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Steel Battallion Heavy Armour - "1/10" "It does not work" "Should not have shipped"
- Thread starter Jackpot
- Start date
Mister Negative
Member
Is funny look at the review of Official Xbox Magazine. They are at the top of page
http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/steel-battalion-heavy-armor/critic-reviews
Geez, they should at least try to pretend they aren't biased.
MightyHedgehog
Member
Eh, did anyone really expect another SB? Ever? It was a one-time thing because MS paid for its development, just like a lot of Kinect releases only exist because MS paid for their development to sell Kinect sensors and attract more people. SB never made money, so it was never destined to be a franchise, anyway. Maybe I'm just missing the joke.
Before reading up on it, I thought the game would be a game in which using kinect would be optional (similar to Forza).
Hybrid != optional.
Yeah, I know that.
In my previous post, I used "hybrid" in the sense that one didn't have to use kinect since the game worked both ways (with just a controller or with a controller and kinect), grouping it in with other hybrid games. I should have used a better term/way to describe what I meant though.
Jolee Bindo from KotOR. Eli and Alyx Vance.
Neuromancer
Member
Pretty sure it's an independent magazine despite the name. They've given many a poor score to Kinect games in the past.
Man he wants to like it so bad.
LightofRohan
Member
Damn, the game looks really nice though and I love all the details in the cockpit -- a lot of care went into that. It's sad the Gameplay/controlls designer was high on meth the entire time.
The thing is, as i watched the youtube videos i thought that it is a really nice idea if it would work correctly and this has a lot of potential. If this would work nicely, i bet it is a fun experience , especially for hardcore players who are into it. And i say this as someone who doesn't like kinect at all.
The state the game is right now is rather sad and a shame. It has to be frustrating as developer if you know that people will have problems with your game but your schedule/publisher is pushing you to release it unfinished/unoptimized.
The state the game is right now is rather sad and a shame. It has to be frustrating as developer if you know that people will have problems with your game but your schedule/publisher is pushing you to release it unfinished/unoptimized.
Alx
Member
So, I finally tried the demo thanks to this thread. Well, it's not so bad. Not 1/10 bad anyway.
Actually the things I liked the least in the game was its confusion. I guess it's because they are aiming for a "realistic" approach, but the first time you walk on that beach you don't even know who's firing at you. And when you're getting hit hard, all your cockpit is shaking around and you can't do anything for a few seconds.
The kinect controls were of course the point on which I wanted to focus. The tutorial was easy, and most of the controls work during the small mission of the demo : run, boost, change ammo, aim... I had one annoying problem , each time I wanted to open the small door protecting the front glass, I pulled down the periscope by lowering my hand. I had to do it reaaally slowly to avoid that problem, which is harder to do in the middle of battle.
A few scripted animations were quite amusing, especially grabbing a fleeing ally by the bottom of his pants and punching him in the face. I missed a few high fives and hand shakes, though.
Anyway, the kinect controls are far from perfect and can get in the way if you don't keep perfect control of your gestures, but it still works. I managed to finish the mission anyway. I'm still not convinced by the way they use gestures for the game (only adding "cool factor" to the complex commands of the mecha), but they did put some effort in the game.
I'm not too sure why some people had such bad experiences with the controls. One possibility is that most people may try to fumble around when trying to have a command register, while I think the game expects you to make clean motions without hesitating (for example, don't put your hand forward, wait for the ingame hand to move, and try to pull a lever... just do the motion and the game should follow).
Actually the things I liked the least in the game was its confusion. I guess it's because they are aiming for a "realistic" approach, but the first time you walk on that beach you don't even know who's firing at you. And when you're getting hit hard, all your cockpit is shaking around and you can't do anything for a few seconds.
The kinect controls were of course the point on which I wanted to focus. The tutorial was easy, and most of the controls work during the small mission of the demo : run, boost, change ammo, aim... I had one annoying problem , each time I wanted to open the small door protecting the front glass, I pulled down the periscope by lowering my hand. I had to do it reaaally slowly to avoid that problem, which is harder to do in the middle of battle.
A few scripted animations were quite amusing, especially grabbing a fleeing ally by the bottom of his pants and punching him in the face. I missed a few high fives and hand shakes, though.
Anyway, the kinect controls are far from perfect and can get in the way if you don't keep perfect control of your gestures, but it still works. I managed to finish the mission anyway. I'm still not convinced by the way they use gestures for the game (only adding "cool factor" to the complex commands of the mecha), but they did put some effort in the game.
I'm not too sure why some people had such bad experiences with the controls. One possibility is that most people may try to fumble around when trying to have a command register, while I think the game expects you to make clean motions without hesitating (for example, don't put your hand forward, wait for the ingame hand to move, and try to pull a lever... just do the motion and the game should follow).
It kind of seems like Japanese devs were almost tricked into trying to make "real" games for Kinect while Western devs either ignored it or made kids / dance / fitness games. It's a little sad that the people who actually tried to fulfill the promise of core games on Kinect got universally screwed.
This is exactly why I never want to see anyone point to Dance Central as the shining example of why the Kinect works. Kinect was not designed to be a still shot-stencil comparer technology. We could have had Dance Central with the Eyetoy long ago.
With each game that just does not control well on the Kinect at which point will the apologists stop blaming the game devs and just blame the technology? The idea is GOOD, the actual tech is BAD. Stop living in denial.
I feel sad that the next Panzer Dragoon will almost certainly be a POS because MS insisted it be made "better" with Kinect.
Criminal Upper
Banned
That's been delayed to "TBC"
Honestly what could they have done? The only game that truly works is Dance Central and Child of Eden.
Would a Steel Battalion game that consists of clapping, waving my palms around slowly, and striking poses so that the Kinect can match it to some predefined shape really be a better game?
The only realistic implementation I can see is make the game controller only with maybe a couple of voice commands. But at that point, that's pretty much just a normal controller-based game.
It was a slow month.The best part is that it says 3/10 but also EDITOR'S CHOICE!
Alx
Member
I don't think it's a still shot stencil, if anything it's an "animated 3D stencil", since the full execution counts in the game. Anyway, I still think that the Konami dancing games are better kinect games, and those do track the limbs of the user, unlike what we know of Dance Central.
I think people trying to downplay the technology are even more in denial. The skeleton tracking works, you can see it in the tuner, or in games like Kinect Adventures or Kinect Sports, where you can make your avatar move and dance in real time. You can even download the free SDK and make it work on your PC and get the full coordinates in 3D space.
There is no doubt that hardware works and the software can track gestures. There is still a software hurdle to recognize those gestures, and of course use them ingame. Since it doesn't seem to be included in the kinect API, it's the developer's task to implement it.
Seraphinianus
Banned
Yes there's no doubt that it can track gestures. Tracking them and then using them as an input for gaming is a WHOLE different story. There's nothing for devs to implement if the tech is simply not good enough to translate gestures to actual input.
Like I said the idea is good. When the Kinect gets revised with more horsepower, the tech will likely even realize the original idea. But the fact remains, the tech in the Kinect v1.0 is shit.
Haunted
Member
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
That's not what hybrid means, and I don't know why you would think that.
When you buy a hybrid car, do you you think you can use gasoline OR the internal battery?
KefkaTaran
Member
You may want to re-read. Scores are not assigned by a different editor. Different editors read it, suggest a score, and then talk it through with the original writer until they figure out the score that everyone is comfortable with. It's a process that helps make sure the tone of the review is in line with the score and that the review isn't just being written with a certain number in mind.
We're going to have an editorial up discussing this process a bit more hopefully today.
Exactly. At no point does Arthur or any other editor who didn't review a game say, "No, this is the score the game is getting, deal with it."
In fact, I don't know of a single outlet where people editing a review provide NO feedback on the score. This is no different than that except that the score itself isn't in place before turning in the review.
Alx
Member
I don't know what you include in "the tech" exactly, but in theory it is indeed the developer's task to code the rules that will translate gestures to actual input. Like they did when they had to translate positions of an analog stick into commands, or accelerations of the wiimote, or trajectories on a touch screen... Currently the kinect SDK provides raw coordinates of joints on the user, like a mouse provides coordinates of its 2D position, that's what is expected from it.
Sure it's easier when there is middleware that does the recognition job for you (provided you pay for it), but such middleware has yet to be developed, so it's still in the developers hands. Maybe MS is working on its own library of gesture recognition, but they're not the only one that should do it. Anyway it's not a matter of hardware, limitations or even horse power. It's a matter of pure development skill in pattern recognition.
Again, I know what it means.
However, I was saying (or at least trying to say) that since most hybrid kinect games for the 360 give one the option of using the controller and kinect, or just the controller, I thought that Steel Battallion was going to do the same (that is until I read more about it).
I just didn't state that clearly in my original post. I made a mistake when reading/posting.
R_thanatos
Member
How are you feelign then after acheiving this feat
So this games was so horrible that it caused IGN to retroactively give the original Steel Battallion a 3/10 as well?
http://ca.ign.com/games/steel-battalion/xbox-481366
Funny to see 3/10 - "awful" - Editors' Choice
Yeah, tagging the old games in the review apparently caused a weird CMS bug. We're working on fixing it now. But I agree it's hilarious.
(And yes, I'm at IGN Xbox now. Mods, any way to change it without making a new one?)
This. I'm currently playing Rogue Warrior just to see how bad it is.
I might do the same with this game, the fact it is frustrating is a big turn off though. There is also no way I'm paying full retail for it.
I am wondering why anyone would preorder this game anyways...
Also why would you preorder ANY game? I don't it
Neuromancer
Member
Maybe duckroll will do it for you since he's hanging out in here; if not, PM any mod and they can change it for you. So how's working at IGN compared to OXM and do you miss your old pal Dan Amrich?Yeah, tagging the old games in the review apparently caused a weird CMS bug. We're working on fixing it now. But I agree it's hilarious.
(And yes, I'm at IGN Xbox now. Mods, any way to change it without making a new one?)
schwabdizzle
Banned
The developer is gonna blame the hardware and MS will blame the developer.
Alx
Member
We were specifically mentioning the gesture recognition features in a game like Steel Battalion. Lag is a performance issue, but it's usually not a game breaking one. While a gesture command not registering is obviously one. Non responsiveness is not really an issue with kinect, and accuracy is good enough for any tracking at limb level (ie with a few cm resolution). Anyway it's something that you can take into account when designing your game.
Everything considered though, it's still wrong to claim "the tech doesn't work, period". It does work, only you have to make something out of it. That's currently the difficult part.
Everything considered though, it's still wrong to claim "the tech doesn't work, period". It does work, only you have to make something out of it. That's currently the difficult part.
Go and play Child of Eden and tell me it's inaccurate and unresponsive. It's not.
If one game managed to have responsive and accurate controls then how can it be the hardware at fault? You wouldn't call analog sticks a failed technology just because there are games with shitty analog acceleration curves that are terrible to play.
PrinceOfApathy
Banned
When Joe shook the guys hand, I lost it. What a garbage piece of hardware this insidious bile of a company unleashed on the social consciousness of gamers. Just die already, please.
This is amazing, made my day.
Z_Y
Member
PuppetMaster
Member
I've never even heard of this angryjoe guy before. But that video was hillarious!
soulassssns
Banned
Theverge?
Walks out...
Walks out...
Kuro Madoushi
Unconfirmed Member
OH MY...STOP GRABBIN SHIT!
Gamespot is playing the game with no indicators at all.
Video footage:
- Taking a Bridge
- Going Insane in the Desert
- Shooting VTs and Touching Crew
Video footage:
- Taking a Bridge
- Going Insane in the Desert
- Shooting VTs and Touching Crew
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
It uses your whole arm+hand to get a general idea of where you are pointing and also has a generous application of auto aim to compensate for its guesses. If the game had no lock on system it would be a frustrating mess too. Any game with a general idea of what you are doing can fill in the missing data and make it look like you are under control.
It's a bit of both here it seems. Kinect clearly could not handle the kind of game they tried to make, but they also should've either scaled back or not even have used Kinect.