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[FrankWza]

The proprietary SSD - how it works and what it delivers
From the very first PlayStation 5 reveal in Wired, Sony has spent a lot of time evangelising its SSD - the solid-state storage solution that will be transformative not just in terms of loading times, but in how games will be able to deliver bigger, more detailed worlds and much more dynamic use of memory. With an impressive 5.5GB/s of raw bandwidth alongside hardware accelerated decoding (boosting effective bandwidth to around 8-9GB/s), PlayStation 5's SSD is clearly a point of pride for Mark Cerny and his team.


I copy pasted fromeugamer. This is from themarch deep dive. So you can choose to ignore what the PS5 architect is saying but I won’t.

the seller that was trying to sell you his product said things out of context and real world scenarios ? No way :O Then it must be so, since he said it.

That Unreal Engine footage is a damn tech demo, not a game. And right after we got leaks it could run on a laptop with a 2080, which was quickly deleted after, probably because it doesnt suit the narative that ps5's magical ssd touched by alladin is just bullshit.

I cant imagine that something more ridiculous than fixating on the storage device can exist. Everything else at least could have been viable in the real world, the ram, the cpu, the gpu. But we had to choose the drive instead =))

yup, the eBay seller who’s trying to sell me a grilled cheese sandwich with an image of Elvis Presley. Or is it the guy selling a used undershirt with a ps5-shaped sweat stain?
im gonna quote the post of mine that you failed to address that quotes for you, the article that covers the deep dive. You should take a look at eurogamer.
When you get a chance, send me a link to where I can purchase that PS5 SSD.

 

[The Leaked Truths]

Stil cant belive posters dont understand streaming data and how that would effect performance if going very high details and textures.

it does not matter anyway, Dymnamic 4k is this gen, but Spiderman never dipped below native 4k for 60 FPS, and its effectively open world as a large cty.

So I really dont know where the expectation differences are going to be, especially the resolution posts are laughable.

In 2 months time GAF will be arguing about quality of reflection in a puddle you pass in 2 seconds of gameplay.

Enjoy the games, anyone expecting to see differences will be disappointed, especially 3rd party.

Any game can be native 4k and 60 FPS if dev wants it to be. Or they go RT and effects. Choices/

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

 

[The Leaked Truths]

Should be allowed to vote both nobody wants a slow console

That's a great way to show the World or at least NeoGAF how clueless PlayStation Fans can be!!! Thanks for showing us

 

[FrankWza]

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

When demons souls remake is out, you should compare the ps5 and x versions. See which one comes out on top.

 

[geordiemp]

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

 

[prinz_valium]

Series X
More powerful and faster load times, lol

 

[Edgelord79]

As a PC user that has both, I would choose the SSD for gaming only if he power differential is as slight as it appears between these two consoles. If the power differential results in large framerates differences (i.e. 10 or more) then no to the SSD.

It's too early to say though. I think it also depends on how games are optimized.

 

[The Leaked Truths]

Instead of posting these worthless 1st Grade analyses you should go to Jim Ryan and lick his Boots

 

[The Leaked Truths]

When demons souls remake is out, you should compare the ps5 and x versions. See which one comes out on top.

Demon's Souls will be released on the XBox Series X? I thought it is an exclusive to the PlayStation 5 and PC.

 

[FrankWza]

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

When demons souls remake is out, you should compare the ps5 and x versions. See which one comes out on top.

Demon's Souls will be released on the XBox Series X? I thought it is an exclusive to the PlayStation 5 and PC.

Good job.

 

[DForce]

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

Shadow of the Tomb Raider
RTX 3080: 50fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


The Division
RTX 3080: 60fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 50fps


Metro
RTX 3080: 35fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 30fps


Assassin Creed
RTX 3080: 55fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


Red Dead Redemption 2
RTX 3080: 70fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 60fps


These graphics cards are mower powerful than current gen consoles and they're not maintaining a the target frame-rate. Guess how more demanding next gen games are going to be?

 

[geordiemp]

Instead of posting these worthless 1st Grade analyses you should go to Jim Ryan and lick his Boots

Shadow of the Tomb Raider
RTX 3080: 50fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


The Division
RTX 3080: 60fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 50fps


Metro
RTX 3080: 35fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 30fps


Assassin Creed
RTX 3080: 55fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


Red Dead Redemption 2
RTX 3080: 70fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 60fps


These graphics cards are mower powerful than current gen consoles and they're not maintaining a the target frame-rate. Guess how more demanding next gen games are going to be?

Not worth teh effort, he is just trolling, only worth a craig

 

[The Leaked Truths]

Shadow of the Tomb Raider
RTX 3080: 50fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


The Division
RTX 3080: 60fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 50fps


Metro
RTX 3080: 35fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 30fps


Assassin Creed
RTX 3080: 55fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 40fps


Red Dead Redemption 2
RTX 3080: 70fps
RTX 2080 Ti: 60fps


These graphics cards are mower powerful than current gen consoles and they're not maintaining a the target frame-rate. Guess how more demanding next gen games are going to be?

Thanks for posting these Comparisons but I will wait and see how 1st Party Games perform on the XBox Series X before I judge. I could imagine that 1st Party Games for the XBox Series X will be highly optimised for the XBox Series X.

 

[The Leaked Truths]

Not worth teh effort, he is just trolling, only worth a craig

Don't forget to let me know how Jim Ryan's Boots tasted!!! I could imagine they taste a little bit like Dynamic 4K which actually would fit exactly your taste Thanks

 

[geordiemp]

Don't forget to let me know how Jim Ryan's Boots tasted!!! I could imagine they taste a little bit like Dynamic 4K which actually would fit exactly your taste Thanks

I just remind trolls of craig as I cant be bothered to engage with them. So hear you are, OPTIMISED for XSX

 

[theddub]

I just remind trolls of craig as I cant be bothered to engage with them. So hear you are, OPTIMISED for XSX

It'll be real funny if in the end that, Halo Infinite, a 60fps open world with Ray tracing game, ends up being more techically impressive than any game on SSDStaytion5.

 

[prinz_valium]

I just remind trolls of craig as I cant be bothered to engage with them. So hear you are, OPTIMISED for XSX

Spamming a topic with the same bad meme over and over again?

It's weekend. Go out for once and have some fun.

 

[geordiemp]

Spamming a topic with the same bad meme over and over again?

It's weekend. Go out for once and have some fun.

Your here trolling, so have another...

 

[Lethal01]

That Unreal Engine footage is a damn tech demo, not a game. And right after we got leaks it could run on a laptop with a 2080, which was quickly deleted after, probably because it doesnt suit the narative that ps5's magical ssd touched by alladin is just bullshit.

It "could" run on mobile... If you downgrade it hard enough. Flight Simulator could run on ancient hardware if they took out a bunch of features too.
The point is that without the SSD it would look worse and a faster SSD allows for more detailed assets for the GPU to render.

 

[Lethal01]

As a PC user that has both

PC gamers currently do not have a way to get what the upcoming consoles have in terms of the storage architecture, RTX IO will probably allow for it but that won't be out for several months if I remember correctly.

 

[Memorabilia]

We know Series X definitely has a somewhat more powerful CPU/GPU combo, a larger SSD, and possibly a faster booting SSD as well. That last part is particularly interesting if it holds true.

 

[Memorabilia]

Should be allowed to vote both nobody wants a slow console

Stop making sense. Console Warriorz are working hard in here.

 

[geordiemp]

We know Series X definitely has a somewhat more powerful CPU/GPU combo, a larger SSD, and possibly a faster booting SSD as well. That last part is particularly interesting if it holds true.

The power is scary for sure, i just dont know how ps5 can compete.

 

[Edgelord79]

PC gamers currently do not have a way to get what the upcoming consoles have in terms of the storage architecture, RTX IO will probably allow for it but that won't be out for several months if I remember correctly.

I already play almost instantly. Things load up almost instantly. The PS5/Xbox doesn't have anything at all on PC except for it's ease of use under a television (it's better HDR implementation). Making a SSD 5 seconds faster doesn't change that. I could play on a standard 7200 RPM drive and get better fps than on either next gen console with my hardware (I have nvme though). So what exactly am I missing here except some market-speak secret sauce mumbo jumbo?

 

[Lethal01]

I already play almost instantly. Things load up almost instantly. The PS5/Xbox doesn't have anything at all on PC except for it's ease of use under a television (it's better HDR implementation). Making a SSD 5 seconds faster doesn't change that. I could play on a standard 7200 RPM drive and get better fps than on either next gen console with my hardware (I have nvme though). So what exactly am I missing here except some market-speak secret sauce mumbo jumbo?

There is nothing magical or mysterious, You are playing games built around having to run on an ancient HDD and would never really try to take advantage of an SSD outside of shorter loading screens.

Would you get the save framerate on star citizen?


Direct Memory access isn't some mythical technology either, We know that most modern GPU's outside of some server optimized stuff Don't really support.


There is no mumbo jumbo, like I said RTX IO and Direct Storage are literally made to remedy this on PC.. Are you saying that they are just pretending there is a problem and then pretending to fix it?

 

[LarknThe4th]

Faster load times are a game changer so the PS5 seems great for that(although the series X isnt a slouch either) and the backwards compatibility that Microsoft are offering is also a game changer

I think at the end of the day though there wont be much difference between the two once we start seeing games like Fable, Avowed, GOW2 and Demon Souls

 

[Edgelord79]

There is nothing magical or mysterious, You are playing games built around having to run on an ancient HDD and would never really try to take advantage of an SSD outside of load times.

Direct Memory access isn't some mythical technology either, We know that most modern GPU's outside of some server optimized stuff Don't really support.

I understand the tech quite well actually, however to be clear, every console launch is prefaced by "new" tech and "mind blowing" leaps in performance. I'm skeptical because I've seen mind blowing performnce already on PC. Show me.

 

[Von Hugh]

20 % more of something that has tangible effects versus 100 % more of something that might have more tangible effects.

But I guess I'll see when the multiplat games come out.

 

[Riky]

20 % more of something that has tangible effects versus 100 % more of something that might have more tangible effects.

But I guess I'll see when the multiplat games come out.

As well as much faster Ram bandwidth and a faster CPU.....it's obvious how this is going to go.

Which is why there is a campaign to discredit DF before the comparisons arrive.

 

[FrankWza]

I already play almost instantly. Things load up almost instantly. The PS5/Xbox doesn't have anything at all on PC except for it's ease of use under a television (it's better HDR implementation). Making a SSD 5 seconds faster doesn't change that. I could play on a standard 7200 RPM drive and get better fps than on either next gen console with my hardware (I have nvme though). So what exactly am I missing here except some market-speak secret sauce mumbo jumbo?

cerny addressing this in the deep dive is about as much “market speak” as an F1 engineer explaining how he just got a V6 to output the same 800 horsepower next to a V8 that has 800 horsepower. The proof is in the performance.

bigger engine dont always mean mo powah

 

[theddub]

cerny addressing this in the deep dive is about as much “market speak” as an F1 engineer explaining how he just got a V6 to output the same 800 horsepower next to a V8 that has 800 horsepower. The proof is in the performance.

bigger engine dont always mean mo powah

Bad analogy
TFs in this case equals the interim performance measurement, until we get multiplats, which is valid because they are both RDNA2 architecture, meaning we are , close enough, comparing apples to apples.

For example Nvidia doesnt release the higher TF 2080ti and say "oops" looks like the lower TF 2060(both Turing architecture) outperforms our higher TF 2080ti, our bad

 

[FrankWza]

Bad analogy
TFs in this case equals the interim performance measurement, until we get multiplats, which is valid because they are both RDNA2 architecture, meaning we are , close enough, comparing apples to apples.

For example Nvidia doesnt release the higher TF 2080ti and say "oops" looks like the lower TF 2060(both Turing architecture) outperforms our higher TF 2080ti, our bad

It’s a perfect analogy. Because there are other components to consider. Just like there are other parts and dynamics in those cars to be able to put out the same horsepower. And every part in both consoles is predictable. EXCEPT the SSD in the PS5,which nobody has any idea of when it comes to what it is capable of and what it will be able to do for the PS5s performance. Cerny does, I’ll go with his explanation over people in here still mentioning faster load times.

 

[theddub]

It’s a perfect analogy. Because there are other components to consider. Just like there are other parts and dynamics in those cars to be able to put out the same horsepower. And every part in both consoles is predictable. EXCEPT the SSD in the PS5,which nobody has any idea of when it comes to what it is capable of and what it will be able to do for the PS5s performance. Cerny does, I’ll go with his explanation over people in here still mentioning faster load times.

SSD helps with steaming in assets not the direct rendering, computation of the assets that are there. It can help make those assets available, but you're limited by your GPU for whether you can render them all on screen with performance.

For example, streaming in said assets from old hard drive tech would have been the bottleneck now the bottleneck is really going to be the PS5s GPU to meet the rendering performance of XSX.....it's not going to increase gpu performance on the ps5

 

[Edgelord79]

cerny addressing this in the deep dive is about as much “market speak” as an F1 engineer explaining how he just got a V6 to output the same 800 horsepower next to a V8 that has 800 horsepower. The proof is in the performance.

bigger engine dont always mean mo powah

Which you have absolutely zero proof of yet. So let's just wait and see shall we. Could be great, but if developers aren't going to utilize it then it's pretty much meh.

 

[FrankWza]

SSD helps with steaming in assets not the direct rendering, computation of the assets that are there. It can help make those assets available, but you're limited by your GPU for whether you can render them all on screen with performance.

For example, streaming in said assets from said hard drive could have been the bottleneck now it's really going to be the PS5s GPU

Which you have absolutely zero proof of yet. So let's just wait and see shall we. Could be great, but if developers aren't going to utilize it then it's pretty much meh.

Im going by what Cerny says. That’s it. I’mnot claiming to know anything. I’m sayin, the guy is the architect of this system. The companyis coming off of a generation that gave us the secondhighest selling console of all time. I’m gonna choose to believe them and him. But yes, I agree, we’ll see.

 

[Edgelord79]

Im going by what Cerny says. That’s it. I’mnot claiming to know anything. I’m sayin, the guy is the architect of this system. The companyis coming off of a generation that gave us the secondhighest selling console of all time. I’m gonna choose to believe them and him. But yes, I agree, we’ll see.

Fair enough. One quick point though, the PS4 did so well not because of hardware, but because of its games. In fact, it's hardware was inferior to Microsoft's. Although Cerny is there architect, he is also a company man. He touted the 3D audio as being something incredible, but 3D audio had been around for a while and there are limitations without proper hardware setup. We shall see, but I suspect the real world truth is somewhere in there middle.

 

[Boglin]

SSD helps with steaming in assets not the direct rendering, computation of the assets that are there. It can help make those assets available, but you're limited by your GPU for whether you can render them all on screen with performance.

For example, streaming in said assets from old hard drive tech would have been the bottleneck now the bottleneck is really going to be the PS5s GPU to meet the rendering performance of XSX.....it's not going to increase gpu performance on the ps5

Since you seem to know where all the bottlenecks lie, would 500MB/s have been good enough for the SSD or did it need to be at least 2.4GB/s?
Do IOPs matter for asset streaming? How about latency?

 

[FrankWza]

Im going by what Cerny says. That’s it. I’mnot claiming to know anything. I’m sayin, the guy is the architect of this system. The companyis coming off of a generation that gave us the secondhighest selling console of all time. I’m gonna choose to believe them and him. But yes, I agree, we’ll see.

some points that I’m referring to I’ll copy paste below.

- the solid-state storage solution that will be transformative not just in terms of loading times, but in how games will be able to deliver bigger, more detailed worlds and much more dynamic use of memory. With an impressive 5.5GB/s of raw bandwidth alongside hardware accelerated decoding (boosting effective bandwidth to around 8-9GB/s)

-to get instant access to urgent data, more of it needs to be stored in RAM on the current generation consoles - opening the door to a huge efficiency saving for next-gen. The SSD alleviates a lot of the burden simply because data can be requested as it's needed as opposed to caching a bunch of it that the console may need... but may not.

Fair enough. One quick point though, the PS4 did so well not because of hardware, but because of its games. In fact, it's hardware was inferior to Microsoft's. Although Cerny is there architect, he is also a company man. He touted the 3D audio as being something incredible, but 3D audio had been around for a while and there are limitations without proper hardware setup. We shall see, but I suspect the real world truth is somewhere in there middle.

It was? I know the mid gen console(one x vs pro)was but not at launch.
3d audio has been around for a while but not native to consoles without an adapter or mixamp. It’s looking like you’ll be able to plug any headset into the dual sense and get 3D audio which is pretty cool. DualShock 4 output stereo to headphones. I know xb1 had the atmos app but I’m not sure how it works

 

[Stealth_Cobra]

I think sony's approach is going to pay off rather fast, as having a 5.5GB/s disk speed vs a 2.4GB/s disk speed is quite the difference, and it will allow devs to basically fetch stuff so fast from the HD that they don't have as many bottlenecks in terms of loading new zones / cells / textures / models / etc. Should improve everything from load distance, loading times, level of details of objects ,etc.

While having more raw power is good, I'm pretty sure most games will end up running at 4k 60 Fps anyway on both consoles without much compromises, and I doubt most people will be able to tell the games apart in terms of graphical fidelity... Much easyer to see the difference between a loading time that's twice as long than seeing a couple more pixels at 4K and a couple more FPS when the human eye isn't even supposed to be able to see above 30FPS. Also believe many Sony exclusives will be able to push the faster HDD to deliver stuff that would not necessarily be possible on the other platform, like let's say ratchet and clank's use of dimensional portal basically loading a new level every time you enter one...

 

[theddub]

Since you seem to know where all the bottlenecks lie, would 500MB/s have been good enough for the SSD or did it need to be at least 2.4GB/s?
Do IOPs matter for asset streaming? How about latency?

Depends on the game, context.

What renders those assets on the screen is it the SSD or the GPU or some of both? (Rhetorical)

In contrast, what provides those assets...is it, and the respective bandwidth, the SSD, RAM or caches? The SSD is in the memory heiarchy, it's in the business of providing assets not processing or rendering them on the screen.

Provided the same assets, the XSX GPU will outperform the ps5s GPU.

Now the question is where is the bottleneck? It will depend. I was postulating that most of the time...it's gonna be the gpu as Nvidia is already hitting , in amphere performance, much higher performing GPUs.

 

[geordiemp]

Depends on the game, context.

What renders those assets on the screen is it the SSD or the GPU or some of both? (Rhetorical)

In contrast, what provides those assets...is it, and the respective bandwidth, the SSD, RAM or caches? The SSD is in the memory heiarchy, it's in the business of providing assets not processing or rendering them on the screen.

Provided the same assets, the XSX GPU will outperform the ps5s GPU.

They will be roughly the same. GPU wise.

Its more than about TF, you will find that out soon enough when mS decide to show a modern game on XSX.



Just keep saying XSX is much more powerful actually, it will be fun to watch.

 

[theddub]

They will be roughly the same. GPU wise.

Its more than about TF, you will find that out soon enough when mS decide to show a modern game on XSX.

John hasn't seen anything other than Minecraft, which Ray tracing is much more advanced and computationally intensive than what he's seen on Spiderman.


Interpretation...mine...he's saying wait because he doesn't know and we don't either.

 

[Lysandros]

SSD helps with steaming in assets not the direct rendering, computation of the assets that are there. It can help make those assets available, but you're limited by your GPU for whether you can render them all on screen with performance.

For example, streaming in said assets from old hard drive tech would have been the bottleneck now the bottleneck is really going to be the PS5s GPU to meet the rendering performance of XSX.....it's not going to increase gpu performance on the ps5

Are you aware of the fact that if PS5's SSD/IO is used as intended as described in Road to PS5, the GPU will have to render only what is in the player's/character's vision right? Rendering only 120 degree of game logic, geometry, assets etc. out of 360, thus saving significant amount of RAM, bandwidth and cycles. I have hard time seeing how this doesn't improve performance.

 

[MrFunSocks]

It's been touched on several times in this thread (I don't think I've posted here, but its been a long week so... lol) but:

1. The paper specs seem to favor the XSX at first glance. I completely agree with that, sans SSD and Audio stuff.

why do you think the PS5 has an advantage in audio? The much hyped tempest engine is just Sony not wanting to pay for Dolby Atmos. The Xbox One has 3D audio right now. The Series S/X have the same audio capabilities as the PS5.

Sorry, but all I can see are excuses from a PlayStation Fan of why his beloved Toy can't render the Pixels in native 4K@60FPS even with 1st Party Games like Demon's Souls.

Dynamic 4K@30FPS is not what I expect from Next-Gen Consoles at least not from 1st Party Games and this also applies to the XBox Series X!!!

To be honest 1440p from launch games is alarming. Usually the launch games are essentially previous gen games in high resolution with some graphical bells and whistles, so them not even hitting 4K is not good. As the generation goes on the resolution usually drops as devs start wringing more and more of the power from the consoles, stressing them harder.

 

[MrFunSocks]

Im going by what Cerny says. That’s it. I’mnot claiming to know anything. I’m sayin, the guy is the architect of this system. The companyis coming off of a generation that gave us the secondhighest selling console of all time. I’m gonna choose to believe them and him. But yes, I agree, we’ll see.

I’m sorry but do you really think Cerny is anything more than a Sony PR person? He’s not going to come out and say “yeh the Xbox is more powerful”. He’s going to shill every single thing about his employers console. That’s his job. He’s paid by Sony.

Don’t believe a word that any of these company spokespeople say. They’re literally paid shills. Goes for Spencer and every MS employee too.

 

[The Leaked Truths]

why do you think the PS5 has an advantage in audio? The much hyped tempest engine is just Sony not wanting to pay for Dolby Atmos. The Xbox One has 3D audio right now. The Series S/X have the same audio capabilities as the PS5.



To be honest 1440p from launch games is alarming. Usually the launch games are essentially previous gen games in high resolution with some graphical bells and whistles, so them not even hitting 4K is not good. As the generation goes on the resolution usually drops as devs start wringing more and more of the power from the consoles, stressing them harder.

Agreed And using that Tempest Audio 3D thing which no one ever heard something before but is now the best Audio Tech on Earth according to PlayStation Fans was a huge Mistake!!!

Because of this Movies and Games will not support Dolby Atmos on the PlayStation 5 which is the best Audio Tech you can have on this Planet.

I would always recommend Dolby Atmos. Dolby Atmos is King

 

[Razvedka]

why do you think the PS5 has an advantage in audio? The much hyped tempest engine is just Sony not wanting to pay for Dolby Atmos. The Xbox One has 3D audio right now. The Series S/X have the same audio capabilities as the PS5.



To be honest 1440p from launch games is alarming. Usually the launch games are essentially previous gen games in high resolution with some graphical bells and whistles, so them not even hitting 4K is not good. As the generation goes on the resolution usually drops as devs start wringing more and more of the power from the consoles, stressing them harder.

The level of hardware resources on die dedicated to Tempest are pretty beefy. Iirc we know what both boxes can output here and PS5 has more audio processing grunt. Combine that with their pedigree in the field + devs coming out and praising Tempest and I don't think it's an unreasonable conclusion.

 

[MrFunSocks]

The level of hardware resources on die dedicated to Tempest are pretty beefy. Iirc we know what both boxes can output here and PS5 has more audio processing grunt. Combine that with their pedigree in the field + devs coming out and praising Tempest and I don't think it's an unreasonable conclusion.

Does the PS5 have more audio processing grunt? What can it do that the Xbox can’t? Source?

Sony’s pedigree in the field? You think Sony have more pedigree than Dolby? Which devs have come out and praised Sony’s solution over Dolby Atmos or what Microsoft have? Microsoft have taken audio seriously for generations whereas Sony haven’t.

 

[theddub]

Are you aware of the fact that if PS5's SSD/IO is used as intended as described in Road to PS5, the GPU will have to render only what is in the player's/character's vision right? Rendering only 120 degree of game logic, geometry, assets etc. out of 360, thus saving significant amount of RAM, bandwidth and cycles. I have hard time seeing how this doesn't improve performance.

Yes culling is a common industry practice and can vary how and where it's done and is taken further than what the ps5 will do with mesh shaders on the XSX, which is a more advanced combination or consolidation of the ps5s geometry engine and primitive shaders. Mesh shaders is where AMD and Nvidia landed, after what we see AMD used in ps5 with the geometry engine and primitive shaders. Mesh shaders simplifies the pipeline and may, oversimplification, help developers cull even better:

Microsoft on XSX mesh shaders: watch video at 24:50 mark:

Referenced article: https://www.pcgamer.com/amp/xbox-series-x-dev-teases-juicy-amd-rdna-2-gpu-performance/

Mesh shading demo from Nvidia:



"Even after occlusion culling a significant amount of triangles can exist."

Introduction to Turing Mesh Shaders | NVIDIA Technical Blog

Turing introduces a new programmable geometric shading pipeline, mesh shaders,, enabling threads to cooperatively generate compact meshes on the chip.

developer.nvidia.com

And more from MS:

Coming to DirectX 12— Mesh Shaders and Amplification Shaders: Reinventing the Geometry Pipeline - DirectX Developer Blog

D3D12 is adding two new shader stages: the Mesh Shader and the Amplification Shader. These additions will streamline the rendering pipeline, while simultaneously boosting flexibility and efficiency. In this new and improved pre-rasterization pipeline, Mesh and Amplification Shaders will...

devblogs.microsoft.com

 

[Lysandros]

Yes culling is a common industry practice and can vary how and where it's done and is taken further than what the ps5 will do with mesh shaders on the XSX, which is a more advanced combination or consolidation of the ps5s geometry engine and primitive shaders. Mesh shaders is where AMD and Nvidia landed, after what we see AMD used in ps5 with the geometry engine and primitive shaders. Mesh shaders simplifies the pipeline and may, oversimplification, help developers cull even better:

Microsoft on XSX mesh shaders: watch video at 24:50 mark:

Referenced article: https://www.pcgamer.com/amp/xbox-series-x-dev-teases-juicy-amd-rdna-2-gpu-performance/

Mesh shading demo from Nvidia:



"Even after occlusion culling a significant amount of triangles can exist."

Introduction to Turing Mesh Shaders | NVIDIA Technical Blog

Turing introduces a new programmable geometric shading pipeline, mesh shaders,, enabling threads to cooperatively generate compact meshes on the chip.

developer.nvidia.com

And more from MS:

Coming to DirectX 12— Mesh Shaders and Amplification Shaders: Reinventing the Geometry Pipeline - DirectX Developer Blog

D3D12 is adding two new shader stages: the Mesh Shader and the Amplification Shader. These additions will streamline the rendering pipeline, while simultaneously boosting flexibility and efficiency. In this new and improved pre-rasterization pipeline, Mesh and Amplification Shaders will...

devblogs.microsoft.com

I was not talking about Geometry Engine or Mesh Shader culling or even fustrum culling, did you watch Road to PS5? Cerny talks about the 'entire game logic' + assets being loaded and discarded (around 4-5GB of data) at 0.5 second as the player/character turns. This technique is enabled by the very fast/low latency, custom SSD/IO complex.