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Toriyama wants Lightning Returns' open world to beat Skyrim

Well it cant be worse than BoRIM. It will be fine Toriyama.

Also, Perfo. :| I will still defend Lightning if that makes you feel any better.

Ristlager said:
According to GAF:
Made Final Fantasy 13 a corridor game. Booooo Urns. This is shit, we want open world.
Makes Final Fantasy LR open world. Booo Urns. This is shit. We want something else.
Uses a ton of time on FFXV. Boooo, get your act together.
Uses a bit over a year on LR. Boooo. You should use more time to make it good.

And everyone who has played it (E3) loved the combat, praising it as the best ever. And the tidbits from the other thread was only positives. Get your fricking shit together Gaf. Its getting more and more reddiculuse here every month. With everyone trying to up the previously poster with negative shit. Try to be a little more thoughful in your comments.
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Exactly.
 
Verendus said:
That's a bit harsh.

There are good RPG games from the West. Baldur's Gate was developed in the West. Not that I don't agree also that SE should focus more on their unique taste rather than imitating the West too much. You lose your own voice that way, so to say, which I feel they have to a certain extent. I don't think there is anything wrong with taking inspiration from Western games or any games, but you have to know how to implement what you're taking and do it in an organic manner so that it feels right.

It'll be interesting to see if they get it right with LR, not that I have any hope for them after the previous two entries.

Also, more on topic, Toriyama is a dumbass, probably should just shut up and work on the game instead of humiliating everyone each time he opens his mouth, Lightning lover etc.
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Fuck and yes my man! Shout out to Baldur's Gate!
 
Goli said:
Sony and SE held an event in Japan where people got to sample the game, some key staffers were there and someone asked if it was true whether or not they had increased Lightning's bust size, to which the answer was yes since apparently Toriyama demanded it. They also revealed this "Toriyama wants LR's open world to be better than Skyirm" thing there and a thread was made about it but everyone ignored that point and decided to focus on the boobs issue, now Nirolak decided to made another thread highlighting the Skyrim thing (despite it in fact being old news and already covered before here) and this happened. So yeah, boobs.
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Ooh, I was thinking that maybe you could customize her breasts or something
 
Verendus said:
That's a bit harsh.

There are good RPG games from the West. Baldur's Gate was developed in the West. Not that I don't agree also that SE should focus more on their unique taste rather than imitating the West too much. You lose your own voice that way, so to say, which I feel they have to a certain extent. I don't think there is anything wrong with taking inspiration from Western games or any games, but you have to know how to implement what you're taking and do it in an organic manner so that it feels right.

It'll be interesting to see if they get it right with LR, not that I have any hope for them after the previous two entries.

Also, more on topic, Toriyama is a dumbass, probably should just shut up and work on the game instead of humiliating everyone each time he opens his mouth, Lightning lover etc.
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Sorry it came out that way, but it wasn't my own opinion as I love WRPGs. It was to illustrate that previously WRPGs were (stupidly) viewed as inferior games to JRPGs, and now the poster child for JRPGs is setting out to try and better the most popular RPG period in the last few years.
 
Ristlager said:
According to GAF:
Made Final Fantasy 13 a corridor game. Booooo Urns. This is shit, we want open world.
Makes Final Fantasy LR open world. Booo Urns. This is shit. We want something else.
Uses a ton of time on FFXV. Boooo, get your act together.
Uses a bit over a year on LR. Boooo. You should use more time to make it good.

And everyone who has played it (E3) loved the combat, praising it as the best ever. And the tidbits from the other thread was only positives. Get your fricking shit together Gaf. Its getting more and more reddiculuse here every month. With everyone trying to up the previously poster with negative shit. Try to be a little more thoughful in your comments.
Click to expand...
i_like_you.gif
 
Perfo said:
Great, another topic just made to flame and provoke the community of haters here. The previous topic with so many interesting gameplay mechanics detailed got ignored by the most, while another topic like this with the precise scope of provoking, get replies at the speed of light.

Mods should do something at this point instead of tagging along. Topics like this don't serve any purpose.
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Perfo
Banned
(Today, 12:50 PM)

Poor Perfo. He's just a little too excited about his favorite game, but people need to realize it's never a good idea to tell mods how to do their jobs. Back on topic: I wish the Majora's Mask comparisons would stop. In Majora's Mask, you could indefinitely rewind back to the first day, and that's only like what, the second spell in the entire game? Majora's Mask strength was the balance between urgency and freedom, and the nuances of side quests that were only accessible at certain times on certain days. Even if you missed them the first time around, you could always rewind and try them again.

The same comparison falls apart with Skyrim. The game wasn't widely loved because "it was big." It was built on a huge wave of hype from the previous entry in the series and had tons of mods that kept breathing new life into the game, which kept the barren open world from feeling lifeless. People need to really look beyond basic comparisons understand the true meat of the games that are so well received.
 
Astery said:
If you don't see how ridiculous what they are trying to do, and frankly having 0.1% to actually "beat skyrim" as Toriyama wants LR to do, then I have nothing more to say. Riding a chocobo, yup that's a game changer ok.
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Yes, he should be saying: we know Skyrim is so much better than this game will every be. I am sure noone here would react then.

And him saying the chocobo thing, is a metafor for having a huge open world. The chocobo is not the game changer, the open world is.
 
I'm excited to play this game. They're trying a bunch of new mechanics and approaches and it'll be interesting even if it doesn't pan out to perfection.
 
How is a game that has a real time clock counting down to the end of the game whenever you're not in certain limited situations going to do "Open Word" ?

Even turn based time management games where you have actions that take days and durations measured in years, exploration is limited. I can't conceive of doing "Open World" well in a game with a 13 hour clock. Even if optional stuff lets you double the timer, it still seems unlikely that its going to do Skyrim style open world.
 
Ristlager said:
According to GAF:
Made Final Fantasy 13 a corridor game. Booooo Urns. This is shit, we want open world.
Makes Final Fantasy LR open world. Booo Urns. This is shit. We want something else.
Uses a ton of time on FFXV. Boooo, get your act together.
Uses a bit over a year on LR. Boooo. You should use more time to make it good.

And everyone who has played it (E3) loved the combat, praising it as the best ever. And the tidbits from the other thread was only positives. Get your fricking shit together Gaf. Its getting more and more reddiculuse here every month. With everyone trying to up the previously poster with negative shit. Try to be a little more thoughful in your comments.
Click to expand...
Not only are you distilling a large amount of posters into just GAF, you are also condensing all of the issues with FF13 into "it's a corridor game." Just because Lightning Returns will be an open world game does not mean it will be a good game. It has the potential to be a better game, at least in my opinion, if it doesn't railroad you along a nonsensical plot like FF13 does.

As for FFXV, we first heard of it in 2006 as FF13 Versus. That is a shitload of time for a game to be in development, whereas a bit over a year for Lightning Returns, where their goal is to "defeat Skyrim" is a bit of a joke. So, yeah, it's nice for them to want things. We'll see how it turns out. Only the silly people WANT this (or any other) game to be bad.
 
Perfo should have went with the strategy of making crude drive-by posts (maybe boast that he is in fact making a drive-by post while he is at, since that seems cool too).

Putting aside the knee-jerking from the questionably sensational thread title, in what ways are Lightning Returns open world more along the lines of Skyrim instead of, say, a Majora's Mask? Skyrim is more like an endless mesh of land which you can travel through just by walking in any direction (with generic towns and dungeons popping up on your map), while what I've seen LR has more "designed" with major hubs and unique areas splintered in specific ways. A game LR seems to have a more interesting world to me by default, but it depends on they are aiming for when they say "beat". This kind of reminds me of when people make a big deal about FFXIII being "Call of Duty", when it is vastly more similar to FFX.
 
Some people need to understand how tiresome Lightning is and what's the whole "I hate FFXIII" thing about.She obviously has devoted fanbase but for some people she is one of the most annoying and not interesting main characters in the FF series.

While being marketed the most...

Usually there is FF, people discuss the cast and move on (liking them or not).But not this time,We are getting THREE GAMES about Lightning and it seems LR will be about how amazing she is.

I just want this game to release, have discussion for what it is and move on.
 
Law Abiding Stranger said:
Some people need to understand how tiresome Lightning is and what's the whole "I hate FFXIII" thing about.She obviously has devoted fanbase but for some people she is one of the most annoying and not interesting main characters in the FF series.

While being marketed the most...

Usually there is FF, people discuss the cast and move on (liking them or not).But not this time,We are getting THREE GAMES about Lightning and it seems LR will be about how amazing she is.

I just want this game to release, have discussion for what it is and move on.
Click to expand...

Why do people who like some Final Fantasy games have to give their explicit attention to every game with Final Fantasy in the title - even ones they are tired of hearing about? No one is forcing anyone to play this game or even read about it. I feel like trying to feign it being pushed onto you is a bit of a joke. Seeing the same people every thread for perhaps years now, it is obvious to me that many of you guys are gluttons for this. Perhaps it provides some stress relief.
 
CrimsonCrescendo said:
The game will have 13 months of full production in total by the end and so far it's had about 11 months. 13 months of full production versus the ~40 months they had in Skyrim. It's an asinine goal. There's no way with the resources they were willing to devote to the game that they even came close. And it's especially asinine since the game is built around a timer system and most gamers won't ever experience even a fraction of that content if true. An open world game with a restrictive timer... brilliant.
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I hate to defend a game that isn't even out yet, but from my perceptive it works pretty well. Unlike most games with a restrictive timer, there is a way to gain back time, so you can essentially keep playing the game as long as you like. If you want a 20 hour game, you get a 20 hour game, and if you want a 50 hour game, you get a fifty hour game. It also gives more incentive to actually do side quests because those side quests give you more time to explore. Finally, a restricted time adds tension, and if there is one thing even the best Final Fantasy games are often missing, it's tension.

As for development time, see Majora's Mask, one of the obvious inspirations for this game.

I enjoy reading the Toriyama hate train because it's hilarious, but Lightning Returns has some interesting concepts and it's a shame that they might be ignored because "It has Lightning and the costume thing is pervy and the graphics are bad so it's icky." It certainly shows more creativity than either XIII or XIII-2 did, despite the reused assets.
 
Riposte said:
Why do people who like some Final Fantasy games have to give their explicit attention to every game with Final Fantasy in the title - even ones they are tired of hearing about? No one is forcing anyone to play this game or even read about it. I feel like trying to feign it being pushed onto you is a bit of a joke. Seeing the same people every thread for perhaps years now, it is obvious to me that many of you guys are gluttons for this. Perhaps it provides some stress relief.
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You are obviously right, I am just stating why Final Fantasy/Lightning threads are what they are.
 
I'll say it again that Toriyama needs to show, not tell. That's his main weakness in story telling tbh. Too much is regulated to the background. We need to see major stuff happen .
 
Law Abiding Stranger said:
Some people need to understand how tiresome Lightning is and what's the whole "I hate FFXIII" thing about.She obviously has devoted fanbase but for some people she is one of the most annoying and not interesting main characters in the FF series.

While being marketed the most...

Usually there is FF, people discuss the cast and move on (liking them or not).But not this time,We are getting THREE GAMES about Lightning and it seems LR will be about how amazing she is.

I just want this game to release, have discussion for what it is and move on.
Click to expand...
I don't know what got Perfo banned but now that he is banned i feel the discussion on a final fantasy thread has lost something with it. On the other hand i keep seeing Neogaf members just jumping to a final fantasy thread and just throw a hate comment about the game and not add nothing to the discussion. Just creating a cycle of harassment. How about those members?

ontopic: aiming to create a big world like Skyrim is a good thing. The limit inventory and the time limit also seem a good thing. Ok some may say "how is that a good thing?" It's the franchise moving forward. I know some would prefer FF1-FF15 to be the same game with different graphics but the reason why you started to like Final Fantasy "maybe" it's because it had something fresh. Well LR doesn't fall short on that list. I like the way it's being bold in trying new things. YES Lightning gets bigger breasts. Who cares? If he hadn't said it would you have noticed? Probably yes but wouldn't make a fuss about it. What about having only 1 character? Isn't that good? I kept hearing in LR threads that you hate XIII for having a party that you couldn't control... well now you got no party so deal with it. Crisis Core style!
 
Toxi said:
I hate to defend a game that isn't even out yet, but from my perceptive it works pretty well. Unlike most games with a restrictive timer, there is a way to gain back time, so you can essentially keep playing the game as long as you like. If you want a 20 hour game, you get a 20 hour game, and if you want a 50 hour game, you get a fifty hour game. It also gives more incentive to actually do side quests because those side quests give you more time to explore. Finally, a restricted time adds tension, and if there is one thing even the best Final Fantasy games are often missing, it's tension.
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I don't think that's how it works. I think there is a total of 13 days you can play the game in one playthrough. You start the game at 7 days and you can add 6 more days up to 13 days total. I mean, as far as I know, that's how it is going to work. I hope that info is wrong and you can indefinitely add a lot of time. I understand that it was done to add tension, but... frankly, I don't really care about that kind of tension in my JRPGs. In fact, I hate time limits in just about every type of game which is one of the reasons why I hated Majora's Mask (even WITH the ability to reset the timer and slow it down).
 
Ristlager said:
Yes, he should be saying: we know Skyrim is so much better than this game will every be. I am sure noone here would react then.

And him saying the chocobo thing, is a metafor for having a huge open world. The chocobo is not the game changer, the open world is.
Click to expand...

He should just let the game talk for itself. With a much smaller budget of resources and time, arguably less talented people in charge, throwing dumb words around is not exactly assuring.
 
Law Abiding Stranger said:
You are obviously right, I am just stating why Final Fantasy/Lightning threads are what they are.
Click to expand...

I think some of the bitching stems from the fact that S-E announced a lot of Final Fantasy titles way too early, and the only titles to make if over have been the Lightning games. Like, if Versus was announced in 2-3 years from release in 2012, instead of 8-9 years from release in 2006, and if Type-0 was actually localized, I think less people would be complaining about FF13 related titles. This strikes me very much like the situation with Secret of Evermore. Fans wanted SD3 (the true followup to Secret of Mana), but got Evermore instead. The game was vilified as a result.

In reality, Final Fantasy 13 came out (in the west) in early 2010. Square Enix has released two quick follow-up games to maximize their costly investment in FF13, and to cut down the wait time between true sequels. Assuming that S-E's new leadership means that FFXV will be out in 2014 or 2015, the wait between FF13 and that won't be any different than the wait between X and XII or XII and XIII. Plenty of spin-off games were released between those titles as well.
 
heiyu said:
I like the way it's being bold in trying new things. YES Lightning gets bigger breasts. Who cares? If he hadn't said it would you have noticed? Probably yes but wouldn't make a fuss about it. What about having only 1 character? Isn't that good? I kept hearing in LR threads that you hate XIII for having a party that you couldn't control... well now you got no party so deal with it. Crisis Core style!
Click to expand...
Change isn't a new thing for Final Fantasy. The entire series is incredibly divisive, and not just because of the characters and story. Just about every Final Fantasy had a big open world. Not really in the Skyrim sense, but I doubt even Lightning Returns is going to have a world that large with as many filler dungeons and small towns.

If people hated XIII for having a party that you couldn't control, then the logical extension would be to give the player control of the party, not take the party away. That being said, control over one character is probably the way to go in this more action oriented game, though they could have had a party where you can actively switch between who you're controlling and who is AI controlled.
 
heiyu said:
I don't know what got Perfo banned but now that he is banned i feel the discussion on a final fantasy thread has lost something with it. On the other hand i keep seeing Neogaf members just jumping to a final fantasy thread and just throw a hate comment about the game and not add nothing to the discussion. Just creating a cycle of harassment. How about those members?!
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He most likely got banned for shitting on the thread and instead of sending a mod a request to shut it down, he called them out in a post. He didn't get banned for trying to do real discussion.

That said, considering LR's development time, it's highly unlikely to have as much content as Skyrim.
 
DigitalDevilSummoner said:
I was just listing things they promised but I am not going to argue with someone who can see the future.
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Good choice. I saw that coming too.

I guess the Zelda comparison is just the time thing like in Majora's Mask, so they can have that. 1/4th of the game being a large expansive area negates skyrim comparison, and Dark Souls comparison is just one every developer 'tries' to do now, but always miserably fails.
 
LOL Dark Souls comparisons

Every game wants to be Dark Souls, but Demon's Souls is the real Dark Souls of Citizen Kane.

SoraanTribal said:
I don't think that's how it works. I think there is a total of 13 days you can play the game in one playthrough. You start the game at 7 days and you can add 6 more days up to 13 days total. I mean, as far as I know, that's how it is going to work. I hope that info is wrong and you can indefinitely add a lot of time. I understand that it was done to add tension, but... frankly, I don't really care about that kind of tension in my JRPGs. In fact, I hate time limits in just about every type of game which is one of the reasons why I hated Majora's Mask (even WITH the ability to reset the timer and slow it down).
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You can't infinitely add time, but you can keep going back to 13 days as long as you keep doing side quests, and I have a feeling the side quests are the meat of this game.

If you want to finish the game quickly, you can, but you can also extend its length; you just have to work at it.

I understand if you dislike time limits, you'll almost certainly dislike Lightning Returns, but I'm really intrigued by its basic ideas.
 
Midou said:
Good choice. I saw that coming too.

I guess the Zelda comparison is just the time thing like in Majora's Mask, so they can have that. 1/4th of the game being a large expansive area negates skyrim comparison, and Dark Souls comparison is just one every developer 'tries' to do now, but always miserably fails.
Click to expand...

I have no clue what you are trying to do here. Just like with most casual FF gamers, the negativity is lost on me. Wolf has been cried too many times.
 
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