Did you play games during the PS3/360 generation? There was a lot of this and nobody complained too much. There is a lot of sub-Full HD games this generation as well. I still spend quite a lot of time gaming on my PS3 and 360 on my 4K and the games still look really good.
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Nintendo Switch Dev Kit Stats Leaked? Cortex A57, 4GB RAM, 32GB Storage, Multi-Touch.
- Thread starter Robert at Zeboyd Games
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Did you play games during the PS3/360 generation? There was a lot of this and nobody complained too much. There is a lot of sub-Full HD games this generation as well. I still spend quite a lot of time gaming on my PS3 and 360 on my 4K and the games still look really good.
That whole paragraph is an explanation of why there probably aren't more cores.
And what reason would Nintendo have to lie to developers and describe the system as weaker than it actually is?
I think it's time to start coming to terms with the dark truth.
These are devs who were working on games for Wii U and came out publicly. Come one, they wouldn't have done this if they were under NDA. And that's why was so damaging in fact for Wii U. Devs stating things under anonymity wouldn't have been the same.
If a user would came now on GAF and post something similar he would be scrutinised to hell and back.
Skittzo0413
Member
But that's not what you claimed. You claimed that this article confirms 256 CUDA cores, and while it says more is unlikely, that speculation alone clearly indicates that they have not been able to confirm 256 CUDA cores. Why the hell would they even be speculating on any of that from that paragraph if anything here was confirmed?
As far as I can tell from the article, the only thing they have seemingly confirmed is the clock speeds. The configuration is still unknown.
As to your edit, I don't think DF has said Nintendo briefed developers on those exact specs. Even if that is what they meant, that could very well be a baseline expectation as these specs were in the devkits at some point before July. For that matter we have no idea WHEN devs were briefed on these specs. So the fact that DF is not considering any of those specs confirmed tells me that they don't know what the final hardware will be.
And I'm definitely bracing for the worst now. I would gladly accept what they say if not for the fan making no sense to me, but I'm certainly willing to accept that they may have needed the fan and that it's not as big a point of failure as I thought.
Read my edit responding to your edit. The specs listed there were in the devkits at some point before July. This could easily be what DF meant by "briefed developers on these specs"- they did so some time before July.
It clearly states Nintendo is telling developers that's how many cores there are. I doubt Nintendo is lying to its developers. You're setting yourself up for brutal disappointment.
Battlefield 1 already do that. That game is rendering at 540p and using chessboard upscale to show 1080p on screen.
If switch use that for all the most advanced games, the visuals will not look bad.
Yeah I did, were there many Games in that range? I have ark on Xbox one in mind, it is sub HD and still higher than 540p. It looks terrible.
And remember in portable mode there are only 40% of the Power available.
I hope devs reduce other factors and keep the Resolution minimum at 720p.
I'm actually expecting Switch Mini to finally fully replace 3DS in late 2018. Smaller, lighter and pocketable.
Yeah, I think this is the most disappointing thing about the latest info, the wasted potential.
I didn't feel disappointed in Wii U because it was really like a house renovation, sometimes building a nicer floor on the top of the ugly ground floor doesn't turn nice.
But now when they have the possibilities of building something from scratch and they had also great tools, something somewhere went wrong and the potential was wasted.
And it's especially disappointing because the other aspects of Switch will probably be great: cool design, some awesome engineering according to the patents and possibly a good price. Could have been the perfect storm indeed. Maybe there will be an awesome price to compensate.
https://mynintendonews.com/2016/12/19/nintendo-switch-listed-as-vulkan-and-opengl-conformant/
https://www.khronos.org/conformance/adopters/conformant-products#vulkan
Good news? Bad news?
People seem to be spazzing out about it
https://www.khronos.org/conformance/adopters/conformant-products#vulkan
Good news? Bad news?
People seem to be spazzing out about it
LordRaptor
Member
Well it confirms its a modern GPU that supports a modern GPU featureset, if there was any doubt about that side of things.
Great news, but we've known for a few days.
Milly Osworth
Member
Old news.
https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/list-of-rendering-resolutions.41152/
There is a incomplete list in that link that gives an idea of the variance of resolutions in the library. Also, don't get hung up on that 40% number. That number refers to the GPU, which is based on a incomplete assessment of unconfirmed specs.
.8GB for OS 3.2GB for games.
That would be a hell of a surprise.
lwilliams3
Member
I wonder if Nintendo themselves will decide to go ahead and upclock them and slightly increase the speed of the fan via firmware down the road. This is assuming that it is 4x A57s instead of something stronger like A72s. I also wonder if it has active A53s in there.
This was part of the leak by Emily Rogers but nobody knows if this is the premium or basic model. I would assume the basic model would be doubled.
So it's either 16->32 or 32->64
It's always worse than we think.
And this rumor was only one person in this thread afaik.
I expect between 1-2gb, that makes more sense to me.
Only stated by Vern and nobody else.
Edit: at least now I can believe that it won't have a browser. With the CPU that underclocked who knows how well it handled the OS and the games all together.
It's still has higher internal volume for just the tablet portion sans joycon controllers vs the Vita 1000.
Schnozberry
Member
The 28nm thing was something invented out of whole cloth to explain things that people are having a hard time accepting. People should stop spreading it.
The WiiU's bloated OS is 1gb, why would this be... larger?
There's almost zero chance this has only four cores. I can't see it. This is either going to have a couple of little cores for handling OS and off-gaming features (like the recording feature), or it has more than four cores and some of them are used for non-gaming purposes.
Maybe it gets a Gamecube's PowerPC to power the OS. That would explain also the VC. /jk
When you listen to your brain and not your heart, when you read all the available information objectively, do you really believe that's the case? When you look at that paragraph explaining why you shouldn't expect hidden cores, when you read that Nintendo is telling developers it's 256, what conclusion do you draw? Put wishful thinking aside for a moment.
lol
I think there's something amiss with what we know about the CPU, the VC is especially a big ??? for the GameCube because unless NERD did something magical, I am not sure how they can get around the CPU bottlenecks usually associated with software emulation with this CPU.
But then I am coming at this from Dolphin on PC, which is largely single thread clock limited.
lwilliams3
Member
Well, even the Wii, 3DS, and Wii U had this little ARM9 @ 100+MHz (fan-named Scarlet for the Wii) for some background stuff.
Skittzo0413
Member
You must be missing the parts of my posts where I'm accepting what DF is speculating to be what we're getting...
All I'm saying is- from a objective and logical read of that article, they have clearly not confirmed those specs. Why would they be saying they've now confirmed the clock speeds but not the GPU/CPU configurations? Why would they be speculating that there COULD be more CUDA cores, no matter how unlikely?
AGAIN: It's very likely that what they're saying about overall performance is correct and I've accepted that. But they are not claiming to be confirming the GPU/CPU configurations in that article.
This is what I was curious about in a previous post (here):
But I can't figure out why you'd do something like that (adding an extra SM and then further clocking down) than just downclock 2SMs less rigorously. Is there some sort of battery/power gain in this or is it a shot idea?
The hypothetical of the 3SM with lower clocks puts it right at the original 2SM performance in just mathematical terms, which is why I was curious. 512 vs. ~590.
But I can't figure out why you'd do something like that (adding an extra SM and then further clocking down) than just downclock 2SMs less rigorously. Is there some sort of battery/power gain in this or is it a shot idea?
The hypothetical of the 3SM with lower clocks puts it right at the original 2SM performance in just mathematical terms, which is why I was curious. 512 vs. ~590.
For me, considering the info that we got from insiders and the chronology of those leaks it really seems that initially in the devkits there was a standard TX1, a Jetson board practically and that the restrictions regarding the clocks (and maybe new devkits) were communicated afterwards. That's practically the only way the info fit well in the timeline.
It could even be combined with a fan no longer being in the tablet, although that would make quite strange the vents seen in what seems to be already a retail unit (Fallon).
It could even be combined with a fan no longer being in the tablet, although that would make quite strange the vents seen in what seems to be already a retail unit (Fallon).
lwilliams3
Member
Lol. They did do things like that for the DS, 3DS, and Wii, and Wii U (they basically have a shrunken Hollywood GPU in the latter), so it is not unusual for Nintendo to add customization to aid BC.
We would have almost certainly has some kind of leak specifically calling out a downgrade though I think. There's no way there wouldn't be a revolt if they pulled such a downgrade.
Could they actually evolve a PowerPC core into a mobile one? I mean they tormented the poor little processor so much between from GC to Wii U that nothing would surprise me anymore. We need Blu's take on this one.
Leaking info to Eurogamer is also a kind of revolt. But in the end, the system seems relatively easy to work with, so I don't think there are that many reasons for revolt.
Thraktor posted about this a bunch and basically yes, more SMs at lower clocks means less power for equal or greater performance to fewer SMs at higher clocks.
What is this new info that DF got if not someone wanting us to know that the system "sucks"?
Yeah well, not so sure about that. Unlike Wii U this thing has so far positive buzz and is planned to sell rather well, and we haven't even seen games.
Thrashing a potential good source of revenue even anonymously is not a good idea at this point.
Nah this is a technical spec for retail, this is probably just a normal leak from SDK updates like with the Neo. DF is itself rather positive on the whole thing anyway, so it doesn't really paint a negative picture.
Yeah, probably. With all the Nvidia tools and OpenGL and Vulkan compatibiltiy, big engines support and so on I don't think devs have actual reasons to complain. Wii U situation was totally different because the tools and the support really sucked even long time after launch.
teflontactics
Member
At this point nobody knows what the actual architecture configuration is going to look like, and all we have is a few clockspeeds, speculation, and "leaked" information that may or may not be accurate, and may or may not be old information (ie; an old config, or build of devkit - or even an old "plan").
As such, I think trying to nail down the exact power of the system is pretty pointless with this amount of confirmed information. The range of possibilities in the final product and the possibility of unknown unknowns is too high.
We can claim clockspeeds of three parts, which may or may not be the entirety of the system's processing power, and may or may not include the OS as a resource hog.
Not much to say yet, IMO.
As such, I think trying to nail down the exact power of the system is pretty pointless with this amount of confirmed information. The range of possibilities in the final product and the possibility of unknown unknowns is too high.
We can claim clockspeeds of three parts, which may or may not be the entirety of the system's processing power, and may or may not include the OS as a resource hog.
Not much to say yet, IMO.
Also came at the same time as the Vulkan info, so it just feels like a final info dump on the system going out.
Though its only partial at Euro, since they only have a very small piece of the picture as they only seem to have clock numbers... which is a bit weird.
They would have reason to complain if their target hardware had its CPU power cut in half four months before launch though. That would be a massive issue.
EDIT:
Clock speeds is like one of the only spec figures Nintendo gives out to developers.
What? That's nonsense.
The wiiU had a great browser with a much weaker CPU
I'm trying to figure out which of the games we kind of know already would be really impacted byt this and I don't find one.
Much weaker is a stretch. But that was more me being facetious.
lwilliams3
Member
That actually would be a very good reason why the Switch needs a fan even undocked.. lol.
Seriously, I believe the PowerPC architecture is too power hungry. It has been rumors that Nintendo has previously attempted to use PowerPC Gekko into a portable.
So some things I need to say about this now.
First, people who are crying about 32gb internal memory: We can have sd cards afaik and also we have cardridges, which is way better than anything else. There isn´t a hdd where you can buy 1tb for <50, it is probably something like SD and 128gb SD are 100.
Second, at all these people who are crying with "what only 720p my mobile phone does 1080p/1440p" Yes it does, but don´t forget ps4pro can´t even do last guardian on 1080p with more than 30fps.
And at last, after reading the eurogamer leak which is claiming that the tweet is real and after reading thraktors post I can now be relieved and don´t believe it. The person who tweeted this, literally claimed to know about the switch before the trailer and said "Nvidia? No emily is wrong it will be amd like SMD64 said". And now after the trailer suddenly this came up. No thanks
First, people who are crying about 32gb internal memory: We can have sd cards afaik and also we have cardridges, which is way better than anything else. There isn´t a hdd where you can buy 1tb for <50, it is probably something like SD and 128gb SD are 100.
Second, at all these people who are crying with "what only 720p my mobile phone does 1080p/1440p" Yes it does, but don´t forget ps4pro can´t even do last guardian on 1080p with more than 30fps.
And at last, after reading the eurogamer leak which is claiming that the tweet is real and after reading thraktors post I can now be relieved and don´t believe it. The person who tweeted this, literally claimed to know about the switch before the trailer and said "Nvidia? No emily is wrong it will be amd like SMD64 said". And now after the trailer suddenly this came up. No thanks
A GPU is more than just ROPs and shaders, but if you do keep downclocking, you're also reducing performance on the geometry setup (the front end of the rendering pipe).
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