Enygger_Tzu
Banned
The Guardian: 'Git Gud' is offensive!
From Software:
From Software:
Imagine is people really bought into this attempted indoctrination. I can picture Friday the 13th after each round - You and your friends are dead. No, just kidding. You and your friends need to come to the table for breakfast, Jason made you blueberry pancakes and eggs."Git gud" is supposed to be offensive. You're either saying it to be offensive or you're jokingly saying it to pretend to be offensive to your buddies.
People who don't want to hear it need to avoid competitive modes entirely or you know, "git gud". Even if you are great at a game you're still going to hear it from sore losers, though, so if you can't handle that then turn off public text/voice chat---something you did anyway as an experienced multiplayer gamer, right?
I suppose we should stop keeping score in any game/sport that currently has score, so the people who are playing the game simply to relax won't have to worry about actually exerting themselves. Or you know, they could go play solitaire and stop fucking around in competitive games with their ridiculous attitude.
So it is similar to Bejeweled, not necessarily Columns. That's fair. I've played such a broad variety of puzzle games that it still comes across as a meaningless distinction, though.
I just took the time to actually read the whole article, and the core of it to me just seems to fall into the "everything needs to be made to appeal to everyone" line of thinking that I just can't agree with.
Her problem doesn't seem to be as much the git gud messages as it is the concept that some games requiere you to invest time into getting better to overcome some obstacles. And then she goes into some condescending remarks about mostly negative reasons why people might find the challenge in games to be fun.
The thing is, there are games for her. There's a whole genre (kinda) of narrative heavy games with basic gameplay where there's little to no skillbased challenge involved, and there's also plenty of games that offer a "I just want to see the story option" which also makes them extremely easy. But instead of finding and playing the games that match up with her taste she seems to play the ones that don't and then complain about it.
Although ultimately, it just sounds like she wants to watch a movie
If we had more data, then it would probably warrant its own thread. Your suggestion takes us back to whether is it really challenge or the "toxic" communities of many online pvp type games. Then that gets into an even deeper discussion of whether men or women prefer competitive games (like against another human).25% engagement with "survival roguelike" also seems like an indication that it isn't the challenge itself that may put women off but the source of the challenge. If the challenge comes from an unthinking CPU opponent (which is the case in all the top genres except MMO listed by Quantic Foundry) then it seems to be "okay", but if a game incorporates a competitive multiplayer focus it seems that women engage with those genres less frequently.
I don't know if the topic warrants a whole thread, but if you have more thoughts please share. Post up a standalone thread if you think it would be better.
Take it easy killer, we will get through this.Dude(tte), go and reread what I posted before and then maybe take a look at my edit of the OP. I think to have made it quite clear that I intent to discuss the merit of the article itself and not the author.
What are you on about? I gave you an answer, twice. No need to have us run around in circles, we got you the first time.
Yeah, hop into the philosophy topic or take a look at my post history. I'm sure you'll find that I'm very well capable of having a meaningful discussion. I see no reason why I should engage with an article on a deeper level that is clearly intended as clickbait, that would be elevating that article to something it doesn't deserve. I don't vilify whole demographics like that and neither should a journalist that's being paid to write for the Guardian.
You agreed with me that the article is trash, yet here you are trying to argue with me for exposing it as such. Criticizing the clickbaity nature of an article is not the same as giving in to clickbait. I'm certainly not going to be afraid of speaking my mind because people like you might deem it problematic. I read the Guardian article, had some time to spare and created a topic. Nothing more, nothing less. Deal with it.
Your patronizing attitude is based on a preconception of me as a person that's just way out there. I did not make baseless assumptions about you, so how about you return the favor and cut it with the ad hominems. DunDunDunpachi tried to foster the meaningful debate that you so desire, but instead of expanding on what he said you keep harking on about how the tone of my OP is not to your liking.
And yes, you're right, I don't react kindly to bullsh*t articles that blindly vilify whole demographics for the personal gain of the author. I think to have sufficiently demonstrated why the content of the article in question is utter and complete insanity. So how about you take it up with the author who formulated this needlessly vitriolic smear attempt in the first place?
If you seek to discuss the competitive and/or challenging nature of the gaming community, I'm all ears and happy to oblige. Until then, don't expect another reply from my part.
She legit insulted a lot American workers while building herself up to be some high brow hyper competitive super millennial.... Screw her point if she is going to talk down to people.This article triggered me and now I need a safe space.
It was also racist and the author is a nazi.
Expect a call from my attorney for hurting my feelings
That's a good point! Why should I get good at skateboarding in order to perform a kickflip? Why are the white supremacists rolling my ankles?Not sure if I am comprehending. Unless I misunderstood, why would you not want to be good at a particular hobby if you supposedly enjoy it? Whether I am drawing, playing music, sports, skateboarding, working, playing video games, etc I would want to be really proficient at it no matter what.
I’m sure she is aware that there are plenty of games in existence already that suit her special needs. But, just like a lot of this type of modern snowflake, she wants ALL games to be what she wants.I just took the time to actually read the whole article, and the core of it to me just seems to fall into the "everything needs to be made to appeal to everyone" line of thinking that I just can't agree with.
Her problem doesn't seem to be as much the git gud messages as it is the concept that some games requiere you to invest time into getting better to overcome some obstacles. And then she goes into some condescending remarks about mostly negative reasons why people might find the challenge in games to be fun.
The thing is, there are games for her. There's a whole genre (kinda) of narrative heavy games with basic gameplay where there's little to no skillbased challenge involved, and there's also plenty of games that offer a "I just want to see the story option" which also makes them extremely easy. But instead of finding and playing the games that match up with her taste she seems to play the ones that don't and then complain about it.
Although ultimately, it just sounds like she wants to watch a movie
In a way, there isn't really anything wrong with that.I’m sure she is aware that there are plenty of games in existence already that suit her special needs. But, just like a lot of this type of modern snowflake, she wants ALL games to be what she wants.
“EVERYTHING should be the way I WANT it to be.”
The entitled generation.
Really amazed to see how narrow-minded and quick to jump the gun people are in here.
I’m completely rational.In a way, there isn't really anything wrong with that.
Different people have different skills. She isn't alone in this.
There are countless people like her.
Gamers have been wishing for/demanding for acceptance of gaming for as long as I can remember, and now that gaming has become so massive that people like this enter our world, the gaming community gets all conservative and trashes them for actually having valid criticism.
"EVERTHING should be the way I WANT it to be." isn't any different from "I DON'T want things to change in a way I DON'T want it to".
Just playing devils advocate here, but honestly speaking, since I'm getting older, I'm leaning more towards her point of view than to that of most other in this topic.
Matter of trying to see things from a different perspective. Would improve gaming as a whole, if people were a bit more rational.
I read the whole thing too. It's garbage. Her headline is "I don’t want to get good at gaming, I want to escape the relentless pressure to improve myself".
She doesn't have to be better at games, and no one is asking her to be (or if they are, she didn't include any mention of it in the article itself)
She provides no examples of actually being pressured by anyone (remember the headline - relentless pressure), other than an anecdote about how when crawling google for game hints, she often sees people respond on message boards, to others, that they should get good. Also, a link to a new yorker article about self-help culture and the desire to improve oneself.
Her entire ordeal here is bullshit.
I don't think I'm a wise old sage, I'm just saying she has a point but people are too busy pointing fingers.I’m completely rational.
There is nothing wrong with diversity. Wanting everything to suit only your own tastes is not how the world works and is simply unintelligent and lazy.
You are not a wise old sage with a better perspective. We are all getting older mate, lol.
There are plenty of people who think her “point” is ridiculous and a prime example of the idiocy of modern society.I don't think I'm a wise old sage, I'm just saying she has a point but people are too busy pointing fingers.
Escapism, dude. That's the key-word. Escapism.
This whole topic reads like relation-ship counseling, where both parties refuse to see things from the others' perspective, while both have a valid point.
I know plenty of people think that. And I'm not saying they're wrong.There are plenty of people who think her “point” is ridiculous and a prime example of the idiocy of modern society.
Escapism doesn't necessarily exclude challenge. Do you agree with her stance that challenge interferes with escapism?Escapism, dude. That's the key-word. Escapism.
This whole topic reads like relationship counseling, where both parties refuse to see things from the others' perspective, while both have a valid point.
In her case, yes.Escapism doesn't necessarily exclude challenge. Do you agree with her stance that challenge interferes with escapism?
Escapism, dude. That's the key-word. Escapism.
This whole topic reads like relationship counseling, where both parties refuse to see things from the others' perspective, while both have a valid point.
You are putting more effort into her argument than she did. That's commendable, but please don't pretend like the rest of us "aren't getting it" while you play contrarian.In her case, yes.
But not necessarily, no.
That why I used HZD as an example.
They added a "story mode" for people. like her, and a "hard/very hard mode" for people like you.
I don't see how this hurts anyone inbl any way? If anything, everybody wins.
She is just a messenger. You don't shoot the messenger.
Nothing wrong here. I can empathize with her. There are gamers across a broad spectrum of skill levels.I enjoy video games but I’m not good at playing them. I lack a certain gamers’ intuition – is this wall going to be breakable? Which path is the game trying to lead me down?
So her first complaint is multifaceted: she hates looking for advice and seeing the answer "git gud", because she takes that to mean that she is a "lazy piece of shit". She makes a characterization with no further argument. At this point of the article, we must ask ourselves if we agree with her definition. Do you? I don't. Yet, onwards we go.there have invariably been people trying to get out of the same tricky spot. The other invariable part is that one person, and often many, will reply to the asker, “Just get good!!! Git gud!!!”
This basically means “try harder you lazy piece of shit”
So, even reading it "generously", she misrepresents high-skill play while making fun of videogame medium itself. Who, after all, would want to test their skill against something as stupid as a cartoon nemesis? That's her argument. Who, after all, wants to play videogames like a "job"? That's her argument.or, if you’re reading it very generously, “You can do it mate, keep pouring hours of your finite existence on this earth into achieving the millisecond-perfect muscle twitch reaction that will enable you to beat this cartoon nemesis that looks like a cross between a bed bug and a rum ball.”
Who is that directed at? Is that directed at a lack of easy games? No, it's aimed at people who "offer advice on the internet". That's the target of the article and the source of her angst.Rather than acknowledging the real-life deficits in meaning and achievement that make the “productive” approach to gaming such an enticing prospect, some gamers project this sense of shame on to people who aren’t as good at gaming as they are.
This what confuses me, If she doesn't like to "get good at games" then thats pretty much tells me that she doesn't like the entire act of playing video games.Not sure if I am comprehending. Unless I misunderstood, why would you not want to be good at a particular hobby if you supposedly enjoy it? Whether I am drawing, playing music, sports, skateboarding, working, playing video games, etc I would want to be really proficient at it no matter what.
The Guardian: 'Git Gud' is offensive!
From Software:
they should give me a medal just for participating
If someone wants to buy Mario Kart and set it up so that they get to sit there and watch the car drive itself, who cares?
thats why I said earlier that it would be better for her time and money if she just went to twitch or youtube to watch vids.The article is kind of funny to me too in the sense that gamers have been complaining about the dumbing down of their medium for years now. The majority of games that a person like the author would play (a self admitted poor player who just wants to have some fun), have sufficiently easy modes. She doesn't even give any examples of games she plays.
She does say this at one point
I mean, I don't, but at that point, that activity no longer sounds like playing a videogame for fun, it sounds more like watching a cartoon racing program. Or watching another person engage with the thing you are ostensibly interested in.
Over at The Guardian, a residentintersectional feministwriter is offended by the notion that she needs to improve on her skills in order to beat certain games. The whole article is peppered with hyperbolic conjectures, making it seem as if the author is merely venting her frustration over her own poor life choices by having a go at the gaming community.
If you don't want to become better at something that you enjoy, then maybe you're not really enjoying it in the first place. I get the impression that she might not be talking about games, but her own job. At least it would explain why that article is such an entertaining trainwreck of incoherent ramblings.
'Scuse me princess, your hyper-competitive millennial life? Man, I never knew that writing smug inflammatory bullcrap while sipping on your caffè macchiato in front of your laptop would be such a burden. Them poor millenials are really having it tough compared to all the generations before.
Yeah because quite evidently, all gamers are mere scrubs working low-grade jobs that have nothing meaningful to offer.
Take that Truck Simulator players, you ain't got nothing on my shitty blogger lifestyle! Your work is meaningless, but I, I produce meaning!
I guess that's what it feels like writing low-grade clickbait for the gaming section of The Guardian.
EDIT: Since I prefer to discuss the merits of this article alone instead of opening another can of worms about intersectional feminism, please disregard both terms used above. It was unwise of me to mix them up with the issue at hand.
Exactly. Many, many times in my life I have gotten home from work and realised I am too physically and/or mentally exhausted to have a session of my latest epic game. So, I find something else to do or a simpler game to play, of which there are tons.In all seriousness, the article writer hasn't realised the secret to good gaming, namely not to force it. It's an interactive medium and therefore it requires actual focus. If you're tired after a long days work, you're better off to pass on gaming, chill with TV, a film or a book and get an early night and then play the following day when you're refreshed. To butcher the bard 'Perhaps the fault dear Eleanor lies not in the games but in ourselves'
Your suggestion would be too much work.Maybe she should just stick to Leapfrog.
Or is that competitive too?
Exactly. Many, many times in my life I have gotten home from work and realised I am too physically and/or mentally exhausted to have a session of my latest epic game. So, I find something else to do or a simpler game to play, of which there are tons.
It’s common sense. A human trait that is increasingly lacking in contemporary society.
I know plenty of people think that. And I'm not saying they're wrong. But neither is she.
Good on you for the edit but for what it’s worth the intersection feminist jab made me laugh.
If you're tired after a long days work, you're better off to pass on gaming, chill with TV, a film or a book and get an early night and then play the following day when you're refreshed. To butcher the bard 'Perhaps the fault dear Eleanor lies not in the games but in ourselves'
“Git gud” is a fucking trash response and is part of what makes the Soulsbourne community so insufferable. I know it’s a shock to these people that some people just can’t play these games well or that they can be extremely frustrating, so the best advice they often offer is this condescending bullshit.
Unlike the author, I simply don’t choose to waste my time with overly difficult games.
It is almost as if the writer of this article wants to be a part of the gamer culture (because it’s trendy atm), but doesn’t actually like gaming. So, she would rather brute force it.Indeed. I think a lot of people get caught up in the zeitgeist or feel burdened by their backlog, but you've gotta learn to assess what your state is and then determine whether you're good to go. I'll often hit a game hard for a few weeks when I'm enthused, but then notice the fatigue set in, so I'll generally switch over to something else until my mojo is restored.