Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
Post the whole transcript without the ellipses and the few sentences before and the ones after.
Words matter(ironic).
This exchange is maher trying to squash cubes poignant speech.
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Thats our word, and you cant have it back: Ice Cube confronts Bill Maher
- Thread starter Loudninja
- Start date
Post the whole transcript without the ellipses and the few sentences before and the ones after.
Words matter(ironic).
This exchange is maher trying to squash cubes poignant speech.
OG Shaka Zulu
Member
So when friends use bitch amongst each other, same thing? I'm not a black woman but I had no problem with the way Issa and her friends talked amongst each other on Insecure.
I say the n-word at home. In public sometimes amongst my peer group but never around elderly Black people unless they use it as well.
I say the n-word at home. In public sometimes amongst my peer group but never around elderly Black people unless they use it as well.
ChimpBottle
Member
The word has never been in my lexicon, but I will never support the idea that only one group gets to use a word. I understand the history behind it, but as long as black people continue to let it hold power, there's always going to be a divide.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
We don't allow you to use it because of the history behind it. It's literally that simple. There will always be a divide regardless of whether or not white people can use the same word that they used to use to demean black people.
Intheflorsh
Banned
He starts off by making excuses and acting defensive, and he ends by trying to change the subject immediately. That's not what "owning it" looks like.
Why would a white person want to say it?
Context has been and will always be a critical element of language. Certain words come on or off the table based on audience, and others can be blocked from one's vernacular based on who they are. Slurs have historically been adopted by marginalized groups to potentially be used within their subculture as a method to own an identity without shame, and to overcome the negative connotations society at large has thrust upon them. When members outside that group co-opt that word it still carries as a slur, regardless of intent.
If you're not black, I don't give a shit what you think. Period.
Intheflorsh
Banned
What came before isn't relevant if this is the way he's acting afterwards. Clearly he hasn't learned anything.
People that know they should not say it creates the divide.
EdibleKnife
Member
The divide exists literally only because white people continue to step on toes. Religious symbols have power to their followers and yet people seek to tread carefully and respect the people for whom those symbols carry weight. These social contracts exist and the US in general hasn't earned the opportunity to end the contract in regards to the word 'nigger' just because random white comedians would like to say it.
BadAss2961
Member
I'm black and I agree.
Cube was right about everything. But i'm not a fan of it being our word. One way to keep it alive is casually throwing it around to the point that it's part of your every day vocabulary.
We're pop culture now. Our music is mainstream. We influence people of all backgrounds now more than ever. The word will stay in the minds of white people as long as we continue to repeat it like its nothing. Only when we stop calling each other this will everyone truly understand that its never okay for them to use it.
Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
The fuck did you think you watched?
If anything cube bent over backwards trying to not make maher look like a total piece of shit.
ChimpBottle
Member
That's a pessimistic outlook, and a poor approach to progress. I live in a place where racism is very minimal, and I think if any of my black friends were to start caring about that word, it wouldn't help.
UnemployedVillain
Member
No, there's always going to be a divide as long as white people experience vast benefits do to privilege. The word is just being scapegoated as the reason despite having nothing to do with it. As Slayven said, why would a white person want to say the word?
For instance, a gay person might use the word "fag" (whether you think it should be used at all or not is another discussion), but why would a straight person have any reason to? Why would they desire to? Just because someone else can do something they can't?
BrutishMrFish
Member
It doesn't count if the number of black people living there is also very minimal.
Every time, it needs to be asked.
OricWindstar
Member
That look Ice Cube gives the audience when they try and applaud him saying he accepts Maher's apology is really telling. And Maher seems really reluctant to accept a lot of what he's saying. My respect for Cube has gone up quite bit after watching that.
I'm having to really look at my stance on this again, as I when I watch comedians like Louis CK doing bits with this word, they feel earned and insightful. But I'm also not disagreeing with anything Ice Cube was saying here.
I'm having to really look at my stance on this again, as I when I watch comedians like Louis CK doing bits with this word, they feel earned and insightful. But I'm also not disagreeing with anything Ice Cube was saying here.
Intheflorsh
Banned
Mr.Shrugglesツ;239995655 said:
I was talking about Maher.
You said he didn't own up to anything, I gave you a clip from the same episode completely refuting that. The clip is relevant whether you want it to be or not.
Black people saying nigga is on the bottom of the list for why there will always be a divide.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Again white people not being able to say a word isn't an obstacle towards equality.
cloudburst
Banned
Why would a black person want to say it?
Nah. Just cause white people can't say it don't mean we can't.
Seems you didnt listen or read anything he said or anyone said in this topic. :/
This has been explain so many times now.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Did you miss the past several threads about this subject about the historical context and motivation of black people to say the word? Including the multiple posts in this very thread? You don't even have an excuse, the page is barely a page and a half long.
EdibleKnife
Member
Where is racism very minimal? I live in the US where the FBI literally had to clandestinely investigate white supremacist infiltration in law enforcement. Where the current Attorney General has spent the majority of his life seeking to roll back civil rights for minorities. Where I temper my interactions with law enforcement lest I lose my life (and sometimes that might still not be enough). Where rallies are held to protect monuments to military men who sought to keep slavery alive to this very day. Where I'm the asshole for thinking a neo nazi who wants an ethnic cleansing shouldn't be turned into a celebrity. Saying 'nigger' among my friends or hearing it in rap music literally couldn't possibly make anything about being a Black American worse. Dropping this issue is not the key to singing kumbaya with the KKK and it shouldn't be framed that way. White people who care so much about the word should deal with the fact that they can't use it and actually address problems that affect the lives of minorities if equality is what they claim to care about.
or white people could acknowledge its history and not use it.
Why do black people have to stop using a word when white privilege is the reason it's an issue in the first place?
Puck Beaverton
Banned
ChimpBottle
Member
Possibly as a term of endearment, I guess? Sort of like "man" or "buddy. That's how it's used, no?
Take this example. I have two friends that are best friends with each other. One of them is black, the other isn't (he's Arabic). They call each other "nigga" all the time. They're like two peas in a pod. Should the non-white friend not be allowed to use this word when talking to his friend while other black people with no relation to them can address him as that?
The word holds no weight to them and they're all the happier for it.
cloudburst
Banned
I don't think people should be using that word period (especially people who aren't black).
That's my opinion regardless of what's said in this thread or any thread.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Context? They're practically on the same side when it comes to talking about America's issues with black people.
CrocMother
Banned
There is the word that ends with "a" and the word that ends with "er" . I've only heard black people say the former, and only white people the latter.
If white people have the second word, I aint gonna say shit about black people having the first one. I've heard so much fucked up racist shit in my life, if I was actually black I can't even imagine what it would be like.
Just listen to what black people are saying and nod on this issue.
If white people have the second word, I aint gonna say shit about black people having the first one. I've heard so much fucked up racist shit in my life, if I was actually black I can't even imagine what it would be like.
Just listen to what black people are saying and nod on this issue.
Puck Beaverton
Banned
I had a ton of Hispanic kids at school say it. I blame the rap music.
I'm black and I don't like using it either.
That has not one damn thing to do with whether it's okay for Bill Maher or any other white dude to say it or not. They are entirely independent questions.
Question 1: Should black people say it?
Answer 1: Maybe. Maybe not.
Question 2: Should other people say it?
Answer 2: Hell fucking no.
That has not one damn thing to do with whether it's okay for Bill Maher or any other white dude to say it or not. They are entirely independent questions.
Question 1: Should black people say it?
Answer 1: Maybe. Maybe not.
Question 2: Should other people say it?
Answer 2: Hell fucking no.
EatinOlives
Member
The fact that Maher has Cube on his show specifically to lecture him makes this look duplicitous as hell on Maher's part. Obviously Cube is being 100% honest, but "hey black folks come on down and let's make a show about lecturing me" makes it look like Maher is taking advantage of them as an extended mea culpa.
Intheflorsh
Banned
I said "that's not what 'owning it' looks like" obviously referring to what he said in the clip.
If he supposedly owned up to it earlier then why is he qualifying his apology with the "there wasn't any intention behind it" excuse now?
Genuine question here, not trying to stir up who should or shouldn't say it, or if anybody should:
I understand the argument of taking back power for the word, and that white people don't really need to input on how black people refer to each other. My question is, where would you stand if a bunch of white people, like a group of friends, would like to refer to each other as nigga, maybe simply because they see it as a similar form of comradery. No mal-intent, and they're still careful not to say the word around black people out of consideration. Do black people have a say in their vocabulary?
I understand the argument of taking back power for the word, and that white people don't really need to input on how black people refer to each other. My question is, where would you stand if a bunch of white people, like a group of friends, would like to refer to each other as nigga, maybe simply because they see it as a similar form of comradery. No mal-intent, and they're still careful not to say the word around black people out of consideration. Do black people have a say in their vocabulary?
EdibleKnife
Member
Cool. 2 people you personally know say "nigger" to each other and break bread when they could find literally thousands of other words that mean "amigo". That was never the issue with racism, racial violence, minority disenfranchisement or white supremacy in the first place.
Wait you've never heard white people say it? That's...shocking. Not even when they're singing a song??
Part of my culture and something i share with friends and family. I don't use it at work or even in public, but with people i love and trust it is something i share
"Hey this people don't have to deal with 400 years of systematic racism. They got over it, why can't black people"
Do you know how silly that sounds?
That is the overlapping problem people see the word and forget the history.
allenpergallon
Member
Good on Cube, he was on point.
But damn, feels like this thread is on clockwork with the opposition to us using the word.
But damn, feels like this thread is on clockwork with the opposition to us using the word.
the_darkness
Banned
Yeah such a snowflake that he voluntarily invited on the very people he insulted and gave them a chance to grill him.
Of course he was fucking uncomfortable. This narrative that he couldn't give a shit what they were saying is pure bullshit.
So you think white people should be allowed to say nigger, is what youre saying
Ice Cube made a really good point. You can tell he's not personally upset with Maher or even shaming him but using his mistake to spread a message. I agree, as a white man I try to never use slurs that ultimately mean malice even if used lightly. There is history with that word. I wasn't personally bothered by what Maher said, but that doesn't make it right.
I hope we all learn from this.
I hope we all learn from this.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
But you just asked why black people want to use the word in response to the question of why a white person would wanna say the word. I have a funny feeling that you knew the answer to both, but one is particularly much more egregious. So you tried to act like we haven't answered your question already.