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[Astral Dog]

This is why Nintendo keeps failing

 

[Gotdatmoney]

It's a fun read to look at Reggie the face of Nintendo vs. Reggie the PR guy.

He might be infuriating to some (and looking at some of the other Nintendo threads he absolutely is), but the man has a knack, a gift, for what he is being paid to do.

Reggie could walk into the overwhelming majority of PR/Business Development departments in the world and be successful.

Sometimes I think the nature of the business is lost in here.

I love the guy tbh. Reggie is the type of PR guy that just knows how to deliver a message. Say something without saying anything and that is tough as hell cause does it so genuinely.

 

[Robaperas]

First off, why are they asking Reggie about Far Cry 5?

Second, can people stop forcing other people to do whatever the hell they want? Nintendo want to make games about jumping plumbers and collectible monsters without focusing on a social/political message, just for fun, let them fucking do it?

Jesus.

Who is forcing them to stop? Having an opinion on something someone said isn't forcing anyone to anything.

 

[BRocknRolla]

Sad fact is that Reggie is likely GOP (just because a good 90% of people who make to the C-suite are), while Nintendo's leadership is probably big into the Liberal Democratic party of Japan (also right).

Though their games have done some progressive things over the years, they themselves are likely not.

Probably shouldn't be putting people into political boxes without actual evidence to back it up.

It's really messed up.

 

[boiled goose]

Plenty of games from Nintendo touch on political and social issues.

XBCX discussed gender roles, xenophobia, etc.

Silly answer Reggie.
Just say something like the visions of different developers clearly go into the games they make. The meaning of Art comes in part from the creator, but also from how people interpret it. Video games and other interactive media are forms of art.

The end.

 

[Nyoro SF]

I think that's the case here. The election of Trump was such a shocking, ridiculous and frightening thing that people feel it needs to be opposed whenever it can. People are using that to justify, well, all manner of acts, and they feel that simply being "non-political" is incredibly offensive when being partisan is the only way.

Yep.

In the current climate, anyone that is not with you is against you.

 

[KLoWn]

And that is why I will never really care much for Nintendo games. The don't even dare to have any sort of message other than childish fun.

What absolute stupidity.

 

[BRocknRolla]

Yep.

In the current climate, anyone that is not with you is against you.

I don't know if you're being serious, but if you are, that's a terrifying sentiment.

This is why Nintendo keeps failing

Is that why they released an overpriced, behind the times, gimmicky console last gen? It was because they weren't making a political statement?

 

[ViolentP]

This thread illustrates perfectly why Nintendo should not get political with their works.

 

[TheGraykid]

But it's all opinion right? What one picks up from it politically/socially, someone else can see something different and someone might not see anything at all, or see it, and just not care or anything in between.

So why emphasize on it? I think when people say they don't want to see politics/social commentary in their games, they mean they don't want it emphasized or focused on, which I say is a good idea as it works for everyone. Those who want to see it/ talk about it can. Those who see it but don't care or don't see it don't have to.

For instance, those who choose to care about political ideas can have the argument is Peach being a princess who gets kidnap sexist, or is it done because she's a matriarch of an entire kingdom and that's the best way to take it over (knock over the king, win the game). Those who choose not to see it or don't care enough about it will choose just to play the game. Ignore the story, characters and lore for just the gameplay because the rest doesn't matter and doesn't have to matter, it was made up for fluff. Who cares what the creator thought when they made it.

So I like Reggie's answer, keeps it open for everyone to do their own thing.

As for that last sentence. It doesn't have to be considered "normal" for someone to ignore it. Could be that they see it as "this is fiction". Or that they don't agree with it, but can ignore it for the rest of the game, there can be many reasons why they don't see it, or don't care to talk about it.

I think we're mostly on the same ground. however, I never said that Nintendo needs to emphasise the politics in their work. I'm essentially saying that them implying that their existing work is entirely non-political is kinda bullshit.

I also find it irritating what people chose to consider as political and non-political, and I think that Nintendo plays into that with this statement.

In regards to your final paragraph, obviously I am assuming when I say that what people view as political is driven by what people view as normal. However, I think it's hard to interpret things in any other way, if you look at pretty much all the games people chose to complain about in regards to them being too politicised, it's very much about the presence of non-culturally-normal stuff. For example Mass Effect Andromeda.

 

[Salty Rice]

What? What are the political lines in Zelda?

Even if you think you dont have a voice you can take down the evil man.

 

[Basketball]

Politics is boring

 

[MisterHero]

Cant wait to see this response plastered in every thread asking about playable female characters from Nintendo

They just had 2 tournaments for games that 1) has females as the default protagonist (Splatoon), and 2) a game where half the cast is female (ARMS).

There are also 2 Metroid games announced.

soooo...

 

[ElTorro]

nvm, I probably just misread.

 

[boiled goose]

And that is why I will never really care much for Nintendo games. The don't even dare to have any sort of message other than childish fun.

What an ignorant post.

Tons of games from Nintendo touch on political issues. Any game that is slightly more complex in narrative than a simple platformer is going to touch on political issues. (pokemon, earthbound, any nintendo rpg, etc.) all have things to say that can be considered political.

Reggie is a business man from NOA. He doesn't represent the entirety of creative views of Nintendo.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

Cool, totally in line with firing a woman due to online harassment.

 

[sanstesy]

Sad fact is that Reggie is likely GOP (just because a good 90% of people who make to the C-suite are), while Nintendo's leadership is probably big into the Liberal Democratic party of Japan (also right).

Though their games have done some progressive things over the years, they themselves are likely not.

👌🏽

 

[SDBurton]

I don't know if you're being serious, but if you are, that's a terrifying sentiment.

They're not wrong though. Happens all the time in OT.
I'm a democrat (like most here) and there are times where I'm left feeling like "whoa".

 

[uncredited male]

Reggie should have some smoke pellets on him at all times for situations like this.

 

[Drey1082]

Even if you think you dont have a voice you can take down the evil man.

That's not a political statement.

 

[BTA]

You could argue BotW has a commentary on the nature of automated drone warfare.

I'd say that's what I'm reading into it though. I wouldn't attribute an overtime political stance from the creators on that though. Certainly not on Nintendo as a body.

Doesn't make it any less meaningful, but I just won't claim Nintendo was intentionally making a statement with it.

I was actually just talking more things like Kilton's jokes about destabilizing currency and such. (Though I only thought of that because I saw it last night).

But one could say the setting is in itself political in that way; it doesn't have to be intentional to be so. "Political" here is, of course, fairly meaningless as a term, but every work carries both conscious and unconscious messages from its creafor(s) that reflect their beliefs.

 

[Salty Rice]

That's not a political statement.

I know. It was just a joke of Link having still no voice actor.

But according to Gaf literally everything is political so im not even sure about that.

 

[Astral Dog]

You could argue BotW has a commentary on the nature of automated drone warfare.

I'd say that's what I'm reading into it though. I wouldn't attribute an overtime political stance from the creators on that though. Certainly not on Nintendo as a body.

Doesn't make it any less meaningful, but I just won't claim Nintendo was intentionally making a statement with it.

And Other M is a commentary on the stress of being a single mother

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Sad fact is that Reggie is likely GOP (just because a good 90% of people who make to the C-suite are), while Nintendo's leadership is probably big into the Liberal Democratic party of Japan (also right).

Though their games have done some progressive things over the years, they themselves are likely not.

No, the sad fact is you're making wildly baseless accusations based on a simple statement and nothing else. That you actually had posted this without a shred of self awareness at how ridiculous it was, is astounding

 

[fernoca]

Thread title (typos), reasoning behind the article (FarCry 5 is making political statements, what do you think of that Nintendo?) and the responses in here (firing Alison Rapp, Nintendo = Trump supporters, Nintendo = childish company) ...are all over the place.

 

[Lime]

Also known as "we are fine with the status quo and won't rock the boat." Nintendo is apparently fine with the way the world is and won't bother to do anything that steps out of its politics.

I guess this answer also helps explain why they have been quiet when it comes to gaming's problems with misogyny and racism and be silent while people in gaming are terrorized by hate campaigns and inherent bigotry.

And in the end it's no wonder they are like this given this response in this thread where people think that it's possible not to be political. Maybe Nintendo's 'apolitical' stance is fine with people who aren't hurt by Nintendos implicit politics in their games (gender, race, sexuality, etc.) and their hardware (class, labor, exploitation).

So it is apparently okay for Nintendo to say they are not political while they still churn out games with white men as the protagonists, with a lack of recognition of LGBTQ, with making people of color invisible, with being quiet about the world beyond games, and so on. Because for them and others unaffected, "it's just games and fun".

 

[Parapraxis]

Nintendo is the Jimmy Fallon of video games.

I laughed lol thanks.

That being said, politics are an inseparable part of reality, you can't wish it away. Pretty poor answer from Reggie. Any narrative has political ideals and messages, I don't know how that can be avoided. Life is political.

(Lime's post above me is well said and I agree with you Lime, claiming to be "apolitical" is nonsense when you are a media company that produces narrative content)

 

[John Kowalski]

Yep.

In the current climate, anyone that is not with you is against you.

The problem with framing the contemporary this kind of way is that someone somewhere felt like this at all points in our history, and to them it's always true.

 

[Lijik]

They just had 2 tournaments for games that 1) has females as the default protagonist (Splatoon), and 2) a game where half the cast is female (ARMS).

There are also 2 Metroid games announced.

soooo...

oh cool thanks for the demonstration of the other head in sand response in those types of threads "heres my list of 3 things so shut up about it"

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Cant wait to see this response plastered in every thread asking about playable female characters from Nintendo

Outside of Zelda, and maybe the new Mario, you're probably going to have a hard time even finding Nintendo games without female characters released anytime in the last few generations. But I'd sure like to see you try

 

[TheGraykid]

You can't be serious

I'm not saying that they sat around in a room and said "How can we make Mario look more like a man's man". I'm saying that a lot of character designs have changed over the years. This, of course, is part of a art style so it makes sense, but I'm just saying that they weren't trapped here, they could have changed things a little if they wanted.

 

[XandBosch]

You could argue BotW has a commentary on the nature of automated drone warfare.

Could say Windwaker gave Ganondorf a story in how being marginalized by the world can turn you into the villain.

I'd say that's what I'm reading into it though. I wouldn't attribute an overtime political stance from the creators on that though. Certainly not on Nintendo as a body.

Doesn't make it any less meaningful, but I just won't claim Nintendo was intentionally making a statement with it.

Not to be rude, but is this a joke?

 

[Albino_Yeti]

This thread is crazy. I just want to play Kirby.

Kirby is a metaphor for conformity, as evidenced by Kirby taking on the powers and looks of those he sucks in.

 

[spekkeh]

I think it's totally fair. Not everyone should be making political statements.

In fact most people shouldn't.

Nintendo wants to make fun playthings and that's fine. Making serious statements takes away from the frivolousness and therefore the playfulness.

But you gotta be mindful of representation. Just because you don't want to make a statement doesn't mean it doesn't have influence. But Reggie isn't saying anything contrary to that I believe.

 

[Nickle]

Reggie isn't saying that no Nintendo game has ever made a political statement, he's saying that Nintendo games are primarily intended to be about fun rather then bold social commentary.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I'm not saying that they sat around in a room and said "How can we make Mario look more like a man's man". I'm saying that a lot of character designs have changed over the years. This, of course, is part of a art style so it makes sense, but I'm just saying that they weren't trapped here, they could have changed things a little if they wanted.

If anything they've trended away from the typical "man's man" characters. Link has seemingly been becoming more androgynous, despite Aonuma claiming there's nothing behind it

 

[RumbleHumble]

Man, there are some bad posts in this thread. People not even trying to have a genuine argument.



What point do you think you're making? That it's a lot easier to make your point if you build a disengenuous strawman?

Not trying to make a point about Reggie currently. The guy is doing his job and I mostly agree with his reasoning. I was jokingly pointing out that such reasoning SHOULD have a breaking point. No one can stay neutral in all conditions without inherently making a statement affirming status quo.

 

[Ogodei]

Probably shouldn't be putting people into political boxes without actual evidence to back it up.

It's really messed up.

Can't find the study that i was thinking of that said people with the title "CEO" were 95% likely to be a Republican, this study says it's 52% likely GOP, but only 2% likely to be Democrat, so we have an idea where the non-reporters (29%) probably lean. http://www.statisticbrain.com/ceo-statistics/

As far as Japan goes, everyone in business is in bed with the LDP, but politics there is less about ideology and more about personal relationships. You're LDP because your associates are, etc.

I'm not being accusatory (big Nintendo fan), just asserting a likely truth.

 

[BRocknRolla]

I was actually just talking more things like Kilton's jokes about destabilizing currency and such. (Though I only thought of that because I saw it last night).

But one could say the setting is in itself political in that way; it doesn't have to be intentional to be so. "Political" here is, of course, fairly meaningless as a term, but every work carries both conscious and unconscious messages from its creafor(s) that reflect their beliefs.

And I agree. And I think this is perhaps the gravest error in this thread, that people seem convinced they know what Reggie means by political.

I agree that it's impossible for something to be absent of politics purely because we bring our politics with us, and we can and do bring them to bear on our experiences. And in such a way, the creator inserts their own, as does the player.

But politics as "having a message", an intentional choice, which many in this thread are arguing Nintendo should be required to have, is possibly (Even likely in my opinion) is all Reggie is referring to.

"Politics" exist all around us, but intentional political statements are not the same. And I can't agree with anyone who demands the later must exist for anyone.

 

[MisterHero]

oh cool thanks for the demonstration of the other head in sand response in those types of threads "heres my list of 3 things so shut up about it"

So making the games and marketing them isn't enough? Tell me more

 

[BTA]

I'm not sure I understand this response.

I 100% believe that video games can and should engage on a cultural and political level whenever they so choose

However, are you suggesting that there is some sort of moral imperative for them to do so? I certainly disagree with that. If Nintendo or anyone else doesn't want to make a political statement, why should you compel them to do so? What's wrong with acknowledging that others can do it, but you won't?

It's not that there's a moral imperative to do so, it's that every game inherently does so. Using "political" clouds this a bit, but the real point here is that every work someone makes inherently has messages that reflects their beliefs and/or intent, and to act otherwise is foolish and cowardly at best.

Trying to act like this isn't the case is disingenuous, and if we want to talk about moral imperatives, I do think feeding into this belief that you can somehow be apolitical (when what that generally actually means is regressive, or at least anti-progress) is in fact flawed morally due to the negative impact it has on people. Look at what just came out of interviews about Detroit- David Cage trying to say that his game that's literally about oppression and slavery somehow doesn't have a message, it just asks questions. Such statements cater to people who don't want games to have messages, and that's a political act in itself.

EDIT: Sorry to essentially talk past you- didn't see your latest reply before posting. Nor did I realize you were the same poster I originally quoted, oops.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

Every piece of art is influenced by the views of the people who made it. "Statements" aren't necessarily beating players about the head with an idea and don't even have to be intentional to be made.

A statement definitely has to be intentional. People can derive all kinds of things from a piece of art that it's creator didn't intend to say something about.

 

[Not]

Also known as "we are fine with the status quo and won't rock the boat." Nintendo is apparently fine with the way the world is and won't bother to do anything that steps out of its politics.

I guess this answer also helps explain why they have been quiet when it comes to gaming's problems with misogyny and racism and be silent while people in gaming are terrorized by hate campaigns and inherent bigotry.

And in the end it's no wonder they are like this given this response in this thread where people think that it's possible not to be political. Maybe Nintendo's 'apolitical' stance is fine with people who aren't hurt by Nintendos implicit politics in their games (gender, race, sexuality, etc.) and their hardware (class, labor, exploitation).

So it is apparently okay for Nintendo to say they are not political while they still churn out games with white men as the protagonists, with a lack of recognition of LGBTQ, with making people of color invisible, with being quiet about the world beyond games, and so on. Because for them and others unaffected, "it's just games and fun".

Spot on.

 

[Saucycarpdog]

Kinda sounds like a GG's sentiment; "I don't like politics in my games! I just want to get back to playing games that only characters like me!"

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

He's right.

Making political statements isn't what Nintendo does. Let other devs do so if they wish.

Nintendo should stick to what they're good at.

Making fun games and making people smile.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Spot on.

No, it's not spot on, unless Reggie's words hold more weight than the actions of developers he isn't in charge of and has no control over. But apparently on here, words speak louder than actions for some people

 

[BRocknRolla]

Not to be rude, but is this a joke?

Do I think they're making a statement about it? Not one that's overt. Can you fit it in with media that talks about the result of drone warfare (Like that one CoD game or various films and books)? Yeah, I think you could. You could say it reflects fears of the result of us putting our defense in someone else's hands. It's normal for there to be undercurrents like that in media and society regardless of whether the creators intended it.

I wouldn't say BotW stands as a central example of it, but it fits in the wider picture. Certainly not an original thought on my part either.

Can't find the study that i was thinking of that said people with the title "CEO" were 95% likely to be a Republican, this study says it's 52% likely GOP, but only 2% likely to be Democrat, so we have an idea where the non-reporters (29%) probably lean. http://www.statisticbrain.com/ceo-statistics/

As far as Japan goes, everyone in business is in bed with the LDP, but politics there is less about ideology and more about personal relationships. You're LDP because your associates are, etc.

I'm not being accusatory (big Nintendo fan), just asserting a likely truth.

Regardless of whether the stats point to it, that's a real "pre-crime" mentality. I think being accusatory is exactly what your original post was being.

Judge people on the actual facts, not what social strata they appear to fit it.

 

[Drey1082]

Kinda sounds like a GG's sentiment; "I don't like politics in my games! I just want to get back to playing games that only characters like me!"

He's not saying that though...

And people are free to like, or dislike political games if they so choose. It's when it becomes negative that problems arrise.

 

[Albino_Yeti]

Also known as "we are fine with the status quo and won't rock the boat." Nintendo is apparently fine with the way the world is and won't bother to do anything that steps out of its politics.

I guess this answer also helps explain why they have been quiet when it comes to gaming's problems with misogyny and racism and be silent while people in gaming are terrorized by hate campaigns and inherent bigotry.

And in the end it's no wonder they are like this given this response in this thread where people think that it's possible not to be political. Maybe Nintendo's 'apolitical' stance is fine with people who aren't hurt by Nintendos implicit politics in their games (gender, race, sexuality, etc.) and their hardware (class, labor, exploitation).

So it is apparently okay for Nintendo to say they are not political while they still churn out games with white men as the protagonists, with a lack of recognition of LGBTQ, with making people of color invisible, with being quiet about the world beyond games, and so on. Because for them and others unaffected, "it's just games and fun".

Half of Nintendo's protags are not even human.

 

[takriel]

Nothong wrong with that.