Support NeoGAF

[Draxon Gamer]

The reason why turn based is such a risk now is because Jrpgs never actually in most cases evolved turn based gameplay. Wrpgs did it in the early 90's and then dropped it for action or real-time tactics. TB Jrpgs then were still paying the same as they were 5 years before and 10 years after.

Square Enix doesn't want to innovate with a new TB system and feels that if they due TB they have to use some version of what they used to use in the past and I think that is why Square keeps choosing the DMC route.

Capcom learned they had to stop being scared after they were in trouble ten years ago, Squares going to have to learn the same thing.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I have no idea what a Honkai Star Rail is but just going by the image saying that it's a mobile game, I reckon most of it's from mtx.

It is Genshin Impact, except turn-based. Still a Gacha game designed around lootboxes and grinding for that extra 10 character roll chance for a 5 star character. Much like Genshin, it didn't make money because it is a quality game. It made money because of whales.

 

[Pejo]

People aren't playing Honkai for its turnbased gameplay. They are buying it because its a mobile gacha game.

I have no idea what a Honkai Star Rail is but just going by the image saying that it's a mobile game, I reckon most of it's from mtx.

Oh yea because gacha and microtransactions are a gameplay genre. It's fine to not personally like turn-based games, but don't project that there's no market for it.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Oh yea because gacha and microtransactions are a gameplay genre. It's fine to not personally like turn-based games, but don't project that there's no market for it.

I love turn-based games. But I am not blind enough to use a shitty MTX/Gambling game to prove a non-existent point.

 

[Aenima]

Yea, no modern audiences like turn based combat mirite?

FF16 is not a waifu collector gatcha mobile game. That money dont come from sales, come from microtransactions. Genshin was doing crazy numbers too and has action combat. Also turn based combat fits much better the mobile audience because playing action games on touch screens simply sucks.

 

[Pejo]

I love turn-based games. But I am not blind enough to use a shitty MTX/Gambling game to prove a non-existent point.

FF16 is not a waifu collector gatcha mobile game. That money dont come from sales, come from microtransactions.

Nobody would be doing the microtransactions if they didn't like the game.

 

[adamsapple]

Oh yea because gacha and microtransactions are a gameplay genre. It's fine to not personally like turn-based games, but don't project that there's no market for it.

The fact that your go-to example is a mobile gacha game is indication enough on how much market there is for it.

Nobody would be doing the microtransactions if they didn't like the game.

Are you familiar with how "whales" work in MTX games?

 

[Dr. Claus]

Nobody would be doing the microtransactions if they didn't like the game.

You clearly don't understand basic human psychology and gambling addiction.

Also the fact that you immediately jumped to this instead of Octopath Traveller II, Bravely Default II, Live A Live, SaGa remasters, Pixel Remasters, or others shows how little of a market there is for turnbased. Its a niche genre. It has always been a niche genre. Just like CRPGs. That is fine, we still get those games. We still get amazing games at that.

Do better.

 

[Captain Toad]

I'm not gonna watch it because I have seen enough but....is it good?

Looks to be one of the best games ever made. Looks like complete trash.

Those are the two, and only two, opinions, I'm seeing.

 

[Pejo]

The fact that your go-to example is a mobile gacha game is indication enough on how much market there is for it.

Hey it's not my fault that no publishers are putting out big budget turn based RPGs with high quality other than gacha game devs. The best we get these days are small budget/low risk games like Octopath and the slew of bargain bin stuff S-E put out over the year like Various Daylife, Diofield Chronicles, etc.

If we saw a high quality, properly marketed turn-based game, I have a feeling it would find its market with no issues. Right now that market is being satisfied by Star Rail.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Hey it's not my fault that no publishers are putting out big budget turn based RPGs with high quality other than gacha game devs. The best we get these days are small budget/low risk games like Octopath and the slew of bargain bin stuff S-E put out over the year like Various Daylife, Diofield Chronicles, etc.

If we saw a high quality, properly marketed turn-based game, I have a feeling it would find its market with no issues. Right now that market is being satisfied by Star Rail.

You are absolutely delusional.

 

[AutumnLeaves]

Still don't know how I feel about it to be honest. I feel like it's trying to do so much at once and it becomes chaotic. Will definitely give it a shot though.

 

[Fake]

You are absolutely delusional.

He got a point. Being a gacha or not have nothing to do with the gameplay at all.
And being a turn based game do not make the game less enjoyable. The last DQ game was pretty good.

I seeing so much particles in this combat, its pretty no doubt, but only when the game launch we can compare. I expect something as good as GoW 2018. IMO.

 

[Raonak]

As someone who loves FF and DMC, this feels like a love letter to me

day -1

 

[Dr. Claus]

He got a point. Being a gacha or not have nothing to do with the gameplay at all.
And being a turn based game do not make the game less enjoyable. The last DQ game was pretty good.

I seeing so much particles in this combat, its pretty no doubt, but only when the game launch we can compare. I expect something as good as GoW 2018. IMO.

Being a gacha indicates why the game has earned as much money as it did. It has nothing to do with it being a turn-based product. Nor did I say anything about turn-based games making games overall less enjoyable.

Honkai is a weak, rushed out product with a mediocre game play loop that has only earned as much as it did due to gambling and gacha mechanics. Compare tis mechanics to DQ11, Octopath 2, Bravely Default II, etc and you can easily see it is a far, far weaker product. It isn't AAA, high-quality, or "properly marketed". Its just a sad attempt by someone trying to prove a non-existent point.

 

[Danjin44]

Yea, no modern audiences like turn based combat mirite?

Not everyone wants Chinese gotcha online only F2P games. I mean I love turn based RPG but I rather play games like Octopath or SMT over this.

I‘m also can enjoy ARPG and to me FFXVI combat looks super good to me

 

[Fake]

Being a gacha indicates why the game has earned as much money as it did.

So, they earned that money because is a gacha?

 

[Alan Silvestro]

It needs sparks.

 

[Danjin44]

So, they earned that money because is a gacha?

I'm pretty sure most people who in to that game care less about the turn based combat and more about gacha stuff.

 

[Dr. Claus]

So, they earned that money because is a gacha?

 

[Hero_Select]

This looks... fine. I'm getting it regardless but eh, Idk why I'm not really feeling it.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

I hear you…normally I would have brushed off your comment if it was 95% of the other posters on Gaf, but you’ve always been respectful to me on here, so it’s only right I hear you out. So you say you have personal issues with Square Enix, what’s that about?

well, I think everyone has a Publisher and/or IP that means a lot to them.

...i still remember the moment I put the FFIX disc (without knowing anything about this franchise or even the term J-RPG).

and boom! it was such a mindblowing spectacle that transformed me in very profound way.... but also my appreciation of the medium as the most complex and powerful one. So.....long history short:

When you see Square-Soft trend of releases even taking into consideration The Spirit Within movie...They were building such level of prestige and their ambition was unparalleled.... they flew to close to sun...and it's a shame Square Enix is not even in the same ballpark.

 

[NightmareFarm]

People hating because of the battle system…some of these dummies are going to miss out on an amazing experience because of it too.

There is so much to praise about this game and FF purists are STILL hung up on it being action based. Complete BS. Just let it go...

Funny since XV hardly got any hate with it's action based combat system that strays even further from the old style of play than this one. At least in this game the focus is around elemental magic like the old games not warping which had nothing to do any mainline game prior to XV.

 

[NightmareFarm]

I got tired while watching the gameplay of a game for the first time. The enemies just won't die. It saddens me to see only a handful of people concerned about the new direction of Final Fantasy. I don't understand what sets it apart from an ordinary action game, besides the boring combat.

It's not for you anymore and that's fine.

 

[GenericUser]

Looks good

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

I got tired while watching the gameplay of a game for the first time. The enemies just won't die. It saddens me to see only a handful of people concerned about the new direction of Final Fantasy. I don't understand what sets it apart from an ordinary action game, besides the boring combat.

I'm sorry I've been concerned about the "new" direction of Final Fantasy since Square destroyed the series with trash like XIII, XV, and VIIR. I'm glad XVI looks like a game made for adults.

 

[cash_longfellow]

well, I think everyone has a Publisher and/or IP that means a lot to them.

...i still remember the moment I put the FFIX disc (without knowing anything about this franchise or even the term J-RPG).

and boom! it was such a mindblowing spectacle that transformed me in very profound way.... but also my appreciation of the medium as the most complex and powerful one. So.....long history short:

When you see Square-Soft trend of releases even taking into consideration The Spirit Within movie...They were building such level of prestige and their ambition was unparalleled.... they flew to close to sun...and it's a shame Square Enix is not even in the same ballpark.

Again, respect…Final Fantasy 9 spinning up with the kazoo in the intro or whatever else that f’n instrument was on the main screen, nothing will match that. I get where you are coming from.

Square Soft was my childhood. I grew up on early FF games, with FF2 on snes being my first pre order ever… from Electronics Boutique (saved up for a whole summer of mowing lawns).

But man (or not man, no disrespect..pride month lol)…those days are long gone. We have to appreciate what we have. You said a 90+…but not only is that number tough to hit for something like Final Fantasy, because of nostalgia…but we are also forgetting an 85-90 is a god damn amazing score.

I respect your opinion fully, and I truly do understand it, but I hope you drop your guard and give the game a shot with a blank slate in your mind…understanding that the industry isn’t what it was, but willing to appreciate it for something it is .

Buttttt if not, I still respect that too. Opinions are what make us unique as people!

 

[cash_longfellow]

There is so much to praise about this game and FF purists are STILL hung up on it being action based. Complete BS. Just let it go...

Funny since XV hardly got any hate with it's action based combat system that strays even further from the old style of play than this one. At least in this game the focus is around elemental magic like the old games not warping which had nothing to do any mainline game prior to XV.

I’m with you completely…I was there at FF1 on NES…I’ve adapted, I just hope others are as willing as I am to adapt!

 

[Dutchy]

I much prefer the old games and combat system but this looks kinda cool to play. But I do hope you can tone down visual cue's. Shit looks epileptic.

 

[xellos2099alpha]

There is so much to praise about this game and FF purists are STILL hung up on it being action based. Complete BS. Just let it go...

Funny since XV hardly got any hate with it's action based combat system that strays even further from the old style of play than this one. At least in this game the focus is around elemental magic like the old games not warping which had nothing to do any mainline game prior to XV.

They are as stubborn as post sunnder world Emet.

 

[Kataploom]

Seems like Square is really pulling those preorders, Zelda effect hasn't ended yet and I don't see it ending anytime soon, even non-gamers are laughing at memes on Facebook lol. But TBF, I'd get the game if it was on PC, I feel like I kinda can trust Square Enix on day one release

 

[ANDS]

If this is more than a well made but bog standard action game I'll eat my hat.

People are sleeping on this game.

Top 5 FF no less.

How can people be "sleeping" on a game that isn't out yet?

 

[Larxia]

Yea, no modern audiences like turn based combat mirite?

Most people playing these mobile gacha games are really a different thing...

I played Genshin for a while, because I liked the visual, the exploration etc, but I gave up a few months ago, a lot of it was extremely frustrating. The daily limitation, not being able to play as you want / when you want, everything feeling like a job, the insane grind, the amount of money people are willing to put into this...

Everytime I went to some places talking about these problems, reddit, discord etc, I always got rejected and people laughed at me, they defend all of the worst practices and don't see what's wrong with it.

All of this to say that, it really seem like these people aren't even really gamers, you can really tell they never played a "normal" game without all of this grind and awful practices. They're just mobile users who play this to follow the current trend, but they don't care about the gameplay, they just want to unlock the new popular characters and that's it. It could have the worst gameplay ever, it would still be successful if they have pretty characters and lot of marketing, it's a really strange thing.

 

[DoktorCoktor]

What's that!? More footage of Final Game of Thrones: A Witcher's Fantasy (Featuring Dante from Devil May Cry)!? Oh goodie! Pffft

Persona 3: Reload, FFVII: Rebirth, FFIX Remake, DQIII HD 2D, Dragon Quest XII and Dragon's Dogma 2 can't come soon enough.

 

[NightmareFarm]

What's that!? More footage of Final Game of Thrones: A Witcher's Fantasy (Featuring Dante from Devil May Cry)!? Oh goodie! Pffft

Persona 3: Reload, FFVII: Rebirth, FFIX Remake, DQIII HD 2D, Dragon Quest XII and Dragon's Dogma 2 can't come soon enough.

Those game series you mentioned are medieval... just like most oldschool final fantasy titles...

 

[Shodai]

On the fence - The combat is awfully chaotic and flashy. I suppose cool for some, but it's a big negative for me, as it is hard to follow anymore. I am sure as a younger person I'd have followed it fine, but these days, it's all a distracting mess.

Chalk one more request for turn-based combat.

 

[bender]

 

[Kacho]

The game is in great hands so it will no doubt be excellent. That said it might have been better to make this a spin-off rather than a mainline entry. This is obviously meant to appeal to the widest group possible, those that are outside of the Final Fantasy bubble, but will they bite? I dunno. We shall see.

 

[AngelMuffin]

I feel like they’ve published the entire game at this point.

 

[Lokaum D+]

I got tired while watching the gameplay of a game for the first time. The enemies just won't die. It saddens me to see only a handful of people concerned about the new direction of Final Fantasy. I don't understand what sets it apart from an ordinary action game, besides the boring combat.

Agreed 100%, pls square, bring back turn based combat, miss the old good times of been staring at my screen choosing the same skills for 3 minutes to kill a enemie been all leveled up.



This is how a NOT boring combat should look.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Looks glorious.

 

[Fake]

Just don't make much sense... of course the game is more appealing.

 

[Fake]

I'm pretty sure most people who in to that game care less about the turn based combat and more about gacha stuff.

Agree, but is a load of money just for an avarage 'gacha'.
Not defending, I hate gacha, but tolerate depending of the game.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

FF15 style gameplay from the looks of it, which is OK since I enjoyed 15's gameplay. Concerning Squeenix's ability to tell a good story though......

 

[PaddyOCanager]

Uh, that doesn't look great.

The amount of SFX, text and numbers all over the screen is absurd. I'm sure it'll be fun to play but that shit is off-putting. I'm hoping the story and characters are good more than anything though - I'm confident the combat will be fine either way.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Jesus there's so much going on on the screen , also these camera movements during combos and dashes

Too exhausting for me to just watch a few minutes, also these Ironblood Fanatics are tankier than Ruby Weapon

Music on this game can't get more epic tho, and story might be good, but yea, watching cutscenes on youtube looks healthier for my eyes than playing it

Its the damn particle effects being wayyyyytoo bright. I hope there's a setting to tone that down

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

Very disappointed the video is not 60fps performance mode. Thing is almost unwatchable to me, all I can think about is how bad the motion looks in it, how does anyone play 3D games like that at those low framerates I have no clue.

Well, a few more weeks until I can see it running properly myself.

The frametate is going to be abysmal for this. We already know that it fluctuates massively between combat and exploration. The games director even acknowledged this and said something to the effect that "there's not enough time to do anything about it"

Don't know his exact words but I'm expecting the performance mode to be a shitshow. Also not expecting resolution to be great in performance mode based on...every recent 3rd party game these days...it'll be a low native res and use some form of fsr2 or upscaling and the end result will be questionable

 

[PSYGN]

christ! just a couple minutes of that deep-throated grunting/roaring was enough for me. really hope there's an option to tone that down, or i'm afraid i'm out. it's just seriously obnoxious. hours & hours of it? fuggedaboudit...

Do not be ashamed of sudden arousal.

 

[hussar16]

Ugh.. Sorry, just not that interested in a combat system of overly tanky massive health bare enemies where you have to wail on them for minutes on end just to get their stagger bar filled in order to finally begin doing meaningful damage to them. Only for the stagger bar timer to run out and you're back at square one. That shit is so overplayed and tiresome.

That said, the game looks smooth as silk and graphically looks pretty fantastic.
The combat system just kills the entire thing for me.

This combat gameplay is just so bad. The last good gameplay was ghost of thushima something next gen and revolutionary in my opinion

 

[Little Chicken]

I'm not inspired by the footage but it could just be the person playing.

It reminded me of the more annoying aspects of FFXV's combat encounters; button mashing and enemy sponges.

And they're still using that awful font despite a wildly different tone!