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[Digital Foundry] In Theory: Is PS5 Powered By AMD's Gonzalo Processor?
- Thread starter GoldenEye98
- Start date
AnotherOne
Member
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Insane Metal
Member
I thought the leaks were saying Gonzalo was actually XB?
That's exactly what I've been saying. There's no way any of those consoles will come with 15, 16, 18TF... even 14TF is a stretch.
Evilms
Banned
60 CU x 64 = 3840 Stream Process
3840 x 2 x 1400Mhz ~ 10.7 Tflops
3840 x 2 x 1800Mhz ~ 13.8 Tflops
62 CU x 64 = 3968 Stream Process
3968 x 2 x 1400Mhz ~ 11.1 Tflops
3968 x 2 x 1800Mhz ~ 14.2 Tflops
In reality there are many possibilities.
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SonGoku
Member
In reality we dont even know if Gonzalo will end up in consoles
Crossing my fingers for either. On 7nm with Navi should be doable
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JareBear: Remastered
Banned
It’s gonna be powered by my fuckin cash as soon as I can hit pre-order on it, whenever that will be
Love this GIF
Love this GIF
KlickKlack
Banned
what DF are talking about makes absolutely sense.
when they go full with 60CU no way this gpu can run 1,8GHz without monstet cooling and bigger cost for all components
i think PS5 will have 40CU with 1,8GHz that means 9,2 TF.
such specs console has no need for more than 12-16GB Ram
and is 399$ worth
GoldenEye98
posts news as their odd job
I think even 12TF is a stretch. I'd be surprised if we get more than ~54 active CU's and more than 1.5GHz gpu clock speed. aka 10.3TFlops
If Radeon VII is anything to go by you'd need a 400mm^2 chip to fit an 8 core-Zen cpu and 64CU's (with 60 active).
For reference the launch PS4 and the PS4 Pro chips are around 325-328mm^2.
And that isn't even getting into the clock speed which ain't going to be close to 1.8GHz imo. People are widely optimistic in what they expect.
Whatever GPU performance MS/Sony will be able to deliver relies on AMD to be able to deliver improvements in performance per watt in Navi.
The best proxy for GPU performance right now is Radeon VII (3840 SPs) given that it's manufactured at the same 7nm as the new console chips will be. Radeon VII uses around ~300W at stock settings (1.4GHz Base, 1.75GHz boost) which gives us a peak of 13.4TFLOPS.
The best proxy for GPU performance right now is Radeon VII (3840 SPs) given that it's manufactured at the same 7nm as the new console chips will be. Radeon VII uses around ~300W at stock settings (1.4GHz Base, 1.75GHz boost) which gives us a peak of 13.4TFLOPS.
SonGoku
Member
No way dude, you are lowballing way too hard.
12TF and 24GB is the minimum
Keep in mind Navi its a more efficient arch on 7nm no less. They could pull close to 14TF with either 60 or 62 CUs. The chip would be no bigger than the pro or X at 7nm
Old arch though, we dont know how big of a change Navi is.
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It's still GCN based but we'll see in a few months when Navi 10 cards are available. Personally not expecting much, stilI think Turing will still be better perf/W at 12nm. I think AMD needs to Zen-esque blank slate design before we see anything truly competitive.
Fake
Member
^ Yes... if you missed my post... The entire conversation. Rich don't give then too much credit, but this guy indeed was right about the PS4 cpu code number before they release the PS4. Same code about number, cpu, clock speed, type, cache, etc...
So this time they given him a little credit.
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Evilms
Banned
Lol the xbox one x have 40cu and the ps4 pro 36cu you think really the futur PS5 will have just 40cu
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SonGoku
Member
Not saying it will be better than Nvidia just much better than Vega
We know Vega was an afterthought and all efforts went into Navi.
Panda1
Banned
Lol the xbox one x have 40cu and the ps4 pro 36cu you think really the futur PS5 will have just 40cu
The x1 and ps4 have 8 cores - according to your logic ps5 and x4 should have how many cores?
If you think they gonna have 60+ then we looking at a $1000 console. A 2080GTX is $1300
Shin
Banned
I saw them asking the other day, reminds me when I posted that Gonzalo string on this site someone tried to debunk it because of 3DMark.
Out of everything in this video it's nice to see the PS4 silicon matching the ID/tag from 3DMark which I wasn't aware of and solidifies what Apisak said when he uncovered Gonzalo.
Also nice to know what the "18" is, been bugging me for a a week now.
GoldenEye98
posts news as their odd job
Sounds like you are confusing CPU cores with GPU compute units..
Fake
Member
Indeed. This also can prove the dev kits are in fact out and in many ways and differents forms. Hope DF give this guy more credit.
Panda1
Banned
i was just making the point - numbers dont always increase with new tech - why not 16 core machines?
Shin
Banned
Article that goes along with the video for those wanting to read and/or at work.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2019-is-amd-gonzalo-the-ps5-processor-in-theory
This made my day, didn't know there was such an Xbox but I kinda thought AMD named the SoC/project.
Because it's impossible to convince people who's minds are made up, it's like talking to a wall.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2019-is-amd-gonzalo-the-ps5-processor-in-theory
This made my day, didn't know there was such an Xbox but I kinda thought AMD named the SoC/project.
I wish they had the balls and wrote this piece or did this video months ago all things considered.
Because it's impossible to convince people who's minds are made up, it's like talking to a wall.
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Evilms
Banned
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Darius87
Member
given that radeon VII is 331mm2 in which fits 60CU assuming ps5 die size won't increase in size from ps4 which is 347mm2 and zen cores pretty much same size as jaguar cores, in that case ps5 should end up around 56 CU, 6 CU should be disabled giving total of 50 CU so if 1.8 Ghz is true PS5 would be 11.52Tflops. which is great, given that ps4 was 399$.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
To be honest all of this talk about GPU TFlops makes the whole thing feel underwhelming. A 50% bump in fill rate over the Pro does not exactly feel like a next gen system.
I'm much more interested to see how things like CPU, the SSD, Raytracing, and better async compute stack up as differentiators. I don't think raw performance alone is going to do it.
I'm much more interested to see how things like CPU, the SSD, Raytracing, and better async compute stack up as differentiators. I don't think raw performance alone is going to do it.
Insane Metal
Member
I'm placing my bet now: 56 CUs for PS5.
thelastword
Banned
Or, they downplay those who had it right or were close..... Or, they say they always believed in the revealed specs; ssd, 8k, zen2, high tf and vram..... Just like you have many youtubers and outlets saying, they knew what Sony would offer
.... Yes, all lies.....
Silver Wattle
Gold Member
56 or 60 CU with 8 or 4 disabled for yields.
2 disabled is too small.
2 disabled is too small.
TeamGhobad
Banned
early devkit rumors said it was cloked at about 11tflops.
Shin
Banned
Too detailed to be made up or someone spent some serious fucking time coming up with this info, I've never read about before. On mobile so using via via link: https://www.resetera.com/threads/ne...-anaconda-dont-want-none.112607/post-20024749
PS4 refresh
PS5 memory and storage systems
- sometime between september and november
- 199
- fabbed on samsung 7nm EUV
- best wafer pricing in the industry
- die size 110mm²
- no PRO refresh, financially not viable yet
- too close to PS5 as well
PS5 memory and storage systems
- 24 GB RAM in total (20 GB usable by games)
- 8 GB in form of 2 * 4-Hi stacks HBM2
- Sony got "amazing" deal for HBM
- in part due to them buying up bad chips from other customers which can't run higher then 1.6 Gbps while keeping 1.2v.
- HBM is expected to scale down in price a lot more than GDDR6 over the console lifetime
- Samsung, Micron and SK Hynix already shifting part of their capacity towards HBM due to falling NAND prices
- Sony will be one of the first high volume customers of TSMCs InFO_MS when mass production starts later this year (normal InFo already used by Apple in their iPhone)
- InFO_MS brings down the cost compared to traditional silicon interposers - has thermal and performance advantage as well
- InFO_MS allows them to drive their 1.6 Gbps chips @ 1.7 Gbps (435 GB/sec.) without having to increase the voltage above 1.2v
- HBM is more power efficient compared to GDDR6 - the savings were invested into more GPU power
- additional 16 GB in form of DDR4 @ 256 bit for 102.4 GB/sec.
- 4 GB reserved for OS, the remaining 12 GB usable by games
- memory automatically managed by HBCC and appears as 20 GB to the developers
- HBCC manages streaming of game data from storage as well
- developers can use the API to take control if they choose and manage the memory and storage streaming themselves
- memory solution alleviates problems found in PS4
- namely that CPU bandwidth reduces GPU bandwidth disproportionately
- 2 stacks of HBM have 512 banks (more banks = fewer conflicts and higher utilization)
- GDDR6 better than GDDR5 and GDDR5x in that regard but still less banks than HBM
- at the same time trying to keep CPU memory access to slower DDR4
- very satisfied with decision to use two kinds of memory for price to performance reasons
- allowed them to go below ~50 GFLOPs per GB/sec. bandwidth but still keep above 40 GFLOPs per GB/sec.
Tarkus98
Member
They got it running under DOS? Excellent, I can finally close my binary app down now. This is a big cutting edge step forward.
Insane Metal
Member
That would be incredibly disappointing since it's only 8GB of HBM2, the rest is 16GB of DDR4 at 102GB/s which is really, really slow for a gaming machine.
Dragon_Rocks
Gold Member
I don't even know why I come into these kind of threads and read them. All these abbreviations, numbers and calculations being thrown around and the only things I know of and can understand are CPU, GPU and RAM. How do you guys know so much about these? Are you all into some kind of chip designing course or work? Or is it all based on knowledge gathered on the net?
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Listen, I'll admit: I'm not the most educated person when it comes to gaming technology. I appreciate the efforts that companies put into their silicon architecture but at the end of the day, whether PS5 or Xbox has the better specs, it all comes down to the developers and how well will they utilize the technology given to them.
The biggest proof that you don't need the best specs to make a great game is Zelda's Breath of the Wild. I've realized this when I played Silent Hill 2 for the first time back in 2016. That game is a bonafide masterpiece but not because of the PS2 specs but because of the genius behind the team that developed it.
My biggest fear come this next generation of games is whether we will still be able to keep a steady creative pool of developers that can make bonafide masterpieces. Unfortunately, GAAS may be one of the factors that kills the creativity that drove the gaming industry to the heights that it comfortably sits in at the moment.
The biggest proof that you don't need the best specs to make a great game is Zelda's Breath of the Wild. I've realized this when I played Silent Hill 2 for the first time back in 2016. That game is a bonafide masterpiece but not because of the PS2 specs but because of the genius behind the team that developed it.
My biggest fear come this next generation of games is whether we will still be able to keep a steady creative pool of developers that can make bonafide masterpieces. Unfortunately, GAAS may be one of the factors that kills the creativity that drove the gaming industry to the heights that it comfortably sits in at the moment.
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demigod
Member
Maybe I’m missing something but how does this equate to the 880 GB/sec leak?
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ethomaz
Banned
It doesn't. Two stacks of HBM2 @ 1.6Gbps = 410GB/s.
ethomaz
Banned
Forget HBM2.
GDDR6 is the only memory next consoles will use.
And yes at 352bits bus 24GB GDDR6 reaches that bandwidth.
See above.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I’m not buying this.
demigod
Member
I missed this part, can you quote or link it.
ethomaz
Banned
Radiocast with the Wired’s guy that interviewed Cerny... he left some things out from the article.
It was posted here.
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