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[Skittzo0413]

Of course Switch will sell much more units than WiiU, and it will have much better third party support because of that (and because ports are very easy, yes they are). People claiming otherwise are hilarious.

Simply when you look at trends from Google search or social media, Switch public awareness is much higher than WiiUs ever was, such factors are always resulting in sales.

Don't forget that this is also the 3DS successor, so take that Nintendo audience of (with some overlap) ~40-50 million and put them all on the same platform. Also with double the development power from Nintendo themselves.

Take Two: We are extremely impressed with what Nintendo has to offer.

Everyone: Are you gonna make Switch games then?

Take Two: God no.

More like-

Take Two 2012: "We're very skeptical of the Wii U"

Take Two 2016: "Nintendo is making a great effort to support third parties on the Switch, we've very excited!"

And not to mention they are on the confirmed developer list.

 

[Father_Brain]

If both Matt and Emily Rogers say that there's no sea change in Western third-party support coming, you should probably believe them rather than get your hopes up based on positive but extremely vague quotes.

 

[RootCause]

We'll see when the system is out

Yep, it feels like I've heard this song before.

 

[Interfectum]

OK? it has to because it's replacing both the 3ds and WiiU but that doesn't answer the question about third party support? It's not a guarantee at all especially with how Nintendo is and how they are with third party support in the last 3 generations.

The Switch, unlike Wii, Wii U, etc has a standard controller layout that comes with the system and doesn't feature gimmicks. Couple that with the fact that most 3rd party engines are easily portable across platforms means porting a lot of these games won't be a massive undertaking. Devs don't have to worry about second screens, wiimotes, lack of buttons, weird button placement, etc.

Indie devs are going to flock to this system for sure as Unity and UE3 will have built in support and, again, they don't have to code or recode around second screens, motion controls, etc. Their PS4/Xbone game will should compile to the Switch and be up and running fairly quickly.

I think a lot of naysayers are going to be surprised how many games actually end up on this system, especially if it sells relatively well.

 

[Skittzo0413]

If both Matt and Emily Rogers say that there's no sea change in Western third-party support coming, you should probably believe them rather than get your hopes up based on positive but extremely vague quotes.

I don't recall Emily saying anything but didn't Matt just say "don't expect a massive change in terms of western third party support"? That doesn't mean there won't be any improvement, just that we shouldn't expect it to be on par with PS4/XB1.

I mean, if they can get back to Gamecube levels of third party support that in itself would be a huge improvement.

And it's not really that the quotes indicate support- what they do when compared to the quotes about the Wii U is reveal that the attitude of developers seems pretty drastically different this time. Just because a developer/publisher is taking the platform seriously and genuinely believes it has promise doesn't mean we'll get great support from day 1, but it does mean that if the platform takes off then it will likely get much greater support than it would have if the hardware or Nintendo's policies were still as big of a barrier as they were for the Wii U.

 

[Plum]

Take Two: We are extremely impressed with what Nintendo has to offer.

Everyone: Are you gonna make Switch games then?

Take Two: God no.

What is The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim: Special Edition?

 

[Turrican3]

Being the easiest Nintendo system for developers ever is good, but lets not act like they're even close to at parity with Sony and MS because that ignores that Sony and MS have the two most developer friendly consoles of all time right now.

I'm not claiming any parity, I just believe it's very hard to know how difficult is to port games to this platform for people that do not have access to actual dev kits.

The lack of negative rumours at a time where news about the WiiU not being exactly the best machine to develop for were already spreading, plus statements from companies like Take Two who historically haven't had good relationship with Nintendo surely can give some hope at least.

Just like how "great effort" doesn't actually mean results "improving" doesn't mean good.

I actually believe indie relationship *is* good currently, but unfortunately for Nintendo, WiiU was such a massive failure that prevented many more success stories to happen.

The purpose for the consolidation isn't to shoot for the #1 market slot against Sony and MS. It's to have Nintendo fans stop spending money on two different low profit margin hardware products

IIRC Wii and DS were high profit margin hardware so I'm not entirely sure about that.
I'd argue is more about consolidation of their software development, to the extent I fully expect them to pull one or even two other form factors, Switch-compatibile in the following years.

 

[Father_Brain]

I don't recall Emily saying anything but didn't Matt just say "don't expect a massive change in terms of western third party support"? That doesn't mean there won't be any improvement, just that we shouldn't expect it to be on par with PS4/XB1.

I mean, if they can get back to Gamecube levels of third party support that in itself would be a huge improvement.

Even GC levels of third-party support would absolutely be a massive change. It was still getting a large percentage of Western multiplatform games as late as 2005.

Until there's proof to the contrary, I'm standing my prediction: Switch will only get a handful of direct ports of current-gen AAA games over its lifespan, and most of those it does get will be from Ubisoft.

 

[Skittzo0413]

IIRC Wii and DS were high profit margin hardware so I'm not entirely sure about that.
I'd argue is more about consolidation of their software development, to the extent I fully expect them to pull one or even two other form factors, Switch-compatibile in the following years.

Yeah, this has been Nintendo's stated reason for this move many, many times over the past few years. I'm not sure why there are people still doubting it (thinking there's a separate 3DS successor coming) when it's come straight from the horse's mouth.

Even GC levels of third-party support would absolutely be a massive change. It was still getting a large percentage of Western multiplatform games as late as 2005.

Until there's proof to the contrary, I'm standing my prediction: Switch will only get a handful of direct ports of current-gen AAA games over its lifespan, and most of those it does get will be from Ubisoft.

Fair enough, I'm certainly not confident enough to bet against that. But I definitely can see potential for change in that area. The picture will likely be a good bit clearer come January 12th.

 

[Schnozberry]

What is The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim: Special Edition?

Made by Bethesda?

Take Two would be NBA 2K....

 

[Plum]

Made by Bethesda?

... and published by Take Two.

Take Two would be NBA 2K....

Which is coming to the Switch as well.

My bad for forgetting about NBA though.

 

[Nilaul]

Nintendo's biggest problem is basically the apathy towards third parties on by their consumers. Third parties are expected to provide immauclate ports and vast amounts of shown support based on nothing and even then might sell like shit.

Yeah Nintendo consumers should totally re-buy fully-priced ports of old games or ports removed contents and features. Like totally.

 

[Skittzo0413]

Yeah Nintendo consumers should totally re-buy fully-priced ports of old games or ports removed contents and features. Like totally.

The other way to solve that (other than blaming the consumer) is to actually build a different audience who will buy those types of games. That starts with making similar types of games, whether first party or third party exclusive/crossover.

Edit:

The portability of the Switch is going to be a selling point to buying or rebuying a lot of these games too.

I'd imagine a portable Rocket League or Witcher 3 would cause a lot of people to repurchase even if it's missing a feature or two.

I know I'm already saving up for Skyrim Switch, complete with the Nintendo mod package (Samus Dovahkiin vs. Ridley Alduin, Master Sword quest, Parrthurnax voice swapped with Mario, Blue Falcon horse)!

Spoiler

Please Bethesda!

 

[Robin64]

Yeah Nintendo consumers should totally re-buy fully-priced ports of old games or ports removed contents and features. Like totally.

Definitely! I was ecstatic to pay £50 for Mass Effect 3 when other platforms had just gotten Mass Effect Trilogy for £30. Couldn't believe my luck.

 

[Interfectum]

The portability of the Switch is going to be a selling point to buying or rebuying a lot of these games too.

I'd imagine a portable Rocket League or Witcher 3 would cause a lot of people to repurchase even if it's missing a feature or two.

 

[Shaanyboi]

When you had devs packing up their WiiU dev kits before the system even came out, it's hard to take any positive talk seriously until an actual announcement.

 

[GDGF]

The CEO of Take-Two was straight up saying he was skeptical about the Wii U being a good home for their core titles last gen.


http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ta...ore-games-report/1100-6382927/?comment_page=3



The president of Take-Two is straight up saying Nintendo is making a great effort in pleasing third parties with the Switch, adding that they're optimistic about the system.

 

[Turrican3]

I'm not sure why there are people still doubting it (thinking there's a separate 3DS successor coming) when it's come straight from the horse's mouth.

I actually think that *could* actually come, it just wouldn't be a "true" 3DS successor (i.e. a second, totally incompatible platform) but, as I said, simply a "handheld-only" variant of the same Switch hardware that runs the same software. More or less. ^__^

 

[Kilrogg]

We'll see when the system is out

You mean "when the system has been out for a while"

The first few months, if not the first year, will obviously be average at best. No console, at least these days, gets a lot of top-of-the-line third party games from the get-go. So unless the first year of the Switch is absolutely abysmal, we'll have to wait a bit before getting a clear idea of its third-party potential.

 

[Schnozberry]

... and published by Take Two.

Bethesda publishes their own games. Take Two has nothing to do with them.

 

[GDGF]

This is about the most optimistic thing Bethesda said about the Wii U.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/bethesda-on-wii-u-support-we-will-see/1100-6411504/

This is what they're saying about the Switch.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/11/22/nintendo-switch-bethesda-director/

 

[Skittzo0413]

I actually think that *could* actually come, it just wouldn't be a "true" 3DS successor (i.e. a second, totally incompatible platform) but, as I said, simply a "handheld-only" variant of the same Switch hardware that runs the same software. More or less. ^__^

Yeah, that's what I meant by "separate" 3DS successor. As in, a device which is meant to only play handheld games and doesn't share software with the Switch. Which a lot of people seemed to believe up until the Pokemon Stars rumor came out.

This is about the most optimistic thing Bethesda said about the Wii U.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/bethesda-on-wii-u-support-we-will-see/1100-6411504/

This is what they're saying about the Switch.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/11/22/nintendo-switch-bethesda-director/

You should totally make a thread with all of these. Title it something like, "Same song and dance? Not this time!"

 

[Cday]

Telling us what we want to hear.

 

[Plum]

Bethesda publishes their own games. Take Two has nothing to do with them.

Shit, that's me being an idiot then.

 

[Interfectum]

This is about the most optimistic thing Bethesda said about the Wii U.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/bethesda-on-wii-u-support-we-will-see/1100-6411504/

This is what they're saying about the Switch.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/11/22/nintendo-switch-bethesda-director/

Yup, this.

I get that some of you are trying to keep expectations in check but I think it's a bit disingenuous to say these third parties are straight bullshitting us this time because they all loved Wii U too (they didn't).

The only big bullshit line was the infamous "unprecedented partnership" but I'm guessing a lot of crazy happened behind the scenes before and after that announcement.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

You could argue that the Switch is 1.5 console generations behind its competition..

You could, but you could also argue that the Switch is a generation-or-so ahead of the Vita, the iPad and most other 7-inch tablets. Of course, the Vita was a failure, the iPad was not primarily intended for gaming, and neither device is expressly designed to also be usable at home on a larger screen, but that's just it--there's nothing quite the Switch on the market.

 

[atr0cious]

The Switch, unlike Wii, Wii U, etc has a standard controller layout that comes with the system and doesn't feature gimmicks.

The switch is a gimmick in itself and has a less standard layout than the gamepad. But you're right in that things are different this time, mainly due to marketing and how the system was perceived/received by the press and then the general public.

 

[Candescence]

Yeah, third parties were a lot more pessimistic about the Wii U than people think they were.

and you could argue that the Switch is 1.5 console generations behind its competition.

Don't you mean roughly .5? What we know about the Switch's hardware heavily indicates that it's 'half a gen behind' at worst.

 

[Skittzo0413]

The switch is a gimmick in itself and has a less standard layout than the gamepad. But you're right in that things are different this time, mainly due to marketing and how the system was perceived/received by the press and then the general public.

How does the Switch have a less standard layout than the gamepad? It has everything the gamepad has and additionally (rumored) analog triggers.

 

[Interfectum]

The switch is a gimmick in itself and has a less standard layout than the gamepad. But you're right in that things are different this time, mainly due to marketing and how the system was perceived/received by the press and then the general public.

Other than system power, the Switch "gimmick" won't really cause devs to have to rethink their control schemes like, say, the Nintendo Wii would.

And what buttons is the Switch missing that a standard controller has?

 

[Mpl90]

Yeah, that's what I meant by "separate" 3DS successor. As in, a device which is meant to only play handheld games and doesn't share software with the Switch. Which a lot of people seemed to believe up until the Pokemon Stars rumor came out.



You should totally make a thread with all of these. Title it something like, "Same song and dance? Not this time!"

Naaah, too click-baity. Something like "A comparison between Wii U and Switch pre-launch statements" would be a better fit. Also, if anyone's going to do it, please include my post on why the so-much touted "Wii U slide" is actually a fake (it's in this thread as well, just at the bottom of page 7).

 

[Dark Cloud]

This is about the most optimistic thing Bethesda said about the Wii U.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/bethesda-on-wii-u-support-we-will-see/1100-6411504/

This is what they're saying about the Switch.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/11/22/nintendo-switch-bethesda-director/

Naw. It's the same song and dance. *rolls eyes*

 

[The Hermit]

Yes, Take Two saying something like this is of note.

Nothing huge, but something to note.

I think its the first time Take Two even mentioned Nintendo.

 

[aBarreras]

Bethesda publishes their own games. Take Two has nothing to do with them.

Take two published Oblivion, but that was 10 years ago

 

[Alienous]

You could, but you could also argue that the Switch is a generation-or-so ahead of the Vita, the iPad and most other 7-inch tablets. Of course, the Vita was a failure, the iPad was not primarily intended for gaming, and neither device is expressly designed to also be usable at home on a larger screen, but that's just it--there's nothing quite the Switch on the market.

I just don't know how much that matters. The Vita was capable of outputting impressive games on the go, but that wasn't enough. "Play last-gen games in higher fidelity on the go" doesn't seem like a big selling point, and "play current-gen games on a handheld" would probably entail prohibitive development resources to down-port Xbox One and PS4 games, depending on how powerful the hardware actually is (which we don't know for sure yet).

Don't you mean roughly .5? What we know about the Switch's hardware heavily indicates that it's 'half a gen behind' at worst.

Yeah, 1.5 was off. Assuming the Switch is halfway between the 360/PS3 console generation, and the XBONE/PS4 console generation, then the Switch would be ~1 console generation behind the latest hardware (the PS4 Pro and the Scorpio) using my admittedly flawed logic.

The sentiment was that I expect developers to skew upwards rather than downwards - it seems far more likely that they'll invest time into better performing/looking versions of games for the new hardware rather than investing time in getting Xbox One quality games to run on portable hardware.

 

[psyfi]

Good to hear, but I'm not getting my hopes up. It's buy most my games on Switch if I could, though.

 

[10k]

I'm not falling for this again. It may be Bethesda saying it this time instead of EA and Ubisoft but I'll wait to see if it's true. Post this quote again Xmas 2017.

 

[El Topo]

I'm not falling for this again. It may be Bethesda saying it this time instead of EA and Ubisoft but I'll wait to see if it's true. Post this quote again Xmas 2017.

Yup. Words are cheap. Time will tell. Wait, can I get another common saying in this post? Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder. The early bird catches the worm.

 

[nikatapi]

I'm not falling for this again. It may be Bethesda saying it this time instead of EA and Ubisoft but I'll wait to see if it's true. Post this quote again Xmas 2017.

True. On the other hand, even though the system is going to be weaker than the other consoles, it's the first time when a Nintendo device doesn't seem to have a unique architecture, and i'm sure Nvidia as a provider of both hardware and software has made a serious effort in making the console easy to develop for.

In that sense, Switch might be the most developer-friendly console ever to come from Nintendo, and that is definitely a step towards attracting more games, if it makes the investment for ports significantly smaller.

And we haven't heard much (if any) negative comments about the console at this point, while WiiU had some criticism from the beginning.
The hybrid nature of the system is a big selling point, and i'm pretty confident that the 3rd party support at least in the first year is going to be significantly stronger than it was on the WiiU. Whether the support is going to be something worth buying is another thing though, and of course how these games will perform is something to be seen.

 

[Pejo]

So best case scenario, what are people actually expecting with this? Downports of current gen games? Late ports of PS3/360 games? Custom games made only for the Switch by 3rd parties?

I just honestly don't see how this thing makes sense to third party publishers by being behind the curve on tech.

I mean, look at the Wii. It sold like crazy, but even then 3rd party games mostly sold like shit, and most of the support was bargain bin shovelware like Imagine Babyz.

I think Nintendo is never going to get truly great 3rd party support until they actually make their consoles at least somewhat comparable to where the rest of the industry sits.

Who knows though, maybe Switch will be powerful enough to run PS4/Xbone games at 720p with lower visual effects. That could be good enough, especially when playing on the go.

 

[trikster40]

Don't we hear this with every new Nintendo system? Try as they might, Nintendo is just more concerned with maintaining their family-friendly image. The last console that they took risks with was the GameCube. You had Nintendo publishing M rated games. You had Eternal Darkness, MGS, etc. to me, the GC felt on par with PS and XB while still maintaining their image.

At this point, Nintendo thrives on the handheld market. That market is shrinking thanks to mobile, and Nintendo is going to try to bring the mobile market to a new level with console gaming on the go. I have a feeling you are going to find some initial 3rd party support but it will quickly deteriorate like always. You'll see a lot of easy ports based on the commments regarding the ease of porting over, but once the Pro and Scorpio take off, porting those over won't be as easy.

 

[Makonero]

Yup. Words are cheap. Time will tell. Wait, can I get another common saying in this post? Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder. The early bird catches the worm.

it is what it is

 

[Skittzo0413]

Naaah, too click-baity. Something like "A comparison between Wii U and Switch pre-launch statements" would be a better fit. Also, if anyone's going to do it, please include my post on why the so-much touted "Wii U slide" is actually a fake (it's in this thread as well, just at the bottom of page 7).

Ha yeah my idea was kind of a joke. And yes, I'm very tired of seeing that Wii U list- it's certainly not accurate.

So best case scenario, what are people actually expecting with this? Downports of current gen games? Late ports of PS3/360 games? Custom games made only for the Switch by 3rd parties?

I just honestly don't see how this thing makes sense to third party publishers by being behind the curve on tech.

I mean, look at the Wii. It sold like crazy, but even then 3rd party games mostly sold like shit, and most of the support was bargain bin shovelware like Imagine Babyz.

I think Nintendo is never going to get truly great 3rd party support until they actually make their consoles at least somewhat comparable to where the rest of the industry sits.

Who knows though, maybe Switch will be powerful enough to run PS4/Xbone games at 720p with lower visual effects. That could be good enough, especially when playing on the go.

We have very trustworthy insiders saying that porting PS4/XB1 games to Switch will not be much of a technical problem. So since it seems you're working under the assumption that the Switch won't be powerful enough to run those games (at least unless they're heavily downgraded like Wii versions were) then that assumption appears to be wrong.

Based on what we know and what's been rumored, the Switch might be closer to XB1 in real world performance than the XB1 is to the PS4. So if the XB1 can get satisfactory ports then the Switch likely will too.

Also, the big draw for third parties is the ability to offer full AAA console games on a mobile console. That's a much bigger selling point than what we had on the Wii U (asymmetrical gameplay, dual screens) and possibly even the Wii.

 

[boiled goose]

Same song and dance every launch.

I'll believe it when I see it.

.

The power middleground and nonstandard controls will probably be an issue.

 

[Candescence]

but once the Pro and Scorpio take off, porting those over won't be as easy.

Newsflash, Scorpio and Pro won't factor into anything. Exclusives for either won't happen, because that would be basically Sony and/or MS shooting themselves in the foot.

The power middleground and nonstandard controls will probably be an issue.

The Switch's controls is basically a bog-standard dual-stick controller. There's nothing nonstandard about it.

 

[Interfectum]

.

The power middleground and nonstandard controls will probably be an issue.

How does Switch have nonstandard controls?

 

[Plum]

.

The power middleground and nonstandard controls will probably be an issue.

There's literally nothing nonstandard about the Switch's controls. It even has analog triggers instead of digital like with the Wii U.

 

[boiled goose]

There's literally nothing nonstandard about the Switch's controls. It even has analog triggers instead of digital like with the Wii U.

Two shoulder buttons?

 

[Skittzo0413]

Two shoulder buttons?

Yes... there is a shoulder and a trigger button on each of the joycons.

 

[Anth0ny]

Controller won't be a problem for third parties this time around

It'll be the lack of power and, more importantly, perception of the audience for third party games on Nintendo platforms.