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[AristoCat]

Meanwhile, PD wants to chase e-sports forgetting that it's shit like Rocket League that dominates Twitch/Youtube/MP events.... not in-depth car simulators with hours spent in menus tweaking cars like they're real. Or competitions where it's about taking pretty pictures of cars (not knocking photomode, but somewhat knocking photomode ~ It's amazing, but no, it should never be without a meaty game backing it)

A robust and feature-filled MP would be just fine, just like any other game.

Some of the things that end up being done with the GT engine are indeed impressive as fuck, but it's getting to a point, like my earlier ranting, where Kaz is going way off on tangents and forgetting a fucking huge part of his base are gamers. Not professional drivers.

Thank you, couldn't agree more.

 

[CloudStrife_ca]

I'm in, I've been missing some current gen Gran Turismo.

 

[Darklor01]

FM5 was a launch title in 2013 with just shy of 200 cars and 13 tracks, which became 14 tracks and over 200 cars after they added the free post-launch Nürb updates. I think it's fair to point out the major criticism then was the amount of content. That's not a flattering parallel, given the amount of solo content they've described here.

I have a feeling there's more "meat" to GTS than they're letting on, even aside from the online league events. If it's truly just the 177 car/17 track count here with minimal career play, a lot of everyday players won't be happy. That said, I can't imagine they don't already have a hopper of expansion content planned out for after launch.

If I recall, it was said that this game will be a base they add on to on a continual basis.

 

[Gestault]

If I recall, it was said that this game will be a base they add on to on a continual basis.

Exactly. And even GT5/6 delivered on that over time, all other complaints aside. If they strike a rewarding balance of free vs paid expansion content, they'll have a very happy community (if expectations are in check and the racing is good).

 

[Audioboxer]

The thing is not even that. The thing is going that route you'll have to compete with games that do that already, and much better.

Are you referring to some of the PC simulators? I can't speak much for them, but I do know I've seen GT called out a few times in the face of what goes on with some of the PC only simulators.

Thank you, couldn't agree more.

It's not even controversial ranting anymore. Many of the long-standing PS fans are crumbling to comments like that. Many who used to defend PD/GT like it was legitimately their baby. Console wars are still around, but I think in 2017 people on all sides are a lot more willing to criticise, rather than blindly follow. PD have been building up heat for years for their unfocused/scattershot approach to GT.

 

[orochi91]

Some of the things that end up being done with the GT engine are indeed impressive as fuck, but it's getting to a point, like my earlier ranting, where Kaz is going way off on tangents and forgetting a fucking huge part of his base are gamers. Not professional drivers.

My buddies share the same sentiment.

Despite being huge GT fans, they won't be picking this up on launch day.

 

[Darklor01]

Exactly. And even GT5/6 delivered on that over time, all other complaints aside. If they strike a rewarding balance of free vs paid expansion content, they'll have a very happy community (if expectations are in check and the racing is good).

Yep . Also, it pays to work for a company who's specialty is manufacturing very expensive MFP devices for printing out 'dem Photo Mode shots.

 

[onemanasylum]

FM5 was a launch title in 2013 with just shy of 200 cars and 13 tracks, which became 14 tracks and over 200 cars after they added the free post-launch Nürb updates. I think it's fair to point out the major criticism then was the amount of content. That's not a flattering parallel, given the amount of solo content they've described here.

I have a feeling there's more "meat" to GTS than they're letting on, even aside from the online league events. If it's truly just the 177 car/17 track count here with minimal career play, a lot of everyday players won't be happy. That said, I can't imagine they don't already have a hopper of expansion content planned out for after launch.

Who gives a shit? Number of cars do not make a game....Gt5 and 6 had more then forza, doesn't matter. Minimal career? How do you even know this? IMO, Gt would be way better just having a year 2, year 3 update, with content sprinkled throughout the year...racing games do not need a new 70 dollar game every 1-2 years...

 

[BigEmil]

In a way i want GT Sport to flop to give PD a reality check, mainly the main man Kaz

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[Darklor01]

In a way i want GT Sport to flop to give PD a reality check, mainly the main man Kaz

You know, even if it did that and taught them a lesson, it would take so long before they released another in the series that we may have gotten very old or may have even died before release, right?

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Who gives a shit? Number of cars do not make a game....Gt5 and 6 had more then forza, doesn't matter. Minimal career? How do you even know this? IMO, Gt would be way better just having a year 2, year 3 update, with content sprinkled throughout the year...racing games do not need a new 70 dollar game every 1-2 years...

This .
GT is a perfect game for GaaS.
1 version per gen and you build on that .

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[BigEmil]

You know, even if it did that and taught them a lesson, it would take so long before they released another in the series that we may have gotten very old or may have even died before release, right?

That could all be finally changed if Kaz was replaced

I wish, the brand is still too strong, even after the "flop" 6 was (that still sold over 5m, even though many at bargain bin prices).

Yeah but since this is their first GT on PS4 they likely expect around GT5 sales numbers, then when they realise it doesn't then yeah..

 

[Darklor01]

That could all be finally changed if Kaz was replaced

Yeah but since this is their first GT on PS4 they likely expect GT5 sales numbers, then when they realise it doesn't then yeah..

Kaz won't be replaced unless Kaz wants to be replaced.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

That could all be finally changed if Kaz was replaced

Yeah but since this is their first GT on PS4 they likely expect GT5 numbers, when it doesn't then maybe

Even if they sell less that GT5 it won't matter unless it drop by a huge amount .
They will make a ton of money thanks to DD and GaaS model .
Also they really can't replace Kaz that easy with how high up he is in SCEJ .

 

[Audioboxer]

My buddies share the same sentiment.

Despite being huge GT fans, they won't be picking this up on launch day.

Yeah, it's definitely some of the gamers who feel left behind. There are only so many world class trailers (because yes, PD trailers!!!!111) you can gawk at before getting the end product and being like, yeah, it's good, but....

Used to be PC-only, yes. Now some are going to console (like Assetto, PCars, Dirt Rally, etc). While they won't match the graphics and maybe overall polish of GTS, the racing aspect is where they shine. And unlike GT, they evolve / adapt (most of the time) and you don't have to wait a whole generation for another game.




Hell, I have all Gran Turismos, from 1 to 5, prologues too. After/during 5 Kaz went mad, and shit started going downhill fast.

True, I never did pickup Project Cars. No one is going to knock PD's technical wizardry, it's the project management of what the overall game is to be. If you ask me "e-sports" is the dumbest move yet. If I get proven wrong I'll hunt down my own crow and cook it, but it'll probably be some over glorified MP component and the usual GT competition to "make a pro racing driver". I mean, that's cool Kaz, but like 99.5% of the GT audience just want an amazing game to play at home. We do not all want to become professional racing drivers, just enjoy some racing fun, post on forums and maybe get together in MP lobbies/some sort of "clans".

When the balance tips totally MP as well, you naturally alienate the SP gamers too. You need to have a good balance, because no, not everyone is interested in playing online bumper cars with randoms

 

[onemanasylum]

Let's see how sport turns out before calling for KAZ's head.. People already like sport is some kind of failure...I mean Gt5 and 6 sold close to 17 mill combined/

 

[dracula_x]

In a way i want GT Sport to flop to give PD a reality check, mainly the main man Kaz

And what if it won't? That would be mean that Kaz is genius and he really understands what people want.

btw, they updated sales numbers:

11 months ago – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1261191

now

they sold another 160,000 copies of GT6 since then and 10,000 copies of GT PSP

 

[Not Drake]

After/during 5 Kaz went mad, and shit started going downhill fast.

Speaking of hills and going fast, is Pikes Peak in?

 

[Primethius]

Even if they sell less that GT5 it won't matter unless it drop by a huge amount .
They will make a ton of money thanks to DD and GaaS model .
Also they really can't replace Kaz that easy with how high up he is in SCEJ .

I honestly think the SP stuff is going to make or break the sales potential.

I think the series will experience a drop off even from 6 if it ends up being largely barebones SP wise. Games coming out in 2017, with less content than a full GT game, focused on "e-sports" and seems to not be as full fledged on the SP side of things.

If it has a notable sales drop off, I don't think it'll surprise anyone.

I bought 5 and 6 and yet Sport just seems so unappealing.

 

[Gitaroo]

After GT6 I will not be suprised if this flop. Basically EU is the only region this might sell.

 

[cooldawn]

They already did that before, so.

Does that mean you think they shouldn't include it again? It's one of the best circuits in the world. It should be standard.

Oh, dear.

They already did that before, so.

Gran Turismo 5 was paid for content. Gran Turismo 6 was free content. A mix of both this time? Free circuits, paid for cars.

Meanwhile, PD wants to chase e-sports forgetting that it's shit like Rocket League that dominates Twitch/Youtube/MP events.... not in-depth car simulators with hours spent in menus tweaking cars like they're real. Or competitions where it's about taking pretty pictures of cars (not knocking photomode, but somewhat knocking photomode ~ It's amazing, but no, it should never be without a meaty game backing it)

A robust and feature-filled MP would be just fine, just like any other game.

Some of the things that end up being done with the GT engine are indeed impressive as fuck, but it's getting to a point, like my earlier ranting, where Kaz is going way off on tangents and forgetting a fucking huge part of his base are gamers. Not professional drivers.

I understand what you are saying but the perspective seems skewed.

Kaz is trying to merge the game with reality. Nissan's GT Academy is one part and this just takes it's next step. Sure, the game will be streaming events at higher skill levels but the drivers that do well that will reap amazing rewards. That's the real goal.

A lot of the teams energy has gone in to that, which is what you don't like. If it's compelling enough to watch is an entirely different matter, though.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[onemanasylum]

After GT6 I will not be suprised if this flop. Basically EU is the only region this might sell.

Most games would kill for a flop over over 5 million sales....this is going to do well.

I honestly think the SP stuff is going to make or break the sales potential.

I think the series will experience a drop off even from 6 if it ends up being largely barebones SP wise. Games coming out in 2017, with less content than a full GT game, focused on "e-sports" and seems to not be as full fledged on the SP side of things.

If it has a notable sales drop off, I don't think it'll surprise anyone.

I bought 5 and 6 and yet Sport just seems so unappealing.

I think you are being overly dramatic...a Sp campaign is there and it has over 100 events, they are not license tests, there are full blown races, and challenges...Let's wait and see what's there before signing the death knell for GT..... GT SP needed a shake up from the bumper car bloatedness imo. This is not just an esports title....

 

[Audioboxer]

And what if it won't? That would be mean that Kaz is genius and he really understands what people want.

btw, they updated sales numbers:

6-7 months ago – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1261191


now


they sold another 160,000 copies of GT6 since then.

GT6 was a mishandled release anyway. If it was all about DC getting the PS4 limelight (look what happened there...), then GT6 should have been PS4 bound for 2015. Considering PD's monster dev-cycles firing it out to lukewarm reception on the PS3 was just... strange.

There's little point in saying "but game X by developer Y would kill for 5m+ sales!". GT games/sales get compared to GT games/sales.

Does that mean you think they shouldn't include it again? It's one of the best circuits in the world. It should be standard.


They already did that before, so.

Gran Turismo 5 was paid for content. Gran Turismo 6 was free content. A mix of both this time? Free circuits, paid for cars.


I understand what you are saying but the perspective seems skewed.

Kaz is trying to merge the game with reality. Nissan's GT Academy is one part and this just takes it's next step. Sure, the game will be streaming events at higher skill levels but the drivers that do well that will reap amazing rewards. That's the real goal.

A lot of the teams energy has gone in to that, which is what you don't like. If it's compelling enough to watch is an entirely different matter, though.

Then the argument has to be is PD then incapable of progressing on this new vision whilst still creating a stereotypical GT game content wise? If so, that's either a risky sacrifice or telling that the studio has to stop being so insular and either start outsourcing or increasing in size. It's not acceptable to have to wait 4/5 years in between releases and actually REDUCE the amount of content (by a fair amount).

 

[Gitaroo]

H

Most games would kill for a flop over over 5 million sales....this is going to do well.





I think you are being overly dramatic...a Sp campaign is there and it has over 100 events, they are not license tests, there are full blown races, and challenges...Let's wait and see what's there before signing the death knell for GT..... GT SP needed a shake up from the bumper car bloatedness imo.

If 80% of those 5 millions copies are from the 20-30 bucks bargin bin then it is still a massive flop; which is what GT6 was. If I were Sony I wouldn't never give Kaz anymore excuse or ridiculous budget anymore. And most likely will hire somebody else to salvage whatever I can squeeze out from the franchise. The years of delays between games, tons had happened in the racing sims genre and other dev has pushed the bar very high where even new GT looks outdated before its even out.

 

[onemanasylum]

If 80% of those 5 millions copies are from the 20-30 bucks bargin bin then it is still a massive flop; which were what GT6 was. If I were Sony I wouldn't never give Kaz anymore excuse or ridiculous budget anymore. And most likely will hire somebody else to salvage whatever I can squeeze out from the franchise. The years of delays between games, tons had happened in the racing sims genre and other dev has pushed the bar very high where even new GT looks outdated before its even out.

Did it lose Sony money? It launched at the end of last gen after PS4 launched.....you have no idea it "Flopped".

How does GT sport look "Outdated"?

Gt5 was the only Gt that suffered numerous delays..... Gt threads always bring out the shit posting.

 

[dracula_x]

If 80% of those 5 millions copies are from the 20-30 bucks bargin bin then it is still a massive flop; which were what GT6 was. If I were Sony I wouldn't never give Kaz anymore excuse or ridiculous budget anymore. And most likely will hire somebody else to salvage whatever I can squeeze out from the franchise. The years of delays between games, tons had happened in the racing sims genre and other dev has pushed the bar very high where even new GT looks outdated before its even out.

You mean like Project Cars, Forza and any other racing sim game, right?

 

[Audioboxer]

If 80% of those 5 millions copies are from the 20-30 bucks bargin bin then it is still a massive flop; which were what GT6 was. If I were Sony I wouldn't never give Kaz anymore excuse or ridiculous budget anymore. And most likely will hire somebody else to salvage whatever I can squeeze out from the franchise. The years of delays between games, tons had happened in the racing sims genre and other dev has pushed the bar very high where even new GT looks outdated before its even out.

The thing is, PD do manage to do things on a reasonable budget... That's why it still prints Sony money. It's more just sad to see the studio not fully moving on from it's PS1/PS2 glory days. The racing game market is quite tough, as many of today's youngsters do prefer going to Halo/Rocket League/Overwatch or COD. Not GT. A lot of the old faithful are still with PD/GT, but it's many of us who get vocal as fuck about where Kaz is leading the franchise.

It's great it makes money, for everyone in Sony to enjoy nice paychecks and celebrate, but the franchise deserves better than to steer further into just being a money maker (hyperbole boost enabled, I know GT games are still good games). Gotta get those 90%+ Metacritic scores again though

What the fuck happened in this thread?


GT6 has more than any Forza game has ever sold. What the fuck is going on here?

Jaded/salty GT fans expecting the worst.

Spoiler

Then if it's better than expected, celebrate?

Although, your second comment is a little bit of what epitomises current PD attitudes. We sell fuck loads so who cares? It would be nice if PD did appear to take more criticism on board from gamers, especially because the racing game market has serious competition on the go.

 

[jayu26]

What the fuck happened in this thread?

After GT6 I will not be suprised if this flop. Basically EU is the only region this might sell.

GT6 has more than any Forza game has ever sold. What the fuck is going on here?

 

[borges]

Its a Gran Turismo. Its gonna be great. Period.

 

[Behlel]

What the fuck happened in this thread?


GT6 has more than any Forza game has ever sold. What the fuck is going on here?

Fanboysm is a shitty thing.

 

[flipswitch]

So this will be like 4 years since the last GT released?

 

[DieH@rd]

Let's see how sport turns out before calling for KAZ's head.. People already like sport is some kind of failure...I mean Gt5 and 6 sold close to 17 mill combined/

If beta is to be believed, "Sport" feature really quickly weeded out crazily aggressive players. Sportmanship ranking is a great addition for online play.

 

[Hoje0308]

If beta is to be believed, "Sport" feature really quickly weeded out crazily aggressive players. Sportmanship ranking is a great addition for online play.

If I could race online and not get punted off at turn one, I would be so happy. Reason enough to buy the game, actually.

 

[Heshinsi]

Campaign mode?

I hope it's extensive. I'd buy the game but I'm mainly looking for SP stuff.

Yeah Kaz said no mode has been dropped from the previous game, but from what GT Sport was initially billed as, I don't know how extensive the campaign mode is.

 

[TheAdmiester]

I wish, doubt it according to some lists posted earlier in this thread.

As far as I know, Pikes Peak can't appear in other games (such as DiRT 4 despite PP having been in DiRT Rally) because PD has licenced it exclusively. If other devs aren't allowed to use it and it doesn't even show up in GT Sport that would be astoundingly scummy/dumb.

 

[onemanasylum]

If beta is to be believed, "Sport" feature really quickly weeded out crazily aggressive players. Sportmanship ranking is a great addition for online play.

It is huge imo, would make me race online when i never would bother, people are sleeping on GT Sport , but that's their right.

 

[Caayn]

So this will be like 4 years since the last GT released?

Just ~7 weeks shy of four years.

 

[cakely]

Unless PD really drops the ball on this one, it's going to sell well. Heck, even if they do drop the ball it will probably sell well.

GT doesn't have a yearly release cycle, the games are few and far between and the thirst feels real.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

The thing is, PD do manage to do things on a reasonable budget... That's why it still prints Sony money. It's more just sad to see the studio not fully moving on from it's PS1/PS2 glory days. The racing game market is quite tough, as many of today's youngsters do prefer going to Halo/Rocket League/Overwatch or COD. Not GT. A lot of the old faithful are still with PD/GT, but it's many of us who get vocal as fuck about where Kaz is leading the franchise.

Today younth enjoy Halo/Rocket League/Overwatch or COD ?
You do know that EU was always GT biggest market and i don't think the cross that high for certain games .
In fact i say there is not as much cross over for something like GT and Rocket League to begin with .
Halo is like a non factor for GT since it on another system along with other factors .

 

[Tutomos]

The thing is most of the criticism about GT and Kaz may be valid, but the problem I have is that the competition is not really bringing out anything exciting. Forza has driving line and rewind function on by default and most people are going to play it like that which is a shame.

I like that Kaz is saying I'm going to make this game enjoyable for people who really wants to learn racing and for those who do want to learn they will love the game.

 

[hanspampel]

What the fuck happened in this thread?


GT6 has more than any Forza game has ever sold. What the fuck is going on here?

We don't know that.

Several Forza games could've sold more than 5 million. (FM3, FM5, FH2 or FH3 are the most likely ones) Especially Forza Horizon 3 is still selling strong and was already at 2.5 million sold trough in just under 4 months

 

[Audioboxer]

Today younth enjoy Halo/Rocket League/Overwatch or COD ?
You do know that EU was always GT biggest market and i don't think the cross that high for certain games .
In fact i say there is not as much cross over for something like GT and Rocket League to begin with .
Halo is like a non factor for GT since it on another system along with other factors .

It was a tales from my ass feeling that in today's market it's probably more challenging to get younger games, like early teens, to be playing GT. I was playing GT on PS1/PS2 when I was young.

I personally think a lot of the GT base today are the same ones that grew up on GT but are now older. Loyalty to the GT brand has been a massive success, but the fear is that loyalty is going to get strained as PD fumble around a bit and other competitors actually keep improving. GT used to run around pretty uncontested, but in more recent times there is no denying other franchises have come a long way.

Throw in the saying, what's wrong with having amazing competition and just enjoying all games? True. However, PD still have magic in their fingertips, especially around technical wizardry and attention to detail. Some of us just want that magic to line up with the other aspects of GT to truly have the best in class experience on all fronts.

 

[Alebelly]

I thought this was the equivalent of GT Prologue, aka an expanded demo and not the next mainline game which is still years away?

It was initially planned to be a smaller game, more substantial than prologue but not deserving of the full fledged 7 in the title. But Kaz said the game just kept growing during development so it turned into a $60 game instead of $40. But it's still not GT7.

Gotta love Prime, got the $70 Limited Edition for $55.
(I really don't care for the box art, they're generally quite excellent.)

 

[Kolx]

GT has been managed so poorly it's insane. Releasing 6 after the ps4 cycle then making this instead of GT7 and now releasing it in October. How did this take 4 years to develop btw?

Kaz won't be replaced unless Kaz wants to be replaced.

Sony owns the IP and the studio. Companies can be patient but after a while they will kick you out.

Most games would kill for a flop over over 5 million sales....this is going to do well.

Not when your game cost tons shit of money to make. GT5 was the (2nd?) most expensive game Sony ever made up to that point. considering GT Sport dev cycle I don't think it's that cheap either.

 

[Servbot24]

Did it lose Sony money? It launched at the end of last gen after PS4 launched.....you have no idea it "Flopped".

How does GT sport look "Outdated"?

Gt5 was the only Gt that suffered numerous delays..... Gt threads always bring out the shit posting.

There's more to a game's success than making or losing money. Gran Turismo is not the name that it used to be, and that's thanks to the way the series has been handled the last several years. GT Sport will probably sell at least 5 million, but if GT6 were more successful, maybe GTS would be trending towards 10m or 15m.

 

[Chuck Norris]

Am I misunderstanding? $70 and I only get 8 cars?

 

[onemanasylum]

There's more to a game's success than making or losing money. Gran Turismo is not the name that it used to be, and that's thanks to the way the series has been handled the last several years. GT Sport will probably sell at least 5 million, but if GT6 were more successful, maybe GTS would be trending towards 10m or 15m.

I like to make things up too sometimes. Pure guessing and nothing of substance.