all should be built around it.

What I think is that Naughty Dog wants that every component of the game serves the story. Chapter 4 might be one of the best things that had happened to this medium as a way to tell stories. I played through it three times loving it every time.
It's ok to dislike, it's ok to expect different things but Naughty Dog didn't do anything bad, or boring, or not "engaging" is you that don't find this stuff interesting.