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Developers Begin to Weigh in on the Power Gap Between the Xbox Series X and PlayStation 5. Series X taking the power crown "from all accounts".

Mendou

Mendou

Banned
The Pleasure said:
You just admitted that they have fallen off. Do they still have the scope of development and team size? Sure, but that's creep with all games being made. But do they still have the cultural zeitgeist? The advertising? The sponsorship? Not like they used to. Everything makes it triple A. As much as it hurts my soul to say this, Smash Bros is AAA. Halo and Gears are not. God, I can taste the bile.
Click to expand...
You're acting like a gamma male. Instead of admitting you're wrong, you go on another tangent. Just leave the argument alone or ignore the user.

Proverbs 22:10
Drive out the scoffer, and contention will go out, Even strife and dishonor will cease.
 
IntentionalPun

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
azertydu91 said:
I'm not looking for any cookie and have been talking to a lot of people here or on era to simply to understand more about tech (you can find me on the what is a flop on Era)and I enjoy talking about tech but there's too much warrior here that information is too diluted (dilued?) here and franckly too few people here are willing to discuss tech without some console (or pc sometimes) warrior shitting the threads eother on PS or xbox.
Which is better I don't care what I want is to understand how it works.
But there's too much console war for people to be honest here (maybe we don't know enough to really form an educated opinion).And I have to admit it is hard to follow sometimes the serious tech talk considering english isn't my native language but there's too much bias to be able to talk technologies.
Click to expand...
What in the world about my post was console warrior-ish, to the point where you decided my post was what did it for you?

Just bizarre that of all posts, me pointing out a car analogy doesn't really work is the one that made you decided "this is too much!"

Or was it me pointing out that the games will look better so it doesn't necessarily matter how we describe it? (which was me explicitly NOT being console warrior-ish)
 
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R

Renozokii

Member
ShaDowDaNcA said:
Sony published it and it's only on PlayStation unlike Ori.
So what if a $29 Indy game gets rated a couple points higher.
Nioh is a much more successful franchise.
Ori is more likely to come to PlayStation than Nioh 2 is to come to XB.
Click to expand...

Nioh 2 is an overrated Souslike clone with none of the amazing world building or creativity that makes souls games worth struggling through. Ori is a gorgeous one of a kind platformer that critics thing is near perfect.
 
A

azertydu91

Hard to Kill
IntentionalPun said:
What in the world about my post was console warrior-ish, to the point where you decided my post was what did it for you?

Just bizarre that of all posts, me pointing out a car analogy doesn't really work is the one that made you decided "this is too much!"

Or was it me pointing out that the games will look better so it doesn't necessarily matter how we describe it? (which was me explicitly NOT being console warrior-ish)
Click to expand...
Oh sorry I didn't meant that your post was some console warrior shit ... far from it.
But the car analogy was just the click that reminded me an exact same discussion about ps4/xbox before they released.Then I followed about my tiredness about console warriors in general but it was not about you at all.I'm sorry I thought that I was clear that the rest of my post was more about gaf (or era) in general.That's why you sounded so much on the defensive I understand you better now ... I thought you were just pretty harsh to someone just tired about all the consle warrioirs here.

But yeah your analogy was not console warrioring but it was the exact same analogy someone had prior to this generation which made me understand how we where all running in circles.
 
hyperbertha

hyperbertha

Member
Renozokii said:
Nioh 2 is an overrated Souslike clone with none of the amazing world building or creativity that makes souls games worth struggling through. Ori is a gorgeous one of a kind platformer that critics thing is near perfect.
Click to expand...
Try to be a bit less obvious in showing your Xbox biases. Ori is fine and all buts its not in the same league as Nioh. Its gameplay alone is enough reason to ''struggle through'', but since you probably don't even own a PS to play it, let me tell you the world building is plenty fine.
 
I

itsjustJEFF

Member
I love the console war happening in here LOL the definitive statements in here are gold! Keep up the good fight, bask in the sun while you have it cause we all know the shoe will be on the other foot, its just a matter of time. It's like a butt hurt circle of life!
 
VFXVeteran

VFXVeteran

Banned
I've sent out a request to Mod of War Mod of War to consolidate these numerous console warring threads into a single thread and remove all the new ones.

Guys, it's gotten ridiculous on both sides and needs to stop. This is the perfect example of "zealots favoring their hardware of choice". It's just not interesting or fun anymore to read these threads.
 
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JLB

JLB

Banned
VFXVeteran said:
I've sent out a request to Mod of War Mod of War to consolidate these numerous console warring threads into a single thread and remove all the new ones.

Guys, it's gotten ridiculous on both sides and needs to stop. This is the perfect example of "zealots favoring their hardware of choice". It's just not interesting or fun anymore to read these threads.
Click to expand...

Yeah, although the ignore button, I guess, did marvels.
 
EventHorizon

EventHorizon

Member
The XSX has the clear TFLOPs advantage. The PS5 SSD's speed can't completely negate it. However what the discussion is missing is exactly how the XSX TFLOPs advantage will actually improve games vs what the SSD advantage will do for the PS5. I'll avoid the SSD hotbed right now and speak only about the TFLOPs.

The PS5 has an 18% TFLOP deficit to the XSX. It's real, but it is only half the difference between the launch PS4 and XB1. The key here is that the easiest way to for the PS5 to make up that deficit is to drop the resolution when a game's image processing gets demanding. However, resolution is hitting major diminishing returns, and an 18% resolution reduction from a 4K target will hardly be noticeable.

Putting it another way. An 1800p image with good image sharpening is pretty close to 4K. That's especially true without a side-by-side comparison and while actually playing a game. Now, the PS5's 18% reduction in resolution needed to meet the equivalent processing power of the XSX is still 21% better than that already pretty good 1800p. Practically speaking, outside of a zoomed in slow motion Digital Foundry type image examination, it's a complete non-issue.

...Ok I lied. I will speak quickly about the PS5's SSD advantage because this part of the developer's comment irked me.

It’s[SSD] also nowhere near GDDR6 levels so it can’t reliably be used as virtual memory.
Click to expand...

I've heard some form of that many times, and it completely misses the point. The SSD won't be used as a stand-in replacement for GDDR6. SSD data only needs to be read once for the many many times it will be accessed in RAM. For example, the CPU/GPU won't repeatedly read SSD data, do an add and/or multiply, and immediately write it back to the SSD like it would GDDR6.

No, the purpose of the super fast SSD is to act as a force multiplier for the 16 GB of GDDR6 already in use. By significantly reducing the latency and increasing bandwidth, the PS5's SSD reduces the penalty taken for needing data not already loaded in RAM. That means much less of RAM has to be wasted as a cache for the hard drive or SSD. That effectively gives you more RAM to work with. Cerny used the example that games currently have to have all the data they will need for the next 30 seconds fully loaded in RAM. In contrast with the PS5's SSD, that drops to only needing the next 1 second's worth of data in RAM. That frees up a whole lot of RAM for processing what is immediately around the player at that moment.

It's like a car being able to drive farther because it is more fuel efficient, and not because it has a bigger gas tank. The end result is the same, but no one thinks the parts that make the car more fuel efficient burn like gasoline. Same is true of the SSD. It has the same result of increasing RAM, but it itself is not used just like RAM.
 
oldergamer

oldergamer

Member
EventHorizon said:
The XSX has the clear TFLOPs advantage. The PS5 SSD's speed can't completely negate it. However what the discussion is missing is exactly how the XSX TFLOPs advantage will actually improve games vs what the SSD advantage will do for the PS5. I'll avoid the SSD hotbed right now and speak only about the TFLOPs.

The PS5 has an 18% TFLOP deficit to the XSX. It's real, but it is only half the difference between the launch PS4 and XB1. The key here is that the easiest way to for the PS5 to make up that deficit is to drop the resolution when a game's image processing gets demanding. However, resolution is hitting major diminishing returns, and an 18% resolution reduction from a 4K target will hardly be noticeable.

Putting it another way. An 1800p image with good image sharpening is pretty close to 4K. That's especially true without a side-by-side comparison and while actually playing a game. Now, the PS5's 18% reduction in resolution needed to meet the equivalent processing power of the XSX is still 21% better than that already pretty good 1800p. Practically speaking, outside of a zoomed in slow motion Digital Foundry type image examination, it's a complete non-issue.

...Ok I lied. I will speak quickly about the PS5's SSD advantage because this part of the developer's comment irked me.



I've heard some form of that many times, and it completely misses the point. The SSD won't be used as a stand-in replacement for GDDR6. SSD data only needs to be read once for the many many times it will be accessed in RAM. For example, the CPU/GPU won't repeatedly read SSD data, do an add and/or multiply, and immediately write it back to the SSD like it would GDDR6.

No, the purpose of the super fast SSD is to act as a force multiplier for the 16 GB of GDDR6 already in use. By significantly reducing the latency and increasing bandwidth, the PS5's SSD reduces the penalty taken for needing data not already loaded in RAM. That means much less of RAM has to be wasted as a cache for the hard drive or SSD. That effectively gives you more RAM to work with. Cerny used the example that games currently have to have all the data they will need for the next 30 seconds fully loaded in RAM. In contrast with the PS5's SSD, that drops to only needing the next 1 second's worth of data in RAM. That frees up a whole lot of RAM for processing what is immediately around the player at that moment.

It's like a car being able to drive farther because it is more fuel efficient, and not because it has a bigger gas tank. The end result is the same, but no one thinks the parts that make the car more fuel efficient burn like gasoline. Same is true of the SSD. It has the same result of increasing RAM, but it itself is not used just like RAM.
Click to expand...

You pretty much lost me after you equated Tflops to resolution. The two don't have to go hand in hand. Dropping resolution would help if PS4 has less ROPs, but doing so won't help it make up a gap in floating point calculations.
 
S0ULZB0URNE

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
DynamiteCop! said:
Ori isn't indie.
Click to expand...
It sure is.

www.techradar.com

Nintendo Switch nabs a former Microsoft exclusive, and two iconic indie games

Superhot and Hotline Miami live on
www.techradar.com www.techradar.com

www.geek.com

'Ori and The Blind Forest' Brings More Xbox Indie Goodness to Nintendo Switch - Geek.com

The saga of Xbox on Nintendo Switch continues. Just a few years ago It would’ve been wild to see Microsoft support one of its biggest rivals so heavily. But as the company shifts …
www.geek.com www.geek.com

www.polygon.com

Xbox indie Ori and the Blind Forest runs at 1080p and 60fps with no loading screens

Ori and the Blind Forest, the upcoming Xbox One and Windows PC release from independent game developer Moon Studios, will run at 1080p and 60fps, game director Thomas Mahler told Polygon. Mahler...
www.polygon.com www.polygon.com
 
Stuart360

Stuart360

Member
Yeah Ori is an Indie game. People automatically think of a solo dev in his spare room developing a game when you say 'Inide', but studios can be Indie too.
Although with ori's budget, AA would probably be more accurate.
 
DynamiteCop!

DynamiteCop!

Banned
ShaDowDaNcA said:
It sure is.

www.techradar.com

Nintendo Switch nabs a former Microsoft exclusive, and two iconic indie games

Superhot and Hotline Miami live on
www.techradar.com www.techradar.com

www.geek.com

'Ori and The Blind Forest' Brings More Xbox Indie Goodness to Nintendo Switch - Geek.com

The saga of Xbox on Nintendo Switch continues. Just a few years ago It would’ve been wild to see Microsoft support one of its biggest rivals so heavily. But as the company shifts …
www.geek.com www.geek.com

www.polygon.com

Xbox indie Ori and the Blind Forest runs at 1080p and 60fps with no loading screens

Ori and the Blind Forest, the upcoming Xbox One and Windows PC release from independent game developer Moon Studios, will run at 1080p and 60fps, game director Thomas Mahler told Polygon. Mahler...
www.polygon.com www.polygon.com
Click to expand...
Stuart360 said:
Yeah Ori is an Indie game. People automatically think of a solo dev in his spare room developing a game when you say 'Inide', but studios can be Indie too.
Although with ori's budget, AA would probably be more accurate.
Click to expand...
It's not an indie game, it's an independent developer who is contracted and financed by a third party and also published by them.

An independent game is independent throughout the stack from development, to funding, to publishing.

The Witcher 3 is an indie game, Ori is not.
 
Last edited:
S0ULZB0URNE

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
DynamiteCop! said:
It's not an indie game, it's an independent developer who is contracted and financed by a third party and also published by them.

An independent game is independent throughout the stack from development, to funding, to publishing.

The Witcher 3 is an indie game, Ori is not.
Click to expand...
LOL
 
Rightisright

Rightisright

Banned
thelastword said:
So where are the developers who said they are likely to get more out of PS5? All I see here are mostly downplay PS5 quotes, not even excitement for Series X tbh.....Seems like the same MS exclusive guys to me, like the same Grannel guy, and how many other developers exactly?, who are they? and what are they working on?

Besides, both Schreier, Moore's Law is Dead and many others over twitter have expressed that there is lots of interest in PS5 over Series X, which the majority of their sources are third party studios.....As for Sony first party.....Obviously SWWS is going to put out the best graphics next gen, like they always do, so of course we want to know what they have to say...…...
Click to expand...
Considering the majority of those devs quoted worked for Sony studios they would never of even seen a XSX dev kit.
 
Rightisright

Rightisright

Banned
thelastword said:
So all the customizations and extra silicon is bullshit? So you would rather obfuscate tangible hardware that will actually make a huge difference at runtime between these consoles because you just want to push "it's simply a 10.3 vs 12.1 equation full stop?".....Got it....
Click to expand...
Lol. You do realize it's actually the XSX that has the extra silicon (APU size) and more customizations yeah?
 
Hawking Radiation

Hawking Radiation

Member
IntentionalPun said:
What in the world about my post was console warrior-ish, to the point where you decided my post was what did it for you?

Just bizarre that of all posts, me pointing out a car analogy doesn't really work is the one that made you decided "this is too much!"

Or was it me pointing out that the games will look better so it doesn't necessarily matter how we describe it? (which was me explicitly NOT being console warrior-ish)
Click to expand...
I don't know the context of the argument here but that member is right.

Neogaf (nowadays since the PS5 reveal) has become a haven for fanboys to ruin thread after thread with console warrior nonsense to the point where it's really difficult to get any sort of discussion going regarding the tech in both consoles.

I also find myself going over to Resetera to read up more on how these machines work. Coming back to this forum you have to wade through pages and pages of rubbish to get to one or two good posts.
 
Hendrick's

Hendrick's

If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
PropellerEar said:
What makes it a great video, any new insight that we don't already know?
Looking at the title iand thumbnail it looks like clickbait fanfiction.
Click to expand...
It talks about velocity architecture. With the 5 thousand threads about the PS5's I/O, it's nice to hear about the specialized hardware and software powering the Xbox. Honestly, it sounds to me like the PS5's only advantage might not be one at all.
 
SleepDoctor

SleepDoctor

Banned
VFXVeteran said:
I've sent out a request to Mod of War Mod of War to consolidate these numerous console warring threads into a single thread and remove all the new ones.

Guys, it's gotten ridiculous on both sides and needs to stop. This is the perfect example of "zealots favoring their hardware of choice". It's just not interesting or fun anymore to read these threads.
Click to expand...


I asked a couple times in the threads. Its needed since every thread turns into a shitshow.

Its just Sony fanboys basically doing damage control after all the shitposting and trolling in every xbox thread since the xsx reveal. They claimed 13, 14, and some even 15 tf for ps5....... but they got 9.2 with a overclocked gpu to 10.2.
 
S0ULZB0URNE

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
SleepDoctor said:
I asked a couple times in the threads. Its needed since every thread turns into a shitshow.

Its just Sony fanboys basically doing damage control after all the shitposting and trolling in every xbox thread since the xsx reveal. They claimed 13, 14, and some even 15 tf for ps5....... but they got 9.2 with a overclocked gpu to 10.2.
Click to expand...
A OFFICIAL link saying it's 9.2 or are you going to continue to troll?
 
M

Max_Po

Banned
wait, is this just a troll thread ? I don't see " Developers "

just one guy who worked on something relevant decades ago.
 
DynamiteCop!

DynamiteCop!

Banned
ShaDowDaNcA said:
10.28 TF's/2230ghz is the base speed.
Click to expand...
b0c050d21155ab4cd75097d1beb0520a.jpg
 
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