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65% Gross Racist Dad Joke, 35% Spy Shit, 5% Paxton—True Lies: Cameron's Worst Film

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foxdvd

foxdvd

Member
The bathroom sequence is still one of the best. The best part...Arnold waiting for the attack and he decides to act unaware by taking a piss...and he is actually taking a piss, not faking. That is some balls there.

Years later, I was shocked how much the strip sequence, and the punishing of his wife was taken so far. I was a little taken back by the middle part of the movie when I saw it in theaters, but watching again there is a solid 30 minutes of misogynist bullshit. It really is beyond cruel.

This movie is both amazing and bad at the same time. Unfortunately you have Bill Paxton's amazing performance mixed in with some serious bullshit.
 
P

Par Score

Member
True Lies is great, right up there with Last Action Hero and Kindergarten Cop.

Bobby Roberts said:
But it's the Bond comparisons (and the movie openly invites them every 5-10 minutes, so it's unavoidable) that really brought into contrast just how badly this film has aged in the 20+ years since its release. I remembered this movie being more of a spy movie than it actually is. There's not much spy shit here at all. It's closer to fuckin' Austin Powers than Bond.
Click to expand...

rDEEprO.gif


Of course it is, it's a comedy.
 
M

Messofanego

Banned
Only diehard Cameron fans bring up this movie (much like Piranha 2). If you didn't see it at the time, no one talks about it other than maybe one GIF from it, that it's a bad parody action thing, or the awkward striptease. It has no cultural cache.
 
Pegasus Actual

Pegasus Actual

Member
Hilarious movie. Great action. I don't t think it's fair to project psychobabble onto the director because he got divorced. What's supposed to be racist? Islamic extremists attacking America and demanding we stop meddling in the middle-east?

And I don't know what to tell you, as a kid it was very clear that Arnie was off the deep end and that Tom Arnold was too spineless to stand up to him. The movie was actually pretty sympathetic to Jamie Lee Curtis's cheating on him. It made it very clear that she was being neglected emotionally. It didn't try to make you "hate the cheating whore" at all.

One of Cameron's better movies, and one of Arnie's for that matter.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
Pegasus Actual said:
Hilarious movie. Great action. I don't t think it's fair to project psychobabble onto the director because he got divorced. What's supposed to be racist? Islamic extremists attacking America and demanding we stop meddling in the middle-east?

And I don't know what to tell you, as a kid it was very clear that Arnie was off the deep end and that Tom Arnold was too spineless to stand up to him. The movie was actually pretty sympathetic to Jamie Lee Curtis's cheating on him. It made it very clear that she was being neglected emotionally. It didn't try to make you "hate the cheating whore" at all.

One of Cameron's better movies, and one of Arnie's for that matter.
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Definitely Arnold's last great movie too.
 
H

Htown

STOP SHITTING ON MY MOTHER'S HEADSTONE
Yeah, the striptease scene was kind of awful.

It tries to be funny and sexy, but that only works if you completely forget that Curtis's character is supposed to be a human being for a few minutes.
 
M

Megasoum

Banned
Fevaweva said:
The Rock is better than True Lies.
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I mean... Yeah of course... The Rock is EASILY in my Top 3 best action movie of all times.

However... I think True Lies is a great movie. It's one of those seminal 90s action movies that you don't see anymore.
 
D

Discotheque

Banned
it's his weakest movie aside from that Piranha 2 thing.

still I thought Bill Paxton was fuckin hilarious and some of the action in here is dope as hell. The man knows his setpieces. That bridge scene and the harrier jet too..god damn.
 
Y

Yamauchi

Banned
I watched it a few years ago and thought it was still enjoyable but definitely outdated. Not a bad flick, though. Paxton was hilarious.
 
K

kswiston

Member
I saw this in theatres when I was 11 or 12 and thought it was great. Mainly due to the mentioned stuff with the harrier jet. Any sensitivities would have probably been lost on me. I didn't even know what a blow job was in that one joke (my elementary school was home to a lot of sheltered kids). I might have seen it on a cable a few times since then, but I don't recall watching True Lies since leaving high school. As such, I can't comment on the racism/sexism/etc. If I ever noticed it, it was close to 20 years ago.

I do remember thinking that it was weird that Tom Arnold was talking about the sex life of Arnold's daughter who was supposed to be 14 or something.
 
S

shintoki

sparkle this bitch
While I enjoy, it's always been a mess of a film. First half hour and last half hour, don't match up with the middle, which is surprising since Cameron really doesn't mess up with plotting.

But I'll agree with the premise. Film is something that just can't happen now, bit lost in time similar to stuff like Mel Brooks and others.
 
Schattenjäger

Schattenjäger

Gabriel Knight
Bobby Roberts said:
But Harry Tasker essentially lies his wife into a dangerous situation, forces her to pretend she's a prostitute, then forces her to perform for him, and while Harry gets his comeuppance for this later, the entire thing is played 100% as an acceptable gag. It's really fucking creepy and gross.

.
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I won't even get into the other ludicrous points you made and focus on this..

What exactly is so creepy and gross about what Harry Tasker did? Married couples role play all the time ..
Grant it.. he took advantage of his spy privileges but it's a movie and the scene is integral to the plot of the movie

If you're gonna hate on the movie - at least hate on the pacing as that was the worst part
 
T

tuna_love

Banned
i had no idea who directed this movie so im not a Stan of cameron or anything like that shit. i fucking love this movie.
 
M

Matt

Member
Schattenjäger;232386869 said:
I won't even get into the other ludicrous points you made and focus on this..

What exactly is so creepy and gross about what Harry Tasker did? Married couples role play all the time ..
Grant it.. he took advantage of his spy privileges but it's a movie and the scene is integral to the plot of the movie

If you're gonna hate on the movie - at least hate on the pacing as that was the worst part
Click to expand...
Generally people who role play, you know, are aware that it's a game.

He absolutely was way out of line, and the movie even says so.
 
bryanee

bryanee

Member
Urgh what terrible opinion.

One of my faves. Hilarious and the action is fantastic. If it wasn't for T2 it would easily be my fave Arnie flick.
 
M

Messofanego

Banned
lmao at people conveniently forgetting the racism and sexism

Here's an article from 1994, it's not some revisionist hot take or some "with mature eyes" thing.

http://ew.com/article/1994/08/05/racism-and-sexism-true-lies/

After raking in $62 million in just two weeks, True Lies has eased fears about recouping its reported $120 million budget. But Arnold Schwarzenegger’s actioner is now embroiled in another sort of trouble, a controversy involving charges of racism and sexism.

A loose coalition of Arab-American organizations picketed the film’s mid-July opening in more than 10 cities across the country, protesting its cartoonish depiction of fanatical, kaffiyeh-clad Arab terrorists. The New York City-based National Council on Islamic Affairs and the American-Arab Relations Committee have called for a boycott of the movie and for its outright banning in 54 Arab and Muslim countries. ”This film is truly a bunch of lies,” says Albert Mokhiber, president of the American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC) — the group that persuaded Disney to alter possibly offensive lyrics for Aladdin‘s video release.

As it did with Asian-American groups concerned about racial stereotyping in Rising Sun, the film’s distributor, Twentieth Century Fox, rebuffed Arab-American groups’ early requests to screen the film. Just weeks prior to Lies‘ release, the studio agreed to add a disclaimer — a decision that Fox spokeswoman Andrea Jaffe says ”cost us some money, and required an extra day’s work on the picture.” The disclaimer hasn’t won Fox much goodwill. ”When I stayed to see it,” says ADC spokeswoman Anne Marie Baylouny, ”I was the only one left in the theater.”

The ADC is asking that Schwarzenegger tape a new statement for the Lies‘ video, explaining that the film’s villains do not represent any particular race. ”With the fall of the Soviet empire, Hollywood needs a new enemy; we’ve become a convenient scapegoat,” says Mokhiber. Lies director James Cameron counters, ”I just needed some convenient villains. It could [have been] anybody. I could have picked Irish terrorists.”

Cameron, who was praised for his gun-toting heroines in Aliens and the Terminator films, has also been slammed for Lies‘ attitude toward women, especially in the film’s talked-about strip-tease scene. ”I felt embarrassed for both Jamie Lee Curtis and for her character when I watched her scenes,” says Los Angeles Times film critic Kenneth Turan, whose review helped spark a debate over whether the film was misogynistic. ”In the context of an action film, a strong character is in control. She’s being controlled. The audience is laughing at her because she’s being humiliated.” Unlike the Arab-Americans, however, women’s groups have yet to condemn the film. ”We don’t think the intent is to make women look bad,” explains Tammy Bruce, president of the National Organization for Women’s L.A. chapter. ”Compared to the Arabs, women come off relatively well in this one.”

Cameron also dismisses charges of sexism. ”I don’t think every scene in a movie has to present itself as an example of political correctness,” he says, defending the controversial interrogation scene in which a hidden Schwarzenegger bullies wife Curtis into confessing her love for him. ”I’ve had a lot of guys say, ‘I need one of those rooms at my house.’ ”​
 
S

Snowman Prophet of Doom

Member
Titanic and Avatar are both worse. They're not even enjoyable on a level of cheese the way this film is, just trite dialogue and annoying characters played completely straight.
 
S

Skiptastic

Member
Don't you besmirch the name of Temple of Doom, Bobby! I won't stand for it! *remains seated*

True Lies was weird when I rewatched it recently. I didn't like it that much but it's okay. I haven't seen all of Cameron's filmography to determine if it is his worst.
 
T

The Albatross

Member
The Strip Tease was considered twisted back then too.

Personally I think that Avatar is worse. True Lies is intentionally cheesy. At the time, I thought it was a comedy, and so the lame humor, stereotypical characters and jokes, never bothered me (then, haven't seen it recently), but I just figured it was a comedy. Avatar is unintentionally cheesy. It is brutally, skin crawlingly cheesy and cliched.
 
T

tuna_love

Banned
Messofanego said:
lmao at people conveniently forgetting the racism and sexism

Here's an article from 1994, it's not some revisionist hot take or some "with mature eyes" thing.

http://ew.com/article/1994/08/05/racism-and-sexism-true-lies/

After raking in $62 million in just two weeks, True Lies has eased fears about recouping its reported $120 million budget. But Arnold Schwarzenegger’s actioner is now embroiled in another sort of trouble, a controversy involving charges of racism and sexism.

A loose coalition of Arab-American organizations picketed the film’s mid-July opening in more than 10 cities across the country, protesting its cartoonish depiction of fanatical, kaffiyeh-clad Arab terrorists. The New York City-based National Council on Islamic Affairs and the American-Arab Relations Committee have called for a boycott of the movie and for its outright banning in 54 Arab and Muslim countries. ”This film is truly a bunch of lies,” says Albert Mokhiber, president of the American Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC) — the group that persuaded Disney to alter possibly offensive lyrics for Aladdin‘s video release.

As it did with Asian-American groups concerned about racial stereotyping in Rising Sun, the film’s distributor, Twentieth Century Fox, rebuffed Arab-American groups’ early requests to screen the film. Just weeks prior to Lies‘ release, the studio agreed to add a disclaimer — a decision that Fox spokeswoman Andrea Jaffe says ”cost us some money, and required an extra day’s work on the picture.” The disclaimer hasn’t won Fox much goodwill. ”When I stayed to see it,” says ADC spokeswoman Anne Marie Baylouny, ”I was the only one left in the theater.”

The ADC is asking that Schwarzenegger tape a new statement for the Lies‘ video, explaining that the film’s villains do not represent any particular race. ”With the fall of the Soviet empire, Hollywood needs a new enemy; we’ve become a convenient scapegoat,” says Mokhiber. Lies director James Cameron counters, ”I just needed some convenient villains. It could [have been] anybody. I could have picked Irish terrorists.”

Cameron, who was praised for his gun-toting heroines in Aliens and the Terminator films, has also been slammed for Lies‘ attitude toward women, especially in the film’s talked-about strip-tease scene. ”I felt embarrassed for both Jamie Lee Curtis and for her character when I watched her scenes,” says Los Angeles Times film critic Kenneth Turan, whose review helped spark a debate over whether the film was misogynistic. ”In the context of an action film, a strong character is in control. She’s being controlled. The audience is laughing at her because she’s being humiliated.” Unlike the Arab-Americans, however, women’s groups have yet to condemn the film. ”We don’t think the intent is to make women look bad,” explains Tammy Bruce, president of the National Organization for Women’s L.A. chapter. ”Compared to the Arabs, women come off relatively well in this one.”

Cameron also dismisses charges of sexism. ”I don’t think every scene in a movie has to present itself as an example of political correctness,” he says, defending the controversial interrogation scene in which a hidden Schwarzenegger bullies wife Curtis into confessing her love for him. ”I’ve had a lot of guys say, ‘I need one of those rooms at my house.’ ”​
Click to expand...
how is it convenient?
 
JeTmAn81

JeTmAn81

Member
It was pretty crappy then, it's pretty crappy now. The Uzi stairs scene is one of the worst in cinematic history. But I don't remember anything racist about it.
 
C

cchum

Member
The Icon said:
I'm pretty sure Bobby is on a mission to destroy all the things I love. Next week - Big Trouble in Little China.
Click to expand...

That movie is more sexist than true lies, dude tries to own a woman lol.

Also why they gotta be Chinese?

Halfway joking. Love big trouble.
 
entremet

entremet

Member
cchum said:
That movie is more sexist than true lies, dude tries to own a woman lol.

Also why they gotta be Chinese?
Click to expand...

You're gonna go down a deep rabbit hole if we're going to now analyze some of favorite films in a social lens and dock them points for that.

Doesn't make them poor films.
 
M

Magilla

Banned
cchum said:
That movie is more sexist than true lies, dude tries to own a woman lol.

Also why they gotta be Chinese?
Click to expand...

Yo... you are going to deem a movie as sexist because the Bad Guy does something sexist..?

Why they trying to kill Jewish people in Schindler's List? That movie is hella racist!
 
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