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[Philippo]

I would be massively dissappointed if we don't get Luna (and Gentiana) as a guest party member.

Just imagine this scene: in Altissia, during Niflheim invasion, a giant snake rises from the water threatening to destroy everything, Luna is in front of it and Noctis knows it, so he rushes through the city smashing down Magiteck warriors, reaches her and a duo tag-team fight against both Niflheim soldiers and Leviathan begins.

 

[duckroll]

I would be massively dissappointed if we don't get Luna (and Gentiana) as a guest party member.

Just imagine this scene: in Altissia, during Niflheim invasion, a giant snake rises from the water threatening to destroy everything, Luna is in front of it and Noctis knows it, so he rushes through the city smashing down Magiteck warriors, reaches her and a Leviathan cutscene begins.

Fixed.

 

[Ydelnae]

For anyone questioning that initial claim, Tabata told Famitsu she'd be a guest member. It's not just some random news.

I'm just wondering what's the truth. Did they really write that battle in which Noctis joined Luna out of the game, in the span of 6 months? Or was the statement in the second interview some sort of miscommunication?

The only other reason I could think of it's that they are treating this battle with Luna as a spoiler, but they forgot that they already revealed that it existed.

 

[Koozek]

I'm hoping that XVI can return to being a polished "graphical showcase" kind of a game. I just can't wait to see a new Final Fantasy game that is developed without being weighed down with a decade of baggage.

A lot of FF games have looked great, but I think most of that reputation comes from the ripples of FFVII.

I don't trust a word that that Erren Van Duine writes.

Hi.

LOL

 

[Philippo]

Fixed.

THANKS TABATA

 

[BocoDragon]

Maybe if Luna joins your party it's like a General Leo or Sephiroth moment and we shouldn't even know this now -_-

 

[Mediking]

I would be massively dissappointed if we don't get Luna (and Gentiana) as a guest party member.

Just imagine this scene: in Altissia, during Niflheim invasion, a giant snake rises from the water threatening to destroy everything, Luna is in front of it and Noctis knows it, so he rushes through the city smashing down Magiteck warriors, reaches her and a duo tag-team fight against both Niflheim soldiers and Leviathan begins.

That would be so hype...

 

[Ishida]

I would be massively dissappointed if we don't get Luna (and Gentiana) as a guest party member.

Just imagine this scene: in Altissia, during Niflheim invasion, a giant snake rises from the water threatening to destroy everything, Luna is in front of it and Noctis knows it, so he rushes through the city smashing down Magiteck warriors, reaches her and a duo tag-team fight against both Niflheim soldiers and Leviathan begins.

That would be very cool, but personally I don't mind if it doesn't happen. I'd see it more like a nice extra.

 

[Kagari]

I'm just wondering what's the truth. Did they really write that battle in which Noctis joined Luna out of the game, in the span of 6 months? Or was the statement in the second interview some sort of miscommunication?

The only other reason I could think of it's that they are treating this battle with Luna as a spoiler, but they forgot that they already revealed that it existed.

I'm thinking yeah they blurted it out to soon and maybe it is a spoiler. Maybe.

 

[Koozek]

The FFXV Chocobo-themed Uber cars at PAX, lol:

https://twitter.com/TTM_studios/status/771810124373585920
https://twitter.com/verryfinny/status/771802914402689024

 

[Geg]

Luna fights by firing her dog from her wrist like a rocket

 

[Ray Down]

Luna fights by firing her dog from her wrist like a rocket

What does Noctis do with his, turn it into a sword?

 

[Inuhanyou]

He also tweeted:

@jasonschreier

"In short: Combat feels great; music is excellent; exploring is a lot of fun; story has good potential; writing is... well, it's a JRPG."

What separates JRPG writing from 'normal' game writing? And what makes 'normal game' writing better?

Always have issues with this kind of nonsense. Jason, thumbs down

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

The FFXV Chocobo-themed Uber cars at PAX, lol:

https://twitter.com/TTM_studios/status/771810124373585920
https://twitter.com/verryfinny/status/771802914402689024

Haha so cool

 

[Arkeband]

"kill me"

What separates JRPG writing from 'normal' game writing? And what makes 'normal game' writing better?

Always have issues with this kind of nonsense. Jason, thumbs down

I would assume bad localization, hence the J in JRPG. It's not uncommon. They also tend to overuse the same tropes over and over.

 

[Ray Down]

Or maybe they try to do the Noctis docking, but Luna won't join in cause its too embarrassing.

 

[Soriku]

What separates JRPG writing from 'normal' game writing? And what makes 'normal game' writing better?

Always have issues with this kind of nonsense. Jason, thumbs down

Kingsglaive had what I'd call '"JRPG writing". I can't find the words to describe what defines that type of writing right now, but it sometimes sounds goofy and stilted. Not to say other games with non-JRPG writing don't sound that way sometimes, but I thought it was really noticeable with that movie. That said I more or less get used to the style after having played the game for a while, so meh.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

Or maybe they try to do the Noctis docking, but Luna won't join in cause its too embarrassing.

 

[Servbot24]

The FFXV Chocobo-themed Uber cars at PAX, lol:

https://twitter.com/TTM_studios/status/771810124373585920
https://twitter.com/verryfinny/status/771802914402689024

 

[BocoDragon]

I'd actually be alarmed if I played a jRPG that spoke like a Hollywood movie or whatever it is that we perceive to be "normal". I'd feel like some of the secret sauce is missing. It has a theatrical style of its own that is definitively part of its charm.

Of course, even having said that, there are obviously instances of sub-par dialogue in that particularly "anime" way.

 

[JBwB]

Oh man. I would love to get a PC version. Hopefully a 1080GTX can run it 1080p 60fps max settings.

A PC port of FFXV will probably happen, but don't expect it to come out any time soon.

They showcased the tech of FFXV at SIGGRAPH and that was running on a PC with a 980Ti IIRC. I wouldn't be surprised if the recommended specs were around that mark.

 

[OrionX]

You know, part of me still wants there to be some twist that forces Luna and Noctis to be enemies, as unrealistic as that dream may be since Luna seems far too devoted to him. I always wanted them to keep the tragedy angle that Versus was supposed to have.

 

[Mediking]

You know, part of me still wants there to be some twist that forces Luna and Noctis to be enemies, as unrealistic as that dream may be since Luna seems far too devoted to him. I always wanted them to keep the tragedy angle that Versus was supposed to have.

Versus probably wasn't gonna have Noctis and Stella kill each other. They were just gonna "fight". How do you even fight somebody you have feelings for?

Noctis and Luna has been friends since kids. The best you can hope for is scene where she slaps him playfully or in a way to snap him back into action.

 

[Skilletor]

What separates JRPG writing from 'normal' game writing? And what makes 'normal game' writing better?

Always have issues with this kind of nonsense. Jason, thumbs down

Translation, mannerisms, culture.

It sounds different than something native to English.

Edit: Not saying "normal" writing is better.

 

[OrionX]

Versus probably wasn't gonna have Noctis and Stella kill each other. They were just gonna "fight". How do you even fight somebody you have feelings for?

Noctis and Luna has been friends since kids. The best you can hope for is scene where she slaps him playfully or in a way to snap him back into action.

lol yeah I know, I'm sure it won't happen. Unfortunately the most likely role I see for her right now is for her to sacrifice herself for the greater good. Maybe that's just because she reminds me of Yuna.

 

[Mediking]

lol yeah I know, I'm sure it won't happen. Unfortunately the most likely role I see for her right now is for her to sacrifice herself for the greater good. Maybe that's just because she reminds me of Yuna.

Yuna? Well.... right now... she's singing on stage.

And Yuna does remind me of Luna alot as well but guess what? Luna isn't gonna get killed. She isn't dying. I just don't see it happening.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Translation, mannerisms, culture.

It sounds different than something native to English.

Edit: Not saying "normal" writing is better.

That's what i'm saying. Even though its different and is outwardly translated to be different from how westerners would design a game, what does that have to do with the writing objectively in terms of enjoyment and why it only gets taken so seriously because of the genre?

Someone said because there were tropes, but basically everything has tropes, all western games and media have tropes too. WHy should that matter? Because there are common elements unique to Japanese media?

I just don't get it

 

[CrimsonSquall]

Versus probably wasn't gonna have Noctis and Stella kill each other. They were just gonna "fight". How do you even fight somebody you have feelings for

That's what would make it such a powerful scene(s) if done right.

 

[Crossing Eden]

What separates JRPG writing from 'normal' game writing? And what makes 'normal game' writing better?

Always have issues with this kind of nonsense. Jason, thumbs down

The fact that conversations actually sound like conversations. At this point in time most triple A devs have a good grasp on at least the flow of conversation and how people interact with each other along with giving actors a lot of free reign to add themselves into their performance. And ofc things like performance capture bridging the gap even more, but even if we reduce these things down to games that don't have performance capture, like say, TW3, the acting and writing in JRPGs still comes up short by a long shot, even more so as time goes on and devs are able to get better and better performances out of actors while Japan stagnates in that regard. Or in the worst cases, regresses, at least back when they had lower budgets they didn't have mocap actors acting like jackasses and pretty much missing the point of it in the first place since it doesn't fit with the models or aesthetic or enhance the scene. Yes, everything has tropes, but that doesn't excuse anime JRPG writing being really really below par relative to the rest of the industry.

 

[CrimsonSquall]

The rest of the industry? Not every game sounds like Uncharted or TLoU, most games have just passable VO

 

[OrionX]

Yuna? Well.... right now... she's singing on stage.

And Yuna does remind me of Luna alot as well but guess what? Luna isn't gonna get killed. She isn't dying. I just don't see it happening.

I guess I should've specified I meant X-1 Yuna. And actually right now she's trying to defeat Sin again apparently, but I try to pretend 2.5 doesn't exist like everyone else

Definitely hope you're right about Luna though! That's just the vibe I get from all the "I don't fear death" and "must protect Noctis" talk.

 

[Crossing Eden]

The rest of the industry? Not every game sounds like Uncharted or TLoU, most games have just passable VO

In the triple A space? No, hell even indies lauded indies have great performances, (an indie even beat out TW3 in terms of acting). Like, it's getting genuinely difficult to find triple A games these days with supremely bad acting. Especially in comparison to an anime JRPG. They're just really behind in that regard.

 

[YankeeDonB]

The fact that conversations actually sound like conversations. At this point in time most triple A devs have a good grasp on at least the flow of conversation and how people interact with each other along with giving actors a lot of free reign to add themselves into their performance. And ofc things like performance capture bridging the gap even more, but even if we reduce these things down to games that don't have performance capture, like say, TW3, the acting and writing in JRPGs still comes up short by a long shot, even more so as time goes on and devs are able to get better and better performances out of actors while Japan stagnates in that regard. Or in the worst cases, regresses, at least back when they had lower budgets they didn't have mocap actors acting like jackasses and pretty much missing the point of it in the first place since it doesn't fit with the models or aesthetic or enhance the scene. Yes, everything has tropes, but that doesn't excuse anime JRPG writing being really really below par relative to the rest of the industry.

Recording and voice direction has gotten a lot better in Westen games, it's true, and here Japan is lagging (at least with localization, though I'm not sure that's a fair comparison).

But the writing in most big Western games is still poor. Even most of the examples people cite (e.g., Uncharted) are stilted, stiff, exposition heavy, and forgettable. Don't come close to good contemporary tv writing.

Witcher 3's writing was one of my most pleasant surprises in games in the last few years - it was much more novelistic than cinematic, which I think may work better in an interactive setting. Actually, a lot of the better tv writing also shies away from Hollywood and drifts closer to novelistic (e.g., The Wire, Justified, The Sopranos, etc.).

Just to be clear, by novelistic I mean they're not afraid to start slow burning character driven plots, and allow the dialogue space for these to build, as opposed to shoe-horning in some quipped dialogue between a high octane set piece.

 

[Inuhanyou]

In the triple A space? No, hell even indies lauded indies have great performances, (an indie even beat out TW3 in terms of acting). Like, it's getting genuinely difficult to find triple A games these days with supremely bad acting. Especially in comparison to an anime JRPG. They're just really behind in that regard.

You keep saying 'anime JRPG' like that is supposed to automatically have people know what your talking about when your putting out points.

Motion capture, translation localization, and voice delivery have nothing to do with writing.

 

[BocoDragon]

In the triple A space? No, hell even indies lauded indies have great performances, (an indie even beat out TW3 in terms of acting). Like, it's getting genuinely difficult to find triple A games these days with supremely bad acting. Especially in comparison to an anime JRPG. They're just really behind in that regard.

Well, they are translations of a foreign culture's mannerisms and language and entirely different genre culture.

Quantic Dream games are pretty awkwardly acted too. Because France.

It's not impossible to do a good conversion into English (looking at you Ghibli and FFXII), but I do think some Japanese media is really hard to deal with. Lots of head nodding, odd exclamations, and the like. We also tend to single out the topes of anime culture because they stand out to us, but you know... American gangster movies have tropes, Marvel has tropes, Family Guy has tropes. We just don't notice them because they're right in line with our cultural expectations.

 

[duckroll]

The fact that conversations actually sound like conversations. At this point in time most triple A devs have a good grasp on at least the flow of conversation and how people interact with each other along with giving actors a lot of free reign to add themselves into their performance. And ofc things like performance capture bridging the gap even more, but even if we reduce these things down to games that don't have performance capture, like say, TW3, the acting and writing in JRPGs still comes up short by a long shot, even more so as time goes on and devs are able to get better and better performances out of actors while Japan stagnates in that regard. Or in the worst cases, regresses, at least back when they had lower budgets they didn't have mocap actors acting like jackasses and pretty much missing the point of it in the first place since it doesn't fit with the models or aesthetic or enhance the scene. Yes, everything has tropes, but that doesn't excuse anime JRPG writing being really really below par relative to the rest of the industry.

I don't feel any of this is true. Like, this feels like an answer engineered to try and answer why FFXV in particular has bad writing compared to modern RPGs. That wasn't the question. The question was about why there is a stigma against "JRPG writing" in general. The majority of JRPGs are not FFXV, they don't have performance capture, most don't even have cutscenes and just use talking heads instead.

I will venture to say that the reason why people look down on JRPG writing is because the target demographic for RPGs in Japan are still the 12-19 crowd even after three decades, while in the west the the prime audience is now the 20-30 bracket, and increasing. So while the west is writing RPGs which mostly takes into consideration that gamers who play such games tend to be older now, the same audience and critics playing the typical JRPG will immediately notice how much more childish, whimsical, and nonsensical it is. With something like Pokemon which is very clearly for young kids, that's less of a problem because at that level there's a "for the whole family" effect. But specifically targeting the taste of teenagers will always be a huge hurdle for adults who recognize it for what it is. A good comparison is to compare Game of Thrones and Eragon. Or compare how people talk about "regular movies" and "comic book movies". Same shit. JRPGs are childish as fuck, and that can be part of the charm, but people are going to mock them for that.

 

[stargateheaven]

Its not that the actors are bad but their localised lines

What a waste.

When your long life friend is on fire and as you put hom out, do you say "are you ok?!" Or do you say "hey keep cool"
This line is evidence enough the tone they are going for , for me.

Edit: since they are good actors there will probably be some scenes which aren't bad though. Some lines just cant be saved.

Japanese is where this game is at, suits the whole thing anyway wht with thr japanese motion capture and japanese looking characters

 

[Geg]

"We'll play hide and seek with him!"

 

[Koozek]

Its not that the actors are bad but their localised lines

What a waste.

When your long life friend is on fire and as you put hom out, do you say "are you ok?!" Or do you say "hey keep cool"
This line is evidence enough the tone they are going for , for me.

"We'll play hide and seek with him!"

 

[Skilletor]

I don't feel any of this is true. Like, this feels like an answer engineered to try and answer why FFXV in particular has bad writing compared to modern RPGs. That wasn't the question. The question was about why there is a stigma against "JRPG writing" in general. The majority of JRPGs are not FFXV, they don't have performance capture, most don't even have cutscenes and just use talking heads instead.

I will venture to say that the reason why people look down on JRPG writing is because the target demographic for RPGs in Japan are still the 12-19 crowd even after three decades, while in the west the the prime audience is now the 20-30 bracket, and increasing. So while the west is writing RPGs which mostly takes into consideration that gamers who play such games tend to be older now, the same audience and critics playing the typical JRPG will immediately notice how much more childish, whimsical, and nonsensical it is. With something like Pokemon which is very clearly for young kids, that's less of a problem because at that level there's a "for the whole family" effect. But specifically targeting the taste of teenagers will always be a huge hurdle for adults who recognize it for what it is. A good comparison is to compare Game of Thrones and Eragon. Or compare how people talk about "regular movies" and "comic book movies". Same shit. JRPGs are childish as fuck, and that can be part of the charm, but people are going to mock them for that.

This is very true. Part of why I like Matsuno games and Alexander Smith translations so much.

 

[YankeeDonB]

This is very true. Part of why I like Matsuno games and Alexander Smith translations so much.

Sure, but Smith worked on X also, which is pretty much the epitome of aimed smack-dab-at-teens Final Fantasy.

 

[Koozek]

I don't feel any of this is true. Like, this feels like an answer engineered to try and answer why FFXV in particular has bad writing compared to modern RPGs. That wasn't the question. The question was about why there is a stigma against "JRPG writing" in general. The majority of JRPGs are not FFXV, they don't have performance capture, most don't even have cutscenes and just use talking heads instead.

I will venture to say that the reason why people look down on JRPG writing is because the target demographic for RPGs in Japan are still the 12-19 crowd even after three decades, while in the west the the prime audience is now the 20-30 bracket, and increasing. So while the west is writing RPGs which mostly takes into consideration that gamers who play such games tend to be older now, the same audience and critics playing the typical JRPG will immediately notice how much more childish, whimsical, and nonsensical it is. With something like Pokemon which is very clearly for young kids, that's less of a problem because at that level there's a "for the whole family" effect. But specifically targeting the taste of teenagers will always be a huge hurdle for adults who recognize it for what it is. A good comparison is to compare Game of Thrones and Eragon. Or compare how people talk about "regular movies" and "comic book movies". Same shit. JRPGs are childish as fuck, and that can be part of the charm, but people are going to mock them for that.

Pretty much this, yeah. Sometimes I want FF to "grow up", but then I realize that most of us fell in love with the series as kids/youth too and are still fans, so that approach probably is future-proof. My 12-yo me would've found the FFXV dialogue perfectly cool, I'm sure.

 

[Geg]

Japanese is where this game is at, suits the whole thing anyway wht with thr japanese motion capture and japanese looking characters

Reminds me of some people complaining about Iris's motion capture in the 50 minute gameplay video thread, saying it's unnatural and "who moves like this"

It's a JRPG what do you want

 

[YankeeDonB]

Son of a submariner, FF has always had some goofy lines sprinkled into the melodrama. Just a harder fit w/ vocal work and more realistic characters.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Recording and voice direction has gotten a lot better in Westen games, it's true, and here Japan is lagging (at least with localization, though I'm not sure that's a fair comparison).

But the writing in most big Western games is still poor. Even most of the examples people cite (e.g., Uncharted) are stilted, stiff, exposition heavy, and forgettable. Don't come close to good contemporary tv writing.

Witcher 3's writing was one of my most pleasant surprises in games in the last few years - it was much more novelistic than cinematic, which I think may work better in an interactive setting. Actually, a lot of the better tv writing also shies away from Hollywood and drifts closer to novelistic (e.g., The Wire, Justified, The Sopranos, etc.).

Just to be clear, by novelistic I mean they're not afraid to start slow burning character driven plots, and allow the dialogue space for these to build, as opposed to shoe-horning in some quipped dialogue between a high octane set piece.

I don't hold UC in as much regard as the rest of GAF but the performances hold up quite a bit even if the characters a lot of the time boil down to incredibly safe quipping generators. I agree that games should look more towards tv instead of movies when it comes to writing since it's difficult to a game story into a game in a movie like fashion.

You keep saying 'anime JRPG' like that is supposed to automatically have people know what your talking about when your putting out points.

Motion capture, translation localization, and voice delivery have nothing to do with writing.

Something like Tales of, or the FF spinoffs, hell even something that's lauded like Persona, Fire Emblem, etc. is just really grating to listen to in terms of writing, (things like dialogue), and

Well, they are translations of a foreign culture's mannerisms and language and entirely different genre culture.

Quantic Dream games are pretty awkwardly acted too. Because France.

It's not impossible to do a good conversion into English (looking at you Ghibli and FFXII), but I do think some Japanese media is really hard to deal with. Lots of head nodding, odd exclamations, and the like. We also tend to single out the topes of anime culture because they stand out to us, but you know... American gangster movies have tropes, Marvel has tropes, Family Guy has tropes. We just don't notice them because they're right in line with our cultural expectations.

Quantic Dream games are pretty awkwardly acted because David Cage doesn't know how people talk and thus, is incredibly terrible at writing dialogue. Not because it's from France. If JRPGs legitimately had more Japanese mannerisms instead of anime ones that would be an improvement imho.

I don't feel any of this is true. Like, this feels like an answer engineered to try and answer why FFXV in particular has bad writing compared to modern RPGs. That wasn't the question. The question was about why there is a stigma against "JRPG writing" in general. The majority of JRPGs are not FFXV, they don't have performance capture, most don't even have cutscenes and just use talking heads instead.

There's a stigma because typically JRPGs stick to anime tropes. Poor acting and dialogue included. It just doesn't sound good to listen to compared to that moment where people walk up and ask "is this a movie?"

I will venture to say that the reason why people look down on JRPG writing is because the target demographic for RPGs in Japan are still the 12-19 crowd even after three decades, while in the west the the prime audience is now the 20-30 bracket, and increasing. So while the west is writing RPGs which mostly takes into consideration that gamers who play such games tend to be older now, the same audience and critics playing the typical JRPG will immediately notice how much more childish, whimsical, and nonsensical it is. With something like Pokemon which is very clearly for young kids, that's less of a problem because at that level there's a "for the whole family" effect. But specifically targeting the taste of teenagers will always be a huge hurdle for adults who recognize it for what it is. A good comparison is to compare Game of Thrones and Eragon. Or compare how people talk about "regular movies" and "comic book movies". Same shit. JRPGs are childish as fuck, and that can be part of the charm, but people are going to mock them for that.

I don't think that 12-19 demographic is really an excuse when you consider how much good media is made for that age group, (outside of Japan at least). I don't think it's because the audiences have gotten older either, I view it as standards changing overtime thanks to things getting better in one area of the world while it stagnates in another area of the world. Think about how things were when games finally started getting VA, everything sounded really awful, and lots of things didn't age well at all, but, thanks to the influence of tv shows and movies, (games got more realistic and thus writers started emulating those mediums more when it came to writing), things started to get better in the West. There are bad examples sure, (David Cage games), but lord is the average game better written these days than they were ten years ago. Really don't think the same can be said for JRPGs. Which to me is a shame because I expect better from something like FF this far into it.

 

[Pooya]

I just want to know if the logo was always supposed to show seemingly Ardryn or if they changed that. Did he always have that one wing costume? I'm not sure, he was in one of the old trailer but it's not really clear to see I think.

 

[Skilletor]

Sure, but Smith worked on X also, which is pretty much the epitome of aimed smack-dab-at-teens Final Fantasy.

There was tons of problems with that translation and also why I said Matsuno and Smith specifically.

 

[Falk]

That's what i'm saying. Even though its different and is outwardly translated to be different from how westerners would design a game, what does that have to do with the writing objectively in terms of enjoyment and why it only gets taken so seriously because of the genre?

I think what Jason is getting at is simple:

If you're OK with this, great! The body language in FFXV probably won't bother you.

If you're not OK with this then you will be sad like Crossing Eden.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I don't feel any of this is true. Like, this feels like an answer engineered to try and answer why FFXV in particular has bad writing compared to modern RPGs. That wasn't the question. The question was about why there is a stigma against "JRPG writing" in general. The majority of JRPGs are not FFXV, they don't have performance capture, most don't even have cutscenes and just use talking heads instead.

I will venture to say that the reason why people look down on JRPG writing is because the target demographic for RPGs in Japan are still the 12-19 crowd even after three decades, while in the west the the prime audience is now the 20-30 bracket, and increasing. So while the west is writing RPGs which mostly takes into consideration that gamers who play such games tend to be older now, the same audience and critics playing the typical JRPG will immediately notice how much more childish, whimsical, and nonsensical it is. With something like Pokemon which is very clearly for young kids, that's less of a problem because at that level there's a "for the whole family" effect. But specifically targeting the taste of teenagers will always be a huge hurdle for adults who recognize it for what it is. A good comparison is to compare Game of Thrones and Eragon. Or compare how people talk about "regular movies" and "comic book movies". Same shit. JRPGs are childish as fuck, and that can be part of the charm, but people are going to mock them for that.

That's far more of an explanation, thank you.

But i guess it still just hard for me to grasp looking from the outside in from that perspective.

I always loved anime, manga and Japanese kind of writing. It was just something i really enjoyed, and there's never really been anything that made me feel like i was too old for what i liked, or it wasn't mature enough for my tastes as an adult.

Furthermore, a lot of what i read in the Japanese space can be just as gritty and down to earth as western media targeted at adults, if we're looking for specific things outside of Shounen jump style archetypes.

I never felt like fantastical elements and that kind of thing could divorce a narrative from being taken seriously in that regard. And the tropes argument, for this game in particular feels unearned.

For example, with FF15 in particular, all of these guys are over 20 years old and well into young adulthood or around the age you cite, so does it even still have the "teenagers saving the world" stigma of something like Persona?

I think what Jason is getting at is simple:

If you're OK with this, great! The body language in FFXV probably won't bother you.

If you're not OK with this then you will be sad like Crossing Eden.

She did a weird cultural mannerism exaggerate and denote emotional peppiness..but that's not writing though, that's a weird cultural mannerism.

 

[Tyaren]

For anyone questioning that initial claim, Tabata told Famitsu she'd be a guest member. It's not just some random news.

Wait a sec? Seriously? I've lived all those years believing Luna would not join the party ever. ;__;
Is there proof she actually does? That would be great news,