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[Zog]

I know many of you react emotionally to this, its only natural. Rescuing "a damsel in distress" is something you have hardwired, I have it too. All im saying, is try to see this as two equal adults. And the fact is, one of them crossed the line and made this physical.

See, I consider throwing things at him to be getting physical. From what i understand, women who attack men often tend to use objects.

 

[Racer!]

I’m not rescuing “a damsel in distress” or “hardwired” to have a certain opinion. I already said if all details in the story were kept the same except the two people in it had their positions reversed then the woman would be in the wrong.

Fair enough, its ok to disagree without wishing evil things upon each other. For me its always the person crossing the line to get physical that carries the heavier burden. Because from there you evoke biological human emotions/anger the person may or may not be able to control. Every adult should know this. With kids its a different matter, just because the kid does not have the experience/cognitive ability fathom that. The woman carries equal responsibility for the unborn child in that belly, which makes starting a physical confrontation even worse.

Lets agree to disagree

 

[Foxbat]

Yep, men don't get free passes for biology. They both lost their temper, her first and his temper was a reaction to her but she gets a pass. It's just the usual double standards and it's unacceptable in a world striving for equality.

They're not equal though. That's what you fail to understand. Despite what society attempts to push... Men and Women are not equal. They may be equal in several areas, but strength used during violence isn't one of them.

You can pretend that men aren't bigger, faster, and inherently better at combat than women all else being equal, but that's not how shit works in the real world... No matter how much you wish it did.

They're also not equal here because she is pregnant. Already at a disadvantage at a genetic level, she's even further disadvantaged due to pregnancy.

And yet in this case of violence, you're stanning for this guy, because they should be treated as equals. Yeah, good luck with that.

 

[Papa]

Sean Connery once defended it being ok to slap women with an open hand. At the time, I didn't necessarily disagree with him. If I came home to find my wife getting railed by 3 dudes, she'd almost certainly get slapped. I wouldn't be proud of it, but she'd certainly be deserving of it.

Bill Burr also has a stand up piece about the reasons for hitting a woman. He clearly states that you never do it, but that to say there is never a reason is misguided at best. There most certainly are reasons... You just don't do it.

All that being said. The wife in the video was annoying, and refused to leave him alone even after asked. I don't think it deserves a slap, but I certainly wouldn't crucify him for it, if was just a slap.

But she's pregnant. Now the annoying and whining on her part starts to make sense. Her mood is swinging all over the place. She's starting to show, and certainly feels self conscious about it. It doesn't completely justify her actions, but at least now I can understand where they're coming from.

His reaction was to slap her. A pregnant woman. In front of the kids.

Slapping her may have been excusable, but it was in front of the kids. That makes it inexcusable. Slapping a pregnant woman is going way too far.

Debating the how's, and why's is fine if you're trying to search for excuses, or somehow justify his actions. Many people aren't looking for that, and therefore don't bother.

I would like to think that I would not slap her, or worse, if I caught her cheating, but it's easy to say now when it's not happening. The truth is that I just don't know if the animal parts of my brain would take over in that situation because I've never been in it. If I did hit her, I would expect to receive some form of punishment, but I think she should be subject to a greater form of punishment for breaking the social contract. I don't know what form that would take.

I don't think what the wife in the video here did was particularly bad. I think there's also a lot of context missing because it's just a snapshot of a particular point in time and we have no idea what has been said/done in their relationship before. What seems most likely to me is that he's addicted to the game and she was justifiably upset that he wouldn't sit down to dinner with his family. She shouldn't have thrown the cardboard at him, but what he did was quite obviously orders of magnitude worse.

Debating the hows and whys is not in search of excuses for him; it's to understand how the situation developed in the first place. Throwing out a lazy "never hit a woman" doesn't get to the root cause and it obviously doesn't work otherwise we wouldn't be seeing these things constantly happening.

 

[prag16]

Building a guesswork narrative around the video so you can excuse her behavior. Brilliant.

Not at all. All I'm saying is we don't know. We can obviously condemn him for hitting his wife. But her level of blame is in question, and it may be close to zero. Or it may be considerable (but still less than what the streamer bears).

The bottom line is I tend to give her at least some benefit of the doubt because I know from experience how stressful it can be to care for small children by yourself.

For those continuing to peddle the "zomg he just wanted to be left alone, why can't she understand".

As a father with two small children, you don't get to be 'left alone' whenever you want. That's not how it works. Especially not when you're wife's pregnant, and the current distraction is a children's video game. Doesn't mean she's blameless, or necessarily handled things well. But I find it highly likely that most people shitting on her and standing up for the dude's right to sit in a room playing video games ignoring his family, don't have kids.

 

[Zog]

They're not equal though. That's what you fail to understand. Despite what society attempts to push... Men and Women are not equal. They may be equal in several areas, but strength used during violence isn't one of them.

You can pretend that men aren't bigger, faster, and inherently better at combat than women all else being equal, but that's not how shit works in the real world... No matter how much you wish it did.

They're also not equal here because she is pregnant. Already at a disadvantage at a genetic level, she's even further disadvantaged due to pregnancy.

And yet in this case of violence, you're stanning for this guy, because they should be treated as equals. Yeah, good luck with that.

You can't be half way in for equality because that means that you are NOT in for equality. So where do you stand?

 

[Ulysses 31]

Wouldn't "Couple mistreat each other in front of children" be a more accurate title?

 

[Zog]

Wouldn't "Couple mistreat each other in front of children" be a more accurate title?

Yes it would.

 

[Racer!]

They're not equal though. That's what you fail to understand. Despite what society attempts to push... Men and Women are not equal. They may be equal in several areas, but strength used during violence isn't one of them.

You can pretend that men aren't bigger, faster, and inherently better at combat than women all else being equal, but that's not how shit works in the real world... No matter how much you wish it did.

They're also not equal here because she is pregnant. Already at a disadvantage at a genetic level, she's even further disadvantaged due to pregnancy.

And yet in this case of violence, you're stanning for this guy, because they should be treated as equals. Yeah, good luck with that.

What youre doing here is very very dangerous. There is NO excuse for violence, period! Men tend to sort more towards violence when being attacked than women.

So youre saying we should accept that men are violent to women yelling because they are at a disadvantage at a gentic level?

 

[Alexios]

Yes it would.

No, that's equalizing someone hitting someone else for trying to drill into his brain proper priorities with someone yelling at someone and throwing a piece of cardboard at him for neglecting his family.

As for where people stand on gender equality, it's simple. They have equal rights and responsibilities. They aren't identical as beings physically. Here's an example with the weightlifting world records of men and women.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_men's_weightlifting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_women's_weightlifting
In your imaginary equal world these women would compete against the men rather among each other and never earn any distinction for efforts that are equal to the efforts of the men.

You can clearly see there are major differences. That's not because the women train less, are dedicated less to the sport, or anything of the sort. It's because their bodies are different, plain and simple. Their bodies aren't worse, they're different. Just as men can't (usually) give birth. It stands to reason these differences exist among untrained people who aren't athletes to the same degree. Of course a trained woman could be far stronger than an untrained man. That doesn't change that an equally trained man is likely to be stronger than her. Having such physical differences doesn't make them lesser or not equal or not deserving of equity.

 

[Zog]

But I find it highly likely that most people shitting on her and standing up for the dude's right to sit in a room playing video games ignoring his family, don't have kids.

Who might these people be?

 

[Foxbat]

I think it's sexist to claim that pregnant women can't control themselves.

I think it's sexist to expect pregnant women to be rational all the time.
It's not because they're women. It's because they're pregnant.

I suppose you also expect the paralyzed to walk? The aysmatic to run marathons? I mean we're all equal according to you right?

To discriminate while trying to take the moral high ground is weak.

 

[insanexer]

Couple definitely needs to go to therapy and address the serious communication issues in their marriage. As a dad with a wife and 2 kids, you have to be on the same page with your spouse about most issues in your home. Also, the kids remember this stuff whether the parents realize it or not and the repercussions could resurface years later. The discussion really isn't about who's right or wrong. It should be more of a discussion about the rapid decline of civility & respect in our daily lives and families.

 

[Racer!]

.

 

[Zog]

No, that's equalizing someone hitting someone else for trying to drill into his brain proper priorities with someone yelling at someone and throwing a piece of cardboard at him for neglecting his family.

As for where people stand on gender equality, it's simple. They have equal rights and responsibilities. They aren't identical as beings physically. Here's an example with the weightlifting world records of men and women.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_men's_weightlifting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_women's_weightlifting
In your imaginary equal world these women would compete against the men rather among each other and never earn any distinction for efforts that are equal to the efforts of the men.

You can clearly see there are major differences. That's not because the women train less, are dedicated less to the sport, or anything of the sort. It's because their bodies are different, plain and simple. Their bodies aren't worse, they're different. Just as men can't (usually) give birth. It stands to reason these differences exist among untrained people who aren't athletes to the same degree. Of course a trained woman could be far stronger than an untrained man. That doesn't change that an equally trained man is likely to be stronger than her. Having such physical differences doesn't make them lesser or not equal or not deserving of equity.

So men are stronger than women. Should women be excluded from jobs that require strength? You can't just pick and choose where the 'women are weaker' card is used.

You know, this attitude that 'you should never hit a woman' instead of 'you should never hit anyone' is really justifying men being treated as punching bags.

 

[Ulysses 31]

No, that's equalizing someone hitting someone else for trying to drill into his brain proper priorities with someone yelling at someone and throwing a piece of cardboard at him for neglecting his family.

Why are you inferring that there's a mistreatment balance from that title?

Both sides were mistreating each other so that title is accurate.

The guy is doing the most amount of mistreating but that doesn't erase what the woman was doing.

 

[Racer!]

I think it's sexist to expect pregnant women to be rational all the time.
It's not because they're women. It's because they're pregnant.

I suppose you also expect the paralyzed to walk? The aysmatic to run marathons? I mean we're all equal according to you right?

To discriminate while trying to take the moral high ground is weak.

I expect pregnant women not to be violent. Period. Cant believe what youre saying here....excusing violence. Nobody is accusing the woman for yelling.

 

[Zog]

I think it's sexist to expect pregnant women to be rational all the time.

I guess that's another way to say that pregnant women can't control themselves. You think highly of men, only men can control themselves.

 

[Alexios]

No, you're deflecting the facts with stupid questions. If the women can meet the job criteria they should be allowed, if not then not, just as men who don't meet it don't. Not allowing them solely based on their gender is sexist. Not allowing them on a case by case basis because they don't meet the physical criteria and are unable to do the job is not sexist as you'd not allow it to a man either in that case. I can lift enough to work in construction, I can't lift enough to be a weight lifting champion. A woman can lift enough to work in construction even if she can't lift as much as I can, the job doesn't require me to exploit my lift potential to 100% so my 70% is enough and het 80% is enough if she wants to do it or alternatively she has trained more than me and can also do the same with her 70% but if I trained like her I'd then only use 50-60% for each task over the 8 hour or whatever shift. What are you implying there, that those weight lifting records and all sorts of other physical sports have lower records for women because what? Despite being equal by all accounts they simply refuse to work as hard?

 

[Zog]

I expect pregnant women not to be violent. Period. Cant believe what youre saying here....excusing violence. Nobody is accusing the woman for yelling.

I would call it male supremacy to claim that only men can control themselves.

 

[Foxbat]

You can't be half way in for equality because that means that you are NOT in for equality. So where do you stand?

It's not an "in" or "out" issue. It also doesn't matter what I believe, because genetically speaking... Men and Women are not equal.

 

[Scopa]

Lol, no I didn’t hit her.

 

[Racer!]

I would call it male supremacy to claim that only men can control themselves.

Absolutely. I think if a woman read this, she would be furious, rightly so.

 

[Papa]

No, that's equalizing someone hitting someone else for trying to drill into his brain proper priorities with someone yelling at someone and throwing a piece of cardboard at him for neglecting his family.

As for where people stand on gender equality, it's simple. They have equal rights and responsibilities. They aren't identical as beings physically. Here's an example with the weightlifting world records of men and women.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_men's_weightlifting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_record_progression_women's_weightlifting
In your imaginary equal world these women would compete against the men rather among each other and never earn any distinction for efforts that are equal to the efforts of the men.

You can clearly see there are major differences. That's not because the women train less, are dedicated less to the sport, or anything of the sort. It's because their bodies are different, plain and simple. Their bodies aren't worse, they're different. Just as men can't (usually) give birth. It stands to reason these differences exist among untrained people who aren't athletes to the same degree. Of course a trained woman could be far stronger than an untrained man. That doesn't change that an equally trained man is likely to be stronger than her. Having such physical differences doesn't make them lesser or not equal or not deserving of equity.

Until we are all living in the Wall-E utopia where we are all just lard asses lazing around in mobility scooters while robots do all of the physical work and wars are no longer fought, men and women will never have equal responsibilities due to the physical differences that you are pointing to.

If you want men and women to have equal rights, that’s totally fine, but don’t then pretend that you are campaigning for “equality” when you are not addressing the responsibilities side of the equation.

 

[Zog]

No, you're deflecting the facts with stupid questions. If the women can meet the job criteria they should be allowed, if not then not, just as men who don't meet it don't. Not allowing them solely based on their gender is sexist. Not allowing them on a case by case basis because they don't meet the physical criteria and are unable to do the job is not sexist.

So it's not good to generalize about the physical ability of women UNLESS it benefits them?

 

[Alexios]

So it's not good to generalize about the physical ability of women UNLESS it benefits them?

Where did I say anything of the sort? You keep going on with stupid questions. Them being weaker than men doesn't mean they're too weak for every job that requires a degree of physical prowess as you suggested. They can have that degree required even if it's still less physical prowess than a man in the same circumstances. How's that hard to understand? Job x requires thing y*3. I have a y*6 a woman has y*4, we both meet the criteria, we both should be able to work there rather than have women excluded. If the job requires y*6 then I get in, this particular woman doesn't, but another woman might have y*6 for any number of reasons, including training harder than myself. Indeed, I had an easier time getting to the same point as her. Or are you now suggesting all women should hit the gym twice as much as men so that outside fringe world champion cases then can have equal physical prowess in the average scenario? That's not equity, to require that of them.

 

[Foxbat]

.

What youre doing here is very very dangerous. There is NO excuse for violence, period! Men tend to sort more towards violence when being attacked than women.

So youre saying we should accept that men are violent to women yelling because they are at a disadvantage at a gentic level?

It's apparently dangerous to your reading comprehension.

Men and Women are not equal when it comes to physical violence. I'm not saying that, I'm not suggesting that, nor am I championing that.

Scientific facts are.

 

[Zog]

Where did I say anything of the sort? You keep going on with stupid questions. Them being weaker than men doesn't mean they're too weak for every job that requires a degree of physical prowess as you suggested. They can have that degree required even if it's still less physical prowess than a man in the same circumstances.

Let me clarify:

With things that benefit women like getting a job they want then they should be judged on a case by case basis which is good but then when it comes to violence we here 'a woman hitting a man won't hurt him' and 'you should never hit a women'. Generalizing seems to be ok when it benefits women but not when it doesn't benefit women.

Here we are in 2018, bordering on 2019 and people still can't say 'you should never hit ANYONE'.

 

[Racer!]

Where did I say anything of the sort? You keep going on with stupid questions. Them being weaker than men doesn't mean they're too weak for every job that requires a degree of physical prowess as you suggested. They can have that degree required even if it's still less physical prowess than a man in the same circumstances.

I guess thats next in line for equality. Fight for women rights to be violent.

 

[Alexios]

Your clarifications explanations questions and so on continue to be pure bullshit though. From equalizing yelling at someone for being a complete disrespecting family neglecting dipshit to hurting a pregnant woman physically, to asking stupid questions that somehow want to do what, deny facts like posted athletic records, to equating accepting bodily differences as not being pro-equality and all kinds of other crazy shit. Nobody said people should hit men, you're the one posting in a thread about a man hitting a woman that she somehow is equally fucked up and at fault and a bad mother and how the children are the only ones it's sad situation for because both the parents suck with no evidence whatsoever for it.

 

[Racer!]

It's apparently dangerous to your reading comprehension.

Men and Women are not equal when it comes to physical violence. I'm not saying that, I'm not suggesting that, nor am I championing that.

Scientific facts are.

I`ll make you a deal. Why dont we just say; Physical violence is not allowed for ANY individual, how about that?

 

[Foxbat]

Absolutely. I think if a woman read this, she would be furious, rightly so.

ITS NOT BECAUSE SHE'S A WOMAN.

IT'S BECAUSE SHE'S PREGNANT.

I'm not going to sling personal insults, but if you two can't grasp basic English, then this discussion isn't going to go anywhere.

No wonder everyone here is dog piling you two.

 

[Zog]

ITS NOT BECAUSE SHE'S A WOMAN.

IT'S BECAUSE SHE'S PREGNANT.

Since you believe that pregnant women can't control themselves, you probably want to put some restrictions on them to protect society. No driving, working, etc...?

 

[Racer!]

ITS NOT BECAUSE SHE'S A WOMAN.

IT'S BECAUSE SHE'S PREGNANT.

I'm not going to sling personal insults, but if you two can't grasp basic English, then this discussion isn't going to go anywhere.

No wonder everyone here is dog piling you two.

Ok just so I understand you. Pregnant women has a right to be violent? Or violence by pregnant women should be looked lightly upon? Just trying to understand what you mean...

My wife just read what you wrote. And Im not gonna write here what she called you...it would warrant a permaban.

 

[Zog]

Your clarifications explanations questions and so on continue to be pure bullshit though. From equalizing yelling at someone for being a complete disrespecting family neglecting dipshit to hurting a pregnant woman physically, to asking stupid questions that somehow want to do what, deny facts like posted athletic records, to equating accepting bodily differences as not being pro-equality and all kinds of other crazy shit. Nobody said people should hit men, you're the one posting in a thread about a man hitting a woman that she somehow is equally fucked up and at fault and a bad mother and how the children are the only ones it's sad situation for because both the parents suck with no evidence whatsoever for it.

I have another question for you. Do you consider it physical violence to throw something at another person while angry?

 

[Chiggs]

Sheesh, Fortnite is bad enough by itself, but then you add domestic violence into the mix and the combo becomes unbearably wretched.

This guy is such a fucking loser.

 

[Foxbat]

Ok just so I understand you. Pregnant women has a right to be violent? Or violence by pregnant women should be looked lightly upon? Just trying to understand what you mean...

My wife just read what you wrote. And Im not gonna write here what she called you...it would warrant a permaban.

No, pregnant women don't have a right to be violent. I never stated that they should. You assumed that in your yearning for a debate point.

The second video doesn't work for me, but apparently she violently attacked him in it. Is that correct?
In the first video, there is zero evidence of her attacking him first. Even if she threw cardboard at his computer, that's not personally attacking him.

As such, I only claimed that I understand where her obvious emotional outburst comes from. She sounds annoyed and upset in the video. I can understand where she is coming from there due to her being pregnant. If she threw cardboard at him directly... That was wrong. It was wrong in a "Hey, don't do that." or a "I need to leave." kind of way. Not a let me strike my wife kinda way.

Sounds like you and your wife are perfect for each other then. Lol

 

[Foxbat]

Sheesh, Fortnite is bad enough by itself, but then you add domestic violence into the mix and the combo becomes unbearably wretched.

This guy is such a fucking loser.

If you want to see the real nastiness, take a read through this thread. There's actually a couple of people defending the guy.

 

[LuvOfThaGame]

Egging him on?? She got physical either by throwing things or attacking. She totally deserved to be put in place. I agree though, it should not have been done infront of the kids.

Quoting one of your earliest posts for reference of how you keep dropping hints instead of outright saying what you really think. How many times have you used "put in place" or something similar? This post in particular you said she "deserved" it, as in deserved to get hit.
Stop trying to act like you've been pushing the no violence card.
You support hitting women in this instance, have said so yourself, and it's disgusting.

 

[Chiggs]

If you want to see the real nastiness, take a read through this thread. There's actually a couple of people defending the guy.

Oh, I saw that, unfortunately. Pretty embarrassing.

 

[Foxbat]

I have another question for you. Do you consider it physical violence to throw something at another person while angry?

I have a question for you. Did the woman in the video actually hit the guy with something?

 

[Foxbat]

Quoting one of your earliest posts for reference of how you keep dropping hints instead of outright saying what you really think. How many times have you used "put in place" or something similar? This post in particular you said she "deserved it", as in deserved to get hit.
Stop trying to act like you've been pushing the no violence card.
You support hitting women in this instance, have said so yourself, and it's disgusting.

Wow!!! I didn't see that.

Wonder if his wife who hates me knows she's married to a guy that supports violence against women?

 

[Racer!]

No, pregnant women don't have a right to be violent. I never stated that they should. You assumed that in your yearning for a debate point.

The second video doesn't work for me, but apparently she violently attacked him in it. Is that correct?
In the first video, there is zero evidence of her attacking him first. Even if she threw cardboard at his computer, that's not personally attacking him.

As such, I only claimed that I understand where her obvious emotional outburst comes from. She sounds annoyed and upset in the video. I can understand where she is coming from there due to her being pregnant. If she threw cardboard at him directly... That was wrong. It was wrong in a "Hey, don't do that." or a "I need to leave." kind of way. Not a let me strike my wife kinda way.

Sounds like you and your wife are perfect for each other then. Lol

I laughed. Yeah I think we are perfect for eachother.

The first video is edited so you dont see the assault on the guy. Probably intentionally. Well, you can hear she does something right before he slaps her, maybe a punch to the body or throwing something else at him in the first video also.

 

[Zog]

I have a question for you. Did the woman in the video actually hit the guy with something?

She tried to hit the guy with something.

Now I have two questions for you:

I have another question for you. Do you consider it physical violence to throw something at another person while angry?

and a new one:

Does a slap not count as violence if the slapper tries but misses?

 

[LuvOfThaGame]

I have a question for you. Did the woman in the video actually hit the guy with something?

She threw a folded up cardboard box at him and a few other things that caused no damage. These misogynist believe that it was good enough to ring her bell.

 

[Foxbat]

I laughed. Yeah I think we are perfect for eachother.

The first video is edited so you dont see the assault on the guy. Probably intentionally. Well, you can hear she does something right before he slaps her, maybe a punch to the body or throwing something else at him in the first video also.

So that's a No then. You didn't see her attack him or actually hit him with anything. You're just assuming then?

Showed my wife this thread, and she says that between you and me...

I got the better deal.

 

[Racer!]

Quoting one of your earliest posts for reference of how you keep dropping hints instead of outright saying what you really think. How many times have you used "put in place" or something similar? This post in particular you said she "deserved" it, as in deserved to get hit.
Stop trying to act like you've been pushing the no violence card.
You support hitting women in this instance, have said so yourself, and it's disgusting.

Of course she deserved a reaction in that situation. If you throw things at me, youre going to get a response back. Same goes for defending youreself. When I say violence is never ok, I mean initiating it.

 

[Papa]

Where did I say anything of the sort? You keep going on with stupid questions. Them being weaker than men doesn't mean they're too weak for every job that requires a degree of physical prowess as you suggested. They can have that degree required even if it's still less physical prowess than a man in the same circumstances. How's that hard to understand? Job x requires thing y*3. I have a y*6 a woman has y*4, we both meet the criteria, we both should be able to work there rather than have women excluded. If the job requires y*6 then I get in, this particular woman doesn't, but another woman might have y*6 for any number of reasons, including training harder than myself. Indeed, I had an easier time getting to the same point as her. Or are you now suggesting all women should hit the gym twice as much as men so that outside fringe world champion cases then can have equal physical prowess in the average scenario? That's not equity, to require that of them.

Now you've just introduced another term (equity) which I don't think you understand the meaning of. Equity is at the output end of the system, while equality is at the input end. Communism is an equity ideology.

 

[Racer!]

So that's a No then. You didn't see her attack him or actually hit him with anything. You're just assuming then?

Showed my wife this thread, and she says she's between you and me...

I got the better deal.

You see her throwing things at him, he has to raise his hands up and defend his face if I remember correctly.

Let me be clear, if it was just about the yelling. I would have been on the woman side 100%.

 

[Zog]

She threw a folded up cardboard box at him and a few other things that caused no damage. These misogynist believe that it was good enough to ring her bell.

Never said he should have hit her.